Capital Punishment

[Jessica Leigh]

Originally Posted by Hawkeye

SO WHAT!!! What they need to do is make the death penalty MORE Painful and SLOW, but for those who deserve it of course. I think they should use less of the Death Penalty and only when they are ONE HUNDRED PERCENT sure and the crime is suitable then OF COURSE I support the death penalty. I don;t see how you can't. I know Brian will agree with this, Timothy McViehg didn't deserve a quick and painless death. He deserved to be tortured for a month, and then have his eyes ripped out and his arms cut off and to be thrown into a sea of piranas, and kept alive so he wishes he'd die but you still keep him alive until maybe after a week you give him a lethal injection. And the Sniper from a few years ago and Osama Bin Laden and child molestors all deserve that same punishment. Capitol punishment shouldn't be banned, it should be made much more harsh then it is!

yeah... i agree... and do it quickly so i'm not paying for him or her to live in air conditioning with cable tv and a gym and all that shlt they get in prison.... i work for my money for my air conditioning and for my cable tv and gym membership.... i don't wanna pay taxes for a convicted murderer to have his.

[GateandGarden]

Originally Posted by Jessica Leigh

yeah... i agree... and do it quickly so i'm not paying for him or her to live in air conditioning with cable tv and a gym and all that shlt they get in prison.... i work for my money for my air conditioning and for my cable tv and gym membership.... i don't wanna pay taxes for a convicted murderer to have his.

Last time I checked, prisoners in maximum security prisons who have committed crimes on that level do not get such amenities, and certainly not on death row.

Hillary

[GardenStateGirlie]

Originally Posted by GateandGarden

Last time I checked, prisoners in maximum security prisons who have committed crimes on that level do not get such amenities, and certainly not on death row.

Hillary

Death row or not, I shouldn't have to pay for a criminal of any kind to get a college education and to have things that some people can't even afford that haven't done anything wrong. Were you aware that prisioners received flu shots this year? WTF do they need a flu shot for?

[GateandGarden]

Originally Posted by GardenStateGirlie

Death row or not, I shouldn't have to pay for a criminal of any kind to get a college education and to have things that some people can't even afford that haven't done anything wrong. Were you aware that prisioners received flu shots this year? WTF do they need a flu shot for?

What about reforming prisoners? I know some of the amenities are going too far (or at least I tend to think so), but why should the justice system just give up on them, assume there's no help for them and figure they'll never become productive members of society?

Hillary

[tommer]

generally i try to respect religious people, i really do. it's just like i don't like people lecturing me about my smoking; i know the dangers, but please let me treat my life the way i see right. the reason i say this is because i don't wanna look like i'm critisizing people's beliefs, but the notion of Religion itself. since i believe in the antithesis, explaining it must critisize the thesis, so excuse me.

history proved us that mankind desperetly needed some kind of god. every civilization had some form or another of a superior power to worship, ask for aid and guidence, and especially get their answers from (or more accurately- base upon). only modern thinking let us start breaking free from these old chains. even today, the vast majority of mankind is religious.

i'm not a big scholar, and there are so many things i don't know, many of them science gave us no answer to up to this point in time, but that's fine, science is young, there are many questions that may take centuries to answer accurately. but you know what? i can live with that. i'm actually a simpleton, i don't care why the world turns as long as i don't fall off it.
i do realize tho, that most humens MUST get many answers and certainties that i don't give **** about, for them, when physics can't answer (or give explenations that are too complicated or radical to accept)- there's always the metaphysic.

the bible in my opinion is nothing but a collection of myths, and the most important philosophy book in history. but in fact, archeologists never managed to prove the mythic part right, you won't find a shred of evidence in the entire state of israel to prove a single ancient bible story right. ain't it amazing?
as for the philosophic part, it goes hand in hand with the myths, if you choose to believe the myth then you are "doomed" by morals which were the best and the most advanced ones in hand at the time in which those texts became holy. it's quite simple. excuse me, but i don't want my moral guidence to be thousands of years old, not that all of those are wrong, but i'd like to believe that human values change and advance with time.

[Jessica Leigh]

Amber and Deanna-

your Christianity discussion is totally interesting.... i do have a question for Amber though.... are you asking all of these questions about christianity and the Bible because you aren't educated in Christian tradition and history and you are interested in learning about it? or are you challenging the beliefs of people you don't understand? If this comes off as bitchy or anything I'm sorry, I'm not meaning for it to sound like that... I'm just curious....

Deanna had a good point with her post about name calling... if you don't know a whole lot about the Bible and some of the concepts of what Christians believe confuse you, then go learn about it... but if you are just asking to challenge and berate people here and call them names... that's not cool! Christians believe that God gave them free will... so naturally people are going to make their own choices... they don't have to believe every word of the Bible as if it came from God's mouth... some Xns (Christians) DO believe in every word of the Bible as God's word... those people are called Fundamentalists and are often the Bible thumpers and Evangelists who can be scary.

Some Xns (Catholics, Old Protestant religions such as Lutherans, Anglicans, Episcopalians) believe that the Bible is the INSPIRED word of God... which means that men wrote it based on divine inspiration... and if you read the Bible, not all of it is "god wants you to do this and this." Much of the New Testament (Jesus' life and teachings and Xnity after him) is STORIES about the life of a dude named Jesus and things that he did- many of which were written by some of his friends after he died... so yeah, it is a pretty good historical document.... It's like if you died and your friends put together a photo album and wrote down stories about you and what you did in your life. Other parts of the Bible are open for interpretation... really now... when you listen to a Stevie song you dont always take it literally do you? i mean... do you think Stevie climbed a mountain and saw her reflection in a mirror floating up in the sky? and then she fell down the mountain when a landslide occured? ouch!

ok i'm tired of typing now... i might come back later......

Oh and by the way... i'm not religious... i'm just fascinated by religion and am minoring in it and telling you what i have learned in school.

[Jessica Leigh]

Originally Posted by GardenStateGirlie

Death row or not, I shouldn't have to pay for a criminal of any kind to get a college education and to have things that some people can't even afford that haven't done anything wrong. Were you aware that prisioners received flu shots this year? WTF do they need a flu shot for?

You're f-ing kidding! they got flu shots? they are rationing them here! i'm a relatively healthy 20- something so i don't get one.

[GardenStateGirlie]

Originally Posted by GateandGarden

What about reforming prisoners? I know some of the amenities are going too far (or at least I tend to think so), but why should the justice system just give up on them, assume there's no help for them and figure they'll never become productive members of society?

Hillary

I know a few people that haven't had the best lives. However, they're not going around and killing people. I'm not saying that I have no compassion...I just really lack compassion where these people are concerned. Should my tax dollar and yours fund someone in regards to helping them to learn the error of their ways for however long they should live? They can seek their own salvation when they relive what they did in their minds everyday...I shouldn't have to pay someone to find that for them or help them to become a better human being through whatever means they see fit whether it be through psychology or through religion. I don't mean to sound cold or hardend but everyone has the right when they are born in this country to make something of themselves regardless of whatever happened in their childhood/throughout their lives to them. If there are people that have had hardships and have managed to overcome them, there's proof that it is possible. Why should we say, "okay, these people are of different character. They need to be put in jail for life, die there, but we need to help them find themselves before they do." It's just bizarre. I don't know

[GardenStateGirlie]

Originally Posted by Jessica Leigh

You're f-ing kidding! they got flu shots? they are rationing them here! i'm a relatively healthy 20- something so i don't get one.

Nope. Totally not kidding. My dad was able to get one because he does have diabetes among a lot of other health issues. My grandmother got one as well. Other than that, I don't know many people that were able to get them.
Here it is...

[amber]

Originally Posted by Jessica Leigh

Amber and Deanna-

your Christianity discussion is totally interesting.... i do have a question for Amber though.... are you asking all of these questions about christianity and the Bible because you aren't educated in Christian tradition and history and you are interested in learning about it? or are you challenging the beliefs of people you don't understand? If this comes off as bitchy or anything I'm sorry, I'm not meaning for it to sound like that... I'm just curious....

More specifically i am questioning how a religious person can reconcile belief in what the Bible says about god, and think it's totally true, But not believe or think the other parts are true. if a lot of the bible is wrong, then how can you believe that the rest is right? And what gives people the power to know the difference, if it is ALL in there, the good with the bad. And i think, clearly, many people don't know the difference. My main issue is with the bible.

[The Tower]

Originally Posted by GardenStateGirlie

Death row or not, I shouldn't have to pay for a criminal of any kind to get a college education and to have things that some people can't even afford that haven't done anything wrong. Were you aware that prisioners received flu shots this year? WTF do they need a flu shot for?

Jeezus. Criminals are still human beings. None of us are perfect. I think the best way to avoid breeding crime is to not sink to their level. Nothing justifies cruelty. Life isn't one big contest to see who gets the best stuff- and there certainly isn't an etched in stone hierarchy as to who is better than whom.

Last time I checked I don't think the penalty for felonies was influenza infection and denial of the ability to possibly improve your life so that you increase the chances of you not commiting crimes.

On second thought, you're right- you can keep your precious tax dollars and the criminals will stay criminals and when they've served their sentence then they can be back on the street to rob you of those tax dollars. Isn't life grand?

[GateandGarden]

Well said Chris.

Hillary

[amber]

Originally Posted by The Tower

Jeezus. Criminals are still human beings. None of us are perfect. I think the best way to avoid breeding crime is to not sink to their level. Nothing justifies cruelty. Life isn't one big contest to see who gets the best stuff- and there certainly isn't an etched in stone hierarchy as to who is better than whom.

Actually, another good way is to have resources available to these people where the problem starts - when they're young. Education, the hope of a better life, school programs, food, counseling, well, a whole bunch of social programs. What! we can't spend money on that! we have to build more prisons for when they grow up!

[GateandGarden]

Originally Posted by amber

Actually, another good way is to have resources available to these people where the problem starts - when they're young. Education, the hope of a better life, school programs, food, counseling, well, a whole bunch of social programs. What! we can't spend money on that! we have to build more prisons for when they grow up!

I think it's necessary to spend money on both.

Hillary

[The Tower]

Originally Posted by amber

Actually, another good way is to have resources available to these people where the problem starts - when they're young. Education, the hope of a better life, school programs, food, counseling, well, a whole bunch of social programs. What! we can't spend money on that! we have to build more prisons for when they grow up!

Just imagine what the $200,000,000,000 (yes, that's billion) that Congress appropriated for the stupid invasion/occupation of Iraq could have done for the people of the U.S.?

Let's see.... um, howzabout flu vaccinations?!!??!? Nah, it's the fault of the people in prison that we don't have flu shots- they're taking them all up.

Let's say that the average college education costs $50,000. The money flushed down the Iraq quagmire commode could have financed the college educations of FOUR MILLION STUDENTS!!

Good thing Dubya's on the job!