So Much for Sep. of Church and State - Page 2

The Tower · #16 09-15-2005, 10:18 AM

Yeah, I am seriously tired of all this "praying" for this and "praying" for that. If there are problems and concerns out there that people wish to resolve, perhaps they should actually do something about it instead of just wishing and hoping that it will happen.

Like Ned Flanders said in a classic episode of The Simpsons when his house was destroyed by a hurricane and the town of Springfield banded together to rebuild his house (they did a ****ty job and his house collapsed):

"Well my family and I can't live in good intentions, Marge! Oh, your family's out of control, but we can't blame you, because you have gooooooooood intentions!"

strandinthewind · #17 09-15-2005, 10:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DrummerDeanna

See - and I've stated before that I simply don't understand why people are so offended by those words.....

If you don't believe in God then that's what they are - just words

I mean I see how you're saying that it's an F-You - I just don't see it that way - but that's just me....and I also understand that a lot of it is the extreme religious folk and the radicals that people have a problem with - but man - I don't get the extreme offense people take at the mere mention of God

It is not the mere mention of God - I do not think anyone really objects to that per se. It is in the way it is done and the reasons why. It is the pseudo commanding of people to pray to the Judeo Christian God, which is what he meant as I know of no other major religion (Buddahists, Hindus, etc. ) that refers to its deity that way. I support this by noting W will never say "pray to whatever deity you believe in." I mean if we are going for generality, why not do it that way - why let the alleged vagueness of "Almighty God" exist at all. W does not do it that way because he is beholden to the crazy religious people and he knows the vast majority of Americans will overlook this blatant slight to the theocratic minority because they are Christians or Jews and they could really care a less about anyone else. Thus, the state of religion infiltrating politics/government in America.

strandinthewind · #18 09-15-2005, 10:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gldstwmn

Okay, so now can we impeach him?

Honey - I'd have impeached him on the SOU address citing the reasons for war. Sadly, that will never happen because the D's are mostly complicit in that. But, yes, any excuse to impeach him works for me

It is getting over those legal hurdles that will be a pain in the neck

dissention · #19 09-15-2005, 10:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DrummerDeanna

See - and I've stated before that I simply don't understand why people are so offended by those words.....

If you don't believe in God then that's what they are - just words

I mean I see how you're saying that it's an F-You - I just don't see it that way - but that's just me....and I also understand that a lot of it is the extreme religious folk and the radicals that people have a problem with - but man - I don't get the extreme offense people take at the mere mention of God

The mere mention?

The man just called upon everyone to pray to God. You have your own beliefs and that's fine, but the POTU should not be wasting his time or our money in a silly attempt to shove his God down our throats.

strandinthewind · #20 09-15-2005, 10:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Tower

Yeah, I am seriously tired of all this "praying" for this and "praying" for that. If there are problems and concerns out there that people wish to resolve, perhaps they should actually do something about it instead of just wishing and hoping that it will happen.

Like Ned Flanders said in a classic episode of The Simpsons when his house was destroyed by a hurricane and the town of Springfield banded together to rebuild his house (they did a ****ty job and his house collapsed):

"Well my family and I can't live in good intentions, Marge! Oh, your family's out of control, but we can't blame you, because you have gooooooooood intentions!"

LOL - that reminds me of a joke Dolly Parton told on Lemo awhile back. She said her father bought an old broken down and overgrown farm and through his hard work brought it into a renewed and productive state. Well, the local preacher man happened to stop by one day and praised the Lord for fixing the farm. Dolly said her father looked at the preacher, realizing he wanted only money, and said "Yea, well, you have seen it when the Lord had it by Himself"

chiliD · #21 09-15-2005, 10:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mari

OT, when you google "god's own country" (which I just did, duh) you get lots of links about Kerala, India.

Hmmmm, interesting...I would've thought you would've gotten a bunch of U2 hits.

The Tower · #22 09-15-2005, 10:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by strandinthewind

LOL - that reminds me of a joke Dolly Parton told on Lemo awhile back. She said her father bought an old broken down and overgrown farm and through his hard work brought it into a renewed and productive state. Well, the local preacher man happened to stop by one day and praised the Lord for fixing the farm. Dolly said her father looked at the preacher, realizing he wanted only money, and said "Yea, well, you have seen it when the Lord had it by Himself"

The auto-assumption that everyone has religious leanings that has been so pervasive lately just makes me sick.

