Lindsey was fired. RIP Fleetwood Mac.

[elle]

starting a clean slate, because it seems that new people keep coming out of the woodwork asking why he "left" every few seconds. some people don't want to accept the sad truth that the band he made huge fashioning its music for the last 43 years betrayed one of their own, a family member.

Lindsey's kids are on the internet very clearly saying - he was fired. and that FM is not FM without him, and how proud of him they are.
his brother is out there too, saying the same.
his wife's IG is sporting #teamlindsey hashtag.

news outlets confirmed that he was fired by the band insiders who don't want their names out there, but want the truth to be known. Rolling Stone and Variety are not gossip rags that put out there some unconfirmed gossip. Billy's leaks pulled the trigger before Fm was ready.

i can't help but wonder what's going on behind the scenes. there is a lot of buzz that Lindsey was fighting it legally, but who knows. not clear whether he's fighting to stay in the band or just suing the pants out of them. i understand all my friends who are FM fans first and are sad that the band's longest and most successful incarnation is dead (and properly moved to post-rumours forum here), and want him back. ii did sign and amplified all the various petitions from people wanting him back. but i can't help thinking how betrayed he must feel by the people he considered family, and that he probably doesn't want to see them for a while now. as far as the band members, Stevie, i'm just sad for. she must be a very unhappy person. but mostly i'm disgusted with Mick. and his cold statement cements it and is lower than low.

from all the backlash, maybe their tour will bomb badly. wouldn't that be karmic considering that they fired him because of money, ie pretty rational calculation that FM minus Lindsey would make more money than FM minus Stevie? :laugh: most general social media comments are laughing at the complete craziness and yet another post-success chimera version of the band. i think with this move they made sure there will be movies made about FM.

[lennonfan]

starting a clean slate, because it seems that new people keep coming out of the woodwork asking why he "left" every few seconds. some people don't want to accept the sad truth that the band he made huge fashioning its music for the last 43 years betrayed one of their own, a family member.

Lindsey's kids are on the internet very clearly saying - he was fired. and that FM is not FM without him, and how proud of him they are.
his brother is out there too, saying the same.
his wife's IG is sporting #teamlindsey hashtag.

news outlets confirmed that he was fired by the band insiders who don't want their names out there, but want the truth to be known. Rolling Stone and Variety are not gossip rags that put out there some unconfirmed gossip. Billy's leaks pulled the trigger before Fm was ready.

i can't help but wonder what's going on behind the scenes. there is a lot of buzz that Lindsey was fighting it legally, but who knows. not clear whether he's fighting to stay in the band or just suing the pants out of them. i understand all my friends who are FM fans first and are sad that the band's longest and most successful incarnation is dead (and properly moved to post-rumours forum here), and want him back. ii did sign and amplified all the various petitions from people wanting him back. but i can't help thinking how betrayed he must feel by the people he considered family, and that he probably doesn't want to see them for a while now. as far as the band members, Stevie, i'm just sad for. she must be a very unhappy person. but mostly i'm disgusted with Mick. and his cold statement cements it and is lower than low.

from all the backlash, maybe their tour will bomb badly. wouldn't that be karmic considering that they fired him because of money, ie pretty rational calculation that FM minus Lindsey would make more money than FM minus Stevie? :laugh: most general social media comments are laughing at the complete craziness and yet another post-success chimera version of the band. i think with this move they made sure there will be movies made about FM.

I'm still so surprised by this. I had no idea it was this bad behind the scenes. It really doesn't make sense, I mean, didn't they have plenty of time recently to do their own thing? If they can't stand each other why commit to a tour in the first place? Mick's statement is one of the most cold things I've read in a while. It also supremely contradicts what he's said in the past.

I'm very upset they're treating Lindsey this way. Danny...then Bob....now Lindsey. I doubt I can ever look at Mick the same way again. This jumps the shark.

[aleuzzi]

RIP Fleetwood Mac indeed.

This is the craziest, most idiotic move of this band's crazy and idiotic career.

[NotonRodeo]

Such are my feelings towards this "band" [sic] now that I do really hope Buckingham sues the heck out of them. And he will have a far better claim than Bob Welch ever did.

[chriskisn]

Fleetwood Mac has survived for 51 years, don't reckon Lindsey going will be the end. The music will live on, the crowds will still flock to see them, the money will roll in. Albums might not sell but then even with Lindsey they weren't going to sell many.

We don't know why, it will come out in the end but hell the facts are still muddied about the Weston sacking and I wasn't even born then :lol:

I don't get too caught up in the personalities, just hope we get some new music, and a new album.

[TrueFaith77]

It is proper to start this thread because it highlights two key facts:

1. Lindsey was fired. We don't know why or on what grounds, but that is appears to be the case and needs to be reiterated and deserves all the informed conjecture Ledgies can throw at it.
2. Fleetwood Mac is over. It was great while it lasted.

As for the legal aspect, that's interesting. When Hooky was booted from New Order they had to square things with him legally and financially on complex levels because he is a co-founder of the band and (I think?) all members have songwriting credits on all songs. I'm not an expert, I should look into what deal they ultimately made with him to control the New Order name, release new music, tour, and play New Order songs he co-wrote.

I wonder what grounds Lindsey would have IF the band did agree to a certain tour schedule.

I hope he gets as much as possible.

[Japhry]

word on the street has it that Lindsey refused to make any setlist changes and is/was very rigid. Mick, Stevie and Chris wanted to make significant setlist changes. Face it....as much as Lindsey contributed to the band, he was NOT the entire history of Fleetwood Mac and he was becoming bored with the Mac in recent years...

[jmn3]

word on the street has it that Lindsey refused to make any setlist changes and is/was very rigid. Mick, Stevie and Chris wanted to make significant setlist changes. Face it....as much as Lindsey contributed to the band, he was NOT the entire history of Fleetwood Mac and he was becoming bored with the Mac in recent years...

The set was stagnant and the arrangements have been fairly set in stone since The Dance or SYW tours. But I just can’t see firing Lindsey because he didn’t want to play Oh Well or some of the older stuff. I certainly hope they wouldn’t want Lindsey or anyone to sing any Bob Welch era stuff after the way the treated him. And does he really care if Stevie wants to drop Rhiannon for Straight Back? Maybe he does...in which case this is what we all knew, a group of old fart children.

[lovethemac1]

word on the street has it that Lindsey refused to make any setlist changes and is/was very rigid. Mick, Stevie and Chris wanted to make significant setlist changes. Face it....as much as Lindsey contributed to the band, he was NOT the entire history of Fleetwood Mac and he was becoming bored with the Mac in recent years...

Curious if it's known on the streets, why would he not want to change up the setlist? If he was bored, wouldn't he want some artistic changes that would make the tour interesting?

As much as I try, in my own little removed world from the inner workings of FM, I am having a really hard time making sense of this entire debacle.

They all had to have known, this late in their careers, that firing a key member would essentially make a joke out of their LAST F@#*&%G tour!!!! I get sooooo angry just saying that.

[ViscountViktor]

I always got the impression that Lindsey wanted to change the setlist around and the other's restricted him. Maybe it was the other way round.

[NotonRodeo]

starting a clean slate, because it seems that new people keep coming out of the woodwork asking why he "left" every few seconds. some people don't want to accept the sad truth that the band he made huge fashioning its music for the last 43 years betrayed one of their own, a family member.

Lindsey's kids are on the internet very clearly saying - he was fired. and that FM is not FM without him, and how proud of him they are.
his brother is out there too, saying the same.
his wife's IG is sporting #teamlindsey hashtag.

news outlets confirmed that he was fired by the band insiders who don't want their names out there, but want the truth to be known. Rolling Stone and Variety are not gossip rags that put out there some unconfirmed gossip. Billy's leaks pulled the trigger before Fm was ready.

i can't help but wonder what's going on behind the scenes. there is a lot of buzz that Lindsey was fighting it legally, but who knows. not clear whether he's fighting to stay in the band or just suing the pants out of them. i understand all my friends who are FM fans first and are sad that the band's longest and most successful incarnation is dead (and properly moved to post-rumours forum here), and want him back. ii did sign and amplified all the various petitions from people wanting him back. but i can't help thinking how betrayed he must feel by the people he considered family, and that he probably doesn't want to see them for a while now. as far as the band members, Stevie, i'm just sad for. she must be a very unhappy person. but mostly i'm disgusted with Mick. and his cold statement cements it and is lower than low.

from all the backlash, maybe their tour will bomb badly. wouldn't that be karmic considering that they fired him because of money, ie pretty rational calculation that FM minus Lindsey would make more money than FM minus Stevie? :laugh: most general social media comments are laughing at the complete craziness and yet another post-success chimera version of the band. i think with this move they made sure there will be movies made about FM.

I think it's very smart tactics of Lindsey to keep quiet and let his kids and family speak for him. He knows more than anyone else how chaotic the management of the band is and probably expected they would not be able to come out with a coherent response any time soon--which is exactly what has happened.

It took Fleetwood Mac almost a week after Burnette and the TP photographer went on social media to announce this. I saw threads on Twitter mocking them because the rumour had already been spreading for months in some FM groups. By the time the formal announcement was made the firestorm had already erupted. Their clueless press releases fanned the flames even further.

[NotonRodeo]

It's like the current controversy with Facebook--Zuckerberg did not say anything for days and weeks into the scandal, which made the situation much worse than it would have been had he come out with a statement and interview a day or 2 after the news came out.

Then again, given Mick Fleetwood, an interview with him would only make the band look even more preposterous than they already are.

[lennonfan]

truly, I've never seen anything like this, not even the drama after Tango.

I feel like it wasn't Lindsey it was the FANS that just got bitch slapped by Mick.

The 'people come and go' thing may have worked in '87 but after that so famously tanked it was obvious who came back to save the day hence.

Stunned and admittedly angry it came to this.

[TrueFaith77]

word on the street has it that Lindsey refused to make any setlist changes and is/was very rigid. Mick, Stevie and Chris wanted to make significant setlist changes. Face it....as much as Lindsey contributed to the band, he was NOT the entire history of Fleetwood Mac and he was becoming bored with the Mac in recent years...

That's the least believable theory I've yet heard.

[secondhandchain]

That's the least believable theory I've yet heard.

Right? If LB was bored a different song would help. No way.

[elle]

word on the street has it that Lindsey refused to make any setlist changes and is/was very rigid. Mick, Stevie and Chris wanted to make significant setlist changes. Face it....as much as Lindsey contributed to the band, he was NOT the entire history of Fleetwood Mac and he was becoming bored with the Mac in recent years...

Haha no that is NOT word on the street they never even came as far as discussing the setlist. The disagreement was about bigger picture issues is a word, like logistics of the 2 intermingled tours.

Setlist thing I only saw as a fan speculation.

[nicepace]

I just had a happy little fantasy. I imagine Lindsey sitting in his living room writing a song on his guitar, feeling relieved that he won't have to put up with the nastiness of Fleetwood Mac anymore. His stress level is close to zero! He's thinking that he's already got plenty of money, and it's not as if nobody will buy a solo album or attend a solo tour -- many people will -- probably more because of all this publicity.

He gives a passing thought to Christine, feeling wistful and sorry he won't have a chance to work with her any more, but then he thinks about Stevie, and the thought that he won't have to work with ever again gives him a feeling of deep contentment. He sends John a text, hey man, let's keep in touch, and John texts him a big thumbs up. And he's thinking, give it some time (a couple of months) and maybe he'll get in touch with Christine about some future collaborations.

In my little fantasy, life is very good for Lindsey right now. He doesn't have to put on an act for the fans any more. Now he can be himself, and he can create new music without having to answer to the dysfunction of the Fleetwood Mac machine.

[TrueFaith77]

Right? If LB was bored a different song would help. No way.

He just did a tour with 80% of a new album being played live. Fleetwood Mac hasn’t done that since Rumours!!

[jmn3]

He just did a tour with 80% of a new album being played live. Fleetwood Mac hasn’t done that since Rumours!!

Right! And if I’m not mistaken, it’s been Stevie in interviews over the years who has mentioned you can’t go out and play songs people don’t know and then she references back to the beginning of the Rumours Tour when allegedly the audience knew none of the songs they were playing.

I can’t see Lindsey not wanting to play obscure tunes (IKINW, the SYW songs) but I can see him objecting to playing/singing on songs from the pre-75 years. They had the one off tour in ‘09 with Oh Well back but ever since The Dance they have eschewed Oh Well and anything else.

[dontlookdown]

It’s just music.
And while it’s hugely disappointing, everyone will be fine.
These are all adults at the end of very long hugely successful careers.
I’m just happy they’re all still making music.
Hiring Mike Campbell is the most rock solid insurance policy a band could ever buy into.
The Tom Petty fan base is thrilled. Maybe we should keep an open mind.
If I made a list of the best live shows I’ve seen in my life, Heartbreakers shows would appear several times on the list.

I’m sad and disappointed, but looking forward to seeing my second favorite guitarist on stage with Mick and John.

[jbrownsjr]

Right? If LB was bored a different song would help. No way.

All I can do is laugh at that one.

[elle]

It’s just music.
And while it’s hugely disappointing, everyone will be fine.
These are all adults at the end of very long hugely successful careers.
I’m just happy they’re all still making music.
Hiring Mike Campbell is the most rock solid insurance policy a band could ever buy into.
The Tom Petty fan base is thrilled. Maybe we should keep an open mind.
If I made a list of the best live shows I’ve seen in my life, Heartbreakers shows would appear several times on the list.

I’m sad and disappointed, but looking forward to seeing my second favorite guitarist on stage with Mick and John.

Actually Tom and Mike fan bases are as divided as Mac fan base. They think Mike can and should do better. Some are hoping this might give him exposure. None of them expect he’ll get to express any creativity with the mac.

You know that If Tom was alive, he’d be appalled. Yet I fully expect Lindsey’s name will now be replaced w Toms in all the endless stories from the stage,

[Lola]

I'm still so surprised by this. I had no idea it was this bad behind the scenes. It really doesn't make sense, I mean, didn't they have plenty of time recently to do their own thing? If they can't stand each other why commit to a tour in the first place? Mick's statement is one of the most cold things I've read in a while. It also supremely contradicts what he's said in the past.

I'm very upset they're treating Lindsey this way. Danny...then Bob....now Lindsey. I doubt I can ever look at Mick the same way again. This jumps the shark.

Same here. I didn't know there was anything (arguments, whatever) going on around the time of Musicares until I read thru comments about Billy's post. The part I'm having trouble with is he was fired. Like clean out your desk and security will escort you out of the building. Holy crap! Things must have been brewing for awhile that we weren't aware of. I truly think some of this is Stevie's grief. Not excusing her--she married Kim Anderson after Robin died. She has a history of doing insane things in the grieving process. That doesn't excuse the rest of them.

[dontlookdown]

I don’t know.
There’s a lot of speculation going on.
I’m just going to trust that they all came to this decision as adults,
just as they did in 87.
It sucks for us now, but it’s sort of like offering opinions when the neighbors down the street are going through a divorce.
Not really for us to judge and as I said before, they don’t owe fans anything and they aren’t beholden to us.
Nobody is saving lives here or keeping democracies from teetering off the edge.
It’s just a band.
Not sure if I’ll go see them, but I hope some new and interesting music comes out of it.
I think since I lived through the first Lindsey departure, I have to keep an open mind.
As disappointed as I am...

[Lola]

I don’t know.
There’s a lot of speculation going on.
I’m just going to trust that they all came to this decision as adults,
just as they did in 87.
It sucks for us now, but it’s sort of like offering opinions when the neighbors down the street are going through a divorce.
Not really for us to judge and as I said before, they don’t owe fans anything and they aren’t beholden to us.
Nobody is saving lives here or keeping democracies from teetering off the edge.
It’s just a band.
Not sure if I’ll go see them, but I hope some new and interesting music comes out of it.
I think since I lived through the first Lindsey departure, I have to keep an open mind.
As disappointed as I am...

You sound like my sig other--he's trying to help me with gentle reminders that nobody died. He means it seriously like wouldn't it be worse if one of the members had died.

[NotonRodeo]

Unlike 1987, I'm not sticking around to watch this train wreck. I've already seen it. People who don't think history repeats itself are deluding themselves. This will be a disaster.

At least in 1987 it was plausible to think that Fleetwood Mac still had a future and had opportunities to expand creatively. But now? What, have they taken so much drugs that they actually think they are immortal? And seriously, will they allow Finn or Campbell to dictate matters? Lindsey's Mac succeeded because he was in Mick's terms a "martinet" who compelled everybody to get things done properly his way. Yes he was a monomaniac control freak--but to get this bunch of people to accomplish anything he needed to be. Time was a "democratic" album--heck, didn't Christine have her own guitarist?--and look how awful, awful that was.

I remember the band saying how much more fun it was to make Behind the Mask than Tango. Is there anything on BTM remotely resembling Little Lies or Everywhere or Big Love? Even WTTRS was better than anything there.

So that's that then. In hindsight this band should have died thirty years ago. It is now a Dead Band Walking. It's about time to stop pretending it is still alive. Lindsey worked hard to create that illusion, and at his best he almost succeeded. With him gone, they have no chance.

[jbrownsjr]

Actually Tom and Mike fan bases are as divided as Mac fan base. They think Mike can and should do better. Some are hoping this might give him exposure. None of them expect he’ll get to express any creativity with the mac.

You know that If Tom was alive, he’d be appalled. Yet I fully expect Lindsey’s name will now be replaced w Toms in all the endless stories from the stage,

Back in 1980 blah blah blah MEEEEEE blah blah blah TOM blah blah blah MEEEEEEEEEEEEE lbhalbhalbhalbhalbh MEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE $$

4 minutes later... SO THIS SONG IS ABOUT MEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE....

[NotonRodeo]

Back in 1980 blah blah blah MEEEEEE blah blah blah TOM blah blah blah MEEEEEEEEEEEEE lbhalbhalbhalbhalbh MEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE $$

4 minutes later... SO THIS SONG IS ABOUT MEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE....

:laugh:

I think in one of the threads someone quoted her saying that Fleetwood Mac is still around because she gets bored. Indeed she does think everything is about her.

That's why Lindsey was fired. He is the only one on earth who doesn't defer to her as the icon Madonna Nicopeia.

[rhiannondontgo]

Jeez, some of you guys make it sound like Stevie is the wicked witch of the west hatching some evil plot to ruin poor lindsey’s life for no reason. Nobody woke up and randomly said “hey Lindsey, you’re fired because we’re sick of you”. Stevie & Mick aren’t dumb. They both live for money and attention and they know full well that the full rumours line up is what gets them the most of both those things, so neither would ever prefer to tour with the band incomplete.
Meanwhile they had this tour pre-planned and scheduled. I’ve heard from a few sources that there were even contracts already signed and in place. And he pulled out last minute, just like he did in 1987. Sure Stevie has delayed lots of stuff, but warning your band a year in advance that you want to delay a hypothetical tour is very different from signing on for a preplanned tour and then trying to pull out in the 11th hour. I’m sure they put forth every bit of effort to try to get him back on board. If he chose to continue being the hold-out and the rest of the band grew tired of fighting him on it, then his absence is his own fault. There’s a difference between a band spitefully firing somebody for no reason and a band deciding to continue with their plans despite one member’s absence.
If your argument is that you think they should’ve just broken up or that they shouldn’t call the new incarnation “Fleetwood Mac”, I can understand that. But demonizing & attacking the rest of the band while making Lindsey out to be a completely innocent victim with no complicity is ridiculous IMO.

[bwboy]

I remember the band saying how much more fun it was to make Behind the Mask than Tango. Is there anything on BTM remotely resembling Little Lies or Everywhere or Big Love? Even WTTRS was better than anything there.

Since you asked- Save Me, Skies the Limit, Behind the Mask, and As Long As You Follow are great songs, and I would rank Save Me and Follow higher than Little Lies. In the Back of My Mind, Do You Know, Love is Dangerous, and No Questions Asked are also excellent. This version of the Mac I totally loved. Sorry you didn't like it but I understand... I didn't like Time at all, but that album has fans, too. And there are some bombs on Tango- When I See You Again and Family Man are wretched, Welcome to the Room Sara is saved only by the lyrics, and You and I 2 is forgettable fluff.

