Should "I'm So Afraid" be Kerry's campaign song?

[CarneVaca]

Originally Posted by dontlookdown

Yuck. Sounds like Carne Vaca has swallowed what Bush has spoon-fed half of the nation.

I don't think Kerry has a thing to worry about. Even if he isn't elected, he has a lifelong career of respected public service to be proud of.

Yuck. Sounds like you don't know what you're talking about. You might learn a thing or two if you did a bit of reading up on the candidates rather than coming here and trying to push your Kerry views with tenuous links between the band and your candidate.

I don't get spoon-fed by the Bushers. If you think that you haven't been paying attention.

I don't get spoon-fed by the Democrats either. Can you say the same?

[dissention]

Originally Posted by t.c.

There's an old saying: "If you aren't a democrat in your 20's, you have no heart. If you're not a republican in your 40's, you have no brain." If you don't just look at that quote at it's face value, but what it's really saying, you see that each party has some very strong points to it. And each part lacks some other essential key components. So we can't ever win, and can't ever have it all. Unfortunately.

Yeah, and if you can tell us what the Republican party has for strong points, I'll buy you a soda. The Republicans of today can't even be called true conservatives because true conservatives blush when they see what this abomination of an administration is doing.

If you aren't a liberal, you have no heart and are just out for yourself. Plain and simple.

[CarneVaca]

[QUOTE=t.c.]

Originally Posted by dontlookdown

I've never had one single liberal talk decent to me (and I'm not even a republican - I am sort of middle of the road, independent). I'm sick of the insults myself. If you want to make a difference, post sources from facts that back up your party and your opinions. That works better than just insulting someone and inferring they have no brain and don't know who to think for themselves.

T.C., good for you for speaking up. Dontlookdown seems so out of touch that he doesn't even realize I am one of the most liberal members of this community. I am so liberal that I've had to drop out of the Democratic Party.

Your point is a good one. On either side of the spectrum, people become blinded by the dogma they are fed and too often refuse to research matters for themselves and reach their own conclusions. In 1995-96, I realized I could not longer be partisan when I saw the Bill Clinton debacle and concluded that both sides were full of dog doo. Hypocrisy reigns supreme.

So in the spirit of the original intent of this threat, may I offer a suggestion as a theme song for us independents directed at both parties:

"Go Your Own Way"

Or perhaps even more appropriate:

"Red Rover"

We've come, we've come, we've come to take you over

[CarneVaca]

Originally Posted by dissention

If you aren't a liberal, you have no heart and are just out for yourself. Plain and simple.

Hold on there. I don't even believe that. Come on. Conservatism didn't have to have the adjective "compassionate" attached to it for it to represent some decent, compassionate views.

Just as "liberal" has been corrupted, so has "conservative."

Besides what passes for liberal these days -- Kerry and Edwards!!?? -- makes me laugh.

And if you think that a lot of so-called liberals aren't out for themselves either, you should go take a look at what happened to a lot of those 60s and 70s hippies.

[dissention]

Originally Posted by CarneVaca

Besides what passes for liberal these days -- Kerry and Edwards!!?? -- makes me laugh.

You know how I feel about the Kerry ticket, Carne. Wasn't it just a few days ago that I openly said that Kerry will be quite lucky if he gets my vote? Cobb looks better and better each day.

The Kerry ticket doesn't pass for liberal to people like you and I these days, but they do to people in middle America and the South. Kerry's voting record for the past four years reads like Bill Frist's. His attempts to distance himself from the lefties that gave him his career leaves an awful taste in my mouth, just as his inability to construct a point of view does. He's betraying the liberals of this country, there's no way to pussyfoot around it. A spade is a spade.*

Liberals are people like us, not people who will pander to every kind of person to get into office.

As for what I said about conservatives having no heart, I stand by it. No, I don't think that they are consciously heartless, I honestly believe that the majority of conservatives out there have their heart in the right place...no matter how ill-conceived and mean-spirited their policies and beliefs are. I don't believe that they see their beliefs as being heartless, they believe that they're doing good by their country. My comment was simply what I believe to be naive heartlessness on their part. Unfortunately, the same cannot be said for the conservative Republicans holding office at the present moment. They know that what they're passing and proposing is filth, but they go ahead with it anyways.

*But he's still better than Bush, no matter how miniscule the margin.

[larg]

I'm an 18 year old conservative... what can I say, I've read Brave New World. But I like to think that I have a heart... Sure, I believe a woman DOESN'T have the right to terminate a pregnancy, and many say that makes me heartless. Or that because the Taliban attacked our country and KILLED some of MY LOVED ONES and I wanted revenge on them, that I am heartless. Or that I wanted to see Hussein taken out of power because he was a merciless killer and oppressor, I am heartless. And because at only 18 years old and trying desperately just to pay my way through college and I don't agree with having money taken out of my hard-earned pay check to pay for a man in New York who is too damn lazy to get a job, I am heartless.

Well, maybe you idiots out there who are too ignorant to think before you call someone like me heartless ought to rethink some of YOUR views. YOU are not heartless, you are brainless.

Adam R.

[CarneVaca]

The following things don't make you heartless. Misguided, perhaps, but not heartless:

Originally Posted by larg

I'm an 18 year old conservative... what can I say, I've read Brave New World. But I like to think that I have a heart... Sure, I believe a woman DOESN'T have the right to terminate a pregnancy, and many say that makes me heartless. Or that because the Taliban attacked our country and KILLED some of MY LOVED ONES and I wanted revenge on them, that I am heartless. Or that I wanted to see Hussein taken out of power because he was a merciless killer and oppressor, I am heartless.

