Anti-Rape Condom?

[strandinthewind]

Originally Posted by irishgrl

and what would THAT be?
the only other thing I can think of that would *possibly* work is to make the punishment fit the crime: WHACK OFF the offending organ. I surmise it would only take the Government a short time to get the message across...

btw: in the article, the inventor stated that the rapist (after having encountered this condom) would be in too much pain, and too busy trying to get it off, to do further violence to the woman...

if you ask me, its a wonderfully thought out little thing-a-ma-jig.

that is because you hate all men and penises and the thought of torturing them gives you glee You also cannot fathom that some women would ever use this device in a bad way because women can never do anything wrong - it is always the fault of the penis.

[strandinthewind]

Originally Posted by irishgrl

actually your first point is inaccurate: the punishment is only inflicted at the MOMENT of the crime. INSTANT justice if you ask me.

It assumes a crime, which must be proven. But, you will never admit that because you hate men and all women are victims and the thought of a woman deceiving a man is foreign to you, though it surely happens

Originally Posted by irishgrl

as for cheating husbands, dont they deserve it?

So, a bereaved husband of a cheating wife can spray pepper spray in her vagina as an act of revenge and your okay with that - nice.

[strandinthewind]

Originally Posted by ReFleetwoodMac

Lighten up a bit. I don't think she is saying that all men are guilty and all women are victims. You're talking as if you think all women are evil and all men are the victims of their evil escapades.

I base my comments on prior conversations with Mary where she has said she has little time for evil men, women are victims of men, etc. But, I'll let her explain herself

As for me, I think men rape women all of the time and that is a horrible act for which the men should be convicted with no exceptions. But, in the context of this device, the possibility that it could be used in a bad way by a small number of women does not make its use worthwhile. That is all I am saying.

[strandinthewind]

Originally Posted by ReFleetwoodMac

Sure, but like Lux and most of the others have said, anyone can use anything in a negative way, but that doesn't stop them from being available to us. What's the difference between this and a gun or a heavy brick sitting bedside?

I want to prevent those too

[paleshadow]

Originally Posted by ReFleetwoodMac

Sure, but like Lux and most of the others have said, anyone can use anything in a negative way, but that doesn't stop them from being available to us. What's the difference between this and a gun or a heavy brick sitting bedside?

I think the difference is that it's sort of like being automatically guilty. You can shoot someone, or hit them with a brick, but that's not an automatic implication that you were being raped. I think that if a man goes to the hospital because he has one of these things stuck on his penis the implication is that he was trying to rape someone, when perhaps he was under the impression that he was having consentual sex, and it could possibly be a case of the woman being malicious. If you go to the emergency room with a gunshot wound, or a concussion from a brick, they don't automatically associate that with rape.

[SuzeQuze]

Originally Posted by paleshadow

I think the difference is that it's sort of like being automatically guilty. You can shoot someone, or hit them with a brick, but that's not an automatic implication that you were being raped. I think that if a man goes to the hospital because he has one of these things stuck on his penis the implication is that he was trying to rape someone, when perhaps he was under the impression that he was having consentual sex, and it could possibly be a case of the woman being malicious. If you go to the emergency room with a gunshot wound, or a concussion from a brick, they don't automatically associate that with rape.

I do not understand this device. If it can be so destructive to the penis, what is it doing while inserted in the female? I mean, it could really hurt her if something went wrong with it. I think that in theory it is a good idea but to put it to use doesn't seem feasible.

[amber]

Originally Posted by paleshadow

I think the difference is that it's sort of like being automatically guilty. You can shoot someone, or hit them with a brick, but that's not an automatic implication that you were being raped. I think that if a man goes to the hospital because he has one of these things stuck on his penis the implication is that he was trying to rape someone, when perhaps he was under the impression that he was having consentual sex, and it could possibly be a case of the woman being malicious. If you go to the emergency room with a gunshot wound, or a concussion from a brick, they don't automatically associate that with rape.

In theory, that could be true, but I'm not sure you understand the scope of this problem. I'd call it a national emergency. And I think the instances of "women seeking revenge" would be so small as to be negligible, if not nonexistent. And this place does not have a justice system like America. Or a culture like America. There is little protection at all for women here, and few resources and processes for anyone to be brought to justice. These aren't isolated cases, in fact, it is the norm.

"Two men are due to appear at a court in Johannesburg on Tuesday, accused of raping a five-month-old girl who was discovered covered in blood and in tears.

It is the latest in a series of rapes of baby girls - some of them involving children less than one year-old, which has left South Africans reeling with horror.

Every day the newspapers bring awful revelations: a nine-month-old girl gang-raped by six men; an eight-month-old raped and left by the roadside.


I don't know how to take my anger out. I don't know why he did this

Mother of abused child

Outside the central Johannesburg magistrates' court, 200 demonstrators gathered carrying banners with slogans like "child rapists are not human".

Yet many protesters seem unable to understand why the rapes are happening.

"I don't have an answer, it's inhuman, it's inhuman," one told me.

Rape statistics from South Africa are so shocking as to be almost unbelievable - women's rights activists say one South African is raped every 26 seconds.

It is the young who are particularly vulnerable, with the police saying that more teenagers are raped than any other age group.

But even in a country numbed to horrific events, these cases are bewildering to South Africans, and making them question where their society is heading.

Unearthing truth

It is hardly believable - but some think that this is not new, only that a horrible truth is finally being acknowledged

Alexandria
Township youngsters are among the most vulnerable

"Actually it's not a new phenomenon, it's been something that you hide, you regard it as an embarrassment within the family. But now people have started to talk, they've decided that they've had enough," a woman protester told me.

A typical story reveals the horror.

On a poor Johannesburg estate, a family of eight sleep in one dirty bedroom.

Last week a neighbour seized the nine year old daughter, showed her pornographic magazines and then raped and indecently assaulted her. He gave her a few coins, and said sorry.

The little girl needed extensive surgery - her mother and father are inconsolable.

"I'm very angry, I'm very angry, I don't know how to take my anger out. I don't know why he did this, he used to come here and play with my children..." said the mother.

The father said he wanted to hunt down the rapists.

"How many parents' hearts must be broken?"

He is not alone in his rage.

Last weekend in Soweto a suspected child rapist was stoned to death.

The government is appealing for calm.

Myths

It is also trying to dispel a widespread rumour - that having sex with a virgin cures Aids.

Traditional healers, or witchdoctors, are blamed for spreading this idea, and encouraging child rape.

A sociologist, Lisa Vetton, draws a parallel with Europe, when child prostitution was rampant

"At that time venereal disease like Aids today was incurable. If you had gonorrhea or syphilis you were going to die. And exactly the same myth emerged, that sex with a virgin is going to cure you - so it seems like a very old response whenever sex and death are combined. Suddenly women - girls - get attributed with magical healing powers".


We must re-educate and empower men

Politician Nomvula Mokanyane

Some demonstrators are calling for longer sentences, even castration. Others are more considered.

Local politician Nomvula Mokanyane says that under apartheid, African men were stripped of power and prestige. Now they take their revenge on women, and on tiny children.

"We must re-educate and empower men. There are those who are sick who need to be re-educated. My worry is that men's power is threatened so they use their sexual organ to inflict pain on women."

South Africa's history, its poverty and the Aids pandemic all give insights into how some men behave.

But the rape of tiny children leaves people as mystified here as they would be in any other part of the world.

There is revulsion, but there is also bewilderment.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/africa/1703595.stm

[paleshadow]

Originally Posted by amber

In theory, that could be true, but I'm not sure you understand the scope of this problem. I'd call it a national emergency. And I think the instances of "women seeking revenge" would be so small as to be negligible. And this place does not have a justice system like America. There is little protection at all for women here, and few resources and processes for anyone to be brought to justice. These aren't isolated cases, in fact, it is the norm.

"Two men are due to appear at a court in Johannesburg on Tuesday, accused of raping a five-month-old girl who was discovered covered in blood and in tears.

It is the latest in a series of rapes of baby girls - some of them involving children less than one year-old, which has left South Africans reeling with horror.

