Diana Krall's Christmas Songs - Page 14

Brwn_eyes0511 · #**196** 11-02-2005, 05:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by amber

Oh, sorry - yes, they are. Doesn't make it wrong, doesn't mean you can't do it, but using the actual rules of logic - it is very illogical. It's about as illogical as believing in...oh, say...leprechauns. There is the same amount of empirical evidence that leprechauns exist that there is that god exists.

Well thanks for answering my question. As hard as it was to hear that I, and others who believe, are thought to be illogical by non-believers...I got my question answered...so thanks!

Brwn_eyes0511 · #**197** 11-02-2005, 05:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Tower

How do you, as a person of faith in a loving god, look at the concepts of pestilence and natural disasters that kill millions of people? What do you think about all the poverty and suffering in the world? How does that work into your concept of a loving god?

I know how I, as a secular humanist, look at these things. I was just wondering what you think.

Without suffering there would be no compassion...

dissention · #**198** 11-02-2005, 05:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brwn_eyes0511

Well thanks for answering my question. As hard as it was to hear that I, and others who believe, are thought to be illogical by non-believers...I got my question answered...so thanks!

If God created all of us and everythng around us, who created God? That's always bugged me.

strandinthewind · #**199** 11-02-2005, 05:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dissention

If God created all of us and everythng around us, who created God? That's always bugged me.

The answer is God is all - thus God is time and without Him there would be no time. God has always been and will always be. There is no beginning and no end.

I am not saying you should believe that. I am just giving you the Judeo Christian explanation - and interestingly the explanation contained in most other religions I have seen.

Jyqm · #**200** 11-02-2005, 05:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brwn_eyes0511

Without suffering there would be no compassion...

Ouch.

They feed you that and you eat it, huh? How does that **** taste?

An all-loving, all-powerful god causes massive and incredible suffering to billions of people every day simply to inspire compassion in the other folks? How do you deal with and worship a force that cruel?

Brwn_eyes0511 · #**201** 11-02-2005, 06:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jyqm

Ouch.

They feed you that and you eat it, huh? How does that **** taste?

An all-loving, all-powerful god causes massive and incredible suffering to billions of people every day simply to inspire compassion in the other folks? How do you deal with and worship a force that cruel?

Why are you being so hateful? No one has fed me anything...

I give up...you guys win!

The Tower · #**202** 11-02-2005, 06:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jyqm

Ouch.

They feed you that and you eat it, huh? How does that **** taste?

An all-loving, all-powerful god causes massive and incredible suffering to billions of people every day simply to inspire compassion in the other folks? How do you deal with and worship a force that cruel?

Yeah, that concept is pretty evil. Slaughtering millions of innocents to inspire compassion? Isn't that kind of a sledgehammer approach? I mean, I can be compassionate for someone simply because I care about them. I don't need a "loving" god to wipe them out for me to feel compassion.

Jyqm · #**203** 11-02-2005, 06:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brwn_eyes0511

Why are you being so hateful? No one has fed me anything...

Sorry. But you answered the very important question of "How do you justify belief in an all-powerful, all-loving God with the pestilence and destruction which plagues the world every day?" with "Without suffering there would be no compassion." And that's not the first time I've heard that kind of answer, but still, the astounding cruelty of it shocks me every time.

But you're right. Without suffering there would be no compassion. But you know what? There also wouldn't be any suffering. Sounds like a pretty neat trade-off to me. Actually, sounds kind of like the way God supposedly set things up in the first place.

Mari · #**204** 11-02-2005, 06:10 PM

I can go along with a lot that's been said in this thread but I just find it.. hurting to read an idea that people believe only out of fear.
I'll just try to dig up some sociology from my sleepy brain.
You're looking only at an individual level there, but missing the next level. I think many people call themselves religious because of socialization (they were raised to be religious), it's part of their culture, it's part of group dynamics. It serves a purpose: traditions and rituals serve as a glue to keep a group together.
But when those traditions/rituals lose their purpose, religion disappears, which happened with a lot of christians in my country and probably yours. You ought to think of what purpose christianity can have for certain groups if you want to know why it is succesful, not just look at what it means for the individual.

umm.. I'm too sleepy. I'll try to make more sense tomorrow.