SYW, best album of all time?

[CADreaming]

Originally Posted by Deeshere

I love SYW too. The reason the CD is disjointed in sound, is because by the time Stevie's solo tour ended and she was able to join the band to record the CD, all of Lindsey's songs were done. He, John and Mick had been recording Lindsey's songs for almost a year before Stevie showed up.

Lindsey didn't even get any song's from Stevie to produce until they were about 8 month's into recording. So when Steve showed up around January 2002 all she had to do on Lindsey's songs, was to record her vocals.

The reason having Stevie's songs earlier mattered, was that if Lindsey knew what Stevie's songs sounded like before he recorded and produced his own songs he most likely would have tried to make the flow of the music/sound between his songs and Stevie's songs more complementary, and the CD would not have sounded like 2 solo works (which is really was) all on 1 CD.

However, since his songs were recorded and produced (they were kinda dark and edgy like a Buckingham solo CD usually is) before Stevie showed up to start to record her song's (I think) he darkened the sound of Stevie's songs somewhat to try and match the sound of his own song's and make the CD more cohesive sounding.

Which if I am not mistaken (and Lindsey eluded to in a few interviews) caused some pretty big arguments between Lindsey and Stevie at the end of making the CD, and I think is one of the reason Stevie has refused to do another Fleetwood Mac CD.

I disagree.

[redtulip]

Originally Posted by Lindsfan

When did he allude to that? I know he's talked of a fight between him and Kristen, but I don't recall him alluding to it being about Stevie. Please enlighten me.

And I'm late to this discussion, so forgive me if this has been mentioned or whatever, but I always thought - and still believe - that Stevie's SYW songs weren't played (or were pulled) because unlike Lindsey, she's just not comfortable playing new stuff. She likes to stick to what she's sure her fans will like. If they played it once, and the fans didn't go nuts, she didn't want to wait for them to warm up to it. That's just my opinion, it's not based on anything else.

It makes no sense for Kristen to be bothered by two songs out of all his, and Stevie's songs!

I would be interested to see where he alluded to the fight being about Stevie as well because I've never seen/heard that before, only that there was a fight.

I agree with this. I don't think out of all of Lindsey's songs there would only be a couple she would have problems with if she was bothered by any. If his songs were an issue to her, I think there would be many more. And I think Kristen is secure enough in their relationship and knows the difference between FM Lindsey and the real Lindsey.

And I also get the feeling Stevie isn't comfortable playing new songs live anyway so would probably veto most of them. She was saying in all the press for the tour this year that fans don't want new material so I don't think it would be a stretch to say that she is not comfortable performing the new material because she doesn't think the fans want to hear it.

[CADreaming]

Originally Posted by redtulip

And I also get the feeling Stevie isn't comfortable playing new songs live anyway so would probably veto most of them. She was saying in all the press for the tour this year that fans don't want new material so I don't think it would be a stretch to say that she is not comfortable performing the new material because she doesn't think the fans want to hear it.

I think she's loosening up on this finally. She did about 6 new songs for her IYD tour and that was a big step for her. And, they are doing 2 new songs this tour.

[elle]

Originally Posted by CADreaming

I think she's loosening up on this finally. She did about 6 new songs for her IYD tour and that was a big step for her.

and she changing whooping ONE song between her Unleashed tour set and Live 2013 tour set.

oh yeah i forgot about adding WY.

[CADreaming]

Originally Posted by elle

and she changing whooping ONE song between her Unleashed tour set and Live 2013 tour set.

oh yeah i forgot about adding WY.

This is an excellent tour set, regardless.

[elle]

Originally Posted by CADreaming

This is an excellent tour set, regardless.

i agree. especially in isolation, if there was no Unleashed. or SYW.

but it could have been so much more interesting.

it's kinda like with Lindsey's OMS set, only worse. OMS set was great and amazing and incredible, but it could have been so much more different and amazing (and with so many more songs ).

[CADreaming]

Originally Posted by elle

i agree. especially in isolation, if there was no Unleashed. or SYW.

but it could have been so much more interesting.

it's kinda like with Lindsey's OMS set, only worse. OMS set was great and amazing and incredible, but it could have been so much more different and amazing (and with so many more songs ).

