GRRR Stupid Boy Scouts!!!

[Neb-Maat-Re]

Here in Aus you don't even need to be a boy to join the Scouts. They're unisex.

There are still Girl Guides, but I think they're struggling in relation to Scouts.

[irishgrl]

Originally Posted by Neb-Maat-Re

And they are not an official Scouting organisation.

maybe thats their saving grace

[irishgrl]

Originally Posted by strandinthewind

I think you always had to believe in God to be a BS. I read nothing to the contrary

If you are talking about them being sued for it, well that probably did not happen until sometime in the last 30 years, but the religious aspect was always there

Im aware the OATH has the "G" word in it as I said, but I dont think saying the word is the same thing as expecting a person to BELIEVE. A lot of people say the pledge of Allegiance that arent Christian and dont necessarily believe in our God

No, what I am referring to is a relatively new phenomenon (within the last couple of decades) that has progressively emphasized a REQUIREMENT to go to church and have a regular religious component to your life. And if you went to the BSA site, you could see for yourself that the further along in rank you went, the more church-related activity you were expected to participate in. I think it begins with the Wolf Cubs but I'd have to look again...And now, you are asked if you believe in God and if by chance you dont, you are denied admittance. That didnt used to be the case, either with my Brother or my son's father. (like I said, Im still surprised he agreed with me ) By the way, my brother was in scouting in the late 50's, and my son's father was in scouting in the late 60's early 70's, and no such emphasis was present at that time.

[irishgrl]

The following info was taken from the case James Dale v. Boy Scouts of America (1999)
here is the BSA mission statement and the language of the Federal Charter:

According to BSA's federal charter, BSA seeks "to promote, through organization, and cooperation with other agencies, the ability of boys to do things for themselves and others, to train them in Scoutcraft, and to teach them patriotism, courage, self-reliance, and kindred virtues." BSA's Mission Statement also describes BSA's purpose: "It is the mission of the Boy Scouts of America to serve others by helping to instill values in young people and, in other ways, to prepare them to make ethical choices over their lifetime in achieving their full potential.

In no way do I see a religious component described there. I DO see a committment to building character, instilling a sense of decency and ethics. You can be an Agnostic or an Athiest (or a Samaritan!!) and still exhibit those characteristics.

I will get down to the nitty gritty here: If the BSA bylaws

require "respect [For the convictions of others in matters of custom and religion."

and states in

a training manual entitled Scoutmaster Fundamentals prepared "for Scoutmasters, Assistant Scoutmasters, Troop Committee members, and parents," BSA categorically states: "Religious instruction is the responsibility of the home and church."

how then can they reject ANY religion? (such as Wiccan?) Again and again I read that the Scouting organization urges respect for other people's beliefs, yet I read that Wiccans and Universal Unitarians (among others) have been denied acceptance.

Jason, this next bit is for you--it explains how the court in this case came to determine that the Boy Scouts was a PUBLIC accomodation organization:

b. Public Accommodation

Our case law identifies various factors that are helpful in determining whether Boy Scouts is a "public accommodation." We ask, generally, whether the entity before us engages in broad public solicitation, whether it maintains close relationships with the government or other public accommodations, or whether it is similar to enumerated or other previously recognized public accommodations.

Broad public solicitation has consistently been a principal characteristic of public accommodations. Our courts have repeatedly held that when an entity invites the public to join, attend, or participate in some way, that entity is a public accommodation within the meaning of the LAD. See, e.g., Clover Hill Swimming Club, Inc. v. Goldsboro, 47 N.J. 25, 33, 219 A.2d 161 (1966) (stating that "an establishment which by advertising or otherwise extends an invitation to the public generally is a place of public accommodation"); Sellers v. Philip's Barber Shop, 46 N.J. 340, 345, 217 A.2d 121 (1966) (stating that "an establishment which caters to the public or by advertising or other forms of invitation induces patronage generally is a place of public accommodation"); Fraser, supra, 44 N.J. at 488, 210 A.2d 208 (stating that "in light of the nature of the facilities and activities offered to the general public by respondent's day camp, we hold that it is a public accommodation"); Little League, supra, 127 N.J.Super. at 531, 318 A.2d 33 (stating that "Little League is a public accommodation because the invitation is open to children in the community at large"); Evans v. Ross, 57 N.J.Super. 223, 231, 154 A.2d 441 (App.Div.) (stating that LAD requires "an establishment which caters to the public, and by advertising or other forms of invitation induces patronage generally, not to refuse to deal with members of the public who have accepted the invitation"), certif. denied, 31 N.J. 292, 157 A.2d 362 (1959); see also Kiwanis Int'l v. Ridgewood Kiwanis Club, 806 F.2d 468, 475 (3d Cir.1986) (stating that LAD applies whenever "the organization or club ... invites an unrestricted and unselected public to join as members"); Brounstein v. American Cat Fanciers Ass'n, 839 F.Supp. 1100, 1107 (D.N.J.1993) (stating that " 'primary public accommodation consideration' " under LAD is " 'whether the invitation to gather is open to the public at large' ") (quoting Kiwanis Int'l, supra, 806 F.2d at 474).

