What's up with all the Sheryl Crow hating?

[gldstwmn]

Originally Posted by dissention

A lot of that first album is rather horrific in retrospect. She blew me away with her follow-up in '96. A Change, Every Day Is A Winding Road, Love Is A Good Thing, If It Makes You Happy, Sweet Rosalyn, Redemption Day, Home, Hard To Make A Stand, Oh Marie, etc. That sucker is jaw-droppingly good and still holds up. It's her masterpiece, imo, which says a lot because Globe Sessions is amazing.

Yes. They are both very, very good.

[lagringader&r]

Originally Posted by KarmaContestant

I just have to ask about this...

Ever since TISL was released, I have rarely heard anyone say anything complimentary about Miss Crow, as far as her work with Miss Nicks is concerned. No one has really ever given any reasons why they detest her work on TISL as much as they do. I see lots of snark....but nothing specific, or rather, nothing that can be considered factual or accurate.

Now, please understand, I am not a big fan of Miss Crow. I own none of her albums, 'cept the Live in Central Park one, which I bought purely for Stevie's performance of Gold Dust Woman. So I am not approaching this from the angle of the slighted Sheryl Crow fan....far from it.

I find it curious that so many people are always dissing the TISL versions of Candlebright, Sorcerer, in addition to If You Ever Did Believe. All three produced by Sheryl, and feature her guitar work and backing vocals. People say they cringe when they hear Sheryl's backing vocals. Why? Does she REALLY sound THAT horrible? Did she really do such an injustice to these songs?

I think all three are great. They sound more like Stevie's original demos than almost all of her other songs that she has ever released. Stevie seems pleased by this....so why is it so bad?

The only valid, honest excuse I have ever heard for the dislike of Sheryl's work on these songs is that 'they should have been done with Lindsey.' Usually, this opinion is expressed when discussing Sorcerer. However, I have to counter that with my own statement that Lindsey had 26 years to do these songs with Stevie. It never happened, and was never likely to happen anyway. So what's the problem with Sheryl working on them? Sheryl idolizes Stevie, and did some damn good work, keeping true to Stevie's originality.

I think the vocal on Sorcerer is incredible. Stevie sounds fresh and lively, and no other producer between 1979 and 2001 was able to coax that lovely falsetto out of Stevie....I'm referring to the high notes at the end of the lines in Sorcerer. Sheryl did it! And she seems universally despised for it, from one end of Stevie fandom, all the way to the other end...

Lastly, there's the song "It's Only Love". Alot of people dislike it for it's sappy lyrics....other people detest it because Sheryl wrote it. Is it really worse than any other songs that Stevie sang, yet which were written by someone else....like Cry Wolf....or Docklands?

The reason I'm starting this topic is not to criticize anyone's opinion of Sheryl. After all, you're entitled to it. I just want to understand the truth behind the intense dislike of Sheryl's involvement with TISL and the Practical Magic soundtrack. Someone, please explain it to me. Did she knock you down when crossing the street? Did she tip over your cradle when you were a baby? Did she say something about you that was hurtful, and untrue? Did she steal from you? And please don't offer reasons like "Sheryl sucks", because there really is no truth to that - except in your own mind. Her record sales and ever increasing popularity clearly render that argument invalid.

So what is it? Enlighten me....

Sorry, but I can't stand her. It has nothing to do with Lindsey-should-have-done-those-songs. I heard Soak Up The Sun today and was thinking about starting a thread about her. I know Stevie likes her and she's her little sister and all that, but she is no rockstar. She's pop and commercial all the way. Her videos are almost worse than her songs. Sorry if I'm offending, but she really is a little like nails down a chalkboard. Maybe I just don't like most sappy pop?

Not to say she doesn't have talent. She does. I just really don't like her.

[ShangriLaTroubl]

Originally Posted by lagringader&r

Sorry, but I can't stand her. It has nothing to do with Lindsey-should-have-done-those-songs. I heard Soak Up The Sun today and was thinking about starting a thread about her. I know Stevie likes her and she's her little sister and all that, but she is no rockstar. She's pop and commercial all the way. Her videos are almost worse than her songs. Sorry if I'm offending, but she really is a little like nails down a chalkboard. Maybe I just don't like most sappy pop?

Not to say she doesn't have talent. She does. I just really don't like her.

