Christine: spring 2015 - UK leg & album release

[elle]

wow - thanks so much Nicole! so much easier to discuss using this than that pdf (that so many stated they couldn't even read for some reason?)!

Originally Posted by nicole21290

For many years, Fleetwood Mac fans have wanted to hear a song co-written by Christine and Stevie or even a duet between the two grand dames. Unfortunately that wish may remain unfulfilled.

"Stevie and I have tried to co-write but I found it a difficult process with Stevie. Lindsey was always her interpreter in terms of the fact that he has obviously, you know, a very deep understanding of what her thoughts are in the songwriting department. I can't interpret her as well as he does. The truth of the matter is that we won't stop trying. I'm going to give it another go because she is such a great talent."

this statement is interesting and somewhat puzzling, at least to me. Christine says she is having trouble co-writing with Stevie and goes on to describe how Lindsey never had trouble with that. what does this mean? as far as we know there are no Stevie/Lindsey co-written songs other than Frozen Love. he has only been mentioned as a producer and arranger, for both Stevie's and Christine's songs.

also, it sounds like SN and CM tried (recently?) to co-write a song, in one of the several ways: Stevie started a song, Christine tried to add on to it to make it a complete song, and either didn't see where to go with it, or if she did, Stevie didn't like the result.

[michelej1]

Originally Posted by elle

this statement is interesting and somewhat puzzling, at least to me. Christine says she is having trouble co-writing with Stevie and goes on to describe how Lindsey never had trouble with that. what does this mean? as far as we know there are no Stevie/Lindsey co-written songs other than Frozen Love. he has only been mentioned as a producer and arranger, for both Stevie's and Christine's songs.

also, it sounds like SN and CM tried (recently?) to co-write a song, in one of the several ways: Stevie started a song, Christine tried to add on to it to make it a complete song, and either didn't see where to go with it, or if she did, Stevie didn't like the result.

I doubt that Christine means that Lindsey actually co-wrote with Stevie. I think Christine is referring to collaborations, Gypsy, Dreams, etc. Those are co-writes in Christine's mind.

Michele

[louielouie2000]

Originally Posted by michelej1

I doubt that Christine means that Lindsey actually co-wrote with Stevie. I think Christine is referring to collaborations, Gypsy, Dreams, etc. Those are co-writes in Christine's mind.

How would you define the difference between a song that was a collaboration vs one that was cowritten? The distinction has baffled me ever since Stevie started touting Dave Stewart as the first person she'd ever written a song with.

[michelej1]

Originally Posted by louielouie2000

How would you define the difference between a song that was a collaboration vs one that was cowritten? The distinction has baffled me ever since Stevie started touting Dave Stewart as the first person she'd ever written a song with.

Well, Stevie never said to Lindsey, "here are some words, can you put music to them" or "here is a melody, can you give it some lyrics [not that she thinks Lindsey is capable of writing lyrics]." So, she hasn't written with Lindsey in that sense. She has given him demos with a melody and words and he has arranged underneath it.

As for Dave, I think Stevie never noodled together with anyone. Obviously, she has had co-writers, but she never sat down and sang a line and had the other person scratch his head, play with it a bit and come back with the rest of her line. I think she never experienced that before and that's what she means about Lennon/McCartney.

Michele

[bethelblues]

Originally Posted by James89

I want to see all of these songs in their setlist!!!

Me too! Love her contributions to Tango in the Night. If both Isn't It Midnight and Little Lies are in the set, I'm there. Not that I wouldn't go anyway, but I would be so much more excited. For that matter, it'd be even more amazing if I were there and one (or more) of those songs came on and take me by surprise.

I called Oh Daddy. I figured Christine would want to do it based on another interview. It'll be in the setlist. So then with YMLF, SYLM, Songbird, Don't Stop, and Brown Eyes...maybe Over My Head. I hope there's room for at least one from Tango plus Hold Me or Love In Store. Unfortunately, I'm thinking Think About Me is out, as is the chance of doing oldie Why.

