The Other Side Of The Mirror - A Re-Evaluation?

[Dodfather]

Reading through this thread it quickly became one of the most infuriating on here! I agree with later posters re. the forcefulness of some people's opinions, something that doesn't really contribute to discussion.

As for TOSOTM - I have a real soft spot for it! Always loved Rooms On Fire, Long Way To Go, Alice and Juliet. Controversially, I also quite like Fire Burning. On the whole I do think it's a very patchy album though.

I can't stand Two Kinds Of Love or I Still Miss Someone. Both tracks are, to me, examples of wasted potential. For the latter - Stevie can sing country well, I love some of her more country stuff, so she could have really scored with this but I think it just doesn't work with that production style. As for Two Kinds Of Love, I think Bruce Hornsby is brilliant so should love a duet between them but instead what could have been a brilliant collaboration was wasted on quite a dull song.

[mylittledemon]

Look - The great part about the Ledge is that we all have different opinions... and we can all value why one person feels one thing about a certain record, and why another person may not.

We're all apples and oranges... and a few bananas ... But we all love Stevie, and there's our common ground.

There's no reason to not remain civil to one another. Please, let's not bait one another.

[starshine]

Wow, what a thread!! Well, Mirror will always be special to 'me' because well its when I first started collecting Stevie & Mac stuff. It was a special time for me. I liked it much better than RAL. I think we like certian songs or LP's because of the 'time' in our own lives at that moment. Somethings clicks with a song or group of songs. Sure , with each solo Stevie LP I can pick away of what I'd like more or less of. Or I like her 'look' or 'voice/vocal' here better. I think its kinda a personal thing for each one of us as we expericence it. Like I've stated in many threads through the yrs here. We all love what we love and don't like what we don't like about Stevie/Mac and neither is right or wrong it just is. (Like everything in life you love/like etc). I don't 'love' all that Stevie /Mac have done through the yrs nor do I agree with every choice they've made for LP's etc. Sure mistakes were made and better choices probably could've been made. Life goes on. We all have flaws and probably wish we could have made better choices as well. So, we go on with the hopes that we have learned something and will make a better choice next time. I still love Stevie's music even if I don't love all thats been recorded etc---I'm still a fan. Anyway, Mirror will be special to me always. I do love BD/WH more but Mirror is next than probaly RAL than SA.

[PenguinHead]

Wow! Discussion about this album has really sparked polarizing emotions! You're either on one side (of the mirror-I couldn't resist) or the other!

I don't think it's fair to dismiss a whole album as "garbage." As a dedicated fan, I will always sift through Stevie's garbage and find something redeemable. Even her most "questionable" songs have something to offer.

Granted, the production leaves a lot to be desired, and Stevie's state of mind at that time contributed to less that stellar results/and performances. It is what it is. The fact that it ellicits such intense love and hate says something about it. Art of any kind also gets these kind of subjective reactions. You either find something to value in it, or...want to throw it in the trash.

Despite the production, I really enjoy:

Rooms on Fire
Long Way to Go
Juliet
Doing the Best That I Can

Two Kinds of Love - Could have been a good song, but it's such an ill-conceive concept, and the lyrics and production suck. The only lines that have any concise value are: Who in the world do you think that you are fooling? Well, I've already done everything that you are doing!

Whole Lotta Trouble - This was a missed opportunity. Again, the lyrics and production suffer. Her live performances brought it down even further. The phrase: Would you change your mind at the very last minute? I think you should stop for a second and think for a moment" is good. But she could never remember it verbatim, and completely butchered it.

Fire Buring, Alice, and Ghosts are song that are uniquely Stevie.

Her two cover songs, Cry Wolf and I Still Miss Someone are passable, but very odd choices.

Real Tears should have never been regulated to a b-side! Too bad it wasn't included on the box set - it's an odd gem.

[tabruns]

Here you go:

The Other Side Of The Mirror is so under-rated, it's actually Stevie's best album ever. Discuss.

*ducks*

*runs away laughing maniacally*

[mikephxaz]

wow...after reading this thread I'm reminded of two important facts...First...I need to get a real life and Secondly...if Stevie Nicks ever reads this stuff she must be laughing her ass off!!

[Supernaut]

TOSOTM has hands-down the slickest, most shimmering and fully realized vocal production/harmonics of any Stevie Nicks record. Wall-of-sound Stevie harmonics. GORGEOUS.

