Trouble in Shangri-La better than IYD and 24KG?

[sorcerer999]

Originally Posted by PenguinHead

Street Angel - Uranus

...because it's such a stinker?

And I would have placed "Wild Heart" as Venus...since it's basically the "love and romance" record. Just my opinion, though. These are all great!

[PenguinHead]

Originally Posted by sorcerer999

...because it's such a stinker?

And I would have placed "Wild Heart" as Venus...since it's basically the "love and romance" record. Just my opinion, though. These are all great!

You're right. The Other Side of the Mirror should be Neptune.

I like Street Angel, but Uranus just felt right!

[The Juggler]

I think Nasal In Shangri-La is her worst album, apart from Street Angel.
It can be divided into two - excellent and awful:

Excellent
Trouble In Shangri-La
Candlebright
Sorcerer
Planets
Bombay Sapphires
Fall From Grace
Love Is

Awful
All the rest of the songs

There's no other album with such a clear divide. Apart from the material, Stevie's voice is really rough and bland on most of the tracks - the only vocal variation we get is the falsetto notes in Sorcerer, apart from that it's the same rough, forced voice throughout.

Also I find the production a bit bland - there's nothing wrong with it, but at the same time there's nothing that stands out - it's a plateau of middling production with no personality. I wish Dave Stewart had produced the album, because even the great songs suffer a bit from this bland production.

Dave knows how to produce Stevie's material, with the right amount of light and shade, and you can clearly see in the documentary they worked hard to get the right sound of the In Your Dreams album - it's modern but also very boho and funky in some parts. TISL has the same pop and drums production in every song even though there was a multitude of producers.

So yes, you can clearly see I disagree with the OP - I think IYD and 24 Karat Gold are far superior albums and are my favourites outside of The Wild Heart and Bella Donna. 24KG in particular has such a smooth and beautiful production, and all the songs are top notch (apart from Hard Advice and I Don't Care which is far too long).

[AnthonyMI]

I think TISL had a very good start. The initial Sheryl Crow produced cuts had promise.

Imagine if she had not given Practical Magic two songs. Then If You Ever Did Believe and Crystal may have been on TISL.

If you Ever Did Believe
Crystal
Nomad/Candlebright
Sorcerer
Its Only Love
Fall From Grace



These were my favorites and with the addition of I Miss You I think make a damn near perfect album. I think she was trying too hard to have a Santana rebound like the one he had a year or two earlier. She did not need all that production.

Add in the extended uncut version of Love IS and i think 8 or 9 tracks would have been perfect for a "come back" album. Sometimes MORE is NOT better.

After these songs the vocals got worse with each producer she added. Too Far from Texas is horrid, Planets is so overproduced and dated I can hardly listen to it. My Heart had some good parts, but those certain notes just kill it.

Anyhow, hindsight is 20/20! And the nice thing about iTunes is I can make a custom Playlist and redo TISL to my own taste, include those tracks from Practical Magic, cut the ones I loathe (no Prixsie Fricks or Donald Duck sounding Macy Grey thanks!!)

IN You Dreams had moments of overproductions, but at LEAST, it had ONE producer and not the 5 or so from TISL. IT had a cohesive "sound" and her voice did not change from one song to the next. I think TISL was recorded over a three year period? And I think it was the period her voice went through the biggest chances since the mid 80's. SO it was jarring.

[AnthonyMI]

Originally Posted by PenguinHead

I like all her albums for their unique and distinct atmosphere. Each is a planet in Stevie's universe.

Bella Donna - Sun
Wild Heart - Neptune
Rock a Little - Mars
The Other Side of the Mirror -Venus
Street Angel - Uranus
Trouble in Shangria - Saturn
In Your Dreams - Jupiter
24 Karat Gold - Earth

That would make Soundstage Sessions "Pluto". A planet, but not reaaaaally a Planet.