BSA engages in broad public solicitation through various media. In 1989, for example, BSA spent more than $1 million on a national television advertising campaign. A New York Times article describes one of Boy Scouts' "hip" television ads, quoting a BSA spokesman as stating, "scouting is a product and we've got to get the product into the hands of as many consumers as we can." [FN6] Kim Foltz, TV Ad's Hip Pitch: It's 'Cool' to be a Boy Scout, N.Y. Times, Oct. 30, 1989. BSA has also advertised in widely distributed magazines, such as Sports Afield and Redbook. Local Boy Scout councils engage in substantial public solicitation. BSA frequently supplies the councils with recruiting materials, such as television and radio public service announcements, advertisements, and other promotional products. Monmouth Council, in particular, has expressly invited the public by conducting recruiting drives and by providing local troops with BSA-produced posters and promotions aimed at attracting new members.

FN6. Boy Scouts expresses concern that this article is not properly part of the record before us. Although the quoted statement has not been authenticated, we find it descriptive of material in the record respecting BSA's public solicitation and membership recruitment efforts.

Boy Scout troops also take part in perhaps the most powerful invitation of all, albeit an implied one: the symbolic invitation extended by a Boy Scout each time he wears his uniform in public. See Sellers, supra, 46 N.J. at 345, 217 A.2d 121 (finding that barber shop's pole extended implied invitation to public). A boy in a uniform may well be Boy Scouts' strongest recruiting tool. By encouraging scouts to wear their uniforms to school (WHAT?? ), and when participating in "School Nights" and public demonstrations, Boy Scouts invites the curiosity and awareness of others in the community. Boy Scouts admits that it encourages these displays in the hope of attracting new members.

On the facts before us, it cannot be controverted that Boy Scouts reaches out to the public in a myriad of ways designed to increase and sustain a broad membership base. Whether by advertising or active recruitment, or through the symbolism of a Boy Scout uniform, the intent is to send the invitation to as many members of the general public as possible. Once Boy Scouts has extended this invitation, the LAD requires that all members of the public must "have equal rights ... and not be subjected to the embarrassment and humiliation of being invited, ... only to find the doors barred to them." Evans, supra, 57 N.J.Super. at 231, 154 A.2d 441.

Boy Scouts is a "public accommodation," not simply because of its solicitation activities, but also because it maintains close relationships with federal and state governmental bodies and with other recognized public accommodations. Our cases have held that certain organizations that benefit from relationships with the government and other public accommodations are themselves places of public accommodation within the meaning of the LAD. In Little League, for example, the court concluded that Little League was "public in the added sense that local governmental bodies characteristically make the playing areas available to the local leagues, ordinarily without charge." 127 N.J.Super. at 531, 318 A.2d 33, aff'd, 67 N.J. 320, 338 A.2d 198 (1974). More recently, in Frank v. Ivy Club, 120 N.J. 73, 79, 110, 576 A.2d 241 (1990), a female student sought membership in the all-male eating clubs at Princeton University. Although they did not publicly solicit new members, we held that the clubs' close relationship to the University, a place of public accommodation, rendered them subject to the LAD. Id. at 110, 576 A.2d 241.

