Civil rights and gay pride parade

[ajmccarrell]

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/ar...TICLE_ID=57022

Here's a story about firemen who were ordered to participate in a pride parade. Given the position that many of you took on the issue about whether or not doctors should be allowed to refuse certain types of care if it violated their conscience, do you agree with the firemen here, or do you think they should just shut up about it, and why? I'm really curious here. To me, it appears to be the same issue of personal freedom, what do the rest of you think?

[GoS]

Originally Posted by ajmccarrell

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/ar...TICLE_ID=57022

Here's a story about firemen who were ordered to participate in a pride parade. Given the position that many of you took on the issue about whether or not doctors should be allowed to refuse certain types of care if it violated their conscience, do you agree with the firemen here, or do you think they should just shut up about it, and why? I'm really curious here. To me, it appears to be the same issue of personal freedom, what do the rest of you think?

I didn't read the article, but don't think that anyone should be forced to do something like what you described. We all don't have to support it, but we should at least respect it.

[Johnny Stew]

WorldNetDaily is run by an Evangelical Christian (Joseph Farah) who has referred to homosexuality as "aberrant sexual behavior" and is constantly railing against what he calls "the gay agenda" -- all of which informs the many & numerous anti-gay "articles" he posts (on WorldNetDaily and elsewhere).

If you're going to ask us to read an article, I suggest linking to a website that's not antagonistic and biased towards the very people with whom you're trying to have a discussion.

Although I'm not entirely convinced that a legitimate discussion is what you were really looking for.

[Johnny Stew]

Originally Posted by GoS

I didn't read the article, but don't think that anyone should be forced to do something like what you described. We all don't have to support it, but we should at least respect it.

What the WorldNetDaily article unsurprisingly failed to note was the fact that firefighters in San Diego are always asked first to volunteer to participate in a parade, and then, if there are no volunteers -- or not enough -- then firefighters are assigned.

This is not just true of gay pride parades -- this is the same protocol the department uses for Martin Luther King, Jr. Day parades, St. Patrick's Day parades, and various other "special interest" parades.

Instead, the article focused on "another example of how radical homosexual activists in positions of authority force their agenda on unwilling citizens."

Man, folks sure are afraid of us sissies!

[strandinthewind]

Originally Posted by Johnny Stew

. . . Man, folks sure are afraid of us sissies!

Show me your hose

[Steviefan49]

Originally Posted by Johnny Stew

What the WorldNetDaily article unsurprisingly failed to note was the fact that firefighters in San Diego are always asked first to volunteer to participate in a parade, and then, if there are no volunteers -- or not enough -- then firefighters are assigned.

This is not just true of gay pride parades -- this is the same protocol the department uses for Martin Luther King, Jr. Day parades, St. Patrick's Day parades, and various other "special interest" parades.

Instead, the article focused on "another example of how radical homosexual activists in positions of authority force their agenda on unwilling citizens."

Man, folks sure are afraid of us sissies!

You know, I wasn't going to say anything, but doesn't anyone have a clue that Stevie has a "LOT" of gay fans who read other threads too? LOL.. Whenever I see any articles of Tele- Evangelist stuff and people supporting "anti-gay" movements, it just makes me want to scream.. so as a rule, I just hit the "delete" key and go on.. I just don't get it.. There are all types of people in the world, and I guess that's what makes the world go round you know?

[Steviefan49]

Originally Posted by strandinthewind

Show me your hose

OMG.. I just wet myself laughing.. Good one!

[ajmccarrell]

Originally Posted by Johnny Stew

What the WorldNetDaily article unsurprisingly failed to note was the fact that firefighters in San Diego are always asked first to volunteer to participate in a parade, and then, if there are no volunteers -- or not enough -- then firefighters are assigned.

This is not just true of gay pride parades -- this is the same protocol the department uses for Martin Luther King, Jr. Day parades, St. Patrick's Day parades, and various other "special interest" parades.

Instead, the article focused on "another example of how radical homosexual activists in positions of authority force their agenda on unwilling citizens."

Man, folks sure are afraid of us sissies!

Are you saying that a pride parade is on the same level as an MLK parade, St. Patrick's Day, Thanksgiving, etc? Just curious. I'm just plain against the idea of forced volunteerism of anything. I wouldn't want firefighters to be forcibly volunteered for Mardi Gras either, as a lot of stuff that would offend your average church-going folk happens there too.

[ajmccarrell]

Originally Posted by Johnny Stew

WorldNetDaily is run by an Evangelical Christian (Joseph Farah) who has referred to homosexuality as "aberrant sexual behavior" and is constantly railing against what he calls "the gay agenda" -- all of which informs the many & numerous anti-gay "articles" he posts (on WorldNetDaily and elsewhere).

If you're going to ask us to read an article, I suggest linking to a website that's not antagonistic and biased towards the very people with whom you're trying to have a discussion.

Although I'm not entirely convinced that a legitimate discussion is what you were really looking for.

I wasn't aware of who runs it, it was the first article I found on it that wasn't a blog after I heard about it on the radio. I just thought the situation was eerily similar to the one about doctors and I was wondering if the other side of the position was consistent on this and why.

[ashton]

Nice, an "article" from one of the whackiest sites found on the internet, provided by the resident bigot back from his latest time-out.

Anything for attention.

[ajmccarrell]

Originally Posted by ashton

Nice, an "article" from one of the whackiest sites found on the internet, provided by the resident bigot back from his latest time-out.

