Former President Ronald Reagan Dies at 93 - Page 2

gldstwmn · #16 06-06-2004, 01:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lux

Just curious......do we have to be polite and send condolences if we hated someone? It seems that everyone goes in the good books when they die. Perhaps it's because I'm not American so I have no grounds on which to appreciate him on any level. He and Iron Lady scare me.

So what does a state funeral in the US consist of? I can only relate to the Windsors marching off to Westminster Abbey, but for some strange reason I don't imagine that's what this one will consist of.

I don't know exactly what it will be like. They're all different. I imagine a lot of 21 gun salutes...etc. I read somewhere that Reagan is to be interred in CA and not at Arlington. This is curious to me.
If we wish to discuss the Reagan era, it might be appropriate to start an "I came to bury Caesar not to praise him" thread seperately and leave this one for the condolences.

dissention · #17 06-06-2004, 03:41 PM

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Originally Posted by DeeGeMe

Yeah, but Nancy thought she was an Emperoress!

Yeah, how else could she get a gig on Diff'rent Strokes?

strandinthewind · #18 06-06-2004, 05:56 PM

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Originally Posted by sodascouts

As I said in the deathbed thread, I am very saddened by the loss and his family are in my prayers.

I agree, Jason. If one feels they must use the death of a man as a golden opportunity to express their hatred of him, then the least they could do is start their own thread.

I was going to say that, but then I did not start this thread and the title of this thread does not say it is an in memoriam kind of thing. But, Goldie started one, so I guess it will go there and this will be the "in memoriam thread." BTW - ITA with Goldie that it is appropriate to discuss at any time anyone's legacy dead or alive. I was just unsure of the intent of this particular thread, etc.

greatdarkwing · #19 06-08-2004, 12:27 AM

C'mon people.....He cleaned up the mess Jimmy Carter made as President (a big one at that...c'mon, who sells the Panama canal!?) and helped the economy double in size.

Now, I happen to think he was a great man and a great human being (I hope this doesnt come as a shock to anyone, LOL). My deepest thoughts and prayers go out to Nancy (She loved him so much and was there every step of the way for him).

~Alex

My two conservative cents

dissention · #20 06-08-2004, 09:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by greatdarkwing

C'mon people.....He cleaned up the mess Jimmy Carter made as President (a big one at that...c'mon, who sells the Panama canal!?) and helped the economy double in size.

That's myth, not fact.

Reagan instigated trickle-down economics. Within the first year of the policy, we were in a depression caused by the policy. The 27% cut was slewed two to one in favor of those making over $200,000 per year, in percentages, and far more in real dollars. By the end of the second year, increases in state and local taxes more than made up for the cut for the middle class. Then Reagan increased the Social Security tax, doubling effective tax on the middle income, and widening the disparity.

Wages throughout Reagan/Bush remained negative in real dollars for the next 12 years, the longest and worst growth performance in middle class wages in US history. Average national growth was the lowest since the early 30s. Trickle down is proven to be the worst economic idea is US history when the squeeze on savings and the drain on investment capital force another recession in 1990.

He increased the defense budget to 240% previous levels, bankrupting the national treasury in the face of trickle-down.

He deregulated Banking and Credit Bureaus, leading to the 800 billion dollar bailout of the early 90s when the results of that deregulation forced the middle class to pay off rich folk for cheating us.

He broke labor unions by striking at the Air Traffic Controllers, leading to massive safety shortfalls in the air industry, and more importantly, a slow erosion of US worker wages and benefits.

And it's because of him that Shrub implemented these awful f*cking tax cuts.

gldstwmn · #21 06-08-2004, 10:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by greatdarkwing

C'mon people.....He cleaned up the mess Jimmy Carter made as President (a big one at that...c'mon, who sells the Panama canal!?) and helped the economy double in size.