[bombaysaffires]

Jeez, some of you guys make it sound like Stevie is the wicked witch of the west hatching some evil plot to ruin poor lindsey’s life for no reason. Nobody woke up and randomly said “hey Lindsey, you’re fired because we’re sick of you”. Stevie & Mick aren’t dumb. They both live for money and attention and they know full well that the full rumours line up is what gets them the most of both those things, so neither would ever prefer to tour with the band incomplete.
Meanwhile they had this tour pre-planned and scheduled. I’ve heard from a few sources that there were even contracts already signed and in place. And he pulled out last minute, just like he did in 1987. Sure Stevie has delayed lots of stuff, but warning your band a year in advance that you want to delay a hypothetical tour is very different from signing on for a preplanned tour and then trying to pull out in the 11th hour. I’m sure they put forth every bit of effort to try to get him back on board. If he chose to continue being the hold-out and the rest of the band grew tired of fighting him on it, then his absence is his own fault. There’s a difference between a band spitefully firing somebody for no reason and a band deciding to continue with their plans despite one member’s absence.
If your argument is that you think they should’ve just broken up or that they shouldn’t call the new incarnation “Fleetwood Mac”, I can understand that. But demonizing & attacking the rest of the band while making Lindsey out to be a completely innocent victim with no complicity is ridiculous IMO.


BUT, the story that's out there is actually that STEVIE was the one who issued an ultimatum-- "it's either me or him"-- to the band, not Lindsey.

[guillamene]

starting a clean slate, because it seems that new people keep coming out of the woodwork asking why he "left" every few seconds. some people don't want to accept the sad truth that the band he made huge fashioning its music for the last 43 years betrayed one of their own, a family member.

Lindsey's kids are on the internet very clearly saying - he was fired. and that FM is not FM without him, and how proud of him they are.
his brother is out there too, saying the same.
his wife's IG is sporting #teamlindsey hashtag.

news outlets confirmed that he was fired by the band insiders who don't want their names out there, but want the truth to be known. Rolling Stone and Variety are not gossip rags that put out there some unconfirmed gossip. Billy's leaks pulled the trigger before Fm was ready.

i can't help but wonder what's going on behind the scenes. there is a lot of buzz that Lindsey was fighting it legally, but who knows. not clear whether he's fighting to stay in the band or just suing the pants out of them. i understand all my friends who are FM fans first and are sad that the band's longest and most successful incarnation is dead (and properly moved to post-rumours forum here), and want him back. ii did sign and amplified all the various petitions from people wanting him back. but i can't help thinking how betrayed he must feel by the people he considered family, and that he probably doesn't want to see them for a while now. as far as the band members, Stevie, i'm just sad for. she must be a very unhappy person. but mostly i'm disgusted with Mick. and his cold statement cements it and is lower than low.

from all the backlash, maybe their tour will bomb badly. wouldn't that be karmic considering that they fired him because of money, ie pretty rational calculation that FM minus Lindsey would make more money than FM minus Stevie? :laugh: most general social media comments are laughing at the complete craziness and yet another post-success chimera version of the band. i think with this move they made sure there will be movies made about FM.
Now that the dust is beginning to settle, this is one of the most sensible observations I've read on this mess.Three random thoughts over the past few days:
1.You cannot compare this with 1987 - the 1987 tour was the first in five years and was a virtual comeback. It was successful because it was on the back of TITN and we had 4 tango songs/singles in the set.
2. I listened to the Toronto show from Unleashed tour 2009 yesterday (in 'memory'of LB) and was struck by how good it was with just him and SN.
3. When I first listened to the UK edition of 'The Very Best of Fleetwood Mac' from 2002 -which contained Peter Green era hits, I remember being struck by the sense of a common thread going through ALL of the songs on this collection, despite them being two very different incarnations of the band.

[HomerMcvie]

BUT, the story that's out there is actually that STEVIE was the one who issued an ultimatum-- "it's either me or him"-- to the band, not Lindsey.

Because Lindsey couldn't/wouldn't have said that.

They know which side their bread is buttered on.

[elle]

BUT, the story that's out there is actually that STEVIE was the one who issued an ultimatum-- "it's either me or him"-- to the band, not Lindsey.

Yup. The story this Rhiannon person wrote is the one circulated on Stevie only fans boards, I hear. That’s the story this newest version of post/FM WANTED out there - saying they parted ways makes it look like they are martyrs and are covering for Lindsey letting them down right before the booked tour once again. He was always an a**hole, that story goes. Public would be on their side in that scenario.

But the truth came out because enough people had Lindsey’s back and spoke the truth. Guess he must not be as bad as some are trying to portray him if people have his back so much! Some radio stations are reporting that the band is furious!!

The only positive spin they are getting is their own statements and SN fan boards.

[bombaysaffires]

hmmm... so any response countering the claim that comments about Stevie qualify as "misogynistic" have been removed by mods and/or moved to the 'hot topics' thread so they will be lost. Interesting.

[bwboy]

BUT, the story that's out there is actually that STEVIE was the one who issued an ultimatum-- "it's either me or him"-- to the band, not Lindsey.

That is a rumor, being passed as fact. It seems to validate a few people's feelings on this board. I'll just wait until Lindsey talks before I spread misinformation. I really want to hear his version of what went down and he has no reason to stay silent. Well, there would be only one reason he would keep silent.

[secondhandchain]

BUT, the story that's out there is actually that STEVIE was the one who issued an ultimatum-- "it's either me or him"-- to the band, not Lindsey.

Ironic isn’t it? Back in the day Lindsey said it’s either both of us or I can join the band. She sucks.

[SisterNightroad]

hmmm... so any response countering the claim that comments about Stevie qualify as "misogynistic" have been removed by mods and/or moved to the 'hot topics' thread so they will be lost. Interesting.
I moved that on the Hot Topics thread where it belongs and also responded to it, if anyone simply makes the effort to click either on the redirecting link here in the Rumours board or even directly on the Chit Chat link they'll simply find it there.

[elle]

That is a rumor, being passed as fact. It seems to validate a few people's feelings on this board. I'll just wait until Lindsey talks before I spread misinformation. I really want to hear his version of what went down and he has no reason to stay silent. Well, there would be only one reason he would keep silent.

Nope that was first publicly reported by that Tom Petty insider who got raked over the coals for the whole report. Most stuff that he reported was confirmed since so i’d call this a bit more than a made up rumor.

I don’t see Lindsey talking any times soon. First he is usually pretty classy about not dumping really low stuff in the interviews, and second if he’s suing them and there is some kind of settlement I have no doubt he won’t be allowed to as one of the clauses of the settlement. I hear FM is already fuming with the way reactions are all on his side so far, they would not willingly allow him to add to that by confirming it’s all true.

[dontlookdown]

You sound like my sig other--he's trying to help me with gentle reminders that nobody died. He means it seriously like wouldn't it be worse if one of the members had died.

Exactly. And what the Heartbreakers just went through is a close reminder.
I’m honestly gutted with what happened given how long Ive been a fan; but the shows have gotten a little paint-by-numbers lately. And as much as I loved the idea of a farewell tour, the
setlist would have been constructed in our sleep. And I’m not interested in seeing them phone in performances anymore.
So at least this is something different, and Lindsey will be missed.
But Mike is always shockingly good. And has been for decades.

[rhiannondontgo]

BUT, the story that's out there is actually that STEVIE was the one who issued an ultimatum-- "it's either me or him"-- to the band, not Lindsey.

I’m in no way disillusioned here. I don’t doubt that she issued that final ultimatum but my point is, she did not wake up and say “hey let’s break up the band today and ruin LB’s life for sh*ts & giggles”. She may not always like him but she knows full well that keeping the whole band together is the best thing to do financially, creatively, and for PR purposes. They all know that. So sh*t really had to hit the fan to get 4/5 FM members to just give up and move on without such a vital part of the band. While none of us actually know what the final fight was that caused them to actually go through with something this drastic, it’s been said by multiple people that the drama was sparked by LB wanting to postpone the upcoming FM tour to focus on his solo project. Which is backed up by the fact that he is indeed in the studio currently working on his solo album. Clearly that’s not the whole cause because if it was, they’d just announce that Lindsey won’t be joining them on this specific tour due to scheduling conflicts. Instead they came out and said flat-out that LB is no longer in the band and that it’s “final” and “firm”, leading me to believe that the disagreement ended up becoming far deeper and more personal than just the schedule issue. I assume the ensuing argument over the schedule started an even bigger fight and all the lingering resentment and bitterness just came to a head.
Either way, I don’t believe that any one band member is entirely at fault and I fail to see any possible scenario where LB isn’t somewhat complicit in the drama that lead up to this. There’s no “hero” or “villain” here. There’s 5 very imperfect, petty, difficult people who constantly make each other miserable and have never been able to fully co-exist peacefully. This situation sucks but if they can’t tour all together, they can’t tour all together. I’m not going to tell them to break up. There’s still lots of fans that love the girls and while it’s not preferential, would still rather see 4/5 members than never see them again.

[mitzo]

Maybe Lindsey really crossed the line, by getting physically aggressive. It has happened before. That would get him kicked out, surely.

[Frankenstein]

Back in 1980 blah blah blah MEEEEEE blah blah blah TOM blah blah blah MEEEEEEEEEEEEE lbhalbhalbhalbhalbh MEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE $$

4 minutes later... SO THIS SONG IS ABOUT MEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE....

Stevie when asked about the firing: “If Tom were here, he would say ‘Stevie, I’m so proud of you. This pain with Lindsey’s gone on too long. Go and write some real songs, and don’t buy that doll.’ I know he’s looking down on all of us and smiling.”

:lol:

[dontlookdown]

Read Mike Campbell’s statement on Tom Petty official Instagram account.
It makes it hurt a little bit less.

[SteveMacD]

I’m in no way disillusioned here. I don’t doubt that she issued that final ultimatum but my point is, she did not wake up and say “hey let’s break up the band today and ruin LB’s life for sh*ts & giggles”. She may not always like him but she knows full well that keeping the whole band together is the best thing to do financially, creatively, and for PR purposes. They all know that. So sh*t really had to hit the fan to get 4/5 FM members to just give up and move on without such a vital part of the band. While none of us actually know what the final fight was that caused them to actually go through with something this drastic, it’s been said by multiple people that the drama was sparked by LB wanting to postpone the upcoming FM tour to focus on his solo project. Which is backed up by the fact that he is indeed in the studio currently working on his solo album. Clearly that’s not the whole cause because if it was, they’d just announce that Lindsey won’t be joining them on this specific tour due to scheduling conflicts. Instead they came out and said flat-out that LB is no longer in the band and that it’s “final” and “firm”, leading me to believe that the disagreement ended up becoming far deeper and more personal than just the schedule issue. I assume the ensuing argument over the schedule started an even bigger fight and all the lingering resentment and bitterness just came to a head.
Either way, I don’t believe that any one band member is entirely at fault and I fail to see any possible scenario where LB isn’t somewhat complicit in the drama that lead up to this. There’s no “hero” or “villain” here. There’s 5 very imperfect, petty, difficult people who constantly make each other miserable and have never been able to fully co-exist peacefully. This situation sucks but if they can’t tour all together, they can’t tour all together. I’m not going to tell them to break up. There’s still lots of fans that love the girls and while it’s not preferential, would still rather see 4/5 members than never see them again.
This.

Nobody died, here.

Lindsey was visibly unhappy with Fleetwood Mac (or at least Stevie), and all but said as much. And let’s be honest, many of his fans have stated that they’d rather see Lindsey do a solo tour than another cash grab tour.

As for the new lineup, I can’t imagine better additions. Yeah, I’d rather have had the classic lineup, but I can’t argue the merits of the new guys. I’d go see any band with them. Glad it’s Fleetwood Mac.

Personally, I was over the LB-SN drama a long time ago and had written off the band unless Christine returned. Hopefully, that drama gets even further buried.

[dontlookdown]

This.

Nobody died, here.

Lindsey was visibly unhappy with Fleetwood Mac (or at least Stevie), and all but said as much. And let’s be honest, many of his fans have stated that they’d rather see Lindsey do a solo tour than another cash grab tour.

As for the new lineup, I can’t imagine better additions. Yeah, I’d rather have had the classic lineup, but I can’t argue the merits of the new guys. I’d go see any band with them. Glad it’s Fleetwood Mac.

Personally, I was over the LB-SN drama a long time ago and had written off the band unless Christine returned. Hopefully, that drama gets even further buried.


Agree 100%.
I found Rick and Billy to be pretty bland.
That’s a word I’d never use for Mike Campbell.

[TrueFaith77]

Read Mike Campbell’s statement on Tom Petty official Instagram account.
It makes it hurt a little bit less.



Link? I couldn’t find his insta

[Wdm6789]

What was the disagreement? It had to be pretty bad for Mick and Stevie to let this happen. One would think that those two are the most aware of the novelty that the Rumours five carries. At this point in time, it’s reaching the end of the road for them, and especially after Christine came back, when no one bought that would ever happen, they’re really not going to keep the five together? Really?

[SteveMacD]

Agree 100%.
I found Rick and Billy to be pretty bland.
That’s a word I’d never use for Mike Campbell.
Or Neil Finn, for that matter. I like that they brought in someone who has experience leading successful bands as well as one of the most tasteful lead guitarists in the history of rock.

I really like Billy and Rick (and Bekka), but they were out of their league in Fleetwood Mac. Fleetwood Mac needs people who can make bold musical statements, not glorified sidemen.

[Lola]

Link? I couldn’t find his insta


https://www.instagram.com/p/BhcoOkijGsN/?hl=en

[bombaysaffires]

I hope no one blames Mike for any of this. :distress:

[Mr Scarrott]

https://www.instagram.com/p/BhcoOkijGsN/?hl=en

Thank you for finding this. I know virtually nothing about Mike Campbell, but this is a good place to start. His statement is quite graceful.

[Tango]

https://www.instagram.com/p/BhcoOkijGsN/?hl=en

Thank you for putting this up:

tompettyofficialStatement from Mike Campbell on joining Fleetwood Mac: "Though I was sad to hear Lindsey Buckingham is no longer with Fleetwood Mac, I am honored and excited to join the band. Lindsey is one of my favorite musical artists. A true genius at songwriting and guitar playing. I intend to honor his songs while at the same time bring my musicality to the band. After one rehearsal I can tell it’s going to be an amazing collaboration. I am also very happy to have an opportunity to play with Neil Finn, who I greatly admire. Fleetwood Mac not only has one of the greatest rhythm sections in rock history, it also has two of the finest voices and songwriters in Stevie Nicks and Christine McVie. I am looking forward to the tour with great anticipation."

[gldstwmn]

You sound like my sig other--he's trying to help me with gentle reminders that nobody died. He means it seriously like wouldn't it be worse if one of the members had died.
Yes. And this forum would probably say Stevie killed them. :laugh:

[Storms123]

While the personal drama with this crew has permeating through the veins of this band, this stunt wreaks of something more. I can't see Stevie issuing an ultimatum like that for a few reasons:
1. She loves spinning her tall/long tails about days gone by with Lindsey and how they got thru all their "stuff" learned to forgive, "this was the most beautiful poem I ever wrote about him...." And she knows fans love this. The Sara kissy face interactions and the Landslide flintiness. She knows how to act when she wants to
2. She is a smart business woman and part of her legacy is tied to this bands legacy. Lindsey is intricately woven into it. Cannot avoid it.

Sure, she will be able to weave some stories about Tom on this tour, but..... Not sure if the band expected the backlash they are getting. Are they expecting this tour to be as successful as "On With the Show" Stevie's die-hards aren't going to fill the arena if they aren't getting her gothic trunk of lost songs, and the Stevie die-hards may not know any of the FM deep cuts that have been alluded to getting pulled out here.

The thing most upsetting in all of this is the dismissive nature of the press release. "We wish Lindsey the best"....His fingerprints are all over this band and his ghost will be haunting the stage during this tour. Whatever it took to get them here is really sad. It is hurting the legacy of this band. The one thing the 4 remaining members are short on is time. Let's face it, that's why they were able to pull Mike Campbell into this mess. I do not mean to be disrespectful here to Tom (huge fan) or Mike, but that is a fact.
Fans of FM are being robbed of a farewell tour. This is a cover band of really talented musicians. My money is better served elsewhere. And it breaks my heart.

[gldstwmn]

hmmm... so any response countering the claim that comments about Stevie qualify as "misogynistic" have been removed by mods and/or moved to the 'hot topics' thread so they will be lost. Interesting.

Misogyny is so irrelevant these days.

[gldstwmn]

Agree 100%.
I found Rick and Billy to be pretty bland.
That’s a word I’d never use for Mike Campbell.
Much to the chagrin of some folks here this tour is going to sell well and be a joy to witness. Something different from Fleetwood Mac... Finally!

[dontlookdown]

Link? I couldn’t find his insta

https://instagram.com/p/BhcoOkijGsN/

[dontlookdown]

Much to the chagrin of some folks here this tour is going to sell well and be a joy to witness. Something different from Fleetwood Mac... Finally!

For fans who have been to a Tom Petty show, I think
we’ll be ok with this.
We’ll always miss Lindsey, but the music is going to be very powerful with Mike.

[elle]

Read Mike Campbell’s statement on Tom Petty official Instagram account.
It makes it hurt a little bit less.

it doesn't.

but it makes Mike look better, for sure. much better than the other 4 and their official despicable statement.

[elle]

I’m in no way disillusioned here. I don’t doubt that she issued that final ultimatum but my point is, she did not wake up and say “hey let’s break up the band today and ruin LB’s life for sh*ts & giggles”. S

sadly, i think that may have been exactly what happened. and she will probably regret it in a few years if he understandably decides to never speak with her again.

the alternative would be that she was plotting this for years. now that would be truly sad. :distress:

[TrueFaith77]

it doesn't.

but it makes Mike look better, for sure. much better than the other 4 and their official despicable statement.

I wonder who wrote it

[TrueFaith77]

sadly, i think that may have been exactly what happened. and she will probably regret it in a few years if he understandably decides to never speak with her again.

the alternative would be that she was plotting this for years. now that would be truly sad. :distress:

As soon as BuckVie happened, the plan was being hatched

[HomerMcvie]

As soon as BuckVie happened, the plan was being hatched

Absolutely. She HATED it, and was a jealous slug that they recorded without her.

[secondhandchain]

I will even bet that she records again with the band now that she has Mike Campbell. See? This has STEVIE written ALL OVER IT. She didn't want that horrible monster who ruined all her songs. You know, the guy who produced Gypsy, Rhiannon, Dreams etc.... That guy. SCREW HER. I know this is her. I know it.

[bombaysaffires]

I will even bet that she records again with the band now that she has Mike Campbell. See? This has STEVIE written ALL OVER IT. She didn't want that horrible monster who ruined all her songs. You know, the guy who produced Gypsy, Rhiannon, Dreams etc.... That guy. SCREW HER. I know this is her. I know it.

she will suddenly have a burst of "new found creativity"

[rhiannondontgo]

sadly, i think that may have been exactly what happened. and she will probably regret it in a few years if he understandably decides to never speak with her again.

the alternative would be that she was plotting this for years. now that would be truly sad. :distress:

While she’s a narcissistic, b*tchy diva for sure (and I don’t mean that as an insult, I actually find it entertaining most the time. It kinda makes me just like her more), she definitely isn’t dumb. She’s been sick of him for years now and has done just fine pretending there’s still love there and playing up the whole Buckingham Nicks fantasy love affair for the crowd. She planned all of that scripted love BS on her own. I even remember Linds in an article in the early 2000’s talking about how Stevie and Mick came to him with the idea to put their microphones closer together and have them come up with pre-planned affectionate gestures. The woman knows how to play the game and the goal is always the same: get as much money & positive attention as possible. Anything with Buckingham Nicks involved is guaranteed to do well, but now the stakes have gotten even higher with the full rumours line up reunited. She absolutely knows that her pay raises exponentially as long as all 5 are present and she wouldn’t pass that up. Neither would Mick. They have no real motive to wake up one day and boot him out for no reason. She has nothing to gain. Less money. More negative publicity. It would be pointless.
If she just wanted to tour with a heartbreaker, she’d add them to her solo band. If she had no intention of touring with Lindsey, she would not have willingly signed on to be contractually obligated to another FM tour (and yes, Lindsey was still assumed to be part of this when she signed on).
I still firmly believe the most likely situation was they signed on for the tour fully expecting to go out as the full band and when arguments arose (which they always do, whether it’s over scheduling, set lists, pay grades, or whatever else), it just got out of control and for whatever reason, they just couldn’t work together again at this point.