[KarmaContestant]

Originally Posted by PenguinHead

I like all her albums for their unique and distinct atmosphere. Each is a planet in Stevie's universe.
Wild Heart - Neptune
The Other Side of the Mirror -Venus

Interesting. I'd flip these. Venus is, after all, the planet of love, beauty, desire and relationships. All of the things that are attractive to us, by scent, sight, touch and feeling. The Wild Heart is Stevie's self-professed album about love, sex, and relationships.

Traditionally, Neptune rules over mental disorders, psychic abilities, addictions and escapism. Illusions and spirits are the domain of Neptune. Sound like The Other Side of the Mirror?

[markolas]

I haven't listened to TISL in its entirety in a very long time. I hate to badmouth it too much because I really loved it at the time of its release, but my gut feeling is that, no, it is not better than IYD or 24k. At all.

I would say that I really like the first five songs on it (I know people here hate Every Day, but I've always liked it), but it falls apart in the middle. IYD and 24k both hold up all the way through, despite them both having 1 or 2 songs I don't care for.

[sorcerer999]

I think most of us hardcore fans start out REALLY enjoying her solo records when they first come out, but then after 6 months to a year, we get bored...start getting hyper critical, we pick out our staple favorites, our guilty pleasures, and tear down the rest.

It was easy to be hyper critical of 24KG from the get go, due to the fact that only 3 years had passed since her last solo record, whereas it had been 8 years in between SA and TISL, and a decade between TISL and IYD. It was easy to be forgiving (and even unintentionally have blinders on) whenever these two albums were released. We were all starved for new Stevie music. I remember thinking, "Yeah, That Made Me Stronger kind of has cheesy lyrics, but I guess the Sitar-esque guitar groove is pretty cool." or "I suppose the sentiment of Cheaper Than Free is sweet, so..."

Yeah, I can't stand those songs now.

[twinmatrix]

TISL is my favorite Stevie album, and one of my favorite albums of all time. Every single track on TISL is a 5/5 to me, except Sorcerer.

TISL > IYD > 24k

Originally Posted by sorcerer999

I think most of us hardcore fans start out REALLY enjoying her solo records when they first come out, but then after 6 months to a year, we get bored...start getting hyper critical, we pick out our staple favorites, our guilty pleasures, and tear down the rest.

It was easy to be hyper critical of 24KG from the get go, due to the fact that only 3 years had passed since her last solo record, whereas it had been 8 years in between SA and TISL, and a decade between TISL and IYD. It was easy to be forgiving (and even unintentionally have blinders on) whenever these two albums were released. We were all starved for new Stevie music. I remember thinking, "Yeah, That Made Me Stronger kind of has cheesy lyrics, but I guess the Sitar-esque guitar groove is pretty cool." or "I suppose the sentiment of Cheaper Than Free is sweet, so..."

Yeah, I can't stand those songs now.

I find the lyrics of That Made Me Stronger very empowering, haha.

[bombaysaffires]

Originally Posted by AnthonyMI

IN You Dreams had moments of overproductions, but at LEAST, it had ONE producer and not the 5 or so from TISL. IT had a cohesive "sound" and her voice did not change from one song to the next. I think TISL was recorded over a three year period? And I think it was the period her voice went through the biggest chances since the mid 80's. SO it was jarring.

really?? The production quality of her vocals on 24k is shameful. The cuts from one take to another are pasted together so blatantly obviously, it's like a five year old did them. You can hear complete differences in quality-- some she sounds all muffled and slurry and spitty and other parts her vocals are crisp and even a bit tinny. Frankenstein vocals made up of pieces from here and there stitched very badly together.

Dave should be shot for the sh&tty editing and production. Sounds cheaply slapped together.

[pauls90]

Originally Posted by bombaysaffires

really?? The production quality of her vocals on 24k is shameful. The cuts from one take to another are pasted together so blatantly obviously, it's like a five year old did them. You can hear complete differences in quality-- some she sounds all muffled and slurry and spitty and other parts her vocals are crisp and even a bit tinny. Frankenstein vocals made up of pieces from here and there stitched very badly together.