Many of her songs definetely are pop, but really no more pop than many of Fleetwood Mac's hit songs..if you dig down deep into Sheryl's albums, past the radio stuff you will find some really deep and intriquing songs there..much more than just pop fluff

Chris

[KarmaContestant]

Originally Posted by Kelly

I said her harmonies with Stevie on Sorcerer make me cringe...do you want me to respond? I am used to Sorcerer with Lindsey. I do not like Sheryl's voice WITH Stevie at all. Its just my opinion....Stevie sounds fantastic with Lindsey on Sorcerer and Candlebright and I do not like how it sounds with Sheryl Crow. It is my opinion and there is no "accurate or factual" basis for my opinion. I like "It's Only Love" and I think Sheryl is a cool chick with a great voice but I do not like that she had to sing harmony with her on Sorcerer...especially when I had to see it live. I like Sheryl, just not her voice blended with Stevie's. Sheryl may have inspired Stevie to use difference parts of her voice but other producers have done that as well including Jimmy Iovine. Lindsey also gives her more confidence vocally. I prefer Lindsey's production of most of Stevie's songs...I think he knows her musical soul better than anyone else ever could begin to understand and instinctually knows what to do with her stuff. Sheryl does not strike me as understanding Stevie the same way. Her stuff is too poppy and sappy for someone like Stevie. Lindsey might take some risks and do some weird ****, like the vocals on Illume or the EFO voices but he stays true to the essence of her songs better than Sheryl, IMH and useless opinion.

Well, Kelly, first of all, of course I wanted your response. I wouldn't have asked the questions I asked and presented them in the way I did if I didn't want your response, and the responses of others who detest Sheryl's work with Stevie. That was the whole point of this thread!

Second, I was mistaken to ask for 'accurate or factual' reasons, and you are not the only one who pointed this out to me - as there really is no such thing when it comes to opinions regarding art. My bad, I should know better.

Lastly, and again, this is directed at Kelly, I have to call you out on the 'useless opinion' remark. I didn't say that, and I never would. No one's opinion is useless, I was merely looking for something other than 'I hate Sheryl' or 'Sheryl sucks', and you rose to the challenge quite gracefully. Thank you for your response.

[EveryHour]

Originally Posted by dissention

And they're only two songs out of a catalog that spans almost fifteen years.

I know. Hence the rest of my post.

I was admittedly pleasantly surprised when I arrived at a Stones concert in '02 to find Sheryl opening the show. (She was not at my TISL shows.)

[EveryHour]

Originally Posted by Kelly

I do like how she loosened Stevie up onstage too. Don did the same thing.

I think it's safe to say that Stevie's most comfortable and at her very best when she's duetting/harmonizing. This is perhaps her #1 talent...I dare say above any others.

[EveryHour]

Originally Posted by gldstwmn

That song was more of a collaborative effort on the part of the "Tuesday Night Music Club." The lyrics are actually from a poem called Fun by Wyn Cooper.

Remind me to never buy a book by Wyn Cooper.

[darklinensuit]

Originally Posted by EveryHour

I think it's safe to say that Stevie's most comfortable and at her very best when she's duetting/harmonizing. This is perhaps her #1 talent...I dare say above any others.

She is amazing at that, but her songwriting is #1, IMO.

- Jake

[LiquidBlue5000]

Originally Posted by dissention

I don't, either. What in the world would she use Stevie for? She's already got a huge audience (including the youth audience) and sells millions more records.

Stevie has something that Ms. Crow will never ever have.. a loyal fanbase.. sure, she sells millions of records.. but Sheryl isn't selling out Madison Square Garden.. hell, she isnt even playing Madison Square Garden... There are people who buy records because they like the music and then there are true hardcore fans... I would suspect Sheryl was "using" Stevie to try to attract more of a loyal fanbase for herself... i don't see hundreds of websites dedicated to Ms. Crow, do you?? something must be missing there...

[Kelly]

Originally Posted by KarmaContestant

Well, Kelly, first of all, of course I wanted your response. I wouldn't have asked the questions I asked and presented them in the way I did if I didn't want your response, and the responses of others who detest Sheryl's work with Stevie. That was the whole point of this thread!

Second, I was mistaken to ask for 'accurate or factual' reasons, and you are not the only one who pointed this out to me - as there really is no such thing when it comes to opinions regarding art. My bad, I should know better.

Lastly, and again, this is directed at Kelly, I have to call you out on the 'useless opinion' remark. I didn't say that, and I never would. No one's opinion is useless, I was merely looking for something other than 'I hate Sheryl' or 'Sheryl sucks', and you rose to the challenge quite gracefully. Thank you for your response.

After reading back my posts, I realize I sound like a sarcastic bitch and that was not my intent. I actually did really try to explain why I dislike Stevie and Sheryl singing together. Luckily I think you understood that. Sorry.
BTW...I do LOVE Stevie and Sheryl on SYW..but LB is there too so...