I know what you're saying but I understand the reasons why they do what they do. Ironically, I felt this tour was far better than Unleashed even though the songs were the same, it seemed to just flow better and they sound awesome. Plus, we did have the two new songs from the EP and they threw in two deep cuts from Tusk AND got the WY intro -- it's epic!

[michelej1]

Originally Posted by Lindsfan

She likes to stick to what she's sure her fans will like. If they played it once, and the fans didn't go nuts, she didn't want to wait for them to warm up to it. That's just my opinion, it's not based on anything else.

It makes no sense for Kristen to be bothered by two songs out of all his, and Stevie's songs!

Yes, I think Destiny Rules was pulled because it received a lackluster response just as DLMDA was pulled for the same reason. When they played was Destiny Rules I thought it dragged myself, except for a new vocal arrangement they did at the very end, which I thought was a pretty nice variation on the album.



Michele

[Deeshere]

Originally Posted by CADreaming

I disagree.

I respect your disagreement, but can you tell me why?

[nicole21290]

Originally Posted by Lindsfan

When did he allude to that? I know he's talked of a fight between him and Kristen, but I don't recall him alluding to it being about Stevie. Please enlighten me.

Yeah, he hasn't come right out and said Cast Away Dreams is about Stevie. However, he talked in his introductions about the argument/fight being about:
- having to give up 'an obsession', to stop 'obsessing about something'
- not knowing when to let something go
- a dream he'd been hanging onto (for too long?)
- that he needed some time alone to mourn and grieve the loss of that dream

The fact that it was written (and the argument occurred) whilst he was on the SYW tour (when his and Stevie's r'ship seemed to run from the very hot to the very cold) and the actual lyrics he wrote seem to indicate it IS about Stevie. To me, at least.

Holy light / Visionary sight
There's been a change in plans
Going away / No, I cannot stay
I hope you'll understand

- here, it's actually the word 'plans' I find most most interesting merely because plans are SO much more concrete and realised than dreams or ideas. But yes, it's obviously not his work/music that he was obsessing about and having to give up. He's addressing a person here and in the rest of the song.

She was so enchanted by his voice / She was so shaken by his words
His plan for her… / Was just not possible

I won't be home tonight / I'll just slip out of sight
Lay down my visionary eyes / Dancing on my cast away dreams
Keep yourself out of sight / Farewell to the wishes that died
Look for me in the morning light / Dancing on my cast away dreams

- Bless. He's trying. As he said, he needs time alone to mourn the loss of his dreams and wishes. Pity in 2013 he STILL seems to be dreaming (at least within lyrics) on a regular basis about a certain someone...

Magic one / All our dreams are done
I have no faith today
Sun will rise / In your newborn eyes
Just let me slip away

- Okay. So, this is the main one for me if the constant mentions of dreams weren't enough... MAGIC ONE. Yeah, who else would he be addressing here?! Like really. That alone really pretty much convinces me this obsession he had to try and give up was Stevie. Also, interesting to see how prevalent the ideas of faith is in both his and Stevie's songs, to be honest. And that he now has faith being a part of his meaning of Say Goodbye.

You've shaken your faith in me, no / You've shaken my faith in everything else
A decision no one makes, and now you're going home
Faith is a hard thing to hold on to / Something inside you says I don't have to

And we were magic.

It would do no good
To drown in the sea
Where no one remembers their name
And nothing but nothing is free

- Really, Lindsey?! I DO so much love their repeated use of ocean/sea imagery, by the way. And the drowning...

Drowning in the sea of love
Where everyone would love to drown

After the music ended / There was nowhere to go but down
Faces of glass all hung in the past / They only come here to drown

Hearts will break
With choices we must make
So sleep and dream of me

- Again, another fascinating section to me. Mostly because it talks of heartS breaking and choices WE must make. Plural usages here. This isn't Lindsey merely making a decision and not being bothered by it. It's not even JUST him making choices here. And even once that choice IS made, he still wishes this 'magic one' to sleep and dream of him.

____

Now on the road we've had many really good talks. We've know each other most of our lives and yet we're still trying to figure out what's going on. Obviously, a lot of love as a subtext. But where is that love? How do we get in touch with any of that? For all of us, the decisions we make now are going to determine how we are as people until we die. Stevie and I are trying to look at it...with care. - Lindsey Buckingham.

"I think I might wander underground
I go to my lover we lay on our bed
Did I sell my heart for the dreams in my head?"