It is clear that Boy Scouts benefits from a close relationship with the federal government. Indeed, BSA was chartered by Congress in 1916, 36 U.S.C.A. § 30901, and has been the recipient of equipment, supplies, and services from the federal government, also by act of Congress, 10 U.S.C.A. § 2544. Thus, the Secretary of Defense, 10 U.S.C.A. § 2544(a), and other departments of the federal government, 10 U.S.C.A. § 2544(h), have been authorized to

lend to the Boy Scouts of America, for the use and accommodation of Scouts, Scouters, and officials who attend any national or world Boy Scout Jamboree, such cots, blankets, commissary equipment, flags, refrigerators, and other equipment and without reimbursement, furnish services and expendable medical supplies, as may be necessary or useful to the extent that items are in stock and items or services are available. 10 U.S.C.A. § 2544(a).

Since its inception, BSA has maintained a special association with each successive President of the United States. According to a BSA public relations fact sheet:

One of the causes contributing to the success of the Boy Scouts of America has been the thoughtful, wholehearted way in which each President of the United States since William Howard Taft in 1910 has taken an active part in the work of the movement. Each served as Honorary President during his term in office.

Another fact sheet states that seventy-eight percent of the members of the 100th Congress participated in scouting.

Boy Scouts also maintains a close relationship with the military. According to a BSA pamphlet entitled Organizations That Use Scouting, "military personnel serve Scouting in many capacities." "At many Army, Navy, Air Force, and National Coast Guard installations, facilities are available for Scouting shows, meetings, training activities," and other "similar Scouting events." Monmouth Council, in particular, has used the New Jersey military installation known as Fort Monmouth.

Likewise, state and local governments have contributed to Boy Scouts' success. [FN7] In New Jersey, the Legislature has authorized the Division of Fish, Game and Wildlife in the Department of Environmental Protection to "stock with fish any body of water in this state that is under the control of and for the use of ... Boy Scouts," N.J.S.A. 23:2-3, and has exempted Boy Scouts from having to pay motor vehicle registration fees, N.J.S.A. 39:3-27. Local governmental agencies, such as fire departments and law enforcement agencies, serve Boy Scouts by sponsoring scouting units. Nationally, over 50,000 youth members belong to units sponsored by fire departments, whereas in New Jersey alone over 130 units are sponsored by fire departments and over 100 units are sponsored by law enforcement agencies.

FN7. New Jersey governmental entities are, of course, bound by the LAD. Their sponsorship of, or conferring of special benefits on, an organization that practices discrimination would be prohibited.

Perhaps Boy Scouts' connection to public schools and school-affiliated groups constitutes its single most beneficial governmental relationship. Organizations That Use Scouting advises that "the education field holds our greatest potential." Boy Scouts currently recruits many of its members through its presence in and use of school facilities. A large percentage of scouting units nationally, as well as in New Jersey, are chartered by public schools and affiliated organizations. (BTW: I believe the ACLU put a stop to this because of the recent Supreme Court case which allowed religious and sexual orientation discrimination

Given Boy Scouts' public solicitation activities, and considering its close relationship with governmental entities, it is not surprising that Boy Scouts resembles many of the recognized and enumerated places of public accommodation. Similarity to the places of public accommodation listed in the LAD has been a benchmark for determining whether the unlisted entity should be included. Cf. Board of Chosen Freeholders v. New Jersey, 159 N.J. 565, 576, 732 A.2d 1053 (1999) (stating that "under the ejusdem generis principle of statutory construction, when specific words follow more general words in a statutory enumeration, we can consider what additional items might also be included by asking whether those items are similar to those enumerated"). In Fraser v. Robin Dee Day Camp, for example, this Court held that a "day camp is the type of accommodation which the Legislature intended to reach" because a "day camp offers accommodations which have many attributes in common with swimming pools, recreation and amusement parks, motion picture houses, theatres, music halls, gymnasiums, kindergarten and primary schools, all of which are specifically enumerated" in the LAD. 44 N.J. at 487, 210 A.2d 208. The Appellate Division in Little League identified Little League's " 'educational or recreational nature' " as a basis for the court's conclusion that Little League was similar to the types of public accommodations listed in the statute. 127 N.J.Super. at 531, 318 A.2d 33 (quoting Fraser, supra, 44 N.J. at 487, 210 A.2d 208). Similarly, Boy Scouts' educational and recreational nature, like the day camp in Fraser or the baseball teams in Little League, further supports our conclusion that Boy Scouts is a "place of public accommodation" under the LAD. See, e.g., Advancement Guidelines 4 (1992 ed.) (stating that "education and fun are functions of the scouting movement").

