Capital Punishment

[dissention]

Originally Posted by tommer

i must admit that i find it even hard to understand exactly how come that in the 21st century, capitol punishment is still an acceptable thing in democratic societies.
this whole discussion sounds just freaky to me, in my country it's not even something to debate about. capitol punishment is inhumane, primitive, and obviously doesn't stop crime in any way. fulfilling the revengeance desires of angry mobs is just not a part of the purposes of a modern liberal justice system.

Yup, and the vast majority of the people who support it in the US are the Biblethumpers. How ludicrous.

It's a barbaric practice that needs to be abolished.

[DrummerDeanna]

I'm not all in favor of abortion - I would never have one - however - it's not my place to say that no one else can.....and it all comes down to whether a person believes abortion is actually murder or not - some do not believe life starts until birth....that's their belief...who am I to say it's wrong for someone else?

[dissention]

Originally Posted by Mad4stevie

That is one thing that I never did understand on a fundamental level - why people want to save the lives of those on death row but want to have no restrictions on things like partial birth abortions.

Don't lump partial-birth abortions into that equation, it's misleading. Partial-birth abortions are only viable options when a late-term mother is in danger or the baby is in danger. Most states have laws prohibiting partial-birth abortions if they are not performed within certain guidelines, i.e. they cannot be performed if no one is in danger. Also, many states have laws that give the state government discretion in performing them. To ban partial-borth abortions outright is dangerous.

[tommer]

Originally Posted by dissention

Yup, and the vast majority of the people who support it in the US are the Biblethumpers. How ludicrous.

It's a barbaric practice that needs to be abolished.

of course. but the part i do not understand is how biblethumpers' ideals become state law.

[Serrart]

I'm against death penalty and also in my Country it has been abolished decades ago (it survived in the military code till 1994 though, even if it's been never applied after WWII). It's useless, inhuman and I consider it a legalized form of revenge, something a justice system should prevent, not endorse. About abortions, I think the woman has the right to choose. Hope it doesn't sound as I'm preaching but these are two fundamental points in my value system so I feel strongly about them.

Romy

[ShangriLaTroubl]

Partial Birth abortion, like you said...isnt what it's made out to be...esp by certain persons trying to obtain political office.
It's not a practice that is common, or easy to get...it's not like a mother can say in month 8.5 "oh I decided i dont want to have a baby..lets have a partial birth abortion." To my understanding they are only allowed when the mother faces serious long term injuries or death by having the baby or if the abortion is not performed both the mother AND baby will die..

Some people think partial birth abortion is just so clear cut....and it's in now way relatable, to the death penalty---no abortion is.


The problem with the "partial birth abortion ban" they have tried passing in congress is how it's worded....many Democrats in congress would like a "ban" passed that includes some exceptions.. They would like to ban the practice EXCEPT in cases where it is absolutely necessary...Republicans use it as a political tool, to mess with people's emotions... What many people do not realize is that the ban does not allow women to have an abortion after the first trimester. Unfortunately many birth defects cannot be detected until well into the second trimester, and often times women choose to have an abortion after their 18-20 week ultrasound, if a birth defect is found.

Any1 know the status of the bill?

Anyway sorry to turn this into an abortion discussion..I personally am opposed to someone having an abortion, but I'm not a woman..so I dont think I cant rightfully say.. I have known people to have abortions (never partial birth) and it's just not something you can through into the WRONG category without understanding it i believe..therefore I think people including myself need to research it more

Chris

[DrummerDeanna]

Originally Posted by ShangriLaTroubl

Partial Birth abortion, like you said...isnt what it's made out to be...esp by certain persons trying to obtain political office.
It's not a practice that is common, or easy to get...it's not like a mother can say in month 8.5 "oh I decided i dont want to have a baby..lets have a partial birth abortion." To my understanding they are only allowed when the mother faces serious long term injuries or death by having the baby or if the abortion is not performed both the mother AND baby will die..

Some people think partial birth abortion is just so clear cut....and it's in now way relatable, to the death penalty---no abortion is.


The problem with the "partial birth abortion ban" they have tried passing in congress is how it's worded....many Democrats in congress would like a "ban" passed that includes some exceptions.. They would like to ban the practice EXCEPT in cases where it is absolutely necessary...Republicans use it as a political tool, to mess with people's emotions... What many people do not realize is that the ban does not allow women to have an abortion after the first trimester. Unfortunately many birth defects cannot be detected until well into the second trimester, and often times women choose to have an abortion after their 18-20 week ultrasound, if a birth defect is found.

Any1 know the status of the bill?

Anyway sorry to turn this into an abortion discussion..I personally am opposed to someone having an abortion, but I'm not a woman..so I dont think I cant rightfully say.. I have known people to have abortions (never partial birth) and it's just not something you can through into the WRONG category without understanding it i believe..therefore I think people including myself need to research it more

Chris

What freaks me out is that there are people who are basing their entire decision of who to vote for on abortion.

There was a guy in the paper the other day who said something to the effect of, "I'm very against the war and I don't like a lot about Bush - but I'm against abortion so I'm voting for him..." I couldn't believe it...no matter what the issues that one still incites SO many passionate emotions...

[dissention]

Originally Posted by tommer

of course. but the part i do not understand is how biblethumpers' ideals become state law.

Where have you been?

THEY STEAL ELECTIONS!

[Vianna]

I oppose capital punishment. No matter what someone has done, we have no right to compound the wrong by taking a life.

As to abortion: the choice should be left to the woman and her doctor. Each case is different; you can't make a rule that would cover all cases. This is why I am pro-choice.

[amber]

Originally Posted by paleshadow

Just out of curiousity, how many of those who have posted they are against the death penalty are in favor of abortion?

me. although I posted i was against the death penalty, i wasn't, well, very against it. I was more against the miscarriage of justice portion than the criminals dying portion...but again, i don't think human life is the big furry deal that most think it is.
Amber

[amber]

Originally Posted by DrummerDeanna

What freaks me out is that there are people who are basing their entire decision of who to vote for on abortion.

There was a guy in the paper the other day who said something to the effect of, "I'm very against the war and I don't like a lot about Bush - but I'm against abortion so I'm voting for him..." I couldn't believe it...no matter what the issues that one still incites SO many passionate emotions...

That is extremely illogical to me, too.

[The Tower]

Originally Posted by amber

i don't think human life is the big furry deal that most think it is.

Amen, sistah.

[amber]

Originally Posted by The Tower

Amen, sistah.

ah, I thought i may be villified...but not yet, I guess!
AMber

[Hawkeye]

Originally Posted by dissention

Me.

I am strongly opposed to the death penalty and find it the most vile practice in the judicial system. It's incredibly hypocritical and illogical. The governemnt promotes that murder is wrong, but it's okay when they do it. Gimme a f*cking break.

I strongly support a woman's right to have an abortion. To me, personally, I simply cannot equate murdering someone by lethal injection or electrical chair with aborting a baby that cannot be supported in life by the mother or father.

I just knew you'd chime in with some stupid crap like that again. How can you possibly care more about ****ing murderers then a baby. HOW. didn't you go on and on about killing babys in Iraq or something. But you support abortion.

[amber]

Originally Posted by Hawkeye

I just knew you'd chime in with some stupid crap like that again. How can you possibly care more about ****ing murderers then a baby. HOW. didn't you go on and on about killing babys in Iraq or something. But you support abortion.

Dude! a few cells isn't a baby. And he didn't say he cared more about murderers than babys. And maybe, if a few of those murderers mothers had gotten abortions, instead of raised them poorly, there would be less murderers.
Amber