Band Face Off - Round 11

[estranged4life]

Originally Posted by trackaghost

Of course Petty is not in that category, although he was considered New Wave when he first emerged. I was talking about Johnny Thunders & The Heartbreakers, a completey different band.

Johnny Thunder and glam era David Bowie (With some punky Rolling Stones) then I recommend the great band Hanoi Rocks!!! One of the best bands to be virtually ignored here in the US (And yes, had they arrived during the height of the punk days they would have been bigger than the New York Dolls )

"Two Steps From the Move" is one helluva classic album...Too bad that just as they finally were breaking here in the US Vince Neil Wharton (aka Vince Neil of Motley Crue) killed HR's drummer Razzle in a drunken carwreck, Killing any chance they had of making it big.

[trackaghost]

Originally Posted by amber

I said I liked Talking Heads and Patti Smith. And, if the Ramones were fun, they were still one chord and non melodic. You're talking to a former band/choir geek. I like things that are pretty. And honestly, I like things I can sing to. Not saying I die when I hear punk, it's just not my thing. Actually, though, punk shows live are fun, cause you can dance/hop/mosh around. That, I am in favor of. Solely sonically, though? No.

I'm not saying you should like it, I'm just saying that punk music was not all one chord distorted guitar, angry and dark lyrics, spitting and mosh pits. That was just a small part of it. You said yourself you like three bands from that scene: Blondie, Talking Heads and Patti Smith, could they be any different? None of them contained those elements you mentioned either.
Take The Clash for instance, they mixed reggae, dub, pop, 50s rock n roll, with biting satirical and political lyrics. They weren't just loud guitars and nastiness, that's all I'm saying. Punk is such a wide term, covering a vast array of bands.

[shackin'up]

Originally Posted by amber

To me, Blondie is much more image, and Heart is more culture.

When I typed that, I thought about that too. You have a point there, in the heart-blondie comparison. I don't say that one IS more culture, I said that blondie added more to (pop)culture than Heart. That ALSO is a matter of image, I know.

[trackaghost]

Punk was a reaction to the pomposity of rock in the mid 70s. You have to remember back then prog-rock was becoming the big thing, and that was all about grandiose arrangements and pretentious lyrics. Punk also challenged the superficially of disco (with often political lyrics) and the hippy ideals.

In punk, the sound is stripped down and made to sound more raw and real, but that doesn't mean it's not complex or interesting, or pretty even.The big thing is the DIY ethic, that anyone can play music. But I guess at the end of the day, punk was/is about attitude than anything else. It's a very working class genre of music.

I don't think Green Day and bands like them are punk btw..

[trackaghost]

Originally Posted by amber

But Blondie is not so widely known as Heart.
Actually, though, Heart couldn't influence music that much, because they are really a set entity unto themselves. The whole point of Heart is the kick ass voice, and expert awesome guitar/band work. That can only influence people with just as good of a voice, mainly.
And who would that be? No one, really. Although there are some definite creative tunes there, it's still...you know...rock. And though they may have a great band and great vocals, it's still rock. It's great, great, great rock - the top of rock. But besides it's pentultimate rock skill level, (which is unusual) there is nothing else especially unusual.
Concede.

That's not true, that's your America-centric thinking coming through. Blondie had a big impact over the world, whereas Heart didn't.
Also influence isn't about how many records you sell, it's about how many people pick up guitars or start writing songs because of you. I mean look at Loverboy. There's a band who sold millions of records in the 80s, but does anyone remember them? But The Velvet Underground sold virtually no records at all, and their influence is still being seen on bands forming today.

I see Blondie's influence in Madonna, Cyndi Lauper, Gwen Stefani, Shirley Manson, Courtney Love and countless others. I just don't see Heart's influence in the same way. Without Debbie Harry, Madonna wouldn't have broken through in the same way IMO She paved the way.

[trackaghost]

Originally Posted by amber

okay. I knew that stuff.
uh...so...what's the punk that's as melodic and pretty as the pompous rock of the mid seventies?
Cause that's what I like.
Which punk is complex, band and vocally wise? (besides the ones I said I like, Blondie most notably). Cause I'd like to check them out.

working class genre? Working class people can't sing really well or play instruments? My mom and dad sure can, and we're working class. Also, I think a ton of country singers would beg to differ. Dolly for one.

Try Television or even Patti Smith's first album Horses.

As for working class genre, Country music definitely is a working class genre, so is folk.
I don't remember saying working class people can't sing or play well? You don't think something like classical music is more elite form of music? Especially 20 years ago. Not everyone can pay to learn how to play Beethoven, but most people can pick up a guitar and learn a folk tune. That's the working class element and the DIY ethic.

Plus I think it's great that punk inspires people to think they can make music too. For instance, I'm glad Lou Reed didn't think "wow I can't sing like Frank Sinatra so I shouldn't form a band". I'd prefer his talk-singing anyday over Whitney's technically brilliant, but annoying over-emoting.