This, however, comes close:

And because at only 18 years old and trying desperately just to pay my way through college and I don't agree with having money taken out of my hard-earned pay check to pay for a man in New York who is too damn lazy to get a job, I am heartless.

Check your anger, young man. Get off your ass and go find out exactly how much of this hard-earned money trickles down to that lazy bum you're talking about. How will you feel when you figure out that far more of that money goes to corporations than the needy, the abandoned and the sick?

[dissention]

Originally Posted by larg

I'm an 18 year old conservative... what can I say, I've read Brave New World. But I like to think that I have a heart... Sure, I believe a woman DOESN'T have the right to terminate a pregnancy, and many say that makes me heartless. Or that because the Taliban attacked our country and KILLED some of MY LOVED ONES and I wanted revenge on them, that I am heartless. Or that I wanted to see Hussein taken out of power because he was a merciless killer and oppressor, I am heartless.

To endorse an illegal war knowing that thousands of inncoent men, women, and children are going to be maimed and murdered is as heartless as anyone can get. Iraq never attacked us. Iraq cooperated with UN inspections and gave the inspectors free reign over the country in the many months leading up to the war. Bush illegally stole funds from the Afghanistan debacle to draft a war plan for Iraq, behind the backs of Congress. Iraq had no WMDs, something that Hans Blix had been saying before the war. We gave Iraq their weapons, AFTER he had gassed his own people. After he gassed the Kurds, we reestablished all dimplomatic relations with Hussein less than a year later.

If you want to get more in depth, why don't you ask why it took more than a full two months to invade Afghanistan after September 11th? That's why we haven't found bin-Laden or broken up al-Qaeda, because we gave them a two month running start. What has happened to al-Qaeda after September 11th? Nothing. They're more powerful than ever, boasting a shocking 800,000 members, MOST OF WHICH WERE RECRUITED IN IRAQ AFTER SADDAM WAS TOPPLED.

As for abortion, you should have no say in the matter, you're a man.

Originally Posted by larg

And because at only 18 years old and trying desperately just to pay my way through college and I don't agree with having money taken out of my hard-earned pay check to pay for a man in New York who is too damn lazy to get a job, I am heartless.

If you think that's how the welfare system works, you're sadly misinformed and should include yourself in the "ignorant" category. I suspect that you really have no clue how your tax dollars are being appropriated, but I'll let that slide because you're only 18 and have a lot of learning to do. Personally, I'm barely able to sleep at night knowing that my tax dollars are being used by a hearltess president who wants to write hate into the Constitution, who likes to attack other countries without provocation, and who LIES to the American people about that very war. Look at the deficit, it's shockingly high and it makes no difference how up the economy is at this point, the deficit could take it down to its knees. Bush has spent billions in Iraq and our soldiers don't even have the proper body armor, they're wearing Vietnam-era flak jackets!

Originally Posted by larg

Well, maybe you idiots out there who are too ignorant to think before you call someone like me heartless ought to rethink some of YOUR views. YOU are not heartless, you are brainless.

Adam R.

People in glass houses should not throw stones. Find out how the welfare system works and then we'll talk.

[dissention]

Originally Posted by CarneVaca

Check your anger, young man. Get off your ass and go find out exactly how much of this hard-earned money trickles down to that lazy bum you're talking about. How will you feel when you figure out that far more of that money goes to corporations than the needy, the abandoned and the sick?

He'll probably say he feels the same, just to spite you.

That's how conservatism works, my dear.

[shackin'up]

Hey!

What about Even A Dog Can Shake Hands by Warren Zevon?????

[stefan]

Originally Posted by dissention

You know how I feel about the Kerry ticket, Carne. Wasn't it just a few days ago that I openly said that Kerry will be quite lucky if he gets my vote? Cobb looks better and better each day.

I'd like to add something to this topic. Every voice not going to Kerry goes to Bush. If he is re-elected, then probably because of that. No third one except of Bush and Kerry will get enough votes- every other vote is like thrown in the toilet- no matter how good the intentions may be.
As incredible as it seems that someone may consider to vote for that presidential caricature again- I`m willing to bet that he wins a second time and some postings here on the Ledge now and in the past back that impression up.
I don`t think that anyone who votes for a third candidate can later complain about the caricature and any of his actions because his voice would be part of the re-election even if it's meant in a totally different way.

[shackin'up]

Originally Posted by stefan

I'd like to add something to this topic. Every voice not going to Kerry goes to Bush. If he is re-elected, then probably because of that. No third one except of Bush and Kerry will get enough votes- every other vote is like thrown in the toilet- no matter how good the intentions may be.
As incredible as it seems that someone may consider to vote for that presidential caricature again- I`m willing to bet that he wins a second time and some postings here on the Ledge now and in the past back that impression up.
I don`t think that anyone who votes for a third candidate can later complain about the caricature and any of his actions because his voice would be part of the re-election even if it's meant in a totally different way.

Thank you for saying what I'm refusing to say in this thread. What do you think about:

Even A Dog Can Shake Hands by Warren Zevon????

[dissention]

Originally Posted by shackin'up

Hey!

What about Even A Dog Can Shake Hands by Warren Zevon?????

That's Bush, darling!

[stefan]

Originally Posted by shackin'up

Thank you for saying what I'm refusing to say in this thread. What do you think about:

Even A Dog Can Shake Hands by Warren Zevon????

Yeah. Or what about "On the wrong side" for the supporters of the caricature?

[shackin'up]

Originally Posted by dissention

That's Bush, darling!

No. That's Poor, Poor, Pityful Me.