[secondhandchain]

she will suddenly have a burst of "new found creativity"

Can you imagine the B.S. quotes the world is going to have to suffer through? "I realized it's about the art and who cares about sales" VOMIT

[elle]

While she’s a narcissistic, b*tchy diva for sure.

yes she's very smart and savvy as you say.

about the money, here is something you may find interesting to read that i posted earlier in Lindsey forum, i'd love to know what you think:

http://ledge.fleetwoodmac.net/showpost.php?p=1222658&postcount=12

[rhiannondontgo]

yes she's very smart and savvy as you say.

about the money, here is something you may find interesting to read that i posted earlier in Lindsey forum, i'd love to know what you think:

http://ledge.fleetwoodmac.net/showpost.php?p=1222658&postcount=12

While it’s not entirely implausible, I still think FM is worth the money to her. I’d wager that her average solo tour probably grosses about 1/3 of the average FM tour. After dividing the pay, she probably makes roughly the same amount from both. The major difference being that at solo shows, it’s just her up there nonstop for over 2 hours. Back in the day i’m sure that would please her narcissism, but now I think she probably benefits from the off time. With FM, many songs only require her to stand there and sing harmonies on a few lines and some don’t even need her presence at all. So basically FM makes her around the same amount of money for one-third of the work and 10x the publicity, which she can then use to promote her own interests too like she did so often during OWTS. Call me crazy but I also think it’s likely that she genuinely likes spending time with Chris and Mick (I doubt they enjoy it nearly as much but hey, the woman = $$$ so they’re pleasant to her either way). And she got FM to hire her best friends to sing back up so she’s still surrounded by people she loves whether she’s on her own or with the band. In actuality, I really think the only thing she doesn’t like about FM is Lindsey. But I still don’t think she had some grand plan to sign on and then get herself or him fired. I just think both of them think of the money/publicity first and always assume they’ll be able to work out the kinks but the second they see each other again they realize they underestimated the level of resentment and hatred and everything just goes to sh*t. This time it just reached new levels.

[The Catdancer]

So here's my take on this whole mess. And you might not be interested because I haven't been here in years but here goes. I think it's a combination of things. This didn't just come out of the blue and like someone said:"They didn't wake up one day and said:"Oh, let's make Lindsey's life hell".

First there's the matter of jealousy. I think Miss Nicks couldn't stand it that they made a record without her despite the fact that she said in the press that she wished them all the best. If she did, than why wasn't it called a Fleetwood Mac album? Because that's what it was, it had 4 members on it. But for whatever reason, it wasn't called Fleetwood Mac. So they called it Buckingham McVie. That's a slap in her face, it refers back to Buckingham Nicks.
Lindsey & Christine worked together which was pretty successful. Go back to the old days when Lindsey & Stevie first joined the band and Lindsey wrote World Turning with Christine. She was extremely jealous. I remember reading back then that she said:"He can write a song with her but not with me". That got her pissed off (although they did write Frozen Love together but I don't know the circumstances of that process). Not only that, Buckingham McVie had a pretty successful tour, they got good reviews.

Second there's the abuse. There is no doubt whatsoever in my mind that Lindsey physically abused her. I'm a victim of domestic violence myself and I know the signs, I know the looks. It's scary. And very stressful to work with someone who has abused you in the past. An example of the fear: I hadn't talked to/seen my ex in 15 years and all of a sudden there's a message from him on Facebook. It's been 15 years, I'm in the USA, he's in Europe. I have nothing to fear, he's a million miles away. That's not how it works. I was scared to death. I had to rationalize my thoughts.
I've seen footage of a concert in 1979 where Lindsey grabs Stevie during Angel and she was scared. You could see it in her eyes. She was scared to death. I wish I knew of a way to post it here. However, having said that, she also said, years later, that when she saw him with his kids she made a huge mistake letting him go...

Third there is the power. He has softened through the years, has grown, is not abusive anymore but still pushes her buttons but finally she can say:"It's him or me". She has nothing left to lose by saying that. Her solo career is very successful. Even if Fleetwood Mac would have said:"Well Stevie, we rather have him", there's no loss. She'd just go on her merry solo way and be just as successful as he has ever been. Add Mike Campbell to her band and make another 24kg.

There's one thing that she forgets though: if it weren't for Lindsey she would never have been a part of Fleetwood Mac. She'd been a waitress, a cleaning lady until she inherited all this money from her parents and would live in a big house by herself (with probably her brother and Lori) and her doggies. But because she became a part of Fleetwood Mac and not only that, she became the face of Fleetwood Mac, she became arrogant. I've loved this woman since '77 so this is very hard for me to say but what I've seen over the years is that she changed from a rock 'n roll hippie into a rock 'n roll diva. Back in the 70's, 80's early 90's, she was sweet, compassionate, humble, patient, a very warm personality. I've met her a few times during those era's and I had nothing but praise for her. That's why I can say this.
Another thing she forgets is Lindsey's magic on her songs. There's nobody on this earth who can and will understand her songs as well as he does. Even Christine said about Dreams:"It's just 3 bloody chords" to which Lindsey replied:"Yeah, but they're the right chords". He worked his magic and boom, they had a number one hit.

All 'n all, I just think she was fed up with him. "How dare he ask for a delay when he just toured with Christine and wrote all those beautiful songs with her". What's not important in her mind is that she delayed and delayed and delayed. And Mick went with the money as he usually does.

As far as the true fans are concerned... I guess we're just an after thought.

[NotonRodeo]

As far as the true fans are concerned... I guess we're just an after thought.

We have been an afterthought for decades, and it's frankly our fault as fans, since we put up with their juvenile delinquencies. All those people yelling at FM on FB? I am willing to bet when the tour comes around they will all buy the overpriced tickets anyway. Heck, the attention may even make radio play more of their songs, so the icon can go "ching-ching" or something and make some improvements to her house with her royalty check.

I have not seen the number of their "likes" on the FM page on FB diminish these past few days.

[button-lip]

sadly, i think that may have been exactly what happened. and she will probably regret it in a few years if he understandably decides to never speak with her again.

the alternative would be that she was plotting this for years. now that would be truly sad. :distress:

I think she was plotting this for years. Maybe since the BuckVie album.

I don't know if she will regret it. I don't know this woman anymore. But my bet is that she will. And I really, really hope he shuts the door on her face.

[button-lip]

As soon as BuckVie happened, the plan was being hatched

Bingo! :xoxo::xoxo:

Sometimes I wonder is she created all this mess just to catch his attention....

[button-lip]

I will even bet that she records again with the band now that she has Mike Campbell. See? This has STEVIE written ALL OVER IT. She didn't want that horrible monster who ruined all her songs. You know, the guy who produced Gypsy, Rhiannon, Dreams etc.... That guy. SCREW HER. I know this is her. I know it.

YES!!!! THANK YOU!! :xoxo:

she will suddenly have a burst of "new found creativity"

I'm not so sure about that. She doesn't want to do anything but tour. I honestly don't know what she's planning to do with all that money. She has no kids to send to college, no relatives to care financially for. Couldn't she just be happy instead of ruining a family's life?

[jeets2000]

the alternative would be that she was plotting this for years. now that would be truly sad. :distress:

I’m not sure I believe this, and I feel like a bit of a conspiracy theorist even writing it, but my mind keeps going back to the power dynamic in the band. (Also: full disclosure, I have been unable to keep up with every post in the past week, so if someone has already floated this theory, feel free to insult/ignore.) :laugh:

Stevie famously did not enjoy what she felt was the overly masculine nature of the band, specifically the live performances, during the 2003/04 tour. A few years later, before the Unleashed tour, the Sheryl Crow trial balloon was floated and subsequently popped, from all accounts, by Lindsey. God knows Mick (and John :distress:) doesn't seem to care who comes and goes from his namesake band and the idea of adding Crow could have tapped them into new audiences, ultimately leading to more $$$. But Mick and John, despite it being their band, were almost secondary members in that era (presumably they felt they couldn't tour with just Lindsey or just Stevie).

Is it possible that the seed was planted even then (2008) for all of this? Obviously there was no way of knowing Christine would come back. But Stevie lost that face off because she and Lindsey were on equal footing in 2008. When that dynamic changed, they got one tour under the belts, but at the first sign of tension, she pulled the ripcord. I agree with Elle's post in the Lindsey forum -- I don't think this is about money for Stevie.

I know it sounds nuts, and like I said, I'm not sure even I believe this, but I can't for the life of me figure out what could have triggered the move to fire LB. It's too extreme for a disagreement over tour dates, to me at least.

[gldstwmn]

Second there's the abuse. There is no doubt whatsoever in my mind that Lindsey physically abused her. I'm a victim of domestic violence myself and I know the signs, I know the looks. It's scary. And very stressful to work with someone who has abused you in the past. An example of the fear: I hadn't talked to/seen my ex in 15 years and all of a sudden there's a message from him on Facebook. It's been 15 years, I'm in the USA, he's in Europe. I have nothing to fear, he's a million miles away. That's not how it works. I was scared to death. I had to rationalize my thoughts.
I've seen footage of a concert in 1979 where Lindsey grabs Stevie during Angel and she was scared. You could see it in her eyes. She was scared to death. I wish I knew of a way to post it here. However, having said that, she also said, years later, that when she saw him with his kids she made a huge mistake letting him go...



+1000. They may have each sought treatment for their issues but they've never been treated for the issues between them. PTSD and other issues can pop back up after years of being dormant. I am not saying that this is the case but I do know that at the age of 70 I would not be trilled to have to work with an ex for months on end. Somewhere between Classic East and Musicares is where things really started to go off the rails. The reviews said he played and uninspired set at Classic East and he acted like a bit of an as$ solo on the red carpet at Musicares. There are photos and video. You can see it more in the video. I will find it later and post.

[lilyfee]

While she’s a narcissistic, b*tchy diva for sure (and I don’t mean that as an insult, I actually find it entertaining most the time. It kinda makes me just like her more), she definitely isn’t dumb. She’s been sick of him for years now and has done just fine pretending there’s still love there and playing up the whole Buckingham Nicks fantasy love affair for the crowd. She planned all of that scripted love BS on her own. I even remember Linds in an article in the early 2000’s talking about how Stevie and Mick came to him with the idea to put their microphones closer together and have them come up with pre-planned affectionate gestures. The woman knows how to play the game and the goal is always the same: get as much money & positive attention as possible. Anything with Buckingham Nicks involved is guaranteed to do well, but now the stakes have gotten even higher with the full rumours line up reunited. She absolutely knows that her pay raises exponentially as long as all 5 are present and she wouldn’t pass that up. Neither would Mick. They have no real motive to wake up one day and boot him out for no reason. She has nothing to gain. Less money. More negative publicity. It would be pointless.
If she just wanted to tour with a heartbreaker, she’d add them to her solo band. If she had no intention of touring with Lindsey, she would not have willingly signed on to be contractually obligated to another FM tour (and yes, Lindsey was still assumed to be part of this when she signed on).
I still firmly believe the most likely situation was they signed on for the tour fully expecting to go out as the full band and when arguments arose (which they always do, whether it’s over scheduling, set lists, pay grades, or whatever else), it just got out of control and for whatever reason, they just couldn’t work together again at this point.

While I don't appreciate your language towards Stevie, I agree with your argument. I think the band imploded, as usual, not that there was some conspiracy to kick Lindsey out.

How long have we been waiting for a tour announcement? We all expected the Buckingham McVie album to be a Fleetwood Mac album, and I think we were all surprised (albeit pleasently so) when Lindsey and Christine went on tour. Stevie extended her tour as well and everyone seemed happy. Everyone got what they wanted out of the past few years (well, us fans excluded, of course). Lindsey, Christine, Mick and Stevie all publicly mentioned the upcoming Fleetwood Mac tour and everyone seemed to be on board that it would be happening around this time. We've all been waiting for an announcement or some indication that the band is rehearsing or... anything! And the lack of announcement has fueled rumors that there was trouble brewing below the surface. Now we see the result.

[dreamsunwind]

I really think people need to stop speculating or acting as if they know what could've happened behind closed doors in regards to a relationship that ended over 40 years ago. There's literally no way anyone who wasn't right there could know.
And I 100% think that Lindsey getting kicked out had nothing to do with anything from decades ago. That's practically an entirely different world to them now and they've been through a whole lot and gone through new experiences since then.
Something went down NOW. Maybe he threw a fit over them playing the same old songs, realistically he probably did want them to delay the tour so he could work on solo music because playing those same old songs was ~stifling his creativity~. Whatever it was, Stevie probably got pissed and it all went downhill from there resulting in where we're at now.

[elle]

and the muddying of the facts and speculations is successfully continuing..........

http://www.kansascity.com/entertainment/ent-columns-blogs/back-to-rockville/article208690854.html

Fleetwood Mac's split with Lindsey Buckingham could be band's most damaging

BY TIMOTHY FINN

[email protected]
April 12, 2018 01:53 PM

Fleetwood Mac is waging a dicey bet that its beloved hit songs are more popular than its most vital member.

When the band hits the road later this year, Lindsey Buckingham will not be present. Monday, Fleetwood Mac bomb-shelled the music world by announcing it had parted ways with Buckingham, arguably the band’s centerpiece for the past 40-plus years. It wasn’t explicitly clear if Buckingham quit or was fired (although the consensus was that Buckingham was given his walking papers).

In his place, the band hired Mike Campbell, guitarists for Tom Petty’s Heartbreakers, and Neil Finn, instrumentalist and vocalist for Crowded House, Split Enz and the Finn Brothers.

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inRead invented by Teads
We’ve witnessed this scenario before with Fleetwood Mac. In 1987, Buckingham left the band (creative differences) and was replaced by sidemen Billy Burnette and Rick Vito. He returned 10 years later, for a reunion tour, and remained with the band until this week.

And even before Buckingham and Stevie Nicks joined the band in 1975, Fleetwood Mac went through several significant departures, including Jeremy Spencer and Bob Welch.

This puts Fleetwood Mac among a growing group of classic-rock bands touring with replacement members. The Eagles just visited the Sprint Center with their latest lineup, which includes only one founding member, Don Henley.

When co-founder Glenn Frey died in January 2016, it seemed likely that the Eagles were done as a touring band — until they announced in 2017 they’d enlisted Vince Gill and Frey’s son, Deacon Frey, to fill in alongside Joe Walsh, Timothy B. Schmit and several touring musicians.

Reviews of the Eagles’ tour have been glowing. Gill is a natural fit for the Eagles’ sound, and Frey resembles his father, vocally and physically.

Likewise, when Brian May and Roger Taylor of Queen hired former American Idol contestant Adam Lambert to fill in for the late Freddie Mercury (and tour as Queen + Adam Lambert), even skeptics were impressed with the results. Same with the Who: Roger Daltrey and Pete Townshend delivered a worthwhile show when they visited the Sprint Center in April 2016.

The list goes on: AC/DC is down to one founding member, lead guitarist Angus Young, and is now on its third lead singer, Axl Rose.

Donald Fagen is coming to Starlight Theatre later this year, touring as Steely Dan, though his co-founder, Walter Becker, died in September. The opener for that show: the Doobie Brothers, who are down to two founding members, Tom Johnston and Patrick Simmons.

There is plenty of precedent for Fleetwood Mac’s move, but Buckingham’s departure feels different. For one thing, he didn’t die. For another, he is the primary force behind the band’s live shows, as a vocalist, a guitarist and a stage presence.

He had a heavy influence on the band’s studio sound, especially on the “Tusk” album, which took the band’s sound away from the crisp, polished pop sounds of its blockbuster predecessor, “Rumours.” He also proved himself as a solo artist on his first two albums, “Law and Order” and the ecstatically unhinged “Go Insane.”

Lindsay B Fleetwood Mac.JPG
Lindsey Buckingham, a member of the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame band Fleetwood Mac, rehearses with band mate Christine McVie at Sony Studios in Culver City on Wednesday, May 17, 2017. Buckingham is leaving the band and won't be joining them on tour.

Campbell is as good a guitarist as any and should be able to approximate Buckingham’s playing, though they have distinctly different styles. As a friend put it: “(Buckingham) is a finger-picker. Good luck with ‘Big Love.’”

But Campbell alone could bring in some Petty fans in need of a Heartbreakers fix. Plus there is a connection between the two bands. Petty was Nicks’ duet partner on “Stop Dragging My Heart Around,” one of her biggest solo singles. And Buckingham sang background vocals on “Walls (Circus),” a track from Petty and the Heartbreakers’ “She’s The One” soundtrack.

Finn is a refined vocalist and musician who could elevate Fleetwood Mac’s sound much like Gill did the Eagles’, but he is not widely known among mainstream rock fans.

The new ensemble no doubt will faithfully re-create the hits and favorites. But some things can’t be replicated, starting with the history and chemistry between Buckingham and Nicks, an often tumultuous relationship that goes back to the early ’70s and their pre-Mac “Buckingham Nicks” album.

Nicks singing "Go Your Own Way," Buckingham's diatribe about the end of their romance, won't be the same with Finn on the other end.

Fleetwood Mac withstood Christine McVie's departure from the band from 1998 to 2014, but her absence altered their live shows. The band performed twice at the Sprint Center during her retirement, in May 2009 and April 2013. In that 2009 show, they performed two of McVie's songs, "Say You Love Me" and "Don't Stop," her duet with Buckingham.

In the 2013 show they performed only "Don't Stop." Will they cut most of Buckingham's songs from the upcoming tour? That seems unfathomable, nearly as unfathomable as watching someone else perform them.

In the wake of the split, stories have arisen about Buckingham and his behavior within the group and toward Nicks and other women. The Washington Post this week ran a story about Buckingham that asked if he was “rock’s biggest jerk or misunderstood genius?”

All seemed well earlier this year. In January the group convened in New York to perform after accepting the MusicCares Person of the Year.

During his speech, Buckingham told the audience why the band thrived despite all the turmoil: "Not very far below that level of dysfunction is what really exists, and what we are feeling even more now in our career, which is love. This has always been a group of chemistry."

That chemistry has been altered dramatically, and now the rest of the band is betting that it can go forward and thrive on their fans' love for those many great songs and the memories they arouse. At this point, the odds seem stacked against them.

Lindsey Buckingham, a member of the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame band Fleetwood Mac, rehearses with band mate Christine McVie at Sony Studios in Culver City on Wednesday, May 17, 2017. Buckingham is leaving the band and won't be joining them on tour. Tribune News Service

[elle]

So here's my take on this whole mess. And you might not be interested because I haven't been here in years but here goes. I think it's a combination of things. This didn't just come out of the blue and like someone said:"They didn't wake up one day and said:"Oh, let's make Lindsey's life hell".

First there's the matter of jealousy. I think Miss Nicks couldn't stand it that they made a record without her despite the fact that she said in the press that she wished them all the best. If she did, than why wasn't it called a Fleetwood Mac album? Because that's what it was, it had 4 members on it. But for whatever reason, it wasn't called Fleetwood Mac. So they called it Buckingham McVie. That's a slap in her face, it refers back to Buckingham Nicks.
Lindsey & Christine worked together which was pretty successful. Go back to the old days when Lindsey & Stevie first joined the band and Lindsey wrote World Turning with Christine. She was extremely jealous. I remember reading back then that she said:"He can write a song with her but not with me". That got her pissed off (although they did write Frozen Love together but I don't know the circumstances of that process). Not only that, Buckingham McVie had a pretty successful tour, they got good reviews.

Second there's the abuse. There is no doubt whatsoever in my mind that Lindsey physically abused her. I'm a victim of domestic violence myself and I know the signs, I know the looks. It's scary. And very stressful to work with someone who has abused you in the past. An example of the fear: I hadn't talked to/seen my ex in 15 years and all of a sudden there's a message from him on Facebook. It's been 15 years, I'm in the USA, he's in Europe. I have nothing to fear, he's a million miles away. That's not how it works. I was scared to death. I had to rationalize my thoughts.
I've seen footage of a concert in 1979 where Lindsey grabs Stevie during Angel and she was scared. You could see it in her eyes. She was scared to death. I wish I knew of a way to post it here. However, having said that, she also said, years later, that when she saw him with his kids she made a huge mistake letting him go...

Third there is the power. He has softened through the years, has grown, is not abusive anymore but still pushes her buttons but finally she can say:"It's him or me". She has nothing left to lose by saying that. Her solo career is very successful. Even if Fleetwood Mac would have said:"Well Stevie, we rather have him", there's no loss. She'd just go on her merry solo way and be just as successful as he has ever been. Add Mike Campbell to her band and make another 24kg.

There's one thing that she forgets though: if it weren't for Lindsey she would never have been a part of Fleetwood Mac. She'd been a waitress, a cleaning lady until she inherited all this money from her parents and would live in a big house by herself (with probably her brother and Lori) and her doggies. But because she became a part of Fleetwood Mac and not only that, she became the face of Fleetwood Mac, she became arrogant. I've loved this woman since '77 so this is very hard for me to say but what I've seen over the years is that she changed from a rock 'n roll hippie into a rock 'n roll diva. Back in the 70's, 80's early 90's, she was sweet, compassionate, humble, patient, a very warm personality. I've met her a few times during those era's and I had nothing but praise for her. That's why I can say this.
Another thing she forgets is Lindsey's magic on her songs. There's nobody on this earth who can and will understand her songs as well as he does. Even Christine said about Dreams:"It's just 3 bloody chords" to which Lindsey replied:"Yeah, but they're the right chords". He worked his magic and boom, they had a number one hit.