[elle]

Originally Posted by louielouie2000

How would you define the difference between a song that was a collaboration vs one that was cowritten? The distinction has baffled me ever since Stevie started touting Dave Stewart as the first person she'd ever written a song with.

right? and if a collaboration, would all collaborators receive songwriting credits?
for example, look at the list of songs that Zep recorded and who all is credited http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...y_Led_Zeppelin - co-writing credits seem to run the gamut, for them.

Originally Posted by michelej1

she never sat down and sang a line and had the other person scratch his head, play with it a bit and come back with the rest of her line.

is that really the case? because watching Lindsey and Stevie working on Angel in the Tusk doc, and judging by their conversation, it seems that it was not a completely uncommon occurrence that she would bring in a song, and then they would noodle together and change the melody and fashion it in a final song, probably also adjusting some lyrics (as LB tried again for Thrown Down but by that time she would not take his suggestions anymore).

also, didn't they describe somewhere that LB would usually cut some lyrics or verses out of SN songs (since he considered them too long for pop songs), and also mash together her lyrics from several different poems to make it into one song that would fit the music? i think SN said how he used to do that and how she appreciated that DS would just take her whole poems and make them into songs, no matter how long.

[nicole21290]

Originally Posted by michelej1

As for Dave, I think Stevie never noodled together with anyone. Obviously, she has had co-writers, but she never sat down and sang a line and had the other person scratch his head, play with it a bit and come back with the rest of her line. I think she never experienced that before and that's what she means about Lennon/McCartney.

Michele

The below quote? Change the pronouns to masculine ones and change the song name and it's identical to her 2011 quotes. But it's from 1983. The Lennon McCartney comparison, though, never fails to amuse me. So far off, Ms Nicks.

SN: And we actually wrote it in the living room together as opposed to writing it like a track. She didn't send me a track. We wrote it from scratch, me pacing and her playing her little synthesiser on the floor in the living room.

JL: Is that unusual for you?

SN: Yeah, it's the first time I've ever actually done that. And I was desperate to write this song.... Because she was very compassionate to me, especially at that time, just rode with me until I was just able to start singing something and she just started playing the right thing. And Nightbird was written real quickly and it was like, I thought 'Well, you can write in the same room as somebody else if neither of you have an ego and you both need it each other, it works'.

[bombaysaffires]

Originally Posted by nicole21290

The below quote? Change the pronouns to masculine ones and change the song name and it's identical to her 2011 quotes. But it's from 1983. The Lennon McCartney comparison, though, never fails to amuse me. So far off, Ms Nicks.

SN: And we actually wrote it in the living room together as opposed to writing it like a track. She didn't send me a track. We wrote it from scratch, me pacing and her playing her little synthesiser on the floor in the living room.

JL: Is that unusual for you?

SN: Yeah, it's the first time I've ever actually done that. And I was desperate to write this song.... Because she was very compassionate to me, especially at that time, just rode with me until I was just able to start singing something and she just started playing the right thing. And Nightbird was written real quickly and it was like, I thought 'Well, you can write in the same room as somebody else if neither of you have an ego and you both need it each other, it works'.

what, you don't think Lennon and McCartney would write
"Eye makeup dark, and it's careless
same circles around my eyes
sometimes the real color of my skin
my eyes without any shadow" ??

[jbrownsjr]

Originally Posted by bombaysaffires

what, you don't think Lennon and McCartney would write
"Eye makeup dark, and it's careless
same circles around my eyes
sometimes the real color of my skin
my eyes without any shadow" ??

OMG I just spilled my coffee!!! lolololol

[michelej1]

Originally Posted by elle

also, didn't they describe somewhere that LB would usually cut some lyrics or verses out of SN songs (since he considered them too long for pop songs), and also mash together her lyrics from several different poems to make it into one song that would fit the music?

No. Lindsey didn't mash together lyrics from several different Stevie songs, unless you count him taking the lyrics he wanted from her song to make The Chain.

We all know there's a longer version of Sara, but no I don't think Lindsey generally cut lyrics or verses out of Stevie songs, although I'm sure he WANTED to. She put her foot down.

Michele

[michelej1]

Originally Posted by elle

mash together her lyrics from several different poems to make it into one song that would fit the music?

Maybe that's what he did with Deep Dense. Maybe that's why you like it so much. I'm still waiting for her to sue him for that.