[trackaghost]

Originally Posted by amber

okay, fair enough. Although I don't think you should lump Heart in with Loverboy.

American Centric. Yeah, thanks Track. It's where I live, ya know? And then, you could say, that Blondie was more poppy and simple and that's why they had more of an impact over the world. Then you can say Heart was more skillful, and specific, which is why they didn't. I'm not saying that, but one could.

Oh no, I wasn't comparing Heart to Loverboy, I was just using them as an example of a band who sold a lot of records without a lasting influence. I LIKE Heart, I think they're great. I just think Blondie's influence was greater.

I didn't mean anything by the America comment. Sorry about that It's just that Heart weren't as big in other countries. I don't think Blondie's music was/is simple though, poppy yes.

[estranged4life]

Originally Posted by trackaghost

That's not true, that's your America-centric thinking coming through. Blondie had a big impact over the world, whereas Heart didn't.
Also influence isn't about how many records you sell, it's about how many people pick up guitars or start writing songs because of you. I mean look at Loverboy. There's a band who sold millions of records in the 80s, but does anyone remember them? But The Velvet Underground sold virtually no records at all, and their influence is still being seen on bands forming today.

generational influence...Just because those Canadians Loverboy sold tons of albums back in the 80's mean they will be remembered as trend-setters or someone with a lasting influence upon a generation of people like Blondie or the Ramones.

Heart, While a great band, is known mainly here in the US...Overseas I doubt they are known as well, And are probably pigeonholed as being a strictly "American band" which only appeals to the American taste in music. A band such as NWOBH pioneers/legends Saxon can play at large festivals in Europe, But say they were to tour here in the US and they would probably be stuck in a small club in some Bumf**k hick town since the same thing can also happen since Saxon would be considered a strictly "European" band.

I see Blondie's influence in Madonna, Cyndi Lauper, Gwen Stefani, Shirley Manson, Courtney Love and countless others. I just don't see Heart's influence in the same way. Without Debbie Harry, Madonna wouldn't have broken through in the same way IMO She paved the way.

So true...I may not have any Blondie discs (Though I did inherit some of the music on LP & 8-track from my Mother) but without Debbie Harry the Madonna's of the world wouldnt stand a chance in this ever changing (Mostly for the worse) music climate of the USofA.

Blondie broke through in such a large fashion, that even if you're not a fan ,you have to give 'em respect for that alone...Doesnt matter if the music itself is your cup-of-joe or not.

[estranged4life]

Originally Posted by ReFleetwoodMac

Show me one punk song with one chord. There probably is one, but I don't know it.

is when Bob Mould's former band Husker Du played OKC and performed a 45 minute encore of just 1 single note...That had to be something to experience, 45 minutes of the same note over-and-over-and-over, I can see why Bob thought people had to be "pulled off the walls" after that encore.

[shackin'up]

Originally Posted by amber

Sweeeeeet. And I like John Denver!!!

"West Virginia...Mountain Momma...*sob*"

You should hear Drivin'n'Cryin's version of leaving on a jetplane. One of the best covers ever. That's cowpunkrock. But they leave the feel and the core of the song 100% intact.

[xdreamsunwindx]

Guh. How could I choose!? -_- Garbage gets my vote. I play them the most, and they're just a great band. Hole is great, too. So is NxD. I hate you for making me choose. :-P

I'd go lesbian for Shirley Manson, by the way. XD

[dissention]

Originally Posted by amber

But Blondie is not so widely known as Heart.

That is a ridiculous statement.

[Miss Vicky]

No Doubt...

But only because I despise Courtney Love and can name only one or two Garbage songs off the top of my head.

[shackin'up]

Originally Posted by amber

uh...I teared up a little just reading "Leaving on a Jet Plane".
Drivin'n'Cryin'? Kick ass name.
Okay, well...just yousendit and I can hear it.

http://s41.yousendit.com/d.aspx?id=0...M07WUAXP59XKR0

I love this band. Got their entire catalogue. The USA should be ashamed that they don't pay enough attention to their own jewels.

[face of glass]

Originally Posted by estranged4life

Johnny Thunder and glam era David Bowie (With some punky Rolling Stones) then I recommend the great band Hanoi Rocks!!! One of the best bands to be virtually ignored here in the US (And yes, had they arrived during the height of the punk days they would have been bigger than the New York Dolls )

I may support the success of Finnish acts outside our home country, but I'd much rather take the Dolls over Hanoi Rocks, anytime.

Besides, bigger than New York Dolls were at their heyday? The Dolls weren't a big thing in the first place, although they did have a proper cult following, just like Hanoi.

When the Dolls were still active in 1976, the future members of Hanoi Rocks (who had just entered their late teens) were just starting; Andy McCoy contributed to the first Finnish punk single (Briard's "I Really Hate Ya", for instance.