All 'n all, I just think she was fed up with him. "How dare he ask for a delay when he just toured with Christine and wrote all those beautiful songs with her". What's not important in her mind is that she delayed and delayed and delayed. And Mick went with the money as he usually does.

As far as the true fans are concerned... I guess we're just an after thought.

this is so perfectly said, Debbie. thank you! :wavey: :xoxo:

[Storms123]

I think this is an interesting perspective that will play itself out over the next few weeks/months. How are they going to roll this tour out? Full blown? I don't think they can. They need to test markets. This is an expensive mounting, and if it's going to "not be as robust" as OWTS, they need to be able to pivot/pull back/bail. They are all over 65 (may be not the new Neil) You never know when one of them will need a stent put in or hip replacement last minute. I don't mean to be flip, but I don't think the marketing around this one is going to be as cut and dry as previous tours.

[SteveMacD]

LOL....

It was written by Timothy Finn. I assume/hope not Neil’s brother, Tim Finn. Otherwise, talk about sibling rivalry.

[elle]

i talked to my 14 yo daughter this morning, while driving her to school. i told her Fleetwood Mac fired Lindsey. she was like, what? how does that even happen?

she pondered it a bit, and then came up with this: "i guess they just must have gone senile."

i had to laugh. from the mouths of babes! kids are alright, they cut through the crap and come up with the most plausible explanation. :]

[John Run]

https://www.instagram.com/p/Bhfs0bhAAWD/?hl=en&taken-by=kbchrush

As visitor to the Penguin back to the days of Marty and Lisa in the Mid 1990's, I have experienced many highs and lows with this band, but this is by far the deepest sadness I have ever felt regarding any Fleetwood Mac happening.

It is now clear as evidenced by Lindsey's family's social media musings that this was not Lindsey wanting out. For all his personal failings in the 70s and 80s, he has essentially lived his life over the last 20 plus years as a person devoted to his family and the musical output of this band. He has led it musically, as its most consistent spokesperson and stage presence since 1997, and the band probably would not have had this 20 year second act if it was not for his vision and persistence.

I suspect the Washington Post article was a "friend of FM mgmt" piece to fire a shot across Lindsey's bow that in this "me too" era we will drag up every piece of the past we can, factual or not, relevant or reformed, to embarrass you and your family if you do not play nice.

It is sad that this how it will end for FM & Lindsey. Don't fool yourself, the tour will do just fine. The guys they brought in are talented, the draw is the name of the band and Stevie. Doesn't mean it is right or that I will attend. If I did, I would pay for a front row seat and stand with my back to the stage for the duration.

In all reality this tour will be the end of the band, so its final snap shot in what is for sure the last decade of some of the members' lives, will be this separation that will permanently darken the legacy and innovation of what was the collective musical greatness of these five people.

[NotonRodeo]

If that WP article is the band's way of hitting at Lindsey then it is about time he writes the book it was said he would write about the making of Rumours. I suspect what he will say about Ken, Mick, and especially the icon will not be very flattering.

[Dr.Brown]

It is sad that this how it will end for FM & Lindsey. Don't fool yourself, the tour will do just fine. The guys they brought in are talented, the draw is the name of the band and Stevie. Doesn't mean it is right or that I will attend. If I did, I would pay for a front row seat and stand with my back to the stage for the duration.

I'm sure the money-grubbers on stage wouldn't care less and would have the last laugh as you would be just one more helping them line their pockets with premium $$$ from a front row seat.:mad:

[lisarod]

Sorry I missed what was printed in the Washington Post article. Can anyone paraphrase? Never mind! I Googled the article. They're bringing up old news and painting him in a negative light. Lindsey has grown since then.

[StevieNicksfann]

So here's my take on this whole mess. And you might not be interested because I haven't been here in years but here goes. I think it's a combination of things. This didn't just come out of the blue and like someone said:"They didn't wake up one day and said:"Oh, let's make Lindsey's life hell".

First there's the matter of jealousy. I think Miss Nicks couldn't stand it that they made a record without her despite the fact that she said in the press that she wished them all the best. If she did, than why wasn't it called a Fleetwood Mac album? Because that's what it was, it had 4 members on it. But for whatever reason, it wasn't called Fleetwood Mac. So they called it Buckingham McVie. That's a slap in her face, it refers back to Buckingham Nicks.
Lindsey & Christine worked together which was pretty successful. Go back to the old days when Lindsey & Stevie first joined the band and Lindsey wrote World Turning with Christine. She was extremely jealous. I remember reading back then that she said:"He can write a song with her but not with me". That got her pissed off (although they did write Frozen Love together but I don't know the circumstances of that process). Not only that, Buckingham McVie had a pretty successful tour, they got good reviews.

Second there's the abuse. There is no doubt whatsoever in my mind that Lindsey physically abused her. I'm a victim of domestic violence myself and I know the signs, I know the looks. It's scary. And very stressful to work with someone who has abused you in the past. An example of the fear: I hadn't talked to/seen my ex in 15 years and all of a sudden there's a message from him on Facebook. It's been 15 years, I'm in the USA, he's in Europe. I have nothing to fear, he's a million miles away. That's not how it works. I was scared to death. I had to rationalize my thoughts.
I've seen footage of a concert in 1979 where Lindsey grabs Stevie during Angel and she was scared. You could see it in her eyes. She was scared to death. I wish I knew of a way to post it here. However, having said that, she also said, years later, that when she saw him with his kids she made a huge mistake letting him go...

Third there is the power. He has softened through the years, has grown, is not abusive anymore but still pushes her buttons but finally she can say:"It's him or me". She has nothing left to lose by saying that. Her solo career is very successful. Even if Fleetwood Mac would have said:"Well Stevie, we rather have him", there's no loss. She'd just go on her merry solo way and be just as successful as he has ever been. Add Mike Campbell to her band and make another 24kg.

There's one thing that she forgets though: if it weren't for Lindsey she would never have been a part of Fleetwood Mac. She'd been a waitress, a cleaning lady until she inherited all this money from her parents and would live in a big house by herself (with probably her brother and Lori) and her doggies. But because she became a part of Fleetwood Mac and not only that, she became the face of Fleetwood Mac, she became arrogant. I've loved this woman since '77 so this is very hard for me to say but what I've seen over the years is that she changed from a rock 'n roll hippie into a rock 'n roll diva. Back in the 70's, 80's early 90's, she was sweet, compassionate, humble, patient, a very warm personality. I've met her a few times during those era's and I had nothing but praise for her. That's why I can say this.
Another thing she forgets is Lindsey's magic on her songs. There's nobody on this earth who can and will understand her songs as well as he does. Even Christine said about Dreams:"It's just 3 bloody chords" to which Lindsey replied:"Yeah, but they're the right chords". He worked his magic and boom, they had a number one hit.

All 'n all, I just think she was fed up with him. "How dare he ask for a delay when he just toured with Christine and wrote all those beautiful songs with her". What's not important in her mind is that she delayed and delayed and delayed. And Mick went with the money as he usually does.

As far as the true fans are concerned... I guess we're just an after thought.

I don’t believe Stevie would be jealous of the Buckvie album at all. It was totally her choice not to record with them and they held off as long as they could giving her plenty of time hoping she would change her mind. She wanted to instead do her solo tour and by all accounts was happier doing so since it was the most fun tour and one of her most successful ever. Lastly, the reason the Buckvie album could not officially be called Fleetwood Mac was because Stevie is still legally a member of the band so her not being on the album means it is not a Fleetwood Mac album. That is different from Say You Will when Christine was not signed on anymore as a contracted member of the band so that LP could be called FM.

[FuzzyPlum]

I don’t believe Stevie would be jealous of the Buckvie album at all. It was totally her choice not to record with them and they held off as long as they could giving her plenty of time hoping she would change her mind. She wanted to instead do her solo tour and by all accounts was happier doing so since it was the most fun tour and one of her most successful ever. Lastly, the reason the Buckvie album could not officially be called Fleetwood Mac was because Stevie is still legally a member of the band so her not being on the album means it is not a Fleetwood Mac album. That is different from Say You Will when Christine was not signed on anymore as a contracted member of the band so that LP could be called FM.


I'm not aware of any law that says an album cant be labelled as being by a particular band if one particular member doesn't want to appear on it.

No, the reason it wasn't labelled as Fleetwood Mac is because they'd need to perform live shows to promote the album and that would have caused problems without having Stevie. They'd already signed up for a tour with all 5 band members and the promoters for the forthcoming tour wouldn't have taken kindly to a Fleetwood Mac tour without SN. Furthermore they'd have faced problems from ticket buyers expecting to see SN only to find her absent.

[bombaysaffires]

I'm not aware of any law that says an album cant be labelled as being by a particular band if one particular member doesn't want to appear on it.

No, the reason it wasn't labelled as Fleetwood Mac is because they'd need to perform live shows to promote the album and that would have caused problems without having Stevie. They'd already signed up for a tour with all 5 band members and the promoters for the forthcoming tour wouldn't have taken kindly to a Fleetwood Mac tour without SN. Furthermore they'd have faced problems from ticket buyers expecting to see SN only to find her absent.

it's not a law, but it can well be part of the terms of a contract that people had signed.

[bombaysaffires]

https://www.instagram.com/p/Bhfs0bhAAWD/?hl=en&taken-by=kbchrush

As visitor to the Penguin back to the days of Marty and Lisa in the Mid 1990's, I have experienced many highs and lows with this band, but this is by far the deepest sadness I have ever felt regarding any Fleetwood Mac happening.

It is now clear as evidenced by Lindsey's family's social media musings that this was not Lindsey wanting out. For all his personal failings in the 70s and 80s, he has essentially lived his life over the last 20 plus years as a person devoted to his family and the musical output of this band. He has led it musically, as its most consistent spokesperson and stage presence since 1997, and the band probably would not have had this 20 year second act if it was not for his vision and persistence.

I suspect the Washington Post article was a "friend of FM mgmt" piece to fire a shot across Lindsey's bow that in this "me too" era we will drag up every piece of the past we can, factual or not, relevant or reformed, to embarrass you and your family if you do not play nice.

It is sad that this how it will end for FM & Lindsey. Don't fool yourself, the tour will do just fine. The guys they brought in are talented, the draw is the name of the band and Stevie. Doesn't mean it is right or that I will attend. If I did, I would pay for a front row seat and stand with my back to the stage for the duration.

In all reality this tour will be the end of the band, so its final snap shot in what is for sure the last decade of some of the members' lives, will be this separation that will permanently darken the legacy and innovation of what was the collective musical greatness of these five people.

well said. And I agree about the WaPo piece. Damage control.

[gldstwmn]

https://www.instagram.com/p/Bhfs0bhAAWD/?hl=en&taken-by=kbchrush

As visitor to the Penguin back to the days of Marty and Lisa in the Mid 1990's, I have experienced many highs and lows with this band, but this is by far the deepest sadness I have ever felt regarding any Fleetwood Mac happening.

It is now clear as evidenced by Lindsey's family's social media musings that this was not Lindsey wanting out.
None of those accounts are verified and there are A LOT of parody accounts out there.

[FuzzyPlum]

None of those accounts are verified and there are A LOT of parody accounts out there.


The Instagram accounts for Lindsey's wife and daughter are obviously, irrefutably, 100% without a doubt genuine.

[gldstwmn]

The Instagram accounts for Lindsey's wife and daughter are obviously, irrefutably, 100% without a doubt genuine.

NOT VERIFIED.

[dreamsunwind]

NOT VERIFIED.

Again, they're not celebrities. They're normal people so they don't get verified accounts. I follow Lindsey's daughter, her account is private and it's 100% real, as she posts almost entirely pictures of herself and her friends like any other girl her age. Kristens account is mostly for her furniture but she has also posted personal pictures. Both accounts are real.

[jeets2000]

Again, they're not celebrities. They're normal people so they don't get verified accounts. I follow Lindsey's daughter, her account is private and it's 100% real, as she posts almost entirely pictures of herself and her friends like any other girl her age. Kristens account is mostly for her furniture but she has also posted personal pictures. Both accounts are real.

It's not worth it... gldstwmn is clearly just a troll and being needlessly argumentative. :rolleyes: No one else is questioning the veracity of those accounts.

[jmn3]

NOT VERIFIED.

Since when do the family members of celebrities get verified account? NOT NECESSARY TO BE VERIFIED.

[gldstwmn]

Since when do the family members of celebrities get verified account? NOT NECESSARY TO BE VERIFIED.
If you want to spew it as fact then yeah it needs to be verified. Lindsey's wife's account links back to a website/brand so she could easily be verified. These accounts can be anyone.

[FuzzyPlum]

If you want to spew it as fact then yeah it needs to be verified. Lindsey's wife's account links back to a website/brand so she could easily be verified. These accounts can be anyone.



The fact you are being so vociferous is making me feel quite embarrassed on your behalf.

[dreamsunwind]

If you want to spew it as fact then yeah it needs to be verified. Lindsey's wife's account links back to a website/brand so she could easily be verified. These accounts can be anyone.

Exactly how would 'anyone' get a video like this: https://instagram.com/p/BKoKngrDHsl/

Or pictures like these:
https://instagram.com/p/BHqmJDojuSc/
https://instagram.com/p/BQiZr6VDEhB/

[jmn3]

If you want to spew it as fact then yeah it needs to be verified. Lindsey's wife's account links back to a website/brand so she could easily be verified. These accounts can be anyone.

This might be the most ridiculous thing I’ve seen on The Ledge this week. She’s his wife, she can say whatever she wants to say in support of her husband. She doesn’t need to have a verified account to share her feelings. Good grief. That you think some sort of tinfoil hat conspiracy is going on is just ridiculous.

[NotonRodeo]

Some people simply cannot accept the fact that there are actually people on Earth who like, admire, and love Lindsey sincerely, and that he is not simply the ogre the icon and her worshipers find it convenient to think him to be.

[gldstwmn]

It's not worth it... gldstwmn is clearly just a troll and being needlessly argumentative. :rolleyes: No one else is questioning the veracity of those accounts.
That's because people have bought into the misogynistic led group think of this Ledge, this Rumours forum who have bought into the objectification and vilification of Stevie for so long that some of her long time followers have begun to wonder if it might be true. And when someone dares question these narcissistic abusers who spew this crap then they too are marginalized and vilified using those very same tactics (Crazy! Slut! Troll!). There are plenty who feel that way about Stevie's treatment on this board but would rather leave than deal with it. I don't blame them.
Believe me sweetheart I am quite real. Wanna step outside? Can't handle it? Put me on ignore.

[gldstwmn]

The fact you are being so vociferous is making me feel quite embarrassed on your behalf.
No need. I have been a fan for a very long time and I have finally come to see what many here have buried their head in the sand about for so long. Lindsey is an a$$hole and Fleetwood Mac are tired of him. Save your embarrassment for yourself.

[gldstwmn]

This might be the most ridiculous thing I’ve seen on The Ledge this week. She’s his wife, she can say whatever she wants to say in support of her husband. She doesn’t need to have a verified account to share her feelings. Good grief. That you think some sort of tinfoil hat conspiracy is going on is just ridiculous.
:laugh: My considered opinions are nothing compared to the display that has been going on here this week. :cool:

[gldstwmn]

Again, they're not celebrities. They're normal people so they don't get verified accounts. I follow Lindsey's daughter, her account is private and it's 100% real, as she posts almost entirely pictures of herself and her friends like any other girl her age. Kristens account is mostly for her furniture but she has also posted personal pictures. Both accounts are real.

Her account can easily be verified. You assume I think it's not real. I don't know if it is or not.

[lisarod]

The Instagram accounts for Lindsey's wife and daughter are obviously, irrefutably, 100% without a doubt genuine.

I totally agree FuzzyPlum! 100% their accounts! I never thought I'd be on Lindsey's side 'cause I'm originally a Stevie fan but after how he was treated I am now....

[gldstwmn]

I totally agree FuzzyPlum! 100% their accounts! I never thought I'd be on Lindsey's side 'cause I'm originally a Stevie fan but after how he was treated I am now....
You might want to look at all the parody accounts on Twitter.

[HomerMcvie]

It's not worth it... gldstwmn is clearly just a troll and being needlessly argumentative. :rolleyes: No one else is questioning the veracity of those accounts.

:xoxo::xoxo::xoxo::xoxo::xoxo::xoxo::xoxo::xoxo::xoxo:



Extremely ANGRY, with a personal ax to grind?

[lisarod]

Yes, Homer McVie it's not worth it. I'm not sure what her/his (gldwmn) deal is. Could it be an extreme case of denial? Whatever it is she's never gonna convince me of the likely scenario that occurred between Lindsey, Mick and Stevie and of that those IG accounts are fake.:distress:

[gldstwmn]

Yes, Homer McVie it's not worth it. I'm not sure what her/his (gldwmn) deal is. Could it be an extreme case of denial? Whatever it is she's never gonna convince me of the likely scenario that occurred between Lindsey, Mick and Stevie and of that those IG accounts are fake.:distress:

:lol::lol::lol::lol: :wavey:

[gldstwmn]

:xoxo::xoxo::xoxo::xoxo::xoxo::xoxo::xoxo::xoxo::xoxo:



Extremely ANGRY, with a personal ax to grind?

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[mitzo]

No need. I have been a fan for a very long time and I have finally come to see what many here have buried their head in the sand about for so long. Lindsey is an a$$hole and Fleetwood Mac are tired of him. Save your embarrassment for yourself.

This is what I assumed from the outset. They cannot stand touring with him anymore.

[The Catdancer]

We have been an afterthought for decades, and it's frankly our fault as fans, since we put up with their juvenile delinquencies. All those people yelling at FM on FB? I am willing to bet when the tour comes around they will all buy the overpriced tickets anyway. Heck, the attention may even make radio play more of their songs, so the icon can go "ching-ching" or something and make some improvements to her house with her royalty check.

I have not seen the number of their "likes" on the FM page on FB diminish these past few days.

Well, it's anyone's right to change their mind and to to a show. The dust is settling and people might want to see them one last time.
For me this band is over. I'll go and see Lindsey.

[The Catdancer]

+1000. They may have each sought treatment for their issues but they've never been treated for the issues between them. PTSD and other issues can pop back up after years of being dormant. I am not saying that this is the case but I do know that at the age of 70 I would not be trilled to have to work with an ex for months on end. Somewhere between Classic East and Musicares is where things really started to go off the rails. The reviews said he played and uninspired set at Classic East and he acted like a bit of an as$ solo on the red carpet at Musicares. There are photos and video. You can see it more in the video. I will find it later and post.

I don't know about PTSD issues, I have no idea if she has it. It was just my point of view.

I know he was mad at MusiCares. What I've heard was that there was a fight between Stevie & Lindsey because he yelled at Karen (I don't know what she did, if anything) and Stevie exploded about that.
Also ~ during the first day of rehearsal he supposedly said that she couldn't sing anymore and her voice sounded like sh!t. That's when she was like:"That's it".
I heard it from a good friend who heard it from a band assistant so...

[The Catdancer]

this is so perfectly said, Debbie. thank you! :wavey: :xoxo:

You're welcome, Elle :wavey: Just my point of view :)

[The Catdancer]

I don’t believe Stevie would be jealous of the Buckvie album at all. It was totally her choice not to record with them and they held off as long as they could giving her plenty of time hoping she would change her mind. She wanted to instead do her solo tour and by all accounts was happier doing so since it was the most fun tour and one of her most successful ever. Lastly, the reason the Buckvie album could not officially be called Fleetwood Mac was because Stevie is still legally a member of the band so her not being on the album means it is not a Fleetwood Mac album. That is different from Say You Will when Christine was not signed on anymore as a contracted member of the band so that LP could be called FM.

I get your point about the album not being called Fleetwood Mac but I seriously doubt she thought it would be a success and I don't think she expected them to tour behind it and it would be successful. She's been jealous of Christine & Lindsey doing stuff together since they joined.

[The Catdancer]

I'm not aware of any law that says an album cant be labelled as being by a particular band if one particular member doesn't want to appear on it.

No, the reason it wasn't labelled as Fleetwood Mac is because they'd need to perform live shows to promote the album and that would have caused problems without having Stevie. They'd already signed up for a tour with all 5 band members and the promoters for the forthcoming tour wouldn't have taken kindly to a Fleetwood Mac tour without SN. Furthermore they'd have faced problems from ticket buyers expecting to see SN only to find her absent.