It's like the same auto-assumption that everyone is straight. A co-worker of mine told me a story the other day- she showed me pictures of her two chocolate labs and said that ever since she got married her husband wouldn't allow her dogs to sleep on the bed. I said, "Well, in that case I would choose the dogs over the husband" and she said, "Of course you would!" - the concept being that, as a man, it would be impossible for me to "want" another man.

I just rolled my eyes and walked away...

LongBlackScarf · #23 09-15-2005, 11:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DrummerDeanna

If you don't like it then don't pray

It's no secret our President is a Christian - what did you expect him to say??

I expect him to realize that not ALL the people of American are Christians. I know I have a Jewish friend who becomes very upset with Bush mentions "Jesus Christ, Lord and Savior" in his speeches. That should just NOT be happening. If he wants to urge us to pray, then he's postering himself as an evangelist, and not a President. The President should represent all peoples in this nation, and respect all faiths, including the fine upstanding people here who are atheists. One more thing....since hurricanes are considered "Acts Of God" just WTF are we praying FOR, anyway? That Big Bad God doesn't whack us again??

irishgrl · #24 09-15-2005, 11:32 AM

The Number 1 burning question on MY mind (and everyone else's Im sure) is:
do we get the day off?

LongBlackScarf · #25 09-15-2005, 11:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Tower

The auto-assumption that everyone has religious leanings that has been so pervasive lately just makes me sick.

.

How true! I was doing some local advertising with my community newspaper and my ad-lady was asking me where I had previously placed ads. We were talking about schools, stores with bulletin boards, etc. And then she said "You can do a lot of adverising with your church! What religion are you?" We also assume everyone is CHRISTIAN? I don't think so, toots! I was dumbfounded. I actually went to another paper.

irishgrl · #26 09-15-2005, 11:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by strandinthewind

Honey - I'd have impeached him on the SOU address citing the reasons for war. Sadly, that will never happen because the D's are mostly complicit in that. But, yes, any excuse to impeach him works for me

It is getting over those legal hurdles that will be a pain in the neck

To HELL with the legal hurdles! GET A ROPE! Vigilante justice for a Texan! Go Figure!

SomeKindaMother · #27 09-15-2005, 11:44 AM

Maybe he's trying *ha-a-aaard* to rally the righties that have been wavering over the whole mess he allowed to happen after Katrina....and divert the attention of the 'non-christians'? Or maybe he is just that arrogant. Either way, it takes some of the Katrina fire off him.

Kelly

The Tower · #28 09-15-2005, 11:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LongBlackScarf

I expect him to realize that not ALL the people of American are Christians. I know I have a Jewish friend who becomes very upset with Bush mentions "Jesus Christ, Lord and Savior" in his speeches. That should just NOT be happening. If he wants to urge us to pray, then he's postering himself as an evangelist, and not a President. The President should represent all peoples in this nation, and respect all faiths, including the fine upstanding people here who are atheists. One more thing....since hurricanes are considered "Acts Of God" just WTF are we praying FOR, anyway? That Big Bad God doesn't whack us again??

On NPR yesterday they did a report about the casinos of the Mississippi gulf coast and whether or not they would be rebuilding. They played a snippet from a local radio advertisement of a woman warning the residents of the gulf coast to not encourage the rebuilding of the casinos (even though thousands of people have lost their jobs because of the devastation) because "god" recognized the wickedness of building the casinos in the first place and that's why they were destroyed.

IDIOTS!!!!!!

On a similar note, did anyone see The Daily Show last night where they played footage of some "doctor" stating that dinosaurs did not exist millions of years ago- that they were in the garden of eden with Adam and Eve 4,000 years ago.

No wonder this country is where it is today. The stupidity of the human race is astonishing.

strandinthewind · #29 09-15-2005, 12:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Tower

. . . No wonder this country is where it is today. The stupidity of the human race is astonishing.

The Earth is flat ya know and anyone that says differently is subject to torture for heresy

Brwn_eyes0511 · #30 09-15-2005, 12:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by strandinthewind

Well, it is not just that. It is almost like he is commanding all Americans to pray to "Almighty God" and that is a violation of the Establishment Clause. Put it this way, what if he had called upon America to pray to Shiva, would that have been okay. So, it is a little more than "If you don't like it then don't pray

" IMO. But, if you are not bothered by it, so be it.

Finally, as I indicated, I expected or hope he would have said the less offensive "pray" and specified no deity as America is polytheistic, much to their chagrin.

But you are doing an awful lot of assuming that he is "commanding" all Americans to pray. If you don't pray, then think of it as a "good thoughts" day.