Gold Dust Tour DVDs!

[David]

Originally Posted by ShangriLaTroubl

I think his motives are for fans to enjoy great DVD's personally

Then you're naive, Chris. His motive is a monetary one.

His DVD's are the best Stevie/Fmac bootleg videos out there...esp. the ones he has done in this Gold Dust Tour...He's totally reliable, and a great guy and has been very generous in adding extras from time to time, etc...I don't think he has any evil motive or anything.

A monetary motive isn't an evil motive. It's just a . . . monetary motive.

I haven't seen Bill's DVDs because I have no interest in Stevie's current career, but Bill did a great job of baking & transferring all the reels, which finally seeped their way into all our individual collections. Everything sounded great, & many of us are grateful to Bill for taking such care with those reels -- for being a detail-oriented guy (unlike Devilwoman, for example). But Bill is a businessman, Chris. He's in business. He's a bootlegger. I love bootleggers, Chris. I have always bought & traded bootlegs of Fleetwood Mac. But let's not start redefining "bootlegger" as "someone who gives away concert recordings out of the goodness of his heart." Bootleggers are businesspeople, plainly & simply. The fact that they supply something you want is irrelevant. Chevron supplies me with gas for my automobile, but I don't call the folks in charge of Chevron to thank them for giving me gasoline -- I buy it from them because I want it.

Same with Bill. If Bill were selling something I wanted, I'd quite possibly buy it from him. I have no problems with buying from a businessman who taped the shows himself & wants to sell them. But Bill isn't an actual fan -- he's in business. Why reinvent words, Chris?

If I was brave enough I would do it.

But actual fans have for decades been doing what Bill is now doing -- fans like Torri, for example. Going to huge numbers of shows & recording them. I've recorded several shows myself & traded them with other fans.

That isn't something that only bootleggers do, Chris.

[BlackWidow]

Originally Posted by SapphireSister

Is this guy reliable? I'm about to order my LA show...

I guess I have very strong opinions on people who make money off Bootlegs.
It is a criminal offense for starters. And Stevie's opinion on this subject matter has been well documented. It truly upsets her..and knowing that her father just passed makes it all the more..not cool. If she wanted you to have copies of this show..she will release it on DVD herself..and make the money on it..since it is her work! IMO.....

[David]

Originally Posted by ShangriLaTroubl

Of course he loves Stevie

Then that's something recent. He didn't used to be a Stevie Nicks fan. He was just a guy who found himself in a circumstance of owning all those reels.

If he is now a Stevie Nicks fan, I'll take your word for it. I don't know the guy personally -- for all I know, maybe all these shows he has seen have turned him on to Stevie's music.

[ShangriLaTroubl]

Regardless of what Bill is, I still see no problem with it, and I do not know that he is not a fan...Maybe you know him on a personal level, but I do not. I dont claim to know if he is, but I had heard he was. You can be a fan AND a businessman at the same time, and that may well be what he is..I do know that in my correspondence with him, and his descriptions of the DVDS and answers to my questions, he has described things in the DVD's that only a fan would appreciate..

As I said before, all that really needs to be done is one person buy them and trade them for everyone...so REALLY it doesnt have to be that big of a business

Chris

[BlackWidow]

Originally Posted by trackaghost

I'll probably never see these DVDs, but I admit I do find it odd. I'd prefer to just go to two Stevie shows and enjoy them, then go to a dozen be worried about having to film them all. It makes me wonder what his motives are personally
It's a fair question to ask IMO, esp when what he is doing is essentially illegal.

It is so tacky..illegal...not cool.

[ShangriLaTroubl]

Originally Posted by BlackWidow

I guess I have very strong opinions on people who make money off Bootlegs.
It is a criminal offense for starters. And Stevie's opinion on this subject matter has been well documented. It truly upsets her..and knowing that her father just passed makes it all the more..not cool. If she wanted you to have copies of this show..she will release it on DVD herself..and make the money on it..since it is her work! IMO.....

First of all I dont think the passing of her father has anything to do with bootlegs,but it was quite nice of you to add that in there, I'm sure to add some kind of guilt effect to your post..If you dont like bootlegs, guess what don't buy them, don't trade for them--that's your choice..but don't come on here trying to relate the death of her father to bootleg sales in some attempt to make us feel guilty

Chris

[ShangriLaTroubl]

Originally Posted by BlackWidow

I guess I have very strong opinions on people who make money off Bootlegs.
It is a criminal offense for starters. And Stevie's opinion on this subject matter has been well documented. It truly upsets her..and knowing that her father just passed makes it all the more..not cool. If she wanted you to have copies of this show..she will release it on DVD herself..and make the money on it..since it is her work! IMO.....

Also to add she has never mentioned bootlegs of concerts, so you are ASSUMING it upsets her..She has mentioned being upset that many of her unreleased songs were leaked in bootleg form, because they were stolen from her at one point...but she has never mentioned bootleg concerts

Chris

[dissention]

Originally Posted by David

Maybe one day Bill will be a real fan & start trading.