My two conservative cents

Um, Carter literally inherited the mess of Nixon/Ford. Ford did the best he could IMO, with what was left to him. I think it would have been much more disastrous if Nixon hadn't been pardoned.
The Panama Canal Treaty was one of Carter's crowning achievements. President Carter was awarded the Nobel Peace Prize in 2002. I believe he was the only president to have even been bestowed such an honor

strandinthewind · #22 06-08-2004, 10:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gldstwmn

Um, Carter literally inherited the mess of Nixon/Ford. Ford did the best he could IMO, with what was left to him. I think it would have been much more disastrous if Nixon hadn't been pardoned.
The Panama Canal Treaty was one of Carter's crowning achievements. President Carter was awarded the Nobel Peace Prize in 2002. I believe he was the only president to have even been bestowed such an honor

Yea, but alot of that was from the Vietnam War (which although it had been brewing for a long time, started with a Democrat mind you

http://www.vietnam-war.info/timeline/ ) and Carter did not do anything significant to remedy it

And, mind you I really liked Jimmy Carter - I thought he had more integrity than any President EVER. The problem was and is (see Dissention here I am being cynical

) - it is impossible to make it in politics without being a two faced jerk and I hate that - but it is the unfortunate and awful truth. I mean name one President other than Carter that was not. I cannot think of any

dissention · #23 06-08-2004, 10:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by strandinthewind

Yea, but alot of that was from the Vietnam War (which although it had been brewing for a long time, started with a Democrat mind you

http://www.vietnam-war.info/timeline/ ) and Carter did not do anything significant to remedy it

And, mind you I really liked Jimmy Carter - I thought he had more integrity than any President EVER. The problem was and is (see Dissention here I am being cynical

) - it is impossible to make it in politics without being a two faced jerk and I hate that - but it is the unfortunate and awful truth. I mean name one President other than Carter that was not. I cannot think of any

No you didn't!

Don't forget that the Democrats HATED Lyndon B. Johnson with a passion. The reason he didn't run for reelection was because they told him they would not support him as the nominee.

AND - Vietnam had been brewing for years, even before Kennedy took office.

strandinthewind · #24 06-08-2004, 10:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dissention

No you didn't!

Don't forget that the Democrats HATED Lyndon B. Johnson with a passion. The reason he didn't run for reelection was because they told him they would not support him as the nominee.

AND - Vietnam had been brewing for years, even before Kennedy took office.

I know - the French made a mess of that one that we had to clean up. But, the fact is Johnson, who they elected with Kennedy, was the one who sent them in. As with W, the buck stops with the Pres. - I am so glad I got to make that analogy

dissention · #25 06-08-2004, 11:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by strandinthewind

I know - the French made a mess of that one that we had to clean up. But, the fact is Johnson, who they elected with Kennedy, was the one who sent them in. As with W, the buck stops with the Pres. - I am so glad I got to make that analogy

And I totally agree. For want of a better phrase, Johnson was a wet fart of a human turd.

strandinthewind · #26 06-08-2004, 11:08 AM

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Originally Posted by dissention

And I totally agree. For want of a better phrase, Johnson was a wet fart of a human turd.

Arguably the biggest crook ever in the WH, and that is a high place amongst many!!!!!!

dissention · #27 06-08-2004, 11:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by strandinthewind

Arguably the biggest crook ever in the WH, and that is a high place amongst many!!!!!!

Ugh, and we were on a roll, too.

You just force me to bring Shrub into everything, eh? He's the biggest crook, man.

gldstwmn · #28 06-08-2004, 11:39 AM

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Originally Posted by dissention

And I totally agree. For want of a better phrase, Johnson was a wet fart of a human turd.

Before we start the ragfest on LBJ, let's not forget that he did carry through and sign the Civil Rights Act of 1964.

dissention · #29 06-08-2004, 11:55 AM

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Originally Posted by gldstwmn

Before we start the ragfest on LBJ, let's not forget that he did carry through and sign the Civil Rights Act of 1964.

I'm primarily talking about his Vietnam policies. They were horrific and the way he lied to the people (i.e. Gulf of Tonkin) and stubbornly refused to leave Vietnam made him a real **** in my book. The man was all ego.

gldstwmn · #30 06-08-2004, 11:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dissention

I'm primarily talking about his Vietnam policies. They were horrific and the way he lied to the people (i.e. Gulf of Tonkin) and stubbornly refused to leave Vietnam made him a real **** in my book. The man was all ego.

You know you'll get no argument from me on that. With respect to the Strand's comment on the economy under Johnson, the "guns and butter' economy worked pretty well.