She's not in the best of voice on this record, but she could still vamp. Also, there is some pretty good songwriting, as people have pointed out: Juliet, Ooh, My Love, Doing The Best I Can, Long Way To Go, Rooms On Fire - often, much better (in my opinion) than much of Rock A Little and almost everything subsequent.

[Artemis]

I've been totally and completely obsessed with Doing The Best I Can, lately. And I'm quite tempted to check out the rest of the album because of that. I only have 4 other songs from TOSOTM in my main playlist. The responses in this thread have made for some very interesting reading - I LOVE all the different opinions! And they've made me determined to sit down and listen to the entire album from start to finish, once more. Normally, whenever I try, I just skip the crap I dislike. Buut, I reckon it might be worth a shot. Afterall, I did that with RAL and now I love it!

[tabruns]

I can see why people love The Wild Heart and Rock A Little but for me TOSOTM was actually a more focused, better album.

The Wild Heart has the brilliant "Stand Back" and some other moments of glory: "I Will Run To You", "Sable On Blond" (although I do have to ignore the line "in silence she says 'excaliber'"), the wonderfully rolicking "Enchanted" and the lovely "Beauty and the Beast".

"Nightbird" and "If Anyone Falls In Love" are good songs but I'm a bit thrown by the marriage of the heavy synthesizer riffs with the spacey lyrics. "Gate and Garden" has a catchy chorus but I can't get past some of the lyrics. "Wild Heart" is a meandering unfocused song, and "Nothing Ever Changes" is like a synthesizer version of "Listen to the Rain"...its lacking that Stevie magic.

Rock A Little initially got my attention because of the very different production style. I loved "Talk To Me". Other songs on the album that appealed to me were "Rock A Little", "I Sing For The Things" and "If I Were You". I didn't care for "No Spoken Word" at first but seeing how many other Nicks fans loved the track led me to reconsider it.

"I Can't Wait" was hurt for me by the simultaneous release of Nu Shooz's "I Can't Wait". The comparison made Stevie's song sound like it was trying to be hip and failing. "Has Anyone Ever Written..." just didn't ignite for me. Instead of being moving, it was slow and uninteresting. I couldn't stand "Sister Honey" at all, it immediately sounded gimmicky to me, I could tell "Imperial Hotel" was a good song but I just didn't care for it, "Some Become Strangers" I liked until I heard the Williams Brothers superior version, and "The Nightmare" was another meandering Stevie song.

In contrast I thought TOSOTM was an over-all stronger album. "Rooms On Fire" was and is one of my favorite Nicks songs ever. I like that the first single off the album was co-written by her. I liked "Long Way To Go" but was surprised it was a single. I liked "Two Kinds of Love" even though it was obviously very easy-listening and the lyrics are basically indecipherable. "Ooh My Love", "Ghosts" and "Whole Lotta Trouble" were all good songs, so for my money side 1 (this was back in the vinyl days) was the most solid Nicks string of songs since Bella Donna.

For side 2, I liked "Fire Burning" and "Cry Wolf" even though they didn't really seem to fit with the rest of the album. "Alice", "Juliet" and "Doing The Best That I Can" were great. "I Still Miss Someone" stuck out like a sore thumb as not fitting on the album even more than the first two songs on side 2.

Over-all there weren't any songs on TOSOTM that I just didn't like as there had been on TWH and RAL, I liked my favorite track on it more than any favorite tracks on the other Nicks albums, and that mystical Nicksian "witchy" vibe was all over the album. When it came out it ranked very close to Bella Donna to me.

[sara1998]

Originally Posted by TheWILDheart

Alright, fine, I'll say it.

Jondalar, shut up. You're going to have to accept that some of us love RAL, OSOTM and SA. Your opinion is not fact and low sales do not make any of us love an albm any less. You're clogging up the board by stating your opinion as fact and shoving it peoples faces. Just accept the fact that not everyone feels the same way you do.

I'm standing and applauding. Thanks for that.

RAL is an okay album. Now days it's pretty dated. I guess TOSOTM is as well, but it's probably my favorite. I can't tell you why... maybe the whole notion of it being "concept" if you will, but I enjoy it.

That's all I have... No shoving of my opinion down anyone's throat... see how easy that was??