Not entirely true, at least not in Europe (Holland in this case). They promoted the Time line-up as Fleetwood Mac. I don't recall any band pictures on posters or flyers or whatever. There was no internet at the time. The casual fan who didn't know any better expected Stevie Nicks. You have no idea how many people around me said:"WTF?? That's not Stevie Nicks" and left. I don't think they got into any trouble from ticket buyers at all. People just left and they were playing a small venue which was only half full.

[button-lip]

This is what I assumed from the outset. They cannot stand touring with him anymore.

They?! Stevie is the only one who can't stand working with him anymore.

Christine was perfectly fine during BuckVie, and Mick couldn't care less as long as Lindsey means money.

[button-lip]

I don't know about PTSD issues, I have no idea if she has it. It was just my point of view.

I know he was mad at MusiCares. What I've heard was that there was a fight between Stevie & Lindsey because he yelled at Karen (I don't know what she did, if anything) and Stevie exploded about that.
Also ~ during the first day of rehearsal he supposedly said that she couldn't sing anymore and her voice sounded like sh!t. That's when she was like:"That's it".
I heard it from a good friend who heard it from a band assistant so...

Really?! I didn't know that part of the story. Still, no reason to fire him.

[BombaySapphire3]

I am primarily a Stevie fan although I have been around since the Rumours era so was a Fleetwood Mac fan first and I also have Lindsey's solo albums.I stand with Lindsey on this one. If he and La Nicks were in the same room on their death beds they would each be fighting to stay alive so they could get the last word in .This is the way it has been for decades .To fire him now in the twilight of Fleetwood Mac over something so silly is just tacky.

[jwd]

The way I look at it, is that it's a good thing for Lindsey. Why should he waste any more of his time with a band that doesn't want to make new music anymore, at least Stevie with him in Fleetwood Mac. Then go on endless tours playing the same songs over and over again. If it's not about money, then Lindsey should be a happy man! Completely free to focus on solo work, or hopefully another venture with Christine.

Lindsey was the glue that held FM together for the last two decades. He deserves a lot of credit for that. The energy and ROCK that he brought to their shows will be hard to top, and sorely lacking on their next tour. Mike Campbell can certainly play a mean guitar, but he is not the showman Lindsey is.

As for FM, it's probably the most viable choice for the band at this point. For whatever reason Lindsey wasn't working in the current mix of things. Stevie will most certainly be happy working with Mike Campbell, someone she has written with in the past and gets along with. The dynamics of the songwriting collaborations have been expanded with the addition of Neil Finn. I can most certainly see Christine working well with him.

I have mixed feelings about all this as I will most certainly miss the chemistry of the Rumours Five. They will always be MY quintessential FM.

[elle]

This is what I assumed from the outset. They cannot stand touring with him anymore.

Thank you for confirming the man did absolutely nothing to warrant being expelled!

That’s exact story I’ve been hearing for 2 months and couldn’t believe that’s all. As my kid nicely said, this bunch of people are just senile and cranky, there’s no cause or reasoning for this.

[elle]

Really?! I didn't know that part of the story. Still, no reason to fire him.

It’s bs going around the same as “he was not fired he left” kept going around the whole week. That same story further goes that this happened in March. They cut him off at the beginning of February.

The amount of trolling in this thread, and throwing bs against the wall to confuse everyone and see if something sticks is toxic and ridiculous.

[sodascouts]

Lindsey can't be any worse than he has been in the past... in fact, he's probably better than he was back in the day!

They've dealt with it before and been rewarded handsomely for their pains. What changed?

I feel like there must be more to it than "Lindsey's a jerk."

[elle]

Lindsey can't be any worse than he has been in the past... in fact, he's probably better than he was back in the day!

They've dealt with it before and been rewarded handsomely for their pains. What changed?

I feel like there must be more to it than "Lindsey's a jerk."

There is - Stevie and Mick are even bigger jerks?

And McVies are standing idly buy appeasing the hostile takeover.

[desertangel]

Weeellll... as a long-time fan who has been around awhile, except for lately (lol), my 2 cents is... I was more than a little concerned over Stevie's recent lack of participation and the subsequent pairing of BuckMcVie. Not one to think negatively, I kept an open mind. Needless to say, this latest news does not surprise me one bit. Although, I was a little late in finding out and surprised I didn't see anything of it in my Facebook News Feed. But then with all the manipulation of FB News Feed as of late, perhaps I should not be surprised I didn't see anything of it there.

I agree - RIP Fleetwood Mac.

So many changes happening in the world the last few years, and not good ones. Add this one to the list. It makes me sad.

But I digress, if this must be, then so be it. And I want to acknowledge Lindsey's enormous contribution to the band, from the beginning. Under-rated, under-appreciated, etc. I met him at an after-show for an autograph on the GIS tour. I love watching him play.

[mitzo]

Thank you for confirming the man did absolutely nothing to warrant being expelled!

That’s exact story I’ve been hearing for 2 months and couldn’t believe that’s all. As my kid nicely said, this bunch of people are just senile and cranky, there’s no cause or reasoning for this.

With all due respect, it is not for us to determine whether he warranted being expelled. Clearly the band thought he did. It s over, Elle.

[Angel75]

I know he was mad at MusiCares. What I've heard was that there was a fight between Stevie & Lindsey because he yelled at Karen (I don't know what she did, if anything) and Stevie exploded about that.
Also ~ during the first day of rehearsal he supposedly said that she couldn't sing anymore and her voice sounded like sh!t. That's when she was like:"That's it".
I heard it from a good friend who heard it from a band assistant so...

I can see SN explosively reacting to LB being rude to Karen. LB also making cutting remarks about her voice too is just asking for trouble, when his has deteriorated also. But definitely not reason to FIRE someone.

These petty type of incidences I have no doubt would have SN running to Mick saying 'him or me?'

SN should know better and rise above it, LB shouldn't goad and pick fights.....all so very childish

[The Catdancer]

That's because people have bought into the misogynistic led group think of this Ledge, this Rumours forum who have bought into the objectification and vilification of Stevie for so long that some of her long time followers have begun to wonder if it might be true. And when someone dares question these narcissistic abusers who spew this crap then they too are marginalized and vilified using those very same tactics (Crazy! Slut! Troll!). There are plenty who feel that way about Stevie's treatment on this board but would rather leave than deal with it. I don't blame them.
Believe me sweetheart I am quite real. Wanna step outside? Can't handle it? Put me on ignore.

I haven't bought into anything and I can make up my own mind. I have been a fan since Rumours and since Day One I have loved Stevie, no matter what. Through thick & thin. If you care to take a look back at my posts you'd see I always loved her. But.... instead of love making you blind, you'd also have to be objective and truth is she has changed big time. I'm not crucifying her, she just changed but for me it wasn't a change for the better. I have no idea what happened but like I said in an earlier post, she changed from a rock 'n roll hippie into a rock 'n roll diva. And for me it all started with the Destiny Rules documentary when she says to Lindsey:"You wouldn't say that to Bob Dylan". I'm sure I've said in the past that I thought it was great she was standing up for herself and she shut him up, "she told him". But in actual fact, she is NO Bob Dylan. When I listen to her songs now, objectively, her songwriting was great from BN to RAL. After that it went downhill for me. What I liked about her songs was that I had to figure out what she was talking about (and I wasn't the only one, Christine was wondering about the same thing) but when Tango came along I didn't need to figure it out anymore because she wrote exactly about what was going on. The same goes for the albums after that.

Than I've heard (and seen) horror stories from fans, die hard fans and she treated them like sh!t. One girl went to London for a SYW show, waited hours outside in the pouring rain. Stevie got into the car and just drove by. That would NOT have happened in my day. Here's an example: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sKEVqTpkugw
She says "I'd have to stop for all of you and I can't". You can actually hear someone say:"You never can".
And there are lots of videos like that on youtube. That to me was a huge disappointment. And my point of view is not based just one video. Here's another one: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HMWJ7e2u_Ls
"I really can't stop. Sorry". Look at her face, she'd rather be anywhere else than to spend some time with her fans. To me her attitude says:"Don't bother me". And yes, I can see when sometimes it's too much and she'd be like:"I just want to go home". But this is the path she has chosen and there are consequences along that path. One of them being:"Be nice to the people who put you up there".

[singertobe]

That's it! I've had enough of this foolishness! My family and I have been tirelessly saving up money so that we could see ALL of Fleetwood Mac for the last time. Its not FM without Lindsey. Behind the Mask proved that! If they don't get their crap together soon I'm taking the money I've saved for concert tickets and spending it on a trip to the wolf preserve in Florida that I've been wanting to go to. You've got a choice FM: Bring Lindsey back or lose money!

[The Catdancer]

It’s bs going around the same as “he was not fired he left” kept going around the whole week. That same story further goes that this happened in March. They cut him off at the beginning of February.

The amount of trolling in this thread, and throwing bs against the wall to confuse everyone and see if something sticks is toxic and ridiculous.

Thanks for clearing that up for me. I thought it was a weird story. Oh btw, I'm not a troll ;)

[The Catdancer]

I can see SN explosively reacting to LB being rude to Karen. LB also making cutting remarks about her voice too is just asking for trouble, when his has deteriorated also. But definitely not reason to FIRE someone.

These petty type of incidences I have no doubt would have SN running to Mick saying 'him or me?'

SN should know better and rise above it, LB shouldn't goad and pick fights.....all so very childish

As I said, I heard that via someone else, I do not know the source. I just thought I'd share because in the past my friend's info was always legit. Seems she's wrong about this.
I'm sorry for spreading fake news...

[button-lip]

With all due respect, it is not for us to determine whether he warranted being expelled. Clearly the band thought he did. It s over, Elle.

By the band you mean, Mick and Stevie? Because John and Christine were completely left out.

[button-lip]

I can see SN explosively reacting to LB being rude to Karen. LB also making cutting remarks about her voice too is just asking for trouble, when his has deteriorated also. But definitely not reason to FIRE someone.

These petty type of incidences I have no doubt would have SN running to Mick saying 'him or me?'

SN should know better and rise above it, LB shouldn't goad and pick fights.....all so very childish

That's all Lindsey's fault. It's unbelievable after 53 years of knowing each other Lindsey still doesn't her game.

[jwd]

When I listen to her songs now, objectively, her songwriting was great from BN to RAL. After that it went downhill for me.

I'm a HUGE fan of TISL! One of my favorites of hers.

Than I've heard (and seen) horror stories from fans, die hard fans and she treated them like sh!t. One girl went to London for a SYW show, waited hours outside in the pouring rain. Stevie got into the car and just drove by. That would NOT have happened in my day. Here's an example: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sKEVqTpkugw
She says "I'd have to stop for all of you and I can't". You can actually hear someone say:"You never can".
And there are lots of videos like that on youtube. That to me was a huge disappointment. And my point of view is not based just one video. Here's another one: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HMWJ7e2u_Ls
"I really can't stop. Sorry". Look at her face, she'd rather be anywhere else than to spend some time with her fans. To me her attitude says:"Don't bother me". And yes, I can see when sometimes it's too much and she'd be like:"I just want to go home". But this is the path she has chosen and there are consequences along that path. One of them being:"Be nice to the people who put you up there".

Funny, I've had people tell me that have had interactions with her, whether it's backstage or on a plane, that she's not demanding or diva-like at all.

[button-lip]

I haven't bought into anything and I can make up my own mind. I have been a fan since Rumours and since Day One I have loved Stevie, no matter what. Through thick & thin. If you care to take a look back at my posts you'd see I always loved her. But.... instead of love making you blind, you'd also have to be objective and truth is she has changed big time. I'm not crucifying her, she just changed but for me it wasn't a change for the better. I have no idea what happened but like I said in an earlier post, she changed from a rock 'n roll hippie into a rock 'n roll diva. And for me it all started with the Destiny Rules documentary when she says to Lindsey:"You wouldn't say that to Bob Dylan". I'm sure I've said in the past that I thought it was great she was standing up for herself and she shut him up, "she told him". But in actual fact, she is NO Bob Dylan. When I listen to her songs now, objectively, her songwriting was great from BN to RAL. After that it went downhill for me. What I liked about her songs was that I had to figure out what she was talking about (and I wasn't the only one, Christine was wondering about the same thing) but when Tango came along I didn't need to figure it out anymore because she wrote exactly about what was going on. The same goes for the albums after that.

Than I've heard (and seen) horror stories from fans, die hard fans and she treated them like sh!t. One girl went to London for a SYW show, waited hours outside in the pouring rain. Stevie got into the car and just drove by. That would NOT have happened in my day. Here's an example: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sKEVqTpkugw
She says "I'd have to stop for all of you and I can't". You can actually hear someone say:"You never can".
And there are lots of videos like that on youtube. That to me was a huge disappointment. And my point of view is not based just one video. Here's another one: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HMWJ7e2u_Ls
"I really can't stop. Sorry". Look at her face, she'd rather be anywhere else than to spend some time with her fans. To me her attitude says:"Don't bother me". And yes, I can see when sometimes it's too much and she'd be like:"I just want to go home". But this is the path she has chosen and there are consequences along that path. One of them being:"Be nice to the people who put you up there".

There are tons of pics of Lindsey with fans of his fb groups. :D

[The Catdancer]

I'm a HUGE fan of TISL! One of my favorites of hers.



Funny, I've had people tell me that have had interactions with her, whether it's backstage or on a plane, that she's not demanding or diva-like at all.

TISL has some good some good songs like TISL and FFG but that's about it for me.

That could very well be. I'm just going by what I've experienced myself in the early days (up until the early 90's) where she really wanted to be with her fans and interact with them.

[The Catdancer]

There are tons of pics of Lindsey with fans of his fb groups. :D

I know. Mine is one of them :)

[MaryLiz2]

Thank you for confirming the man did absolutely nothing to warrant being expelled!


To play devil's advocate, perhaps being an a**hole that no one wanted to be around anymore does warrant being expelled? I mean, I have to work with people I don't like...but these are a bunch of 70-something millionaires who have the luxury of saying "Nope, not gonna do it anymore." (In saying that, I'm not trying to imply that Lindsey's is the only difficult personality in the band. I don't know that any are easy to get along with, but it's pretty obvious that within the context of "the five", he was the outsider more often than not).

Admittedly the hardcore level of my fandom has ebbed and flowed over the years, so I'm able to look at this with a level of detached amusement that I wouldn't have had 15 years ago. That said, I keep coming back to the board now to see if we've been given any further actual, verified information beyond "so-and-so says" and "I heard..."; from what I can make out, we don't know anything more from legitimate media outlets about what went on and led to the current situation today than we did on Monday when everything hit the fan. It seems like there is a a lot of speculation being taken as gospel when we really don't know. Perhaps I've missed something?

Regardless, I don't think any of the five owe me anything other than to show up and play for a couple hours if I buy tickets to their show. It looks like they're going to do that with Lindsey this go-round, so it is what it is.

[jbrownsjr]

I know. Mine is one of them :)

I can't quote all your posts. But, I generally agree with everything you've posted in this thread. My sources have told me virtually the same thing. And I have a few. I love Stevie's solo work. After OSOTM the writing lost it's sparkle. The magic that took your heart strings was gone. She tries to be a version of herself instead of just being herself. Sure there's great tunes afterward. I love Illume and a few others.

She's become the kind of person I never thought she would become. She and Christine are such polar opposites in class and elegance. A friend of mine, (who isn't into FM, but into rock and roll) said, "Stevie Nicks is the Rosanne Barr of music." The trajectory of attitude and class have diminished. Her fame is based on people's love of the fantasies she's built over the years. Me included.

I don't fault her for not signing everyone an autograph. It's sad that people do wait in the rain and don't get to talk to her. But, she simply can't do it.

However, it brings a story to mind: I sat next to Judith Light on a trip to LAX from JFK. I got to chat with her for 6 hrs. She said to me, "Part of my job is to touch and talk with as many fans as I can. I enjoy it. And it reminds me that my art is nothing without them" I was shocked when she said that to me. I personally would hate to be famous. I mean look at the folks here on The Ledge.
Some of them are plum crazy. Imagine what it's like out there. :lol:

[BombaySapphire3]

I haven't bought into anything and I can make up my own mind. I have been a fan since Rumours and since Day One I have loved Stevie, no matter what. Through thick & thin. If you care to take a look back at my posts you'd see I always loved her. But.... instead of love making you blind, you'd also have to be objective and truth is she has changed big time. I'm not crucifying her, she just changed but for me it wasn't a change for the better. I have no idea what happened but like I said in an earlier post, she changed from a rock 'n roll hippie into a rock 'n roll diva. And for me it all started with the Destiny Rules documentary when she says to Lindsey:"You wouldn't say that to Bob Dylan". I'm sure I've said in the past that I thought it was great she was standing up for herself and she shut him up, "she told him". But in actual fact, she is NO Bob Dylan. When I listen to her songs now, objectively, her songwriting was great from BN to RAL. After that it went downhill for me. What I liked about her songs was that I had to figure out what she was talking about (and I wasn't the only one, Christine was wondering about the same thing) but when Tango came along I didn't need to figure it out anymore because she wrote exactly about what was going on. The same goes for the albums after that.

Than I've heard (and seen) horror stories from fans, die hard fans and she treated them like sh!t. One girl went to London for a SYW show, waited hours outside in the pouring rain. Stevie got into the car and just drove by. That would NOT have happened in my day. Here's an example: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sKEVqTpkugw
She says "I'd have to stop for all of you and I can't". You can actually hear someone say:"You never can".
And there are lots of videos like that on youtube. That to me was a huge disappointment. And my point of view is not based just one video. Here's another one: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HMWJ7e2u_Ls
"I really can't stop. Sorry". Look at her face, she'd rather be anywhere else than to spend some time with her fans. To me her attitude says:"Don't bother me". And yes, I can see when sometimes it's too much and she'd be like:"I just want to go home". But this is the path she has chosen and there are consequences along that path. One of them being:"Be nice to the people who put you up there".

Her line that she can't sign autographs predates those videos by decades .I went to a Tom Petty concert at the San Diego Sports Arena in 1985 a few months before the release of Rock a Little where Stevie was a guest performer and when she was getting on a bus after the show a fan asked her for an autograph and she turned and said "If i give you one I have to do it for everyone"

[Angel75]

As I said, I heard that via someone else, I do not know the source. I just thought I'd share because in the past my friend's info was always legit. Seems she's wrong about this.
I'm sorry for spreading fake news...

I never questioned your source, this is very believable to me and I was supporting your comments.....

[elle]

Thanks for clearing that up for me. I thought it was a weird story. Oh btw, I'm not a troll ;)

:lol: you know i would never say that to you. :xoxo:

your posts are extremely constructive.

[dreamsunwind]

There's probably going to be a lot of different stories and claims going around in the following weeks about this. To me (and I know I've said this before) I think it's not that much more complicated than a business/scheduling conflict that just went south. There was undoubtably a lot of shadiness and more than one person being stubborn and difficult, it ended up like this and it just shouldn't have happened.

Honestly, what band member has put more hard work into the band than Lindsey? I don't doubt he could make things hell, especially back in the day, but really, he did SO much for the band, whether he liked it or not. He doesn't deserve this.

[elle]

As I said, I heard that via someone else, I do not know the source. I just thought I'd share because in the past my friend's info was always legit. Seems she's wrong about this.
I'm sorry for spreading fake news...

i never heard it, but can't say for sure. i know they cut him off in February and were immediately after getting MC, but also that there was supposedly a minuscule possibility or hope they may reconcile.

maybe he tried to visit them while they were doing tryouts with the newly added guys? idk. it would be a really awkward dynamic, i would think. so if he tried to join and make peace, and Stevie said something like "get outta here you a**hole, you're not with this band anymore" i can see him pulling "when she goes low, i can go lower" kinda thing. ;)

disclaimer on the last paragraph: pure speculation, haven't heard anything like that actually happen.

[dreamsunwind]

i never heard it, but can't say for sure. i know they cut him off in February and were immediately after getting MC, but also that there was supposedly a minuscule possibility or hope they may reconcile.


Wow really? That's awful :(
I'm so surprised to hear that. I just don't understand any of this.

[elle]

To play devil's advocate, perhaps being an a**hole that no one wanted to be around anymore does warrant being expelled? I mean, I have to work with people I don't like...but these are a bunch of 70-something millionaires who have the luxury of saying "Nope, not gonna do it anymore." (In saying that, I'm not trying to imply that Lindsey's is the only difficult personality in the band. I don't know that any are easy to get along with, but it's pretty obvious that within the context of "the five", he was the outsider more often than not).

i don't know where is that obvious. Christine was raving last year how much she loves working with him, and always did, and that the only member of FM where he has tensions is Stevie.