ps: here's the cite:

Boy Scouts of America v. Dale

734 A.2d 1196, 160 N.J. 562 (1999)
cert. granted
--S.Ct. -- 2000 WL 21144 (2000)

by the way here's the brief summary of the decision:

V. CONCLUSION

Today, we hold that Boy Scouts is a "place of public accommodation" and is, therefore, subject to the provisions of the LAD. As a "place of public accommodation" it cannot deny any person "accommodations, advantages, facilities, and privileges ... because of ... sexual orientation." N.J.S.A. 10:5-4. For the reasons set forth in this opinion, application of the LAD does not infringe on Boy Scouts' First Amendment rights.

The judgment of the Appellate Division is affirmed. We remand to the Chancery Division for further proceedings consistent with this opinion.

************************
so much for common sense. In 2000, the Supreme Court (peopled with a majority of conservatives) ruled that

Boy Scouts, and all private organizations, have the constitutionally protected right under the First Amendment of freedom of association to set membership standards. Furthermore, the Court ruled that:

* An association is entitled to protection if it "merely engage[s] in expressive activity that could be impaired."
* The presence of someone who may interfere is enough to impair First Amendment rights.
* Courts must defer to an association's expression
* State anti-discrimination laws may not interfere with expressive rights.

source: BSA legal issues section

Of course many fundamentalists are hopping with glee because this victory gave them the ability to start molding young minds a la Hitler's Youth example...

[irishgrl]

Whoa, this page is a GOLD MINE:
Scout's Honor

SCOUTS HONOR
Provided by the Lambda Legal Education and Defense Fund
Dissociating from Discrimination:
Public entities, organizations, and corporations choosing to teach respect for all kids

Ever since James Dale first challenged the Boy Scouts of America (BSA) for his expulsion, Americans have expressed their outrage at BSA's prejudiced policy. In the time since the U.S. Supreme Court narrowly ruled that the Scouts have a right to discriminate, the public reaction has only grown stronger. Scores of religious organizations, corporations, schools and others have stopped sponsoring, funding, and giving special treatment to BSA; many more have publicly called on BSA to end its discriminatory practices. The following is a list of some of those who have stood up and opposed the Scouts' policy, both before and since the Supreme Court decision.

Public Schools

* New York
* Chicago
* Santa Barbara
* Oakland
* San Diego
* San Francisco
* Minneapolis
* Tucson: Sunnyside Schools
* Sacramento: Davis Joint Unified Schools
* San Jose: Alum Rock Union Schools
* Ft. Lauderdale: Broward County Schools
* Oak Park, IL: Beye Elementary School
* Framingham, MA
* Taunton, MA: Edmund Hatch Bennett Elementary School (1 school)
* Burnsville, MN: Burnsville-Eagan-Savage Schools
* Chapel Hill, NC: Chapel Hill-Carrboro Schools
* Keene, NH
* East Hampton, NY
* Kimball Elementary School, Seattle, WA
* Barre Town, VT
* Jamestown, NY: Jamestown Community College

Public Entities

* Chicago
* Ft.Lauderdale
* Miami Beach
* Tucson
* San Diego, CA police department
* Santa Clara, CA sheriff's department
* West Palm Beach police department
* Wilton Manors, FL
* Los Angeles: City and police department are reviewing their ties to BSA
* Santa Barbara county: No longer gives preferential treatment to Scouts in the use of city facilities
* Princeton, NJ borough council: Denied local troop use of borough-owned space for a fundraising event

Corporate and Charitable Foundations

* Connecticut State Employee Campaign Committee
* CVS Corp.
* J. P. Morgan & Co., Inc.
* Klehr, Harrison, Harvey, Branzburg & Ellers
* Knight-Ridder, Inc.
* Levi Strauss & Co.
* Medtronic, Inc.
* The Philadelphia Foundation
* Portland General Electric
* The Providence Journal Co.
* Textron, Inc.
* Wells Fargo & Co.: Cut funding to BSA in 1992, although it altered policy in 1998 after a merger to allow individual bank presidents to make decisions regarding BSA contributions
* Novell, Inc.: No longer does dollar-for-dollar matching of employee donations to BSA; now only matches employees' donations to United Way