Every day the newspapers bring awful revelations: a nine-month-old girl gang-raped by six men; an eight-month-old raped and left by the roadside.


I don't know how to take my anger out. I don't know why he did this

Mother of abused child

Outside the central Johannesburg magistrates' court, 200 demonstrators gathered carrying banners with slogans like "child rapists are not human".

Yet many protesters seem unable to understand why the rapes are happening.

"I don't have an answer, it's inhuman, it's inhuman," one told me.

Rape statistics from South Africa are so shocking as to be almost unbelievable - women's rights activists say one South African is raped every 26 seconds.

It is the young who are particularly vulnerable, with the police saying that more teenagers are raped than any other age group.

But even in a country numbed to horrific events, these cases are bewildering to South Africans, and making them question where their society is heading.

Unearthing truth

It is hardly believable - but some think that this is not new, only that a horrible truth is finally being acknowledged

Alexandria
Township youngsters are among the most vulnerable

"Actually it's not a new phenomenon, it's been something that you hide, you regard it as an embarrassment within the family. But now people have started to talk, they've decided that they've had enough," a woman protester told me.

A typical story reveals the horror.

On a poor Johannesburg estate, a family of eight sleep in one dirty bedroom.

Last week a neighbour seized the nine year old daughter, showed her pornographic magazines and then raped and indecently assaulted her. He gave her a few coins, and said sorry.

The little girl needed extensive surgery - her mother and father are inconsolable.

"I'm very angry, I'm very angry, I don't know how to take my anger out. I don't know why he did this, he used to come here and play with my children..." said the mother.

The father said he wanted to hunt down the rapists.

"How many parents' hearts must be broken?"

He is not alone in his rage.

Last weekend in Soweto a suspected child rapist was stoned to death.

The government is appealing for calm.

Myths

It is also trying to dispel a widespread rumour - that having sex with a virgin cures Aids.

Traditional healers, or witchdoctors, are blamed for spreading this idea, and encouraging child rape.

A sociologist, Lisa Vetton, draws a parallel with Europe, when child prostitution was rampant

"At that time venereal disease like Aids today was incurable. If you had gonorrhea or syphilis you were going to die. And exactly the same myth emerged, that sex with a virgin is going to cure you - so it seems like a very old response whenever sex and death are combined. Suddenly women - girls - get attributed with magical healing powers".


We must re-educate and empower men

Politician Nomvula Mokanyane

Some demonstrators are calling for longer sentences, even castration. Others are more considered.

Local politician Nomvula Mokanyane says that under apartheid, African men were stripped of power and prestige. Now they take their revenge on women, and on tiny children.

"We must re-educate and empower men. There are those who are sick who need to be re-educated. My worry is that men's power is threatened so they use their sexual organ to inflict pain on women."

South Africa's history, its poverty and the Aids pandemic all give insights into how some men behave.

But the rape of tiny children leaves people as mystified here as they would be in any other part of the world.

There is revulsion, but there is also bewilderment.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/africa/1703595.stm

I understand the scope of the problem. I am not arguing it's magnitude, but I don't feel that this device is the solution. I was also not arguing this method being used because I think there would be wide spread abuse of it. I don't really think that would be the case in South Africa as much as it would be in the United States. I was just responding to the comparison of people using a gun or a brick to prevent a rape as opposed to the anti rape condom. I believe what it said in the article I posted the link to that in the cases of crimes like rape the act is usually not premeditated, and therefor methods to deter it would not be effective. I also was reading that statistically in South Africa a large percentage of the rapes are comitted by family, or other people known to the victim.

As I've been reading this thread I've been thinking about the anti-rape condom, and how really it wouldn't deter anyone. For one thing, the rapist would have to know that the woman had the "condom" inserted. Is it not still traumatic to be penetrated? Is it not rape if the act is cut short, and the man does not ejaculate? The rape is still occuring.

I know this idea wouldn't go over well, but honestly it would be much more effective in keeping penetration from occuring and that would be to use something like a chastity belt. I know rape is so much more then the penetration, but I would think it be better to prevent the actual penetration then to just use a method that only stops it after it has been initiated already.