[elle]

Originally Posted by nicole21290

After the music ended / There was nowhere to go but down
Faces of glass all hung in the past / They only come here to drown

ending with "can you hear me Annie?" by all accounts if about anybody specific Rodeo would be about Anne Heche.

Originally Posted by nicole21290

"I think I might wander underground
I go to my lover we lay on our bed
Did I sell my heart for the dreams in my head?"

"Give us a song but don't live what you sing
Say what you mean but please don't mean a thing

I think I might wander underground
I think I might wander underground

They heard fifteen seconds and that was enough
The idea was new but the business was rough

I think I might wander underground
I think I might wander underground

I go to my lover we lay on our bed
Did I sell my heart for the dreams in my head?

I think I might wander underground"

underground as away from the big business large music labels.

[elle]

Originally Posted by nicole21290

Yeah, he hasn't come right out and said Cast Away Dreams is about Stevie. However, he talked in his introductions about the argument/fight being about:
- having to give up 'an obsession', to stop 'obsessing about something'
- not knowing when to let something go
- a dream he'd been hanging onto (for too long?)
- that he needed some time alone to mourn and grieve the loss of that dream

i have Cast Away Dreams interpretation a bit different from most other people... while looking at everything through the lens of a star-crossed love relationship is romantic, what seems to be a constant and most important thing to LB is music, his art and getting it out there through his musical career (remember young SN complaining he'd rather sleep with his guitar than her ?). repeated use of a word visionary, plans, and everything that you listed in your bullets above to me points towards him finally letting go of any plans to become commercially successful solo artist - we were discussing that in this thread:

http://ledge.fleetwoodmac.net/showpo...81&postcount=5

[Deeshere]

Originally Posted by Lindsfan

When did he allude to that? I know he's talked of a fight between him and Kristen, but I don't recall him alluding to it being about Stevie. Please enlighten me.

He alluded to it on his his Under the Skin Tour during the Cast Away Dreams Into. He would tell the story of his and his wife's argument New York after the Fleetwood Mac show he says this

" She had left to go back to L.A and I was sitting alone the hotel room thinking about what we talked about and it occurred to me that if you have held onto a dream, a goal, and idea for a long, long time it can be difficult to know when it is appropriate to let go of that and also it occurred to me that when you do finally come to that clarity it can be helpful to be left alone for while to mourn the loss of that idea and also to simultaneously celebrate what might come from having made that change.

Here's the video:

[Desiree]

Originally Posted by Lindsfan

When did he allude to that? I know he's talked of a fight between him and Kristen, but I don't recall him alluding to it being about Stevie. Please enlighten me.

I've heard about such a fight on another msg board but don't know anything about it as I'm playing catch up.

And I'm late to this discussion, so forgive me if this has been mentioned or whatever, but I always thought - and still believe - that Stevie's SYW songs weren't played (or were pulled) because unlike Lindsey, she's just not comfortable playing new stuff. She likes to stick to what she's sure her fans will like. If they played it once, and the fans didn't go nuts, she didn't want to wait for them to warm up to it. That's just my opinion, it's not based on anything else.

Uhhh...she played at least six (6) new songs off her new IYD's record so , no, that is not the reason. I believe what she said about playing new songs is that you only play 2-3 along with all the hits off a single record?

It makes no sense for Kristen to be bothered by two songs out of all his, and Stevie's songs!

Well, it wouldn't be the only thing that didn't make sense....for example...my mind is boggled by the fact that any woman, girl friend or wife, could EVER in a million years sit thru a concert where said man sings songs of longing, lust, crashed dreams, when they come to get us we'll finally tell the truth...make amends, the stars are crazy, magic one, and on and on it goes about another woman, one who is obviously of extreme importance in his life! I find his songs to be pretty to the point. I mean each line would stab me in the heart, and it makes her, Kristin, look stupid. I really dislike it when women allow that behavior and look the other way...acting, real, half/half doesn't really matter. So go figure...but the baby being alluded to as a barricade...and DR, it's not being together, it's just following the rules...so fatalistic, kinda takes some of the shine off it all...maybe that's why they didn't't play it..I'm sorry...I think I'm rambling.

[elle]

Originally Posted by Deeshere

He alluded to it on his his Under the Skin Tour during the Cast Away Dