Stating the obvious

[Les]

Originally posted by JamieSPC
That's the question, isn't it? Just once I'd love to hear Lindsey say, "Stevie's a brilliant writer, she deserves her success, and she's had plenty of it without me." Would that be so hard? Instead, we get, "I'm the one sorting her stuff out and turning it into songs."

Lindsey: "Stevie, you're brilliant, you deserve your success and you've had plenty of it without me."

Stevie: "Hey thanks!"

Okay, now what? They still have to work through conflicts and different ideas and reach compromises when they're working together because it's the nature of the beast. Stevie's got her solo career to call all of the shots. I'm assuming there is something about working in a band where she isn't the sole leader that appeals to her or she wouldn't keep coming back to it.

The assumption that Stevie is unhappy about the band and it must be Lindsey's fault is sadly an all too common scapegoating of Lindsey in relation to anything involving Stevie.

[JamieSPC]

Lindsey: "Stevie, you're brilliant, you deserve your success and you've had plenty of it without me."

Stevie: "Hey thanks!"

Okay, now what?

That happened, really? Good. NOW I feel better.

[Les]

Hehe. My favorite is when Charlie Rose was asking Lindsey about her back in 1984 and Lindsey was in the middle of saying that Stevie's had great success and she deserves it because she's worked very hard for it and... then Charlie cuts him off in mid-sentence. Not one of Charlie's finer moments.

[JamieSPC]

[offtopic]
Les,

You wouldn't happen to know where I could get a copy of that interview, would you? That probably wasn't one of Rose's best moments, but on the whole I really like his show and he seems to consistently be the best-prepared and best-researched interviewer out there.

Occasionally, DVDs will have one of his shows as a special feature. There's one of Quentin Tarantino (either on "Pulp Fiction" or "Jackie Brown") that's classic.

~Jamie
[/offtopic]

[CarneVaca]

[Mr. Vaca, returning from a 48-hour struggle with a nasty virus, followed by a wrestling contest with a monitor that resulted in a trip to Best Buy for a new monitor: ]

Interesting discussion here. Jamie, I don't know if your points about the band following everything she suggests are dead on. I mean, after all, we'd be getting seven- to nine-minute songs from Ms. Nicks all the time. That would get tiring by any fandom standard.

This goes to the core of the frustration Lindsey fans feel: Lindsey is the musical genius, Stevie had the image and the mysterious lyrics and the rest of the band is mighty competent. I can't tell you how many times I've played Lindsey's solo stuff to friends, who are awestruck, but they won't go buy the albums. Why? I just can't explain it.

I have no doubt Stevie has a lot to contribute to the band still, but I believe it is Lindsey who remains the architect of the sound.

[JamieSPC]

I mean, after all, we'd be getting seven- to nine-minute songs from Ms. Nicks all the time.

BRING IT ON!!!!!

(he says, remembering the incredibly self-indulgent and practically incomprehensible "D.W. Suite" and the rambling nature of some of Stevie's piano demos and then says...)

Um, never mind.

[CarneVaca]

Originally posted by JamieSPC
BRING IT ON!!!!!

(he says, remembering the incredibly self-indulgent and practically incomprehensible "D.W. Suite" and the rambling nature of some of Stevie's piano demos and then says...)

Um, never mind.

[Les]

Originally posted by JamieSPC
[offtopic]
Les,

You wouldn't happen to know where I could get a copy of that interview, would you? That probably wasn't one of Rose's best moments, but on the whole I really like his show and he seems to consistently be the best-prepared and best-researched interviewer out there.

[/offtopic]

I've got a crappy old VHS copy of the show that I could probably try to copy for you. I'll warn you though, this isn't one of his hugely in-depth interviews. It's not bad, but this was in the days before Charlie had that intimate, sitting across from each other at the table, kind of setup he has these days. I was sort of disappoined the first time I finally saw this interview because I was hoping for a longer and certainly more thoughtful interview with Lindsey since Charlie is usually so good at that these days. I guess this was a little before he hit his stride. Lindsey wasn't in the studio with him even, but on satelite somewhere else and looking decidedly uncomfortable about staring into the camera lense whenever Charlie asked him a question.

Feel free to PM though if you're interested and I'll see what I can do.

[Johnny Stew]

Originally posted by Les
The assumption that Stevie is unhappy about the band and it must be Lindsey's fault is sadly an all too common scapegoating of Lindsey in relation to anything involving Stevie.

Exactly, Les.
And I feel the same way about Stevie constantly being the scapegoat anytime there is tension within the band.
She's not the only one who has an opinion or an ego.

And, as I've said before, I really think this particular thing has been blown entirely out of proportion.
For all we know, the very next day after that interview, she could have apologized for having been difficult (if, in fact, she was), and the whole thing could have blown over.