[amber]

okay, then.

[irishgrl]

Originally Posted by paleshadow

The article in the link above states that anti-rape activists feel that it may cause more violence. It is a legitimate concern that can't be discounted just because the inventor says so.
Also, this device is supposed to be a deterant to rape, but wouldn't capital punishment also be a deterant, and a greater one at that, yet capital punishment was abolished in South Africa a decade ago. Many people feel that because of the nature of rape, there really aren't any deterents. It's not like other crimes that are premeditated.

http://www.iss.co.za/pubs/ASR/11No2/Schonteich.html
"It would appear that the majority of murders, rapes and assaults in South Africa (as in most countries) are not committed by calculating individuals who plan their crimes and weigh up the pros and cons of committing them. Rather, most of these crimes are committed in a moment of passion, anger, thoughtlessness, spite or drunkenness. The fear of being punished harshly if they are caught and convicted for their deeds, does little to prevent the criminal actions of such offenders".

As far as what other options there are, I certainly do not claim to know, or I wouldn't be sitting here posting this message, I'd be doing something about it. I don't feel this device would be practical, or completely effective, but as I said, it has brought national attention to the matter and that is someting in itself.

Well, as to the device bringing more violence, I believe that IF a rapist was snagged by this little gadget in the midst of a rape, his first act would be to Pull OUT and try and get the thingie off. As I understand it, it cant be removed by any means other than surgery so the rapist would be only hurting himself if he tried to remove it. Im assuming that this in itself would prevent him lashing out at the woman (who by now would be getting the heck outa Dodge if she's got half a brain) so, on the contrary, I can certainly understand the inventor's claims. The Anti Rape groups certainly havent been effective with all their speeches and candles have they?
huh.

[irishgrl]

Originally Posted by strandinthewind

that is because you hate all men and penises and the thought of torturing them gives you glee You also cannot fathom that some women would ever use this device in a bad way because women can never do anything wrong - it is always the fault of the penis.

I dont hate all men or all penises. dont be silly. I hate the inequality between the sexes and I hate the crimes that men commit against women and children. However, Im not sure why you are defending cheating husbands.
And, btw: God must've been high when he gave penises to MEN because they've certainly showed they cant handle them........think of how many of Society's Ills are caused by wayward penises. Give me a break.

[strandinthewind]

Originally Posted by irishgrl

. . . think of how many of Society's Ills are caused by wayward penises. Give me a break.

Like Bill Clinton

BTW - just own up to being a male basher. You already said in another thread that you do not really have much use for males -- why shy away from that now

[strandinthewind]

Originally Posted by irishgrl

. . . However, Im not sure why you are defending cheating husbands . . . .

I am not defending anyone. I am just saying that the crime of battery is not a legal remedy. If any partner cheats, the other has no right to maim them. Are we back to Mrs. Bobbitt. I mean this whole auto revenge thing is sick and contrary to our nation of laws.

[strandinthewind]

Originally Posted by ReFleetwoodMac

So all forms of possible self-protection should be banned because of the minority who abuse them? Perhaps there should be a sophisticated screening process that screens these women for their probability of being raped. The low level threat women will be turned away immediately, the middle level threat women will be granted a two week waiting period - which upon completion, they will be reward with the device, the high level threat women will be rewarded the device will a small down payment, and the imminent threat level women will have the device inserted by a skilled professional free of charge, right then and there.

I said all that

Come on - you know what I am talking about here. The bottom line is this penis clamp trap is bogus though perhaps effective if multiple penetration constitutes a rape.

But, to each their own.

[amber]

Originally Posted by strandinthewind

Like Bill Clinton

BTW - just own up to being a male basher. You already said in another thread that you do not really have much use for males -- why shy away from that now

love you, but I think that's rude. And the use of the term "femi-nazi"? very insulting. Besides, I haven't seen one on this board yet. And why would you ever use a term coined by Rush Limbaugh anyway? And even if someone was or wasn't male bashing, your points are still very weak in the context of South Africa. In America, you might have a point. Over there? Your point seems ludicrous to me.
respectfully.