Religious Groups

* National: The Religious Action Center of Reform Judaism issued a statement calling on Jewish families and synagogues to sever ties with BSA, calling the Scout policy incompatible with the organization's beliefs.
* National: Board of Church and Society of the United Methodist Church stated that BSA's policy of denying membership based entirely on sexual orientation conflicts with the social principles of the denomination.
* National: The Episcopal General Convention passed a resolution encouraging BSA to allow adult leaders to serve regardless of their sexual orientation.
* National: Unitarian Universalist Association after the decision release: "We call upon the Boy Scouts of America to end their discrimination against gays...."
* Chapel Hill, NC: Olin T. Binkley Memorial Baptist Church ended its 39-year sponsorship of two BSA groups in protest of the BSAâs policy * Oak Park, IL: Cornerstone Church had its application to charter a Boy Scout troop rejected because the church stated that it refuses to comply with the BSAâs anti-gay policy
* Palm Beach, FL: Two Jewish Community Centers - the Kaplan JCC and the Adolph and Rose Levis JCC - ended sponsorship of BSA troops in protest of the anti-gay policy.
* Denver, CO: Temple Emanuel has informed BSA that troops may no longer meet in its synagogue, and the Temple's Rabbi Steven Foster returned his Boy Scout badges
* Denver, CO: Washington Park United Church of Christ ended its 60-year association with BSA with a "seperation ceremony" due to the anti-gay policy.
* Madison, WI: Orchard Ridge United Church of Christ ended its sponsorship of a troop because of the BSA's policy.
* East Brunswick, NJ: Temple B'nai Shalom ended its affiliation with two Boy Scout groups in protest of the BSA's policy.
* Coral Gables, FL: Temple Judea voted to sever ties with its 49-year-old Boy Scout troop because of the BSA's policy
* Taunton, MA: Union Congregational Church, a United Church of Christ congregation, announced that it will no longer sponsor a Scout troop or give them meeting space in protest of the BSA's policy.
* Golden Valley, MN: Breck School, an Episcopal institution in, said it would no longer sponsor a Cub Scout pack that includes its students, because "the Boy Scouts' policy of exclusion is in direct conflict with Breck's fundamental values of diversity and inclusion."
* Ocean Township, NJ: St. Anselm's Roman Catholic Church has drawn up a policy requiring groups that use its facilities must include everyone, regardless of sexual orientation or other distinctions.
* Norman, OK: St. Andrews United Methodist Church discontinued its charter relationship with Cub Scout Pack 70 in August.
* Squirrel Hill, NJ: St. Edmund's Academy, a nondenominational school with Episcopal roots, announced in January 2001 that it would no longer sponsor a Cub Scout pack unless the BSA changes its anti-gay policy.

United Way Chapters

* Valley of the Sun, AZ (Tempe)
* San Francisco, CA
* Santa Clara, CA
* Santa Cruz, CA
* Silicon Valley, CA (San Jose/Silicon Valley)
* Northern Fairfield County, CT (Danbury)
* Norwalk & Wilton, CT
* Westport-Weston, CT
* Orange, Osceola, and Seminole Counties, FL
* Evanston, IL
* Monroe County, IN (Bloomington)
* Massachusetts Bay, MA
* Fox Cities, WI
* Northern Berkshire, MA (five cities in northern Massachusetts and one in Vermont)
* Hampshire County, MA
* Portland, ME
* Allegan County, MI
* Greater Duluth, MN
* Monadnock, NH (Southwestern New Hampshire)
* Essex/West Hudson, NJ
* Somerset County, NJ
* Santa Fe, NM
* Tucson and Southern Arizona
* Palm Beach, FL
* Snohomish County, WA (Everett)
* Whatcom County, WA (Bellingham)
* Greater Winona, MN
* Jackson County, OR (Medford): Is cutting funding to BSA 15% every year until the discriminatory policy ends
* Westchester and Putnam Counties, NY: Restricting funding to the BSA's Learning for Life program
* Southeastern PA (Philadelphia): Restricting funding to the BSA's Learning for Life program
* New Haven, CT: Gives money to BSA if donors request it, but no longer gives unrestricted funds
* Heart of Florida (Orlando): No longer gives money automatically to BSA; donors must specifically request it
* Broward County, FL: No longer gives money automatically to BSA; donors must specifically request it
* Faribault, MN: Allows donors to exclude organizations like BSA from receiving their money
* Minneapolis/St. Paul, MN: Allows donors to exclude organizations like BSA from receiving their money
* California Capitol Region, CA (Sacramento): Requires all organizations being funded to adhere to a nondiscrimination policy
* Moscow-Latah County, WA: Requires all organizations being funded to adhere to a nondiscrimination policy
* Merrimack County, NH: Requires all organizations being funded to adhere to a nondiscrimination policy
* Seacoast, NH: Requires all organizations being funded to adhere to a nondiscrimination policy
* Southeastern New England (RI, parts of MA & CT): Requires all organizations being funded to adhere to a nondiscrimination policy * Bay County, MI (Bay City): Requires all organizations being funded to adhere to a nondiscrimination policy
* Southeastern New England (RI, parts of MA & CT): Requires all organizations being funded to adhere to a nondiscrimination policy
* King County, WA (Seattle and surrounding area): Restricting funding to the BSA's Learning for Life program
* Pierce County, WA (Tacoma): Has given BSA until June 2003 to come up with a plan to adhere to its nondiscrimination policy