Anything for attention.

I just reported your post. I wasn't trying to be offensive here, but start a civil discussion on the subject of people being forced to do one thing or another in one's occupation; whether you're a doctor that is not willing to perform certain procedures or a firefighter who doesn't want to march in a parade.

I would appreciate it if you would refrain from personal attacks. I will not attack back, I will simply report you to the moderators.

[ashton]

For kicks, check out this news-filled website. It will have you laughing for quite some time. Pay special attention to the WND sections or WND exclusives. The National Enquirer couldn't even make this stuff up. Even the ads are crazy.


I think you will find that this is truly a resource to be valued and trusted, starting with the always present ad about flushing 15 pounds of undigested waste from your system. You then get to read through that undigested waste.

[ajmccarrell]

Originally Posted by ashton

For kicks, check out this news-filled website. It will have you laughing for quite some time. Pay special attention to the WND sections or WND exclusives. The National Enquirer couldn't even make this stuff up. Even the ads are crazy.


I think you will find that this is truly a resource to be valued and trusted, starting with the always present ad about flushing 15 pounds of undigested waste from your system. You then get to read through that undigested waste.

As I said, it was the first full article on the subject I found that wasn't a blog. You could say the same thing about Keith Olberman, the Daily Koz, Democrat.com, moveon.org, or any of the other sites that get posted around here.

[GoldDustOrphan]

City employees should not be asked/required to march in any parade.

San Diego has since changed its policy of sending a firetruck and representatives of the fire department to every civic parade representing different communities.

Even though the fire dept. had representatives at previous parades, the firefighters in this particular case were urged by Thomas More Law Center - a conservative Christian law center based in Michigan - to sue the city for sexual harassment with the promise of cashing in. TMLC drafted them for this lawsuit to pursue its agenda of defaming gay people. The firefighters claimed that alleged catcalls had damaged them so much (physically and emotionally) that they deserved a million bucks each to survive the indignity of it all. Yes, the "TOUGH GUY FIGHTERS" described in the headline of the WorldNetDaily - another conservative-based "news" source - couldn't handle some people yelling at them from the safety of a moving firetruck. Other firefighters in the parade - and past parades - claimed their fellow firefighters were exaggerating reports. Anyone that's ever been to a Pride Parade will also tell you there's usually music blasting from every other float and firetrucks usually have sirens going - how could they really hear what was being yelled. The jury agreed and threw out their claim.

What is interesting about this case is that the testimony from the firefighters that filed the complaint makes the city of San Diego even more vulnerable to discrimination lawsuits: "I called the San Diego fire dept. when my house was burning down or my kitten was in the tree they I was treated differently because I live in a gay neighborhood or I'm gay."

Are you saying that a pride parade is on the same level as an MLK parade, St. Patrick's Day, Thanksgiving?

Yes. If someone is a white supremist, they would object to being in the MLK parade. Native Americans or athiests might find Thanksgiving offensive to their beliefs or heritage. Here in South Boston, our St. Patrick's Day parade (which is always a blast in my book) is a constant source of public scrutiny because of the extraordinary amount public drinking, arrests for fighting, and reports of racist incidents.

[ajmccarrell]

Originally Posted by GoldDustOrphan

City employees should not be asked/required to march in any parade.

San Diego has since changed its policy of sending a firetruck and representatives of the fire department to every civic parade representing different communities.

Even though the fire dept. had representatives at previous parades, the firefighters in this particular case were urged by Thomas More Law Center - a conservative Christian law center based in Michigan - to sue the city for sexual harassment with the promise of cashing in. TMLC drafted them for this lawsuit to pursue its agenda of defaming gay people. The firefighters claimed that alleged catcalls had damaged them so much (physically and emotionally) that they deserved a million bucks each to survive the indignity of it all. Yes, the "TOUGH GUY FIGHTERS" described in the headline of the WorldNetDaily - another conservative-based "news" source - couldn't handle some people yelling at them from the safety of a moving firetruck. Other firefighters in the parade - and past parades - claimed their fellow firefighters were exaggerating reports. Anyone that's ever been to a Pride Parade will also tell you there's usually music blasting from every other float and firetrucks usually have sirens going - how could they really hear what was being yelled. The jury agreed and threw out their claim.

What is interesting about this case is that the testimony from the firefighters that filed the complaint makes the city of San Diego even more vulnerable to discrimination lawsuits: "I called the San Diego fire dept. when my house was burning down or my kitten was in the tree they I was treated differently because I live in a gay neighborhood or I'm gay."



Yes. If someone is a white supremist, they would object to being in the MLK parade. Native Americans or athiests might find Thanksgiving offensive to their beliefs or heritage. Here in South Boston, our St. Patrick's Day parade (which is always a blast in my book) is a constant source of public scrutiny because of the extraordinary amount public drinking, arrests for fighting, and reports of racist incidents.

I would sue if I was forced into going to any parade where sexual advances are made, whether gay or straight. It is tantamount to sexual harassment. I don't care if people have parades to celebrate whatever, but civic employees do have a civil right to free speech (in this case, nonparticipation in something that is not related to their jobs). I find the position you posted as very hypocritical. How would you like it if female employees were required to serve as cocktail waitresses at a sleazy bar during St. Patrick's Day and had to endure catcalls and physical touching? I think you would view that much differently. What is being missed here is that the Fire Chief's actions are a violation of existing employment laws.