Was TITN a surprise?

[HejiraNYC]

For me, every time I bought a new SN or FM album when it was released was an EVENT that had its own timespace - I remember the place I bought it, how much it cost, and most of all, the sense of anticipation of getting to the car, ripping it open and looking at the inner sleeve/booklet for pictures and lyrics. TITN was no exception (CD, Kemp Mill Records, Greenbelt, MD $14.99).

I remember that my biggest anticipation was to see whether Stevie's voice had changed. Some months earlier I saw my first Stevie concert, the RAL tour, and I was sorely disappointed- her voice was off-key and hoarse. As it turned out, TITN confirmed my fears, especially WISYA. And I was also really bummed that Stevie was barely on the album. And although I loved the cover art work, there really weren't any decent band shots in the CD booklet! Grrr...

Musically I wasn't all that shocked- it seemed like the next logical step after the very poppy "Mirage." And "Stand Back" and the RAL album had already paved the way for a very 80's contemporary, synth-driven sound. But the one thing I absolutely deplored (in addition to WISYA) is "You and I Part II." Gawd, that song was cheesy then as it is today. It reminded me so much of "Copa Cabana" and it was definitely a song that I didn't want blaring out of my car speakers.

In a nutshell I thought it was an okay effort, but even for its time I thought it sounded cold and mechanical. Oh, and Stevie's songs were by-and-large ass.

[Sahara]

I wasn't around at the time it was released but I can imagine that what people are saying about it being popular because it had that "hook" was true ~ even though I think it has much more going for it than just that.

And I would kill or die to see TITN done live. Pretty please, Lindsey?!

[priestofnothing]

Originally Posted by chiliD

Agree in principle. Actually, they should've done "Tango" on The Dance tour in place of "I'm So Afraid"...then done "Murrow" on the SYW tour.

That's funny. Not ha-ha funny, but co-incidence funny. I believe Lindsey (or maybe it was Mick) said once that the music for Tango in the Night (the song) was born out of some of Lindsey's live performances of I'm So Afraid. I can't remember where I heard that though - maybe it was in Mick's book?

[littlewolf]

Originally Posted by strandinthewind

Towie -

I think many people thought the love grunts on Big Love had La Nicks in them. I certainly did.

so did i.
tango in the night was the beginning of fleetwood mac to me,after a couple of turns.
the first time they were about to play big love on mtv(was it mtv at the time?)the vj said:listen to those aaahhs,they´re stevie nicks.
this couldn´t have been my first time hearing FM,because i knew that reference meant that stevie hadn´t left the band,as it was rumoured at the time.
following year i changed a job and met a couple of guys who introduced me to peter green period fleetwood mac.
this brought back my interest in tango in the night and at the time everywhere was playing a lot,so i bought it,but didn´t like it very much,so when one of the guys from work wanted to buy it,i sold it to him.
for years i only listened to peter green period FM,but when behind the mask came,little lies was played several times and i decided to buy it again in -91 and from there i started to buy other rumours line up albums(and bare trees)

[aleuzzi]

I just learned to drive when Tango was released. I'd been a die-hard Mac fan since I was twelve and was anxious for this long-awaited LP. I was, on first listen, disappointed. Lindsey and Christine's songs were strong--this I could easily see; but the production was too cold, too slick and, to my way of thinking, derivative of so much synth pop of the time. I remember being annoyed with the way Christine's excellent voice was manipulated a bit in the stuido to sound more sugary than seductive, more breathy than smooth.

Stevie's songs were an all-out disaster. Seven Wonders was good--as many have already noted, but it wasn't hers. The "additional lyrics" credit she gave herself was embarassing, as if she were trying to claim some right to her only solid contribution. As ChilD had noted, Rock a Little was quite a good record. At least half of the songs were hot. So why the sudden drop in writing and performance?

I eventually warmed up to the record. I realized some of my criticisms (where Chris and Lindsey were concerned) were the result of my holding them to a standard that,, by then, was a decade old. There was no GYOW on Tango, but all of Lindsey's songs were meaty contributions. And, as an immediate fan of "Litttle Lies," I soon realized Chris struck gold. Her live performance of "Isn't It Midnight" was even better than the studio one.

Poor Stevie. No amount of spin could save her two songs, which sound inserted, inorganic to the proceedings. I was pleasantly surprised to see she returned to top form on Behind the Mask.