John and Lindsey were always staying same places when on FM tour, and watching DR doc, you'd think that whatever initial disagreements they had back in 1975 are long gone and forgotten.

Mick always praises Lindsey.... or he did, until he fired him :p. all recent tours, at all m&gs Mick had when fans would press him to single out Stevie, he would instead always single out Lindsey as the bands driving force, musical director, etc.

so from everything we know, it's pretty obvious that within the context of "the five",the only person who has a problem with Lindsey in FM is his ex.

[lennonfan]

As infuriated as I am with this band right now, here's something to ponder:
How many bands, if a member was fired, would generate this kind of publicity? I think the number is less than one hand, more like one or two fingers....seriously....that implies a band of import.

All the negative blowback is well deserved, IMO this is the worst thing they've ever done. EVER. I'm still waiting for Lindsey's take but the words from the band themselves IMO showed a total disregard for the feelings of their fans and not that they owe them anything, they can do as they like...but for me, as a longtime fan, I don't really like musical chairs and I believe some are just irreplaceable, Lindsey Buckingham being example no. 1.

RIP Fleetwood Mac.

[sue]

As infuriated as I am with this band right now, here's something to ponder:
How many bands, if a member was fired, would generate this kind of publicity? I think the number is less than one hand, more like one or two fingers....seriously....that implies a band of import.

All the negative blowback is well deserved, IMO this is the worst thing they've ever done. EVER. I'm still waiting for Lindsey's take but the words from the band themselves IMO showed a total disregard for the feelings of their fans and not that they owe them anything, they can do as they like...but for me, as a longtime fan, I don't really like musical chairs and I believe some are just irreplaceable, Lindsey Buckingham being example no. 1.

RIP Fleetwood Mac.

Totally agree with all you say, it’s the word FIRED that is so dreadful.
How can Mick fire the artistic core of this band.
It gets worse as the days go by, a statement of explanation would help.

I will not see them if they come to The UK.

[NotonRodeo]

I think the blowback this time is far worse than the Vito-Burnette debacle. In 1987 I think it was just Rolling Stone and some entertainment magazines that covered this. Now, with the Internet, I can see on Google that this news has spread to newspapers from Saudi Arabia to Singapore, hardly bastions of Fleetwood Mac. This is a bigger deal now. I suspect the band thinks it will all blow over like last time just in time for the tour, and it will--it's happening here already--but not as quickly as they would like. This time moreover some people will refuse to give them the benefit of the doubt. We've seen this movie before.

[lennonfan]

I think the blowback this time is far worse than the Vito-Burnette debacle. In 1987 I think it was just Rolling Stone and some entertainment magazines that covered this. Now, with the Internet, I can see on Google that this news has spread to newspapers from Saudi Arabia to Singapore, hardly bastions of Fleetwood Mac. This is a bigger deal now. I suspect the band thinks it will all blow over like last time just in time for the tour, and it will--it's happening here already--but not as quickly as they would like. This time moreover some people will refuse to give them the benefit of the doubt. We've seen this movie before.

The RickaBilly years were terrible but at least then it was Lindsey who left, the others soldiered on, the music stunk as a result IMO but I was willing to give it a chance. I have no interest in this ugly hybrid.

[BLY]

I liked the Billy/Rick years and Behind the Mask. I'm a Buckingham fan and always will be.I love what he does to the music he crafts. I'm happy that we will get another solo album. The live MAC will never be the same. In 1987 they got a way with the change in line up following up on a hit album with 3 of 4 "hits" by Chris and Stevie. This time around just playing the classics I don't think so. It's going to be interesting to see how this tour gets " Promoted"

RIP fireflies.

[NotonRodeo]

That's what I don't understand. If Lindsey was fired how could they market this? It can't be a nostalgia tour, since one of the main members is missing. It can't be a new music/moving forward tour, since they're a bit too old for that claim to sound credible, and there is no actual new music anyway.

And what would Mike and Neil do? Play GYOW note for note? Will they import some of Stevie's solo songs with Mike on them? How many Crowded House songs will the audience go for without going on bathroom break?

And who will front the band? Stevie I guess. So it's basically her solo tour. Didn't Mick play on one of her tours? So now add John. Chris will end up as something of a guest soloist. Since most of her songs are like 3 minutes long, even if she plays a dozen of them that's just 30+ minutes. Will Stevie take up all the rest of that time?

[jmn3]

And who will front the band? Stevie I guess. So it's basically her solo tour. Didn't Mick play on one of her tours? So now add John. Chris will end up as something of a guest soloist. Since most of her songs are like 3 minutes long, even if she plays a dozen of them that's just 30+ minutes. Will Stevie take up all the rest of that time?

I would assume that yes, Stevie will essentially be the leader of the live shows. I can't imagine how they will retool the shows to be honest. Lindsey was the musical director so someone else is going to have to take over that role, setup the shows, the setlist, the arrangements, and so on. If they just note for note replicate what the band has been doing since 1997 and insert new voice and guitars trying to replicate Lindsey's work, then they are even more pathetic than I already thought.

[elle]

i have to say this is interesting and not a little bit shocking.

as far as i know Inspirer has been heavily Stevie-worshiping publication since its inception. over time it morphed into a magazine promoting successes of women, in music and beyond. i would usually skip any of their SN-related articles, but really enjoyed some of the interviews with strong, successful women, and i love that they have been women-focused for several years now.

http://inspirer.life/home/2018/04/fleetwood-mac-blindsides-lindsey-buckingham-with-firing-adds-mike-campbell-and-neil-finn/


MUSIC Fleetwood Mac Blindsides Lindsey Buckingham With Firing, Adds Mike Campbell and Neil Finn

By Desarae Gabrielle
Published on April 13, 2018 SHARE TWEET COMMENT

Always known for their outlandish drama, Fleetwood Mac did not disappoint when news came to light last Monday that vocalist and lead guitarist Lindsey Buckingham was fired by the band. The rumours of Buckingham’s forced departure began circulating in February, shortly after the bands iconic honor and performance at the MusiCares Grammy week event in New York. The decision to fire Buckingham was made on the heels of the event, completely blindsiding the guitarist who was the creative key in molding the bands revolutionary and progressive sound with albums like Tusk (1979) and Tango in the Night (1987).

Buckingham’s work with the band began in December 1974; Mick Fleetwood asked the California native to join the band when former Fleetwood Mac member Bob Welch departed. Buckingham agreed to join under the condition his then-girlfriend, Stevie Nicks, enter the band with him. Fleetwood agreed and extended the offer to the Buckingham Nicks duo, auditions unnecessary. The additions of Nicks and Buckingham propelled the former blues band to superstardom with album Rumours (1977), which centered around the dramatic breakup of the two lovers as well as the crumbling marriage of Christine and John McVie.

Stevie Nicks’ influence, incredible writing and popularity is undeniable, but Buckingham’s contributions to the band can’t be ignored and are just as vital to the success of the band. On various occasions, the musician morphed his solo work into hits for the British-American group. In ’85, Buckingham began work on a new solo project, during this time vocalist and keyboardist Christine McVie was asked to do a cover of the Elvis Presley hit “Can’t Help Falling in Love” for the soundtrack on the film “A Fine Mess.” Buckingham, Fleetwood and John McVie collaborated with Christine on the track. The collaboration led the fivesome, including Nicks, to work together once more on Fleetwood Mac’s 14th studio album, Tango in the Night. Much of Buckingham’s solo work at the time transformed into this Fleetwood Mac project and featured the eccentric musician playing every instrument on several tracks. Tango in the Night became the bands biggest album since Rumours. Following its release, Buckingham left Fleetwood Mac for personal reasons, citing turmoil in the band with ex-girlfriend Stevie Nicks, and lack of room for creative growth.

Once more, Buckingham began solo work for his Gift of Screws album in ’95, Buckingham invited Fleetwood to contribute drum work on the album. Over time, additional members of Fleetwood Mac were invited to sit in on the recording session including Nicks, John and Christine; the chemistry was palpable and soon reunion plans were in motion. The long-sought and awaited reunion of Fleetwood Mac produced the fifth best-selling live album of all time in the United States, The Dance, which featured new tracks from McVie, Nicks and Buckingham. Buckingham’s track, “Bleed to Love Her” was an unreleased solo track featured on the live album; the track eventually was released on Fleetwood Mac’s Say You Will (2003) album — the first album to feature Buckingham as a full-time member since his departure. Say You Will was the first Fleetwood Mac album to enter the top 3 in the United States since Mirage (1982), but also saw the loss of crucial female member, Christine McVie. Christine, who parted with the band after The Dance, was only featured on two tracks — which were previously recorded with Buckingham for a solo project, not for Fleetwood Mac. Say You Will is now the last album recorded by Fleetwood Mac by the “Rumours 5.” Since the release and subsequent tour of project Say You Will, Fleetwood Mac has taken to the road touring as a Greatest Hits band, only releasing a 4-song EP in 2013 without any promotion or backing from a record company. The EP featured Buckingham Nicks era song, “Without You,” as well as three new additional songs written by Buckingham, including “Sad Angel”, “Miss Fantasy,” and “It Takes Time” — a track which simply features Buckingham playing piano accompanied by his vocals. Mick Fleetwood shocked fans in 2014 when he announced Christine McVie would be re-joining Fleetwood Mac on their next world tour. The reunion tour of the “Rumours 5” sold out in minutes, proving the Rumours era lineup’s popularity and power in the rock and roll landscape.

Christine’s re-involvement in the band led to Buckingham’s piqued interest in new material. In 2015, Nicks stated the band had a lot of material for a new album, leading fans to believe the “Rumours 5” would reunite once more on a record. Instead, Nicks decided to pursue a solo tour with the Pretenders, which was a success for both Nicks and Chrissie Hynde. Because of Nicks’ lack of involvement and commitment, the project was turned into a duo album featuring Buckingham and Christine McVie. In 2017, Buckingham and McVie released the self-titled album, the record featured Mick Fleetwood and John McVie but was not advertised as a Fleetwood Mac project. The album produced critical acclaim for the new material from both Buckingham and McVie, and saw the new duo across the United States on a modest and well-received tour. Both Buckingham and McVie’s chemistry and sound was reminiscent of the Fleetwood Mac lore fans fell in love with in the ’70s.

In mid-2017 an announcement was made that Fleetwood Mac was chosen as the first band to be honored as 2018’s Person of the Year by MusiCares, an event that took place a few days before the Grammys. Singers Miley Cyrus, Lorde, Brandi Carlisle and more took to the stage to honor the band, performing hits like “Landslide,” and “Silver Springs.” Harry Styles joined Fleetwood Mac for a performance of “The Chain,” which will now be the bands last ever performance of the ironic song featuring Buckingham. During the event, members of Fleetwood Mac gave a speech stressing the respect and love they have for one another, calling each member of the band “family,” a dysfunctional family albeit. Given the bands tone and overall messaging of their speeches, Buckingham’s subsequent firing after the event is completely out of left-field and a devastating blow to music fans who were looking forward to seeing all 5 on their upcoming tour. When Buckingham’s firing was announced by media outlets, it was apparent that Fleetwood Mac was not ready to go public with the news, quickly issuing a haphazard statement announcing Buckingham’s replacements — Mike Campbell of Tom Petty and the Heartbreakers, and Neil Finn of Crowded House. Both men are revolutionary performers, but as social media backlash from fans informs — they aren’t Buckingham. It’s unclear how the band’s new lineup plans to move forward amidst such turmoil and uncertainty from their fans. One thing is for certain though, Fleetwood Mac fans are more loyal to the band than the band is to one another.

Fleetwood Mac broke the chain while putting their kingdom up for sale, and now we’re left to pick up the pieces and go home.

[jkmaletic]

The title of this article is totally misleading. The fans are blindsided, not Lindsey.

[Storms123]

The title of this article is totally misleading. The fans are blindsided, not Lindsey.

This press for this tour is going to be interesting. It's good to be John McVie. The other 3 are going to have to rehearse their schtick. I wonder if that will prompt Lindsey to speak out. I think I read somewhere "his" people are referring all inquiries to the band.

[elle]

The title of this article is totally misleading. The fans are blindsided, not Lindsey.
i'm confused: you talked to Lindsey and he told you he was completely expecting to be fired?

[jkmaletic]

i'm confused: you talked to Lindsey and he told you he was completely expecting to be fired?


Yeah, Elle. He and I talked about it at brunch the other day. ;)

To me, "blindsided" indicates it was total surprise, no reason, no discussion whatsoever.

[button-lip]

There's probably going to be a lot of different stories and claims going around in the following weeks about this. To me (and I know I've said this before) I think it's not that much more complicated than a business/scheduling conflict that just went south. There was undoubtably a lot of shadiness and more than one person being stubborn and difficult, it ended up like this and it just shouldn't have happened.

Honestly, what band member has put more hard work into the band than Lindsey? I don't doubt he could make things hell, especially back in the day, but really, he did SO much for the band, whether he liked it or not. He doesn't deserve this.

This! :xoxo:

Why is it so hard for people to believe that’s all that happened? Why Lindsey should have done something really really bad for it to end the way it did? They just pulled the plug and didn’t care about fans at all. :(

[elle]

Yeah, Elle. He and I talked about it at brunch the other day. ;)

To me, "blindsided" indicates it was total surprise, no reason, no discussion whatsoever.

yup. you don't think it was total surprise to him?

i would think he (like the rest of them for that matter), has got a contract and probably owns a part of FM corporation, and can't really even be fired. which must have been a big frustration to other band members, once they talked to the lawyers and figured that out after telling him that they ousted him.

[elle]

This! :xoxo:

Why is it so hard for people to believe that’s all that happened? Why Lindsey should have done something really really bad for it to end the way it did? They just pulled the plug and didn’t care about fans at all. :(
not just fans. also their own jobbing musicians who are not millionaires but actually live of that work. they couldn't care less about screwing them up, obviously.

from Rick Turner's post, it is clear that 2 months ago, people like Neale and Brett could have counted on getting the double income for the same time spent on the road. Lindsey is a multimillionaire, and while it would have been nice and convenient for him to have some of the solo tour expenses (i have to guess like travel and lodging and whatever per diem they do) covered by Fleetwood Mac, which would enable him to comfortably bring solo tour around the world, he'll be fine. he'll be also getting royalties if FM playes some of his songs. but it seems very clear these guys are getting screwed out of half of the income they counted on having in the second part of this year. you know FM won't accommodate them to do both tours now. it sucks.

[button-lip]

I would assume that yes, Stevie will essentially be the leader of the live shows. I can't imagine how they will retool the shows to be honest. Lindsey was the musical director so someone else is going to have to take over that role, setup the shows, the setlist, the arrangements, and so on. If they just note for note replicate what the band has been doing since 1997 and insert new voice and guitars trying to replicate Lindsey's work, then they are even more pathetic than I already thought.

By the tenth show Mick and Stevie will be begging for a new musical director. :p

[sodascouts]

Honestly, what band member has put more hard work into the band than Lindsey? I don't doubt he could make things hell, especially back in the day, but really, he did SO much for the band, whether he liked it or not. He doesn't deserve this.

That's what really gets me. He's worked much harder than anyone else in recent years and this is the thanks he gets?

Let's compare the amount of effort he and Stevie put into the EP. Well. There really is no comparison, is there?

But all that means nothing.

[sodascouts]

This article names no sources. I find it strange they apparently know more about what happened than Variety, Rolling Stone, and TMZ.

[button-lip]

That's what really gets me. He's worked much harder than anyone else in recent years and this is the thanks he gets?

Let's compare the amount of effort he and Stevie put into the EP. Well. There really is no comparison, is there?

But all that means nothing.

No, it means nothing because when they had to choose between Lindsey's solo tour and Stevie's, they of course chose her. They couldn't care less about his work and his legacy. He has already done his work with the band. :(

[button-lip]

This article names no sources. I find it strange they apparently know more about what happened than Variety, Rolling Stone, and TMZ.

Well, Rolling Stones's initial article said he quit the band, and they later changed the title. It's entirely posible somone with more interest in Lindsey's career knows more than Rolling Stones. :shrug:

[button-lip]

yup. you don't think it was total surprise to him?

i would think he (like the rest of them for that matter), has got a contract and probably owns a part of FM corporation, and can't really even be fired. which must have been a big frustration to other band members, once they talked to the lawyers and figured that out after telling him that they ousted him.

Well, someone told me recently he can be fired, and of course he can't if he's owns a part of FM corporation. This is not a regular 9 to 5 job, for God's sake! :nod:

I'm seriously laughing for a week if they fired him before talking to the lawyers. :D:D

[sodascouts]

Well, Rolling Stones's initial article said he quit the band, and they later changed the title. It's entirely posible somone with more interest in Lindsey's career knows more than Rolling Stones. :shrug:

True, but the lack of sources is still suspect and the publication lacks established prestige. I have just learned to be wary.

[Lola]

https://www.stuff.co.nz/entertainment/102974004/fleetwood-mac-and-neil-finn-is-the-perfect-musical-marriage

If you scroll thru the comments there's a longer one where someone describes seeing Mick at a Neil Finn event on Jan 5th. This person speculates something was in the works at that time. (Not sure which thread to put this in)

[Lola]

Here it is:


So I saw Neil and Liam Finn at the Coronation Hall in Waipu on Jan 5th this year.... (tail end of the 1st cyclone of the New Year)..... go camping there every New Years and when we saw this tour of small country town halls we were like "Hell yes!!". Only dabbled into 4 songs of SE and CH fame.... rest was new stuff and brilliantly played! (Well done Neil/Liam/Elroy/ Sharon and band!!)



Trundled along with some friends... happy to be inside a structure after tenting for two days of wet and wind! Watching the show as above - stunning sound and the comic banter of old CH was in effect...... go to the bar to get a wine...... and standing in a less lit area of the hall..... was Mick "I tower over everyone here by a mile" Fleetwood!!! Being a drummer myself the temptation to go and pester him was pretty high (like him) but took that moment to check ones self and leave him alone.



Obviously plans were afoot sometime ago.... so well done to both the Finn Clan and indeed for the Mac and Mike Campbell. I'm glad he is in the mix too.... given there is a connection from Damn the Torpedo's era and the producer that bought Nicks and Petty together (Jimmy Iovine). Seems nicely full circle

[button-lip]

https://www.stuff.co.nz/entertainment/102974004/fleetwood-mac-and-neil-finn-is-the-perfect-musical-marriage

If you scroll thru the comments there's a longer one where someone describes seeing Mick at a Neil Finn event on Jan 5th. This person speculates something was in the works at that time. (Not sure which thread to put this in)

Yes, and again also Mike Campbell was approached before to be "felt out" about how he'd react. Of course he was approached with the truth: that Lindsey was gonna be fired.

[Lola]

Yes, and again also Mike Campbell was approached before to be "felt out" about how he'd react. Of course he was approached with the truth: that Lindsey was gonna be fired.

That's awful. It's one thing to be told "he left, we'd like you to fill in" but if Mike knew they were going to fire him....WoW.

[NotonRodeo]

I'm seriously laughing for a week if they fired him before talking to the lawyers. :D:D

This is the doing of Mick Fleetwood, so I'm almost certain this is what happened :D :blob2:

[sodascouts]

If it's true that they knew for sure that far ahead of time they were going to fire him, why say the kind of things they did at Musicares? Why would they bother having even one day of rehearsal with him? Why would they bother announcing that Sirius station that got yanked at the last minute?

More likely those guys were an alternate plan and they hoped to work something out with Lindsey. Again, Mick must have known it would be best to keep the Rumours 5 together.

Still, I believe what button-lip's sources tell her regarding Lindsey backing down, because you don't use the word "fired" when you were offered a chance to stay if you cooperated and you chose not to.

Thus, the reconciliation of the narratives for me is that the alternate plan became the primary plan at the last minute for personal reasons, since business-wise, they should have let Lindsey stay after he backed down.

Sadly, unlike apparently half the people who post here, I have no "insider sources" or "friends who know people" that are giving me information. Just reasoning it out.

[dreamsunwind]

The writer of this article knows Stevie. How well she knows her I'm not sure, but I assume it has something to do with her working for the magazine, she's spoken with her. I think she has connections in regards to the music industry in general. I remember I saw some of her tweets a long time ago and she had a personal note from Stevie.

[jkmaletic]

This article names no sources. I find it strange they apparently know more about what happened than Variety, Rolling Stone, and TMZ.