Michele

[elle]

Originally Posted by michelej1

Maybe that's what he did with Deep Dense. Maybe that's why you like it so much. I'm still waiting for her to sue him for that.

Michele

nope, i didn't mean him taking some of her lyrics and then mash them with some of the other writers' like he did in the chain. or taking her chorus and changing it somewhat (can't remember what were her original lyrics - was it "deep tense funny kind of love" and he changed it to deep dense funny kind of love?), and adding his own verses to that.

what is stuck in my mind was that he would take several of her poems (emphasis being that all the lyrics were Stevie's, not his or Christine's) and maybe pluck a verse from one and chorus from another and maybe bridge lyrics from the 3rd one. and that would be a part of his work on Stevie's FM songs. if you don't remember that then who knows, maybe i was dreaming one of them saying it.

with Deep Dense, i just love the whole thing - how the lyrics fit with the melody and the speed (is it the fast or the slow version i love? i have no idea), and that slow rolling of the music and the arrangement in the background, like he's doing some pointless job over and over again, and the way he pronounces and half sings half says the words in the verses... just sounds so good and strikes a chord with me. is it that good because she wrote the foundation / start of the song? maybe... he always said it's easier for him to start from someone else's seed and then build a song around it.

but yeah, because it's a co-write i keep thinking he won't ever release it as solo, but maybe as FM... or he just will never release it officially. but if he does, however he releases it, and as you know, i don't want him to re-record it and do to it what he did with She Smiled Sweetly... something just got lost there.

[elle]

Originally Posted by elle

was it "deep tense funny kind of love" and he changed it to deep dense funny kind of love?

ok, looked it up. in Javier Pacheco's Q&A sessions (http://www.fleetwoodmac.net/fwm/inde...131&Itemid=151) he quotes some of the lyrics:

In fact, one song in particular I have sung over and over again for the past thirty years--country and simple, but right on the mark. The lyrics go thusly: "Well there's a deep sense of a funny kind of love, ...when you look back on the way it really was. Kind of like a marriage after it has broken up; Well, there's a deep sense of a funny, ...kind of love." She was speaking of the coming downfall of FRITZ.

also (so i guess there were verses originally to funny kind of love, for some reason i was under the impression it was incomplete http://www.fleetwoodmac.net/fwm/inde...132&Itemid=152):

The two songs she wrote we performed with a minimum of changes or adulterations. ("Were Was I" and "Funny Kind of Love")

there was also a part which i can't find right now where he was discussing what he liked and didn't like about Lindsey's version of the song.

EDIT: the quote i remember was not in the penguin q&a, it was a comment on BN site http://www.buckinghamnicks.net/lb/un...deepdense.html:

"FRITZ BANDMEMBER JAVIER PACHECO speculates:

I finally listened to the song in question, Deep Dense. It is unmistakably a take-off on Stevie's song. The chords are also very similar. I have to think he wrote this to imply he was referring to his relationship with Stevie, I can think of no other reason for taking her song and altering it in this way.

I like what he does on guitar here. MY only problem with the song is that it doesn't seem to go to a climax. Dynamic-wise, it seems very flat to me. The industrial noises he adds to the grind of this piece seem (to me) to symbolize a kind of routine or mechanical repetition in his expression, like the grinding wheels that don't stop, like looking at a relationship you can't shake off. But I guess I get lost in some of Lindsey's ambiguities. The Stevie song "Funny Kind of Love" has no ambiguities, its very clear in what it is saying, very much to the point. IT is a country song but I kinda like it better than this newer version which to me, seems more controlled and almost cloaked in mystery."

[michelej1]

Originally Posted by elle

what is stuck in my mind was that he would take several of her poems (emphasis being that all the lyrics were Stevie's, not his or Christine's) and maybe pluck a verse from one and chorus from another and maybe bridge lyrics from the 3rd one. and that would be a part of his work on Stevie's FM songs.

We would also have to distinguish between eras. Lindsey's work on Stevie's songs and the intimacy he had with them, crafting and re-crafting, was different before they joined FM than after. Michele

[shackin'up]

Come on elle, why are you mentioning a UK leg, when she talks about a European leg? Europe is slightly bigger than the UK, Thank god.