[markolas]

The Sheryl haters can KMA

I love her. Was a fan of hers way before I really knew who Stevie was. I also liked Sheryl's work on TISL; adored it, in fact.

The '96 self-titled thing and C'mon C'mon are my favorite Sheryl albums. Unfortunately, I loaned C'mon C'mon to a friend and never got it back.

I can't wait for her new one.

[sparky]

Originally Posted by LiquidBlue5000

Stevie has something that Ms. Crow will never ever have.. a loyal fanbase.. sure, she sells millions of records.. but Sheryl isn't selling out Madison Square Garden.. hell, she isnt even playing Madison Square Garden... There are people who buy records because they like the music and then there are true hardcore fans... I would suspect Sheryl was "using" Stevie to try to attract more of a loyal fanbase for herself... i don't see hundreds of websites dedicated to Ms. Crow, do you?? something must be missing there...

What's missing ? Twenty more years in the business.

[Gypsy-Rhiannon]

Originally Posted by LiquidBlue5000

Stevie has something that Ms. Crow will never ever have.. a loyal fanbase.. sure, she sells millions of records.. but Sheryl isn't selling out Madison Square Garden.. hell, she isnt even playing Madison Square Garden... There are people who buy records because they like the music and then there are true hardcore fans... I would suspect Sheryl was "using" Stevie to try to attract more of a loyal fanbase for herself... i don't see hundreds of websites dedicated to Ms. Crow, do you?? something must be missing there...

I would suggest that the people who post over on Sheryl's forum consider themselves a very loyal fanbase. I have met some of them and believe me they are very dedicated to her. IMO Sheryl has no need to 'use' Stevie to attract a more loyal fanbase for herself. Sorry.. but I find that statement ridiculous! Since when is someones fan bases measured by websites anyway?

No Sheryl hating coming from me. She's brilliant IMO!

Pip

[LiquidBlue5000]

Originally Posted by Gypsy-Rhiannon

I would suggest that the people who post over on Sheryl's forum consider themselves a very loyal fanbase. I have met some of them and believe me they are very dedicated to her. IMO Sheryl has no need to 'use' Stevie to attract a more loyal fanbase for herself. Sorry.. but I find that statement ridiculous! Since when is someones fan bases measured by websites anyway?

it's not.. but when an artist can sell out most average size venues when they are not promoting a single thing and after not having a hit record in 20 years, i would venture to say their fanbase is pretty dedicated and loyal

Again, there is a distinct difference between the people who buy the records and the true dedicated fans... if Sheryl Crow had the fanbase that equalled the amount of records she sells, she would be playing 3 nights at MSG every single tour.. the fact is, that doesn't happen... Sheryl Crow could sell about the same amount of tickets to her shows in 2005 as Stevie could.. perhaps not even as many... so, for Stevie, who some believe to be a guy, and hasn't had a hit record for 20 years, to be able to sell out a venue the way Ms Crow can who is always on the charts and sells millions of records, something is wrong there... It means the people who buy Shery'ls records don't even care enough to see her Live...

heck.. probably half the people who see Stevie Live don't even have half her albums... it still does not stop the dedicated and loyal fans for continuing to go to her shows time and time again..

[Gypsy-Rhiannon]

Originally Posted by LiquidBlue5000

it's not.. but when an artist can sell out most average size venues when they are not promoting a single thing and after not having a hit record in 20 years, i would venture to say their fanbase is pretty dedicated and loyal

Oh I would agree....

Again, there is a distinct difference between the people who buy the records and the true dedicated fans... if Sheryl Crow had the fanbase that equalled the amount of records she sells, she would be playing 3 nights at MSG every single tour.. the fact is, that doesn't happen... Sheryl Crow could sell about the same amount of tickets to her shows in 2005 as Stevie could.. perhaps not even as many... so, for Stevie, who some believe to be a guy, and hasn't had a hit record for 20 years, to be able to sell out a venue the way Ms Crow can who is always on the charts and sells millions of records, something is wrong there... It means the people her buy Shery'ls records don't even care enough to see her Live...

I still don't see how you can say that Sheryl doesn't have a loyal and dedicated fan base. I'm sure the many fans over on her site who raise thousands of pounds every year for the Delta Childrens home in honour of Sheryl birthday consider themsekves very loyal and dedicated.

heck.. probably half the people who see Stevie Live don't even have half her albums... it still does not stop the dedicated and loyal fans for continuing to go to her shows time and time again..

Sheryl also has fans who follow here around show after show. I still stand by what I said that I don't see that she has any reason to 'use' Stevie to gain more dedicated fans

Pip