Maybe I missed something, but I don't see where this had more information. The conversation that Elle posted with Rick Turner was the most information we've had actually. This article just goes over the band history and what ended up happening. It's like a summary with a tiny bit of opinion added in.

Jamie

[elle]

Well, Rolling Stones's initial article said he quit the band, and they later changed the title. It's entirely posible somone with more interest in Lindsey's career knows more than Rolling Stones. :shrug:
i thought Rolling Stone's article said he was fired from the beginning?

definitely from the first time i saw it.

Variety at first said he left, then they issues a correction, said they checked with the Rolling Stone, and that he was actually fired.

[elle]

The writer of this article knows Stevie.

i thought so too.

[sodascouts]

The "blindsiding" aspect was new - or at least, it was new to me.

[FuzzyPlum]

The writer of this article knows Stevie. How well she knows her I'm not sure, but I assume it has something to do with her working for the magazine, she's spoken with her. I think she has connections in regards to the music industry in general. I remember I saw some of her tweets a long time ago and she had a personal note from Stevie.

i thought so too.


I'm not sure she personally knows Stevie that well but I think it fair to say she's a major Chiffon-head.

[Storms123]

The "blindsiding" aspect was new - or at least, it was new to me.

I agree--this really seems to have come to a head very quickly.

[elle]

I'm not sure she personally knows Stevie that well but I think it fair to say she's a major Chiffon-head.

i think she met Stevie on numerous occasions (that magazine i think started with her interviewing Stevie?), was backstage at a number of FM and SN solo shows, got comped seats, talked to Stevie etc.

[button-lip]

i thought Rolling Stone's article said he was fired from the beginning?

definitely from the first time i saw it.

Variety at first said he left, then they issues a correction, said they checked with the Rolling Stone, and that he was actually fired.

You’re right! I meant to write Variety instead to RS! You know, lack of sleep. :angel:

[elle]

just FYI - second thread on the topic of Lindsey firing already closed in the Steve Hoffman forum.

makes me think someone is contacting reputable boards and shutting these threads down. maybe that corporate greed theory has some legs behind it. the plot thickens!

[button-lip]

If it's true that they knew for sure that far ahead of time they were going to fire him, why say the kind of things they did at Musicares? Why would they bother having even one day of rehearsal with him? Why would they bother announcing that Sirius station that got yanked at the last minute?

More likely those guys were an alternate plan and they hoped to work something out with Lindsey. Again, Mick must have known it would be best to keep the Rumours 5 together.

Still, I believe what button-lip's sources tell her regarding Lindsey backing down, because you don't use the word "fired" when you were offered a chance to stay if you cooperated and you chose not to.

Thus, the reconciliation of the narratives for me is that the alternate plan became the primary plan at the last minute for personal reasons, since business-wise, they should have let Lindsey stay after he backed down.

Sadly, unlike apparently half the people who post here, I have no "insider sources" or "friends who know people" that are giving me information. Just reasoning it out.

What appall me of Musicares is Stevie's kindness towards Lindsey. That's all I'm gonna say about it. Luckily, he took his family, and what a beautiful family he has! :nod:

I agree 100% with your analysis, Nancy. No matter that Lindsey was ready to postpone his solo tour for FM tour. Personal reasons were in the middle of any possibility of reconciliation. And that was the end.

[dreamsunwind]

I'm not sure she personally knows Stevie that well but I think it fair to say she's a major Chiffon-head.

Oh I'm not saying she's a close personal friend or anything, but what Elle said is right, she does have her 'connections' to Stevie and has talked with her and been treated by her. She is indeed a HUGE fan but what's interesting is that she's been quite critical of Stevie in regards to what's happened. I follow her on twitter and if you see her activity, she's definitely not blinded by her love of Stevie.

[BombaySapphire3]

Oh I'm not saying she's a close personal friend or anything, but what Elle said is right, she does have her 'connections' to Stevie and has talked with her and been treated by her. She is indeed a HUGE fan but what's interesting is that she's been quite critical of Stevie in regards to what's happened. I follow her on twitter and if you see her activity, she's definitely not blinded by her love of Stevie.

I think that there are going to be quite a few Stevie fans(myself included ) that have a sense of fair play that are not happy with her and the remaining other 3 and their treatment of Lindsey.If the details of what happened at the musicare event are accurate I would not even rank this scuffle in the top 10 of Stevie/Lindsey altercations of all time.

[dreamsunwind]

I think that there are going to be quite a few Stevie fans(myself included ) that have a sense of fair play that are not happy with her and the remaining other 3 and their treatment of Lindsey.If the details of what happened at the musicare event are accurate I would not even rank this scuffle in the top 10 of Stevie/Lindsey altercations of all time.

If what Elle says is true then they cut him off in February, so if they did get into a fight at Musicares it was probably justified since he was likely tense over what was going on. But that's just speculation on my part.

[dreamsunwind]

What I liked about her songs was that I had to figure out what she was talking about (and I wasn't the only one, Christine was wondering about the same thing) but when Tango came along I didn't need to figure it out anymore because she wrote exactly about what was going on. The same goes for the albums after that.


I SO agree with this! While I get that people's writing style changes over time I am totally with you about how that whole mysterious thing she had going on was one of my favorite things about her songs.
Sara is the perfect example of that. Who even knows what on earth she is talking about/trying to say in that song but the lyrics are BEAUTIFUL and the song is just gorgeous.

[StevieandChris]

If it's true that they knew for sure that far ahead of time they were going to fire him, why say the kind of things they did at Musicares? Why would they bother having even one day of rehearsal with him? Why would they bother announcing that Sirius station that got yanked at the last minute?

More likely those guys were an alternate plan and they hoped to work something out with Lindsey. Again, Mick must have known it would be best to keep the Rumours 5 together.

Still, I believe what button-lip's sources tell her regarding Lindsey backing down, because you don't use the word "fired" when you were offered a chance to stay if you cooperated and you chose not to.

Thus, the reconciliation of the narratives for me is that the alternate plan became the primary plan at the last minute for personal reasons, since business-wise, they should have let Lindsey stay after he backed down.

Sadly, unlike apparently half the people who post here, I have no "insider sources" or "friends who know people" that are giving me information. Just reasoning it out.

I agree with this, but it’s also why I don’t feel sorry for Lindsey any longer. I can easily see the other four tired of him being a jerk so that could be the personal reason why it could not be resolved. We have no idea.He’d sue if he feels there was a breach of contract. He’s been an ass to too many people in the band and in the industry in general. Combined with the fact that he does not have Stevie’s pull, it’s a no brainer. My ex does not Fleetwood Mac and when I mentioned this drama, his first reaction was “what did he do this time?”

And I am not saying Stevie is innocent or an angel.

But it’s ridic to pretend he did not play a role in this.

[Storms123]

I agree with this, but it’s also why I don’t feel sorry for Lindsey any longer. I can easily see the other four tired of him being a jerk so that could be the personal reason why it could not be resolved. We have no idea.He’d sue if he feels there was a breach of contract. He’s been an ass to too many people in the band and in the industry in general. Combined with the fact that he does not have Stevie’s pull, it’s a no brainer. My ex does not Fleetwood Mac and when I mentioned this drama, his first reaction was “what did he do this time?”

And I am not saying Stevie is innocent or an angel.

But it’s ridic to pretend he did not play a role in this.

They all played a role in it--and that's the sad part. The whole situation is sad and unfortunate. I look forward to hearing from the 4 of them (let's face it, John will say nothing) to get the truth--or a least how they all perceive it having gone down. There are 3 sides to every story, and the truth ultimately lies some where in the middle.

[2nd_Hand_News]

Long time lurker but felt the need to join up once all of this went down last week.

A sad, sad time it is indeed. Been a fan of Fleetwood Mac for as long as I can remember. Found the band back in the day through my dad's love of Stevie Nicks' music ("I Can't Wait" was my first exposure to her, we both love that song), and from there I quickly bought up all of Fleetwood Mac's records. After that, I quickly found myself staying more for Buckingham's material more than anyone else's, even though everyone else is ridiculously talented as well.

From that point, Lindsey's music was a huge fixture in my life, so I was blindsided and saddened to read the news last Monday. Thanks, in the off chance he sees this, Lindsey for the many great songs and albums and I can't wait to hear what's next from you. Can't necessarily say that I feel that same way about Fleetwood Mac at the moment, but if Lindsey's on tour, I'll no doubt be there to show my support.

[button-lip]

I agree with this, but it’s also why I don’t feel sorry for Lindsey any longer. I can easily see the other four tired of him being a jerk so that could be the personal reason why it could not be resolved. We have no idea.He’d sue if he feels there was a breach of contract. He’s been an ass to too many people in the band and in the industry in general. Combined with the fact that he does not have Stevie’s pull, it’s a no brainer. My ex does not Fleetwood Mac and when I mentioned this drama, his first reaction was “what did he do this time?”

And I am not saying Stevie is innocent or an angel.

But it’s ridic to pretend he did not play a role in this.

Chris didn’t have any problem touring with Lindsey, so I don’t understand why you insist this was a band decision. This was all Mick and Stevie. Chris and John were left out.

He has been an ass to the industry in general? Funny because I couldn’t find a single article about his firing where they argue it was ok because he was an ass to the industry in general. :shrug:

The role he played in all this is that he should have been smarter and not let Stevie get to him so easily.

They have no right to steal his legacy, especially when he was willing to postpone his solo tour. And they’re not 8 anymore.

[SteveMacD]

Here it is:


So I saw Neil and Liam Finn at the Coronation Hall in Waipu on Jan 5th this year.... (tail end of the 1st cyclone of the New Year)..... go camping there every New Years and when we saw this tour of small country town halls we were like "Hell yes!!". Only dabbled into 4 songs of SE and CH fame.... rest was new stuff and brilliantly played! (Well done Neil/Liam/Elroy/ Sharon and band!!)



Trundled along with some friends... happy to be inside a structure after tenting for two days of wet and wind! Watching the show as above - stunning sound and the comic banter of old CH was in effect...... go to the bar to get a wine...... and standing in a less lit area of the hall..... was Mick "I tower over everyone here by a mile" Fleetwood!!! Being a drummer myself the temptation to go and pester him was pretty high (like him) but took that moment to check ones self and leave him alone.



Obviously plans were afoot sometime ago.... so well done to both the Finn Clan and indeed for the Mac and Mike Campbell. I'm glad he is in the mix too.... given there is a connection from Damn the Torpedo's era and the producer that bought Nicks and Petty together (Jimmy Iovine). Seems nicely full circle
I don’t think it’s as calculated as that. Mick played on Neil’s 2016 album and they became good friends. I think Mick’s cameo at Neil’s show in January wasn’t all that different from him and Christine playing that corporate show with Steve Miller and Billy Gibbons. Just a bunch of musical friends getting to do something a little more casual.

That said, I do see a parallel between this and 1987. Mike, like Billy, was the obvious choice. Neil, like Rick Vito, was not as obvious and was probably the last viable musician who Mick had some type of meaningful musical interaction with who could work within the context of Fleetwood Mac prior to the s**t hitting the fan. Much like Lindsey and Stevie.

[StevieandChris]

Chris didn’t have any problem touring with Lindsey, so I don’t understand why you insist this was a band decision. This was all Mick and Stevie. Chris and John were left out.

We don’t know what happened after the tour, and the time between the tour ended and this decision was made.

He has been an ass to the industry in general? Funny because I couldn’t find a single article about his firing where they argue it was ok because he was an ass to the industry in general. :shrug:

I am thinking on his behavior that has been chronicled by others. How he behaved in front of Mick Jagger, Dick Clark, etc. He has been an ass. I don’t think there can be any question about it.

The role he played in all this is that he should have been smarter and not let Stevie get to him so easily.

They have no right to steal his legacy, especially when he was willing to postpone his solo tour. And they’re not 8 anymore.

His legacy can’t be stolen. As I said elsewhere, they are all acting like babies. Lindsey is not blameless in this.

[elle]

I agree with this, but it’s also why I don’t feel sorry for Lindsey any longer. I can easily see the other four tired of him being a jerk so that could be the personal reason why it could not be resolved. We have no idea.He’d sue if he feels there was a breach of contract. He’s been an ass to too many people in the band and in the industry in general. Combined with the fact that he does not have Stevie’s pull, it’s a no brainer. My ex does not Fleetwood Mac and when I mentioned this drama, his first reaction was “what did he do this time?”

1. rumors are he is suing
2. that's wishful thinking of some fans trying to throw the blame on him, that it's all his fault because he's a "jerk". i'm sick and tired of people claiming like that's a fact. while we have no idea how true or not. everyone who's been working with him is having his back now. and if it's true that industry powerplayers are behind this, that may create problems for them yet they are still behind him. that should tell you something.

[StevieandChris]

Oops somehow my other comments got mixed up in the post in italics, sorry.

[elle]

His legacy can’t be stolen. As I said elsewhere, they are all acting like babies. Lindsey is not blameless in this.

yes, but you are trying to put the blame mostly on him, because you know, he's supposedly a "jerk" - even your ex apparently think so, presumably because that's what you used to tell him. :lol:

[StevieandChris]

1. rumors are he is suing
2. that's wishful thinking of some fans trying to throw the blame on him, that it's all his fault because he's a "jerk". i'm sick and tired of people claiming like that's a fact. while we have no idea how true or not. everyone who's been working with him is having his back now. and if it's true that industry powerplayers are behind this, that may create problems for them yet they are still behind him. that should tell you something.

Just like it is wishful thinking to only blame Stevie and Mick. Four band members all agreed. If he had a history of NOT being a jerk, maybe it would not have happened in this way?

[elle]

Chris didn’t have any problem touring with Lindsey, so I don’t understand why you insist this was a band decision. This was all Mick and Stevie. Chris and John were left out.

He has been an ass to the industry in general? Funny because I couldn’t find a single article about his firing where they argue it was ok because he was an ass to the industry in general. :shrug:

The role he played in all this is that he should have been smarter and not let Stevie get to him so easily.

They have no right to steal his legacy, especially when he was willing to postpone his solo tour. And they’re not 8 anymore.

after that video today, i'm just thinking we've all been misled. Stevie was probably pulling the same bs me or him all the time, and it was not much different this time. whether or not he reacted to it, his faith was sealed. someone in industry likes making chimeric bands to try to get even more money. bands of people who won't stur sh*t. meanwhile Lindsey was not being a good little money-making soldier for those people, instead he complained against cashgrab tours. his fate was probably sealed once Chris pushed him to say what he really thought about Classics.

[elle]

Just like it is wishful thinking to only blame Stevie and Mick. Four band members all agreed. If he had a history of NOT being a jerk, maybe it would not have happened in this way?

read my posts. while you are still stuck on rumors from 30 or 4o years ago, like they want you to, i don't think this firing has much to do with their day-to-day childish squabbles. it is very possible there are some way more powerful people than macsters pulling the strings here. and their calculations may have misfired, so far..

or maybe i'm just watching too many movies! :p :laugh:

[button-lip]

yes, but you are trying to put the blame mostly on him, because you know, he's supposedly a "jerk" - even your ex apparently think so, presumably because that's what you used to tell him. :lol:

Yes, that’s all I’m hearing too. Lindsey is a jerk. And then the other four.

[button-lip]

after that video today, i'm just thinking we've all been misled. Stevie was probably pulling the same bs me or him all the time, and it was not much different this time. whether or not he reacted to it, his faith was sealed. someone in industry likes making chimeric bands to try to get even more money. bands of people who won't stur sh*t. meanwhile Lindsey was not being a good little money-making soldier for those people, instead he complained against cashgrab tours. his fate was probably sealed once Chris pushed him to say what he really thought about Classics.

And of course we all know who took the opportunity to get rid of him.

[elle]

And of course we all know who took the opportunity to get rid of him.
i'm not blaming her anymore. i don't think she took more or less opportunity than she normally does. i guess we'll hear when the tour starts whether she's happy or sad. if she's happy then you are right. if she's sad, then it's really not her fault that much. Mick though who went with it i still have just utter disdain for. but mostly i put it on "promoters". you know, those nice people who started Line Nation.

again, maybe i just had too little sleep with this whole roller-coaster week, and i'm making up scenarios that don't exist. idk.

[dreamsunwind]

after that video today, i'm just thinking we've all been misled. Stevie was probably pulling the same bs me or him all the time, and it was not much different this time. whether or not he reacted to it, his faith was sealed. someone in industry likes making chimeric bands to try to get even more money. bands of people who won't stur sh*t. meanwhile Lindsey was not being a good little money-making soldier for those people, instead he complained against cashgrab tours. his fate was probably sealed once Chris pushed him to say what he really thought about Classics.

I'm confused...what is this video you're talking about?

[elle]

I'm confused...what is this video you're talking about?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=1342&v=-B87yPmRy1s

listen all the way through the end.

[mikeymac]

This feels like Mick's decision to me. I get the feeling Mick wants to reassert HIS leadership; I'll bet he wants Peter Green songs back in and Lindsey scoffed. And what a complete double standard on the way Lindsey is treated versus waiting three years for Stevie, but then again Mick is a little partial to Stevie ;).

[BLY]

[QUOTE=mikeymac;1223478]This feels like Mick's decision to me. I get the feeling Mick wants to reassert HIS leadership; I'll bet he wants Peter Green songs back in and Lindsey scoffed. And what a complete double standard on the way Lindsey is treated versus waiting three years for Stevie, but then again Mick is a little partial to Stevie ;).[/QUO


I agree Mick may be partial to Steve but it's very obvious that Mick and Lindsey are close and that hasn't changed. It's all about timing.....timing timing timing.

[Storms123]

I agree Mick may be partial to Steve but it's very obvious that Mick and Lindsey are close and that hasn't changed. It's all about timing.....timing timing timing.[/QUOTE]

How close now? And I am not trying to stir the pot with that comment at all. I saw the press and PR for BuckVie--it was a love fest for sure. You can tell they truly enjoyed it. The band has his name on it, and it's highly likely that he's the one that had to deliver the message. Again, we have no idea what went down so I am really trying not to speculate. It's been hard the last week for sure! I am drawn back to Lindsey's wife's post where she said something like "He's a good man and got a raw deal" something to that effect. Leading me to think/hope it is timing timing timing as you said.

[singertobe]

I hope someone makes a "Hitler Rants" video about this. You guys know what I'm talking about right? That thing where they change the subtitles on the Downfall movie and make it so he's talking about something else.

[bombaysaffires]

I hope someone makes a "Hitler Rants" video about this. You guys know what I'm talking about right? That thing where they change the subtitles on the Downfall movie and make it so he's talking about something else.

i think someone should find a movie where it's a bunch of people going at it and the subtitles should reflect what each band member says

[bobwelchera]

My goodness.

There is so much negativity here. It's like everyone lost a best friend, then their brother, then it rained for a month.

I'm sad Lindsey won't be a part of it, for sure. I even am teaching myself guitar with a style inspired from his playing. But I'm not angry. That's a lot of wasted energy. The band will go on for this tour, and who knows? Maybe they actually put together an album. I'm game to give them a shot.

Behind The Mask had some good tunes, although Do You Know and The Second Time were the cheesiest and weakest tunes on there, respectively. I do wish As Long As You Follow, No Questions Asked, Paper Doll, Heart of Stone, and Love Shines all found their way on there - even just As Long As You Follow replacing Do You Know and Paper Doll replacing The Second Time would've made that album a lot better. (Paper Doll would've been the needed energy to close out the album too.)

Everyone hates on Time soooo much. Yeah, it felt a bit strange (foreshadowing) not to have Lindsey or Stevie present for the first time since Heroes, and These Strange Times should've been cut (maybe All Over Again too, though it is sweet). Nights In Estoril actually would've been the better closer. But in my long-held opinion, there actually are strong songs on there, and had it been promoted as a country/AOR album in '93 instead of '95, it would've been more successful. Talkin' To My Heart has Top 40 on the country charts written all over it. As does Blow By Blow (which seems to receive the most angst from Time on here for some reason), and Winds of Change.

At any rate, I actually am intrigued by Neil and Mike being in the band - how will Christine and Stevie sound harmonizing with Neil? Does the band open with Everywhere (with Christine's voice at its freshest for the night), Little Lies, or even Rhiannon? Maybe Neil sings Hypnotized? His voice is high enough to sound closer to Lindsey's original vocal on The Chain, so that should be interesting. I could see Spare Me A Little of Your Love making an appearance now. It also wouldn't surprise me if they play one new song, which would be welcomed on my end.

If you don't want to support the band now, I get it, and maybe there are enough folks who feel that way, and that'll make floor seats affordable. :laugh: But we have decades of music and performances with Lindsey in the band, and those aren't going away.