[StevieNicksfann]

I have said before that although I like Bella Donna a lot, I realize I am being blasphemous when I say that it is not the masterpiece most people seem to think it is. I think a lot of the halo effect happened because it was her first album and had hits on it ad established a benchmark to be compared to. I personally love Rock A Little and for the times, think it could have been a much bigger album had it been her first. No matter how strong an album is, it is "tougher" with each outing because you're not new anymore and the stakes are more elevated each time. With this in mind, OF COURSE each album will dip a little. It would have been different if Stevie were a new singer where you begin with a strong album and break out with one hit. Then the Rumours of this new singer's career comes and it becomes the sleeper hit and usually the next album becomes a monster. By the 4th album, it becomes difficult to truly maintain people's interest. Now add the changing of times, changing of music formats, how it is shared, the advent of MTV, how things are promoted, the tastes changing, the world changing, Live Aid, Just say no to drugs, etc... And with Stevie in particular, she was on Klonopin ffs. Of course her vocals were more effortful, she was ON DRUGS. Legal ones. But drugs nevertheless that altered her perception and as she describes it, robbed her soul.

And as I said already in the beginning of this thread, I think you listen to Long Way To Go and that has one of the best vocals she had had in a long time at that point. Two Kinds of Love is beautiful because of the end, and in that vein, the payoff makes the whole thing worth it. Whole Lotta Trouble or LWTG should have kicked off the album to keep her ensconced in the rock formats then the other songs could have followed.

And in terms of those other variables - I could care less when it was certified platinum or if it was at all. TISL has not been certified, who knows if IYD ever will and that does not translate to either of them being less viable albums. I don't care that Bella Donna sold the best. I do not think it's her best album but I don't want to mislead anyone either. I think ALL of her albums are almost equal except Street Angel. And I thought that before it tanked. In fact, People Magazine and others were giving Street Angel pretty good reviews at first which surprised me after they slammed OSOTM and I'm like wtf? I loved that album and hate SA. Yet sure enough in spite of the reviews, the fans clearly spoke their peace and did not buy it. And that's before the internet piracy thing.

Maybe it takes us being in a certain place in life because for me I can appreciate the genius that OSOTM is although not infallible either.

Regardless, I agree you can't arbitrarily call something that is so obviously subjective garbage. That honestly says a lot more about you than it does about Stevie's music.

[markolas]

After listening to the whole thing (as released, tyvm) a couple of times in the last few days, I'm reassessing this album. Actually, I think it's very good and I'd put it in a 2nd place tie with RAL for my favorite SN solo album. I still don't care for TKOL very much, but I can tolerate it. The other song I always said I didn't like, Cry Wolf, I have to say I like now quite a bit. It lends itself to the thematic darkness of the album really well, as does Doing the Best That I Can. And I've always thought I Still Miss Someone was a great way to close this album.

So, yeah. TOSOTM=

[chiliD]

Ok, so, I'll be a bit early and give TOSOTM it's 20th annual run through* a bit earlier in the year than usual.

It's usually mid-summer when I give it it's annual play, but this thread has both "inspired" and "forced" me to move up the schedule a bit.


*= When it first came out, I played it a LOT, I really WANTED to like it. But other than "Rooms On Fire", I just couldn't stand it, so I put it aside for a couple of years before starting on the "once a year trial run".

That said, (switching gears here a bit) this year, the chances for an "attitude flip" on TOSOTM has better odds than most prior years since I just got In Your Dreams yesterday (listened through about 5 straight times last night). Can't say it's her "Best Ever", but I'm liking just about every song...there's not one that jumped out at me that I must skip (there's always been at LEAST one per album of hers that after my initial few playthroughs, that I'm inclined to ignore from there on out...even TISL, which is my all-time fave Stevie Nicks solo album)

[tabruns]

Very interesting perspectives!

One thing I would say though steviefannn is that Trouble In Shangri-La did get certified for Gold. It probably would have gone Platinum if it weren't for tanking album sales.

If In Your Dreams goes Gold I think that would be the equivalent in today's market of Bella Donna going quadruple platinum. Sales are just that bad.

[StevieNicksfann]

Originally Posted by tabruns

Very interesting perspectives!

One thing I would say though steviefannn is that Trouble In Shangri-La did get certified for Gold. It probably would have gone Platinum if it weren't for tanking album sales.

If In Your Dreams goes Gold I think that would be the equivalent in today's market of Bella Donna going quadruple platinum. Sales are just that bad.

I agree with that for sure. Just fyi, when I said TISL wasn't certified, I was referring to platinum status - I do realize it has gone gold.