[priestofnothing]

Originally Posted by aleuzzi

Stevie's songs were an all-out disaster. Seven Wonders was good--as many have already noted, but it wasn't hers. The "additional lyrics" credit she gave herself was embarassing, as if she were trying to claim some right to her only solid contribution. As ChilD had noted, Rock a Little was quite a good record. At least half of the songs were hot. So why the sudden drop in writing and performance?


Poor Stevie. No amount of spin could save her two songs, which sound inserted, inorganic to the proceedings. I was pleasantly surprised to see she returned to top form on Behind the Mask.

At the risk of being flamed here, I have come to believe after many years, this may have been one biggest times when Lindsey "had the urge not to want to help her...." Lindsey himself said there were many years of unresolved feelings between him and Stevie since they broke up 10 years before then, and that when he quit FM after Tango was released, it kind of put some closure on that.

Plus, Stevie had 3 very successful solo albums at that point, Lindsey was not enjoying that much commercial success... I could see how he wouldn't run to her aid in making this record out of jealousy or competitiveness or whatever. I think he was also resentful that she didn't spend much time in the studio for this album, he's made several snide comments about it in interviews over the years.

Just my opinion.

[jbrownsjr]

Originally Posted by priestofnothing

At the risk of being flamed here, I have come to believe after many years, this may have been one biggest times when Lindsey "had the urge not to want to help her...." Lindsey himself said there were many years of unresolved feelings between him and Stevie since they broke up 10 years before then, and that when he quit FM after Tango was released, it kind of put some closure on that.

Plus, Stevie had 3 very successful solo albums at that point, Lindsey was not enjoying that much commercial success... I could see how he wouldn't run to her aid in making this record out of jealousy or competitiveness or whatever. I think he was also resentful that she didn't spend much time in the studio for this album, he's made several snide comments about it in interviews over the years.

Just my opinion.

LB made snide comments about one of his bandmates... that's impossible!!

[aleuzzi]

Originally Posted by priestofnothing

At the risk of being flamed here, I have come to believe after many years, this may have been one biggest times when Lindsey "had the urge not to want to help her...." Lindsey himself said there were many years of unresolved feelings between him and Stevie since they broke up 10 years before then, and that when he quit FM after Tango was released, it kind of put some closure on that.

Plus, Stevie had 3 very successful solo albums at that point, Lindsey was not enjoying that much commercial success... I could see how he wouldn't run to her aid in making this record out of jealousy or competitiveness or whatever. I think he was also resentful that she didn't spend much time in the studio for this album, he's made several snide comments about it in interviews over the years.

Just my opinion.

Why would you be flamed for saying this? I think your observations are accurate. They don't change the facts of the quality of the music, but they certainly put some of it in context.

[skcin]

I don't think that assessment is inaccurate either. LB not wanting to help Stevie (or deal with her **** anymore) is probably a huge reason why her songs weren't up to par. Of course, I must throw in my disclaimer that I actually LOVE 7W, and I do like WISYA & WTTRS a lot- BUT I understand that these songs are nowhere near her best work.

Another possibility in my mind is that Stevie had exhausted a lot of her best material on the 2 albums she released between Mirage & TITN. For a while there, it was every other for Stevie (Mac album '79, solo '81, Mac '82, solo '83.) So then was she waiting for Mac to restart & it didn't happen? Did she say "well screw them, I'm tired of waiting for LB to figure out what he wants to do, I'll put these songs out on my own album instead."

I mean, what was the band doing those 5 years? I know, solo projects & such, but 5 YEARS?!?! Can I assume that LB was the one holding out/stalling? Did he want to leave the band after Mirage, but said "f*ck it" & did one more album for the hell of it? For the money? To shut Mick up? Any clue?

[chiliD]

Originally Posted by skcin

I mean, what was the band doing those 5 years? I know, solo projects & such, but 5 YEARS?!?!

One VERY GOOD point of contention of my idea that Stevie & Lindsey should've just bid adieu to Fleetwood Mac at the end of the Tusk tour. Fleetwood Mac could've carried on with new people and put out an album every (or every other) year. Buckingham & Nicks screwed us FLEETWOOD MAC fans out of at least 3 albums by not being focus solely on the band.