She and Lindsey were getting along quite well on the Mark & Brian interview, interacting with each other, and giggling often.
Both were also complimentary towards each other.

I still look to that as the more current example of how the band is getting along.

[Wayne2]

Originally posted by JamieSPC
(Jamie puts on his flame suit)


Not to belittle the contributions of the guys in the band, but take a long hard look at what happens when you take Stevie out of ANY of their respective equations: )

[Gazza]

Haha!


Actually, I love Stevies voice on Seven Wonders. Be fair now.

[David]

Originally posted by wetcamelfood
Yes, I would. I don't know where this perception comes from that I "think PG is God" because it's not true.

I guess many of us are pigeonholed to varying degrees. I'm generally thought of as a somewhat cranky Stevie hater. But I'd push my own mother out of the way if you were showing me a video of a hot Wild Heart show.

P.S. I definitely don't like all the members of Fleetwood Mac equally. Dave Mason, for example, was a hole in the band's tableau in the mid 1990s. For my money, he brought nothing to the table besides self-consciousness & an unwillingness to commit. He was Pickup Band Central. He oozed "gun for hire" (except when the Mac played "We Just Disagree").

[David]

Originally posted by Johnny Stew
And I feel the same way about Stevie constantly being the scapegoat anytime there is tension within the band. She's not the only one who has an opinion or an ego.

Damn straight. In fact, it was Lindsey who stormed out of one of the mixing sessions.

She and Lindsey were getting along quite well on the Mark & Brian interview, interacting with each other, and giggling often. Both were also complimentary towards each other. I still look to that as the more current example of how the band is getting along.

I think that they're getting along just fine these days. We all have friends who do & say little things that annoy us or who don't work the way we want to work, but we're still fond of those people.

[ricohv]

Because this album reminds me of a cook who forgot to go grocery shopping. So the cook goes into the fridge and the pantry and says, "Well, I'll take a little of this and a little of that and I've got some leftovers of this, and I'll put them all together in this here pot and see how it all comes out." Well, you KNOW it ain't gonna taste too good. It might be edible, but you probably won't LIKE it. [from WindingRoad's post (on pg1)]

What a great quote! I finally realize why from Tusk forward, even though there are some great songs, the albums as a whole don't stand up as well as the most classics (FM/FM or Rumours). Tango in the Night comes close, feeling like the whole album has a vibe as well as each song has a vibe, except it's obvious Stevie wasn't in on the collaboration. Although I love Seven Wonders, I think TITN would've almost been better minus her songs and plus You & I, Pt. 1 and Ricky, and just left as a Lindsey/ Chris project. It certainly would've felt more cohesive overall as an album.

I've thought all along as SayYouWill is played up as BuckinghamNicks II: no way! Lindsey & Stevie don't have to be together to make that album, but they have to be together: working, crafting, writing, and collaborating. SayYouWill is 1/2 of a Lindsy solo album and 1/2 of a Stevie solo album, with some well known hired help !

[DownOnRodeo]

I see what you mean Richov (especially about Tango - a Lindsey/Christine affair with Ricky .... ohh yeah!)

But I see differently re: SYW as BNII. There's no doubt, as eveyone's saying, that Stevie just came in (for all of a year mind) to do the vocals.

But let's face it - what really counts: what goes on behind the scenes in the studio or the actual music which is produced. For all intents and purposes we shouldn't know what's going on behind the scenes - what's evident on the face of the music should tell the most important story.

As you point out, in Tusk onwards there was the creative fracturing etc, which it should be noted is due to some degree to Lindsey taking more total control of the productive process.

In Tusk we had a big division of vocals and in Tango we had the "phone-in effect" from certain members. Arguably Lindsey at the time didn't even frankly want to be working with Stevie and her songs to some degree.

That's all changed: In SYW we have the two singers swimming in and out of each other's songs, a reliance on dual harmonies instead of a solo vocal with an excessive b/g chorus. The whole reason he's been doing the album is because he's happy to working on Stevie's songs.

The only thing is that they have been working under extenuating circumstances with Stevie doing solo thing etc, and the GOS tracks all but complete after years of work. This, as Lindsey has said, would not be the case if a SYW2 was to come around the corner. Fingers crossed. Toes crossed!

So although we don't have the album here to really assess, I'd like to say that what we have is a transitional stage back to Buckingham Nicks; it's not a hotch-potch of various songs because you listen to them and you see Lindsey has got a real continuity with the sound, and they're in each others songs like not since loooong ago.

You've got to ask yourself - what counts more when you're evaluating the music? Drabs of info over the years about the recording sessions, or listening to the songs and hearing that Lindsey is endeavouring to craft a unified, raw band sound through the given material, and that the band is sounding better than in a long time (IMO).