My advice is not to bet on it.

[dissention]

Originally Posted by ShangriLaTroubl

While I understand that he is making a little profit, he does spend a hell of a lot of time going to all these shows just for the sake of filming them..Of course he loves Stevie, but he can't 100% enjoy the show because of his great DVDs...I see no problem with him getting a little something back. Afterall, just get together with some friends, and all go in on it...and then make copies for everyone.. If you want to trade them, trade them...I love how everyone is quick to use the term "a REAL FAN"

Chris

The real question is why people go after those who sell Stevie boots on eBay so viciously when they obviously have no qualms about lining Bill's pockets by buying the bootlegs he sells? The hypocrisy that's so evident amongst the Stevie/FM "trading community" is gag-inducing. You don't see Brian going to Stevie shows, taping them, and then telling other fans that if they want to hear it, they must send him money. He's honorable, this dude isn't. If people want to buy his bootlegs so that he can make a quick buck, that's fine. But when I decide that I want to sell off all of my Stevie boots on eBay for $20 a pop, don't any of you people who buy these DVDs, and defend the selling of them, dare to bitch at me about it.

[StevieNicksEO17]

Originally Posted by SpyNote

I don't know why fans get in such a huff about other fans making a few bucks. It's not any of these fans are making a substantial amount of money off these recordings, surely nothing to retire on. The other thing that people always overlook are the costs associated with recording shows...travel costs, accommodations, tickets, hardware, software, media, etc. If a fan makes a few bucks after all the overhead is taken care of, so what? What happened to "a few bucks for your trouble." And as Chris said, once one person gets ahold of a copy, fans will start trading it.

I don't see what the problem with it is either. If one of my shows were in there, I would be all over it like white on rice. 20 bucks for a show that I loved and never want to forget? Sure, why not. This world is completly about money, and that's how he makes some extra bucks. What can you do?

[dissention]

Originally Posted by SpyNote

The other thing that people always overlook are the costs associated with recording shows...travel costs, accommodations, tickets, hardware, software, media, etc. If a fan makes a few bucks after all the overhead is taken care of, so what?

I see. Bootleggers should not only get their travel, accomodations, AND concert tickets paid for by other fans, but they should also make a profit after said costs are taken care of? I'm no twat and all I can smell at the moment is the pungent aroma of bull**** nipping at my nostrils. You don't hear the people who tape shows and then freely give them to other fans whining about "costs." Hell, the last time I checked, Bill wasn't even much of a Stevie or Fleetwood Mac fan. Now he's going around taping their shows to sell to other fans? Golly, what a swell guy.

As David said, Bill is a businessman.

[seeker007nmss]

It's a personal choice. People do things that are considered "illegal" by some all the time. I don't think there is anyone here who has never driven above the speed limit - atleast once. As far a legality and taking the high road, (no pun intended), I believe Ms. Nicks might have done a few illegal narcotics herself. was it right? Should she have done it? It's a personal choice. The money she lost from bootleggers - would some of it go to that habit? possibly. In a logic sort of way, you could say that by buying bootlegs keeps Stevie from doing illegal things also. (I know, but you see the point). Each their own. If you want them, get them. If you don't, let it go.

[dissention]

Originally Posted by SpyNote

Have you met Bill? It's easy for some fans to judge when they are remote from the situation.

I don't need to meet the guy in order to say that I find his selling of bootleg DVDs for $20 a pop to be downright ****ty and that his motives are monetary. If he was concerned about getting the stuff out there for fans to enjoy, as others have implied, he wouldn't feel the need to charge those fans for the luxury of enjoying it. Simple as that. It's what separates the honorable tapers (an oxymoron, I know) from the dishonorable ones. Once money exchanges hands, things turn to ****.

[dissention]

Originally Posted by SpyNote

As far as I can see, you basing a lot of your argument on what David said. That's hearsay, last time I checked.

Not at all. It's a known fact that he isn't much of a Stevie fan, unless things have changed since he started with those master reels. I was simply agreeing with David's assertion that Bill is in it for monetary purposes.

[seeker007nmss]

Originally Posted by dissention

I don't need to meet the guy in order to say that I find his selling of bootleg DVDs for $20 a pop to be downright ****ty and that his motives are monetary. If he was concerned about getting the stuff out there for fans to enjoy, as others have implied, he wouldn't feel the need to charge those fans for the luxury of enjoying it. Simple as that. It's what separates the honorable tapers (an oxymoron, I know) from the dishonorable ones. Once money exchanges hands, things turn to ****.

Diss, why do you care? If you don't like it - don't support it. Yes, he wants the cash. Who cares? There are alot of things I don't like out there, but they aren't going away anytime soon. There are people who sell crack on the streets. I don't like it, I don't buy it, nothing will stop it (Prohabition didn't work for alchohol - not going to work for drugs either). If someone wants to waste their cash on it... so be it. Bootleggers and copiers have been around forever, (The first printing presses and the copying of Church writs - comes to mind). Accept that these things are not going away anytime soon.