[AncientQueen]

Idon't know, it's just while I'm by no means a Lindsey fan, I have to respect him for all his work in the last decades, after Christine left, he hold the band together, musically and with his energy on stage. And who will replace him in his way to energize the whole band? I feel that FM is now Stevies background band, throw in some catchy Christine songs. And I'm so disappointed about the lack of information/interviews/statements from the band. And the most important for me: What is Christines point of view? I want to know where she stands in this mess. Is she stabbing Lindsey in the bakc, or did something happen that made her change her only recently very good) opinion about him?
In the end, it doesn't matter, since I will probably not see the band again. Since 1990 I went to every germany tour at least once and I only ONCE managed to see all Five Fireflies together, in 2015. I will not deminish the memory of that day for the current incarnation, this is just not my band anymore.

[elle]

Idon't know, it's just while I'm by no means a Lindsey fan, I have to respect him for all his work in the last decades, after Christine left, he hold the band together, musically and with his energy on stage. And who will replace him in his way to energize the whole band? I feel that FM is now Stevies background band, throw in some catchy Christine songs. And I'm so disappointed about the lack of information/interviews/statements from the band. And the most important for me: What is Christines point of view? I want to know where she stands in this mess. Is she stabbing Lindsey in the bakc, or did something happen that made her change her only recently very good) opinion about him?
In the end, it doesn't matter, since I will probably not see the band again. Since 1990 I went to every germany tour at least once and I only ONCE managed to see all Five Fireflies together, in 2015. I will not deminish the memory of that day for the current incarnation, this is just not my band anymore.
band is working hard paying various magazines and papers to push the story of "parting ways" (vs firing which is the truth - that LB wants out) plus surrounding smearing campaign against LB. they got some tickets to sell!

[AncientQueen]

^^^ I want them interviewed, want them to explain themselves. To tell me, why they are okay with no studio album, why the band is still called Fleetwood Mac when Christine or Lindsey are out, but not, when Stevie does not participate, why Lindsey is out right after Mike Campbell needs a new job. And why the heck I should take them serious after such a stunt.

[UnwindedDreams]

My natural reasoning guided me to ask this question in this thread. Neale and Brett will most likely tour with this new FM lineup during the upcoming tour, right?

I don't know if these gentlemen are in a financial position to leave the FM Touring Band (Sharon, Stevvi, Lori, and Mick's support percussionist). I enjoyed watching Neale and Brett in Lindsey's touring band.

[Storms123]

band is working hard paying various magazines and papers to push the story of "parting ways" (vs firing which is the truth - that LB wants out) plus surrounding smearing campaign against LB. they got some tickets to sell!

Does it behoove them to smear him though? Devils advocate here, nothing more. The all look so incredibly immature here, that there really is no upside to a smear campaign, and it could hurt them more in the case of a lawsuit. No idea if there is one looming but if contracts were signed.....then you have CAH crawling out of the woodwork looking to sell more books. I also have not read anything new that’s particularly damaging to LB. I think bringing up passed theories about his behavior is ridiculous and an excuse to sell papers. IIRC, Stevie has never said anything beyond he’s difficult to work with (I am sure none of them are a walk in the park to work with). The biography about here was rubbish(even got her bd wrong)and she’s even acknowledged the fight in Christine’s driveway wasn’t her finest moment either. The remaining 4 are going to need to go out and do press for this. There are going to be so many clauses around what interviewers can and can’t ask, the most we are going to get is what their favorite colors are. I am not a Stevie fan or a Lindsey fan. I love them both and am ultimately a fan of the band. That’s why this entire episode is so disheartening

[elle]

Does it behoove them to smear him though? Devils advocate here, nothing more. The all look so incredibly immature here, that there really is no upside to a smear campaign, and it could hurt them more in the case of a lawsuit. No idea if there is one looming but if contracts were signed.....then you have CAH crawling out of the woodwork looking to sell more books. I also have not read anything new that’s particularly damaging to LB.

i have no idea how all this works. i was just told by a fellow fan (who is not a lb fan actually, but is in music publishing) that it's a standard practice in music business these days to send prepped statements and articles to various publications, and that there is a price list for that.

i think Carol's statement from the other day was very classy and it would be nice to leave her out of this. her statement almost sounded like somebody contacted her and asked her to throw LB under the bus, and she decided to not do that, while still staying truthful. so i have nothing but respect for her.

[Storms123]

i have no idea how all this works. i was just told by a fellow fan (who is not a lb fan actually, but is in music publishing) that it's a standard practice in music business these days to send prepped statements and articles to various publications, and that there is a price list for that.

i think Carol's statement from the other day was very classy and it would be nice to leave her out of this. her statement almost sounded like somebody contacted her and asked her to throw LB under the bus, and she decided to not do that, while still staying truthful. so i have nothing but respect for her.

The statements are definitely prepped, could not agree more. Hopefully we get a little more substance out of the 5 of them at some point. Will go a long way to ending a lot of the speculation.

[secondhandchain]

If ANYONE else is out, it is STILL called Fleetwood Mac, but when the one who rides broom, takes selfies and has never had plastic surgery (she just looks great because "she stopped going in the sun at 30"...YEAH RIGHT) isn't involved, we can't call it Fleetwood Mac. There is a reason that my admiration from Tambourine lady has gone from a 100 to a 3 in two years.

[FuzzyPlum]

My natural reasoning guided me to ask this question in this thread. Neale and Brett will most likely tour with this new FM lineup during the upcoming tour, right?

I don't know if these gentlemen are in a financial position to leave the FM Touring Band (Sharon, Stevvi, Lori, and Mick's support percussionist). I enjoyed watching Neale and Brett in Lindsey's touring band.


I wonder whether they'll need Neale. On the Shake the Cage Tour and Behind the Mask tour they only had Rick and Billy. Now they have Mike and Neil will they still go for a third guitarist? Having said that, Neil Finn is an accomplished keyboard player- do they even need Brett? Not wanting to talk them out of a job but I wonder if they need both of them. Otherwise, might Stevie want to bring Carlos back in?

[bwboy]

If ANYONE else is out, it is STILL called Fleetwood Mac, but when the one who rides broom, takes selfies and has never had plastic surgery (she just looks great because "she stopped going in the sun at 30"...YEAH RIGHT) isn't involved, we can't call it Fleetwood Mac. There is a reason that my admiration from Tambourine lady has gone from a 100 to a 3 in two years.

In all the interviews I read with Lindsey for the Buckingham McVie album, he denied it was supposed to have been a FM album EVERY TIME. So either he was lying or it was never meant to be a FM album.

I think Lindsey was totally lying about it. It was supposed to be a FM album, and they kept hoping Stevie would give in and record a song or two they could slap on the album but she refused to do so, and the record label insisted it not be called a FM album.

[FuzzyPlum]

In all the interviews I read with Lindsey for the Buckingham McVie album, he denied it was supposed to have been a FM album EVERY TIME. So either he was lying or it was never meant to be a FM album.

I think Lindsey was totally lying about it. It was supposed to be a FM album, and they kept hoping Stevie would give in and record a song or two they could slap on the album but she refused to do so, and the record label insisted it not be called a FM album.

Yes. It was supposed to be a Fleetwood Mac album, of course. Lindsey spoke an alternative truth

[aleuzzi]

In all the interviews I read with Lindsey for the Buckingham McVie album, he denied it was supposed to have been a FM album EVERY TIME. So either he was lying or it was never meant to be a FM album.

I think Lindsey was totally lying about it. It was supposed to be a FM album, and they kept hoping Stevie would give in and record a song or two they could slap on the album but she refused to do so, and the record label insisted it not be called a FM album.

Originally, in May 2015, when Christine and Lindsey's collaborations were reported in Billboard and then in Rolling Stone, the language was that the participating four hoped this would be a FM album. However, even from the start there was the caveat that "in one way or another" the new music would come to light. So, I'm guessing the band already knew it would only be a FM album if Stevie participated. If she didn't they wouldn't (couldn't?) call it Fleetwood Mac. This has angered a lot of people, myself included, in no small part because it has prioritized the participation of one member over all others, a member whose actual knowledge of music and ability to shape musical direction is decidedly less than the others. In the words of one of my friends, "Fleetwood Mac is not a going concern without Stevie Nicks." I hate this statement but it is, alas, true for the overwhelming majority of the public. Even when Christine or Lindsey hit it out of the park, Stevie gets some credit. Another friend repeatedly tells me her favorite FM song is "Little Lies" because "Stevie Nicks sings it so well." Well, either my friend is talking about one phrase repeated three or four times in the song or she assumes all singing, no matter what it sounds like, is done by Stevie. Ridiculous. Sad, but true: for most people, Stevie is the epitome of the group. When I enthuse about the LB/CM album, some friends say, "it was boring" (really? more boring than Say You Will? I loved Say You Will but if either is going to be boring THAT would qualify a little more); other friends say, "I'm mad they did the album without Stevie" even when they KNOW Stevie REFUSED to participate.

I ramble.

[elle]

In all the interviews I read with Lindsey for the Buckingham McVie album, he denied it was supposed to have been a FM album EVERY TIME. So either he was lying or it was never meant to be a FM album.

I think Lindsey was totally lying about it. It was supposed to be a FM album, and they kept hoping Stevie would give in and record a song or two they could slap on the album but she refused to do so, and the record label insisted it not be called a FM album.

you know better than that, as you said in your second paragraph. read his and Chris' and Mick's interviews BEFORE the album became BuckVie.

he was covering for Stevie and Mick, to appease Stevie. i wonder if he regrets it now?

oh, i don't think it was record label. it was Mick. he wanted his cashcow. hope it blows up in his face.

[jbrownsjr]

Originally, in May 2015, when Christine and Lindsey's collaborations were reported in Billboard and then in Rolling Stone, the language was that the participating four hoped this would be a FM album. However, even from the start there was the caveat that "in one way or another" the new music would come to light. So, I'm guessing the band already knew it would only be a FM album if Stevie participated. If she didn't they wouldn't (couldn't?) call it Fleetwood Mac. This has angered a lot of people, myself included, in no small part because it has prioritized the participation of one member over all others, a member whose actual knowledge of music and ability to shape musical direction is decidedly less than the others. In the words of one of my friends, "Fleetwood Mac is not a going concern without Stevie Nicks." I hate this statement but it is, alas, true for the overwhelming majority of the public. Even when Christine or Lindsey hit it out of the park, Stevie gets some credit. Another friend repeatedly tells me her favorite FM song is "Little Lies" because "Stevie Nicks sings it so well." Well, either my friend is talking about one phrase repeated three or four times in the song or she assumes all singing, no matter what it sounds like, is done by Stevie. Ridiculous. Sad, but true: for most people, Stevie is the epitome of the group. When I enthuse about the LB/CM album, some friends say, "it was boring" (really? more boring than Say You Will? I loved Say You Will but if either is going to be boring THAT would qualify a little more); other friends say, "I'm mad they did the album without Stevie" even when they KNOW Stevie REFUSED to participate.

I ramble.

This cracks me up so much. It explains the behavior of most chiffons. :rolleyes:

[elle]

Another friend repeatedly tells me her favorite FM song is "Little Lies" because "Stevie Nicks sings it so well." Well, either my friend is talking about one phrase repeated three or four times in the song or she assumes all singing, no matter what it sounds like, is done by Stevie.

it's the second. i cannot count how many people have told me how much they love Stevie's song Go Your Own Way, and would not believe me that she didn't write that song. some in the general public consider it her signature song lol. or her song Songbird. that's why i'd love it if Lindsey prevents them from doing GYOW live. people would notice that. same if Chris prevented them from doing Don't Stop when she was retired.

she's the face of the band, and given credit for everything that others did. it is what it is.

[HomerMcvie]

you know better than that, as you said in your second paragraph. read his and Chris' and Mick's interviews BEFORE the album became BuckVie.

he was covering for Stevie and Mick, to appease Stevie. i wonder if he regrets it now?

oh, i don't think it was record label. it was Mick. he wanted his cashcow. hope it blows up in his face.

She is the reason FM exists. And that they have the fan base they do. And as much as I dislike her, Mick is the real douche in this horrible situation. Karma would be that idiot having to file for bankruptcy one more time. And never recovering from it, dying penniless.

Used to, there was no contest for whom I disliked the most. Man, Mick is really catching up!

[button-lip]

Originally, in May 2015, when Christine and Lindsey's collaborations were reported in Billboard and then in Rolling Stone, the language was that the participating four hoped this would be a FM album. However, even from the start there was the caveat that "in one way or another" the new music would come to light. So, I'm guessing the band already knew it would only be a FM album if Stevie participated. If she didn't they wouldn't (couldn't?) call it Fleetwood Mac. This has angered a lot of people, myself included, in no small part because it has prioritized the participation of one member over all others, a member whose actual knowledge of music and ability to shape musical direction is decidedly less than the others. In the words of one of my friends, "Fleetwood Mac is not a going concern without Stevie Nicks." I hate this statement but it is, alas, true for the overwhelming majority of the public. Even when Christine or Lindsey hit it out of the park, Stevie gets some credit. Another friend repeatedly tells me her favorite FM song is "Little Lies" because "Stevie Nicks sings it so well." Well, either my friend is talking about one phrase repeated three or four times in the song or she assumes all singing, no matter what it sounds like, is done by Stevie. Ridiculous. Sad, but true: for most people, Stevie is the epitome of the group. When I enthuse about the LB/CM album, some friends say, "it was boring" (really? more boring than Say You Will? I loved Say You Will but if either is going to be boring THAT would qualify a little more); other friends say, "I'm mad they did the album without Stevie" even when they KNOW Stevie REFUSED to participate.

I ramble.

And she's probably the new musical director of the band. Seriously. It cracks me up. :laugh::laugh:

But she has more power in the musical industry than I care to admit.

[Iamwilliame]

^^^ I want them interviewed, want them to explain themselves. To tell me, why they are okay with no studio album, why the band is still called Fleetwood Mac when Christine or Lindsey are out, but not, when Stevie does not participate, why Lindsey is out right after Mike Campbell needs a new job. And why the heck I should take them serious after such a stunt.

YES TO THIS ALL DAY LONG!!! I have been saying Buckingham /McVie was as much if not more of a Fleetwood Mac album than Say You Will. I'll even argue it's as much so as Tango In The Night.

I believe the ugliness is just beginning. There is no way Stevie will be able to not comment about all this to Rolling Stone. I'm expecting Lindsey to stay quiet, disappear into his studio and come back with the best album of his career. Maybe he'll form his own band with some wayward big names. I kind of like the idea of Benmont Tench from the Heartbreakers on keyboards. In all seriousness, it would be cool to see him collaborate more with other musicians.

[UnwindedDreams]

I wonder whether they'll need Neale. On the Shake the Cage Tour and Behind the Mask tour they only had Rick and Billy. Now they have Mike and Neil will they still go for a third guitarist? Having said that, Neil Finn is an accomplished keyboard player- do they even need Brett? Not wanting to talk them out of a job but I wonder if they need both of them. Otherwise, might Stevie want to bring Carlos back in? Thank you for this information. I did not know about Neil Finn's abilities. I appreciate your response!

I considered the thought that Neale or Brett would be nominated as musical director for the upcoming FM tour. Elton's musical director is Davey Johnstone, who is not an original member of his band (As an aside, Elton's concerts are not always advertised as "Elton and His Band"). I think the Stones' musical director is Chuck Leavell, the keyboardist and background vocalist. I think The Who's musical director is someone other than Roger or Pete as well. My thinking was that the musical director/show designer for huge bands isn't always a member of the band (exception is Davey).

The possibility of Carlos returning hadn't occurred to me. Speaking of former touring musicians, Taku was in the MusiCares band in January. My prediction is Neale, Brett, Stevvi, Lori, and Sharon stay with no additional hires.

[Storms123]

YES TO THIS ALL DAY LONG!!! I have been saying Buckingham /McVie was as much if not more of a Fleetwood Mac album than Say You Will. I'll even argue it's as much so as Tango In The Night.

I believe the ugliness is just beginning. There is no way Stevie will be able to not comment about all this to Rolling Stone. I'm expecting Lindsey to stay quiet, disappear into his studio and come back with the best album of his career. Maybe he'll form his own band with some wayward big names. I kind of like the idea of Benmont Tench from the Heartbreakers on keyboards. In all seriousness, it would be cool to see him collaborate more with other musicians.

Lindsey and Benmont--how fantastic would that be. Have to assume Christine won't be handling keyboards anymore for him. No Buck/Vie II

[Dr.Brown]

My dream would be a collaboration featuring Lindsey and Jeremy Spencer. I've always thought Jeremy circa Kiln House and Lindsey circa Tusk/Law and Order were kindred spirits. Together they could produce yet another "duo album" this time called Buckingham Spencer featuring a dead penguin somewhere on the cover with a BS logo on its chest.

[dreamsunwind]

I was just listening to the early version of Crystal that got released on the deluxe edition a few months ago. His voice on it is to die for and it made me all sad :(

[jbrownsjr]

I actually had a great experience with a friend.

He said he absolutely would not go see BuckVie because Stevie wasn't going to be there. I bought tickets anyway and forced him.

He could not shut up about how much he loved Christine and Lindsey together.
He was screaming during NGBA and by the time YMLF came on he was dancing.
** I also made him listen to the CD a few times. He loved it.

He made tons of videos and said if they ever come back he's there. He was front row center.

The sold out crowd was on fire. It was really an amazing show on a warm night outdoors at the beautiful Greek Theater in Los Angeles.

[aleuzzi]

My dream would be a collaboration featuring Lindsey and Jeremy Spencer. I've always thought Jeremy circa Kiln House and Lindsey circa Tusk/Law and Order were kindred spirits. Together they could produce yet another "duo album" this time called Buckingham Spencer featuring a dead penguin somewhere on the cover with a BS logo on its chest.

In all seriousness, this is a not-uninteresting proposition. It could be called JEREMY SPENCER AND THE ANGRIEST DOG.

[iamnotafraid]

** I also made him listen to the CD a few times...

Now that's just mean!

[TrueFaith77]

In all seriousness, this is a not-uninteresting proposition. It could be called JEREMY SPENCER AND THE ANGRIEST DOG.

Jeremy Spencer is so prolific and talented. I really wish Mick had tapped him to rejoin the band if he was gonna do Lindsey like Caeasr. At least that would have made sense for a farewell tour.

That being said: Absolutely, I would be over the moon for a Lindsey collab with Spencer.

Fact is, Lindsey doesn't need a band but I do think he needs collaboration because it is part of his talents and his talents should not be wasted.

[Storms123]

Jeremy Spencer is so prolific and talented. I really wish Mick had tapped him to rejoin the band if he was gonna do Lindsey like Caeasr. At least that would have made sense for a farewell tour.

That being said: Absolutely, I would be over the moon for a Lindsey collab with Spencer.

Fact is, Lindsey doesn't need a band but I do think he needs collaboration because it is part of his talents and his talents should not be wasted.

He’s a fantastic artist, gifted and underrated guitarist and I look forward to any and all collaboration that comes out of this time for him. As many in this group has said, he’s the one/primary member of FM that still wants to create.

[michelej1]

You can’t prevent someone from live performing a song as long as they pay the rights.

Michele

[jbrownsjr]

Now that's just mean!

He loved it!! It was great pool party music. We were sipping champs by the pool and having a ball. The music is very upbeat and sparkles like the Palm Springs Sunshine.

[Neal]

He loved it!! It was great pool party music. We were sipping champs by the pool and having a ball. The music is very upbeat and sparkles like the Palm Springs Sunshine.

While I have enjoyed many a BuckVie tune poolside, you lost me with the oppressive, heat-stroke-inducing Palm Springs sunshine... ;)

[jbrownsjr]

While I have enjoyed many a BuckVie tune poolside, you lost me with the oppressive, heat-stroke-inducing Palm Springs sunshine... ;)

It's beautiful in Oct - March... Crystal clear skies... green lawns.. blue swimming pools... and if you're in and out of the water.. the air feels good.

[aleuzzi]

It's beautiful in Oct - March... Crystal clear skies... green lawns.. blue swimming pools... and if you're in and out of the water.. the air feels good.

And it's certainly better than upstate new York in April--I can tell you that.

[sue]

Brilliant blue skies 28’ or 82’ in Southern England today.
Hottest April day since 1949 !!

[gldstwmn]

It's beautiful in Oct - March... Crystal clear skies... green lawns.. blue swimming pools... and if you're in and out of the water.. the air feels good.
Desert Angel... another Mike Campbell tune with a great piano part. :woohoo:

[AncientQueen]

Desert Angel... another Mike Campbell tune with a great piano part. :woohoo:
NOOOOOOOOO! Desert Angel is so awfully bad.