Dave should be shot for the sh&tty editing and production. Sounds cheaply slapped together.

I agree. The production was flat and the mixing poor on 24KG.

I personally love Shangri-La. It contains her best lyrics since TWH.

[MoonSister75]

Thumbs up for TISL from me. Whether it is better than her other recent albums, I don't really know.... But out of all her albums, it's the one I enjoy listening to the most, along with Bella Donna. It just has a certain sparkle to it

[Neal]

To these layman's ears, 24KG sounds criminally under produced. With the exceptions of the title track, "Belle Fleur", and the stunning "ATBW", every song sounded superior in its original demo form. I'm sure the truncated time frame played a part, but Dave did a much better job on IYD.

Despite some nasally vocals, TISL is on par with IYD, in my humble opinion.

[sorcerer999]

Originally Posted by Neal

To these layman's ears, 24KG sounds criminally under produced. I'm sure the truncated time frame played a part, but Dave did a much better job on IYD.

Originally Posted by bombaysaffires

really?? The production quality of her vocals on 24k is shameful. The cuts from one take to another are pasted together so blatantly obviously, it's like a five year old did them. You can hear complete differences in quality-- some she sounds all muffled and slurry and spitty and other parts her vocals are crisp and even a bit tinny. Frankenstein vocals made up of pieces from here and there stitched very badly together.

I guess it's just a matter of perspective. Different strokes for different folks and what have you. I happen to relish the fact that 24KG is under produced. It was a welcomed change from the last two albums. Yes there are differences in crispness on different verses on certain songs, likely due to microphones and one take being recorded in Nashville and another take re-recorded in L.A. I can only really hear this on Mabel Normand and Watch Chain...but unless you are truly listening for those sorts of things, it's not blatantly obvious. And even after it was pointed out to me, it still did not affect my enjoyment of the songs.

I love the sparse instrumentation. I love that you can still hear a guitar reverb echo at the end of IYWML, as well as someone talking in the background at the end of Starshine (you need headphones and the volume way up to hear that one)...and of course the clapping at the end of Lady. It's like guerilla filmmaking. They were in a time crunch. The record, while still showcasing these "tiny" foibles and "mistakes", if you will, is still mixed and mastered extremely well. It all goes back to that time crunch - they didn't have time to give the songs to someone like Chris Lord-Alge to work on for 6 weeks. So they did it themselves, and I think they did a great job.

Originally Posted by MoonSister75

Thumbs up for TISL from me. But out of all her albums, it's the one I enjoy listening to the most, along with Bella Donna. It just has a certain sparkle to it

Now, I will agree with you there. Despite only really enjoying half of the songs, it really does have it's own certain "sound", or "SPARKLE" as you say. Somehow Crow, Shanks and that other guy (can't remember his name) managed to keep a cohesion (or predominant sound or magic) that runs like a thread through the entire record, so I'll give them that. Crow's "Sorcerer" effortlessly blends into Shank's "Planets" with such fluidity.

[wheart]

Originally Posted by sorcerer999

I think most of us hardcore fans start out REALLY enjoying her solo records when they first come out, but then after 6 months to a year, we get bored...start getting hyper critical, we pick out our staple favorites, our guilty pleasures, and tear down the rest.

It was easy to be hyper critical of 24KG from the get go, due to the fact that only 3 years had passed since her last solo record, whereas it had been 8 years in between SA and TISL, and a decade between TISL and IYD. It was easy to be forgiving (and even unintentionally have blinders on) whenever these two albums were released. We were all starved for new Stevie music. I remember thinking, "Yeah, That Made Me Stronger kind of has cheesy lyrics, but I guess the Sitar-esque guitar groove is pretty cool." or "I suppose the sentiment of Cheaper Than Free is sweet, so..."

Yeah, I can't stand those songs now.

maybe YOU got bored after 6 months but don't speak for the rest of us. While I like some of Stevie's solo work more than others, I've never grown BORED with any of them.