[jbrownsjr]

Originally Posted by chiliD

One VERY GOOD point of contention of my idea that Stevie & Lindsey should've just bid adieu to Fleetwood Mac at the end of the Tusk tour. Fleetwood Mac could've carried on with new people and put out an album every (or every other) year. Buckingham & Nicks screwed us FLEETWOOD MAC fans out of at least 3 albums by not being focus solely on the band.

ahhhh yes... the disadvantages of being a star...

[strandinthewind]

Originally Posted by chiliD

One VERY GOOD point of contention of my idea that Stevie & Lindsey should've just bid adieu to Fleetwood Mac at the end of the Tusk tour. Fleetwood Mac could've carried on with new people and put out an album every (or every other) year. Buckingham & Nicks screwed us FLEETWOOD MAC fans out of at least 3 albums by not being focus solely on the band.

That is a little unfair IMO because:

1. CM released a solo record

2. Mick did two I believe

and

3. None of them really seemed to be too interested in FM at the time, though during Stevie's RAL tour they apparently went back in the studio and she worked with them from the road.

So, IMO it was more than just LB and SN's solo stuff. I also think La Nicks' loyalty to a group she really did not need at the time and who really in many ways did not want her around was outstanding. Who among us would stay in that kind of work environment?

[HomerMcvie]

Originally Posted by strandinthewind

That is a little unfair IMO because:

1. CM released a solo record

2. Mick did two I believe

and

3. None of them really seemed to be too interested in FM at the time, though during Stevie's RAL tour they apparently went back in the studio and she worked with them from the road.

So, IMO it was more than just LB and SN's solo stuff. I also think La Nicks' loyalty to a group she really did not need at the time and who really in many ways did not want her around was outstanding. Who among us would stay in that kind of work environment?

Firstly, I'm pretty sure that Mick's were only done during FM downtime(edit below).
And Chris's- wasn't it 1984? FM was in the middle of FIVE YEARS OF NOTHING! Try saying the same about the timing of Bella Donna, The Wild Heart, or Law and Order!
Okay, The Visitor was during this time, BUT, it's not like it was some all time-encompassing effort, requiring Mick two years to finish.

[chiliD]

Originally Posted by strandinthewind

That is a little unfair IMO because:

1. CM released a solo record

2. Mick did two I believe

and

3. None of them really seemed to be too interested in FM at the time, though during Stevie's RAL tour they apparently went back in the studio and she worked with them from the road.

So, IMO it was more than just LB and SN's solo stuff. I also think La Nicks' loyalty to a group she really did not need at the time and who really in many ways did not want her around was outstanding. Who among us would stay in that kind of work environment?

Yeah, unfair to both Fleetwood Mac as a band and FMac's fans.

1) CM released her solo album ONLY BECAUSE there wasn't an active Fleetwood Mac at the time. Had Fleetwood Mac been an active entity, those songs would've been Fleetwood Mac songs, Christine wouldn't have released a solo album. (unlike Lindsey & Stevie, who PLANNED solo careers)

2) pretty much ditto for Mick...although his albums came as a result of playing live (the trip to Africa...then the Zoo started out as a "live only" band...the album was an afterthought)

3) My point. Stevie's RAL tour was placed at a higher priority than the Fleetwood Mac recording project. Which set up a situation of Stevie trying to do too much which affected the quality of both her solo career AND her work with Fleetwood Mac.

[strandinthewind]

Originally Posted by HomerMcvie

Firstly, I'm pretty sure that Mick's were only done during FM downtime(edit below).
And Chris's- wasn't it 1984? FM was in the middle of FIVE YEARS OF NOTHING! Try saying the same about the timing of Bella Donna, The Wild Heart, or Law and Order!
Okay, The Visitor was during this time, BUT, it's not like it was some all time-encompassing effort, requiring Mick two years to finish.

I think the point was that La Nicks and LB's solo stuff detracted from FM's ability to put out more records. I think that can be said for CM and Mick's efforts as well.

I mean Stevie's BD was relatively quickly produced and the tour was very very short.

In the end, I do not blame La Nicks one bit for moving forward with her work and essentially dropping her work and running to FM when they called - and this was also when she was in personal crisis. So, I think it is unfair to assert that her solo career in any way effected FM's ability to produce records. I actually think her very successful solo career enhanced that ability.