Individual BSA Groups Opposing Anti-Gay Policy

* Leaders of the BSA councils of New York City; Los Angeles; Chicago; West Los Angeles; Orange County, California; San Francisco; Philadelphia; Minneapolis; and Boston: At the Scouts' national meeting, these leaders proposed that the Scouts allow churches, schools, and other chartering organizations to decide for themselves whether to have gay scout members and leaders.
* Greater New York Councils of the Boy Scouts of America: In a hearing of the New York City Council, council officials testified, "We firmly believe that anyone of any sexual orientation can live up to [Boy Scout] standards," vowing to try to convince the BSAâs national offices to change its policy.
* Oak Park, IL: Seven Cub Scout packs were expelled from Scouting in January after they informed BSA that they could not comply with the anti-gay policy because it conflicted with city ordinances and school policies that ban discrimination based on sexual orientation.
* Piedmont, CA, Piedmont Council: Has informed BSA that it intends to defy the BSA's policy
* Madison, WI, Cub Scout Pack 302: Has informed BSA of its opposition to the anti-gay policy; has been warned that its charter may be revoked
*Four Lakes Council (Wisconsin): Adopted resolution asking the national organization to change its anti-gay membership policy
* Richmond, CA, Sea Explorers: Has its own non-discrimination policy, in defiance of the BSA's stance
* San Jose, CA, Troop 260: Has its own non-discrimination policy, in defiance of the BSA's stance
* Westwood, CA Cub Scout Pack 34: Has vowed to defy the policy and is considering forming a new group separate from BSA
* Boston, MA, Minutemen Council: Has its own non-discrimination policy, in defiance of the BSA's stance
* Ann Arbor, MI, Cub Scout Pack 33: Adoped its own non-discrimination policy; when told by local BSA council they couldnât do that, the pack dis-affiliated and became a Camp Fire Boys and Girls group
* St. Paul, MN, Indian Head Council: Passed a resolution asking BSA to reconsider its policy
* Montclair, NJ, Cub Scout Pack 5: Parents protested the policy with a petition
* Binghamton, NY, Baden-Powell Council: Passed a resolution asking BSA to reconsider its policy
* Ashland, OR, Cub Scout Den 2 of Pack 320: Withdrew from BSA in protest of the policy
* Providence, RI, Narragansett Council: Has twice asked BSA to reconsider its policy
* Providence, RI, Cub Scout Pack 88: Den leaders announced that they will defy the BSA's policy
* Providence, RI, Boy Scout Troop 28: Sent a letter to its council announcing that it will defy the BSA's policy

Other Select Actions Being Taken

* Spurred by opposition to BSA's anti-gay policy, the American Medical Association adopted a resolution stating that youth groups should lift bans on membership for gay youth because these bans contribute to anxiety and depression among gay youth and are bad public health policy;
* The Rhode Island Medical Society adopted a resolution saying that the Boy Scouts' anti-gay membership policy increases the likeliness of gay youth to be depressed and to commit suicide. At the annual American Medical Association (AMA) meeting this year, the organization urged the AMA to adopt a similar resolution that would apply to all youth organizations.
* Oscar-winning filmmaker Steven Spielberg stepped down from an advisory board of the BSA in April of 2001, stating, "The last few years in Scouting have deeply saddened me to see the Boy Scouts of America actively and publicly participating in discrimination. Itâs a real shame."
* John Archer, longtime philanthropist and activist in Salem, MA, cut ties with the BSA over its discriminatory policy.
* Michael R. Bloomberg, founder and chief executive of Bloomberg, L.P., spoke out against the BSA's policy of discrimination while being inducted into the Eagle Scout Hall of Fame in November of 2000
* Justice James R. Lambden of the California State Court of Appeals has cut his ties with BSA, saying the group's policy is unacceptable and raises ethical questions for all California judges
* New York State Assemblyman Fred Thiele declined to accept the Boy Scouts' invitation to be honored at a dinner because of the BSA policy * Curtis Hainds, an Eagle Scout who was a member of the Order of the Arrow and was named American Legion Eagle Scout of the Year for the state of Missouri in 1992, resigned in 1999 because of the BSA policy
* Rabbi Paul Menitoff, Executive Director of the Central Conference of American Rabbis, esigned his Eagle Scout rank and Order of the Arrow status in protest of the policy
* Frank Edward Allen, head of the Institutes for Journalism and National Resources and an Eagle Scout since 1962, and his eldest son Zachary, an Eagle Scout since 1993, turned in their medals in protest of the policy
* Gary Levitz, a major donor to the United Way of Johnson County, IA, resigned as campaign chairman of the United Way because of the agency's support of BSA, stating that United Way promotes anti-gay discrimination by supporting the Scouts.
* National Education Association Representative Assembly adopted July 2000: "NEA will urge state and local affiliates to work with school boards to establish policies requiring that all private organizations using school facilities have non-discriminatory membership policies"
* Communications Workers of America cut off ties to BSA and issued an Executive Board Resolution stating, "Teaching intolerance is a very poor lesson for our youth... CWA calls upon its local unions and members to refrain from supporting or participating in activities of the Boy Scouts."
* Triangle Community Works, a nonprofit organization serving the gay and lesbian population in Chapel Hill, NC, refused to accept contributions from its local United Way because it continues to support the BSA.
* Charlotte HIV/AIDS People Support, an AIDS agency in Port Charlotte, FL, announced in November of 2000 that it will not accept contributions from a BSA food drive due to the Scouts' discrimination
* Evergreen AIDS Foundation in Bellingham, WA announced that it would no longer accept funds from its local United Way because it also funded BSA; shortly thereafter, the local United Way amended its anti-discrimination policy
* Parris N. Glendening, Governor of Maryland, voiced his opposition to BSA policy in a letter to the Gay, Lesbian, Bisexual, and Transgender Community Center of Baltimore and Central Maryland
* Former President Bill Clinton, in an interview with The Advocate, publicly stated his feelings on the BSA's policy: "I think the policy is wrong... I believe they'll change, and I think we should keep working on them."
* Syracuse University no longer will allow the Boy Scouts' Boy Power fund-raiser to take place on the campus. The University's Chancellor said that he could not allow the Boy Scouts to raise money that would further BSA's policies, which include exclusion based on sexual orientation.

Alternatives to the Boy Scouts: Youth Organizations That Do Not Discriminate

* Boys and Girls Clubs of America, www.bgca.org
* National 4-H Council, www.fourhcouncil.edu
* Camp Fire Boys and Girls, www.campfire.org
* Center for Youth as Resources, www.yar.org
* Girl Scouts, www.gsusa.org
* Jewish Community Centers, www.jcca.org
* YMCA, www.ymca.net

Source: Various news reports

Last updated: 6/15/01

[irishgrl]

Alternatives to the Boy Scouts: Youth Organizations That Do Not Discriminate

* Boys and Girls Clubs of America, www.bgca.org
* National 4-H Council, www.fourhcouncil.edu
* Camp Fire Boys and Girls, www.campfire.org
* Center for Youth as Resources, www.yar.org
* Girl Scouts, www.gsusa.org
* Jewish Community Centers, www.jcca.org
* YMCA, www.ymca.net

needless to say, I bookmarked all of the above. NUFF SAID

[irishgrl]

Traditional ORIGINAL Boy Scout Oath:

link:
http://www.inquiry.net/ideals/b-p/law.htm

B-P Law & Promise
The Scout Law is based on the 1912 and original 1908 edition of Baden-Powell's Scouting for Boys. It contains the rules which apply to Pathfinders and Scouts the entire world over, and which you promise to obey when you are invested as an Pathfinder. Study it carefully so that you understand the meaning of every point.
Traditional Scout Law

1. A Scout’s honor is to be trusted.
2. A Scout is loyal.
3. A Scout’s duty is be useful and to help others.
4. A Scout is a friend to all, and a brother to every other Scout.
5. A Scout is courteous.
6. A Scout is a friend to animals.
7. A Scout obeys orders.
8. A Scout smiles and whistles under all difficulties.
9. A Scout is thrifty.
10. A Scout is clean in thought, word, and deed.

Ok Jason, tell me where the Scout CREED mandates or even HINTS at religion in the foregoing--which is the ORIGINAL SCOUT OATH....

At your investiture as an Pathfinder you will have to make the Scout Promise in front of the rest of the Troop.

This Promise is very difficult to keep, because it is a so serious and you can't be a Pathfinder unless you do your best to live up to this oath. Scouting is not only fun, but it also requires a lot from you. Your willingness to make the Scout Promise indicates to others that you can be trusted to do everything you possibly can to keep your Scout Promise.
Traditional Scout Promise

On my honor I promise that I will do my best:
To do my duty to God and my country;
To help other people at all times;
To obey the Scout Law.

According to tradition, Baden-Powell wrote an alternative oath called the “Outlander Promise” for Scouts who could not, for reasons of conscience, recognize a duty to a King (the norm in the USA), for individuals or members of religions (such as Buddhism, Taoism, and others) that do not worship a deity, and for members of orthodox religions that do not use the name of God in secular settings. Any Member, Patrol, Section, or Group in a Scouting Association like ours may make the Traditional Outlander’s Scout Promise as an alternative oath.

Traditional Outlander's Scout Promise

On my honor I promise to do my best:
To render service to my country;
To help other people at all times;
To obey the Scout Law

If my son were able to recite this instead, I'd go ahead with his enrollment.

[irishgrl]

by the way, if anyone doubts the pervasive influence of the fundies after the post regarding the Outlander's Promise.....please note the following:

Search www.BSAlegal.org

To perform a keyword search, please enter text in the appropriate box below and click "Search". If no results are found, try broadening your search by dropping plurals (s) and avoiding multi-word searches.
Enter keyword and click "search" "Outlanders Promise"


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oh yeah.....NUFF SAID here too. I think its pretty obvious the intent of this seemingly "harmless" and "useful" organization in their quest to brainwash our young. Along the way if they manage to bamboozle the grownups, so much the better...............

[carrie721]

Originally Posted by strandinthewind

Woodcrafting, forestry, canoeing . . . . HMMMMMMMMMMMM

maybe i should mention here that i was in girl scouts for, l ike, 8 years?

also, my brother was in boy scouts for years, and my mother never took us to church, and it was never an issue.

[irishgrl]

Originally Posted by carrie721

maybe i should mention here that i was in girl scouts for, l ike, 8 years?

also, my brother was in boy scouts for years, and my mother never took us to church, and it was never an issue.

too bad my son couldnt join THEN. Like I said, its CHANGED

[SuzeQuze]

Novell is largely Mormon, they have their own brainwashing principles, so naturally they wouldn't support the Boy Scouts who probably won't recognize their religion.

[strandinthewind]

So, the next time you have a meeting at your house and use a public utility, the Fed. Gov. should require you to have klansmen

[irishgrl]

Originally Posted by strandinthewind

So, the next time you have a meeting at your house and use a public utility, the Fed. Gov. should require you to have klansmen

whats yer point?

[strandinthewind]

Originally Posted by irishgrl

whats yer point?

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[irishgrl]

Originally Posted by strandinthewind

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

again, what's yer point?

the mere usage of a public utility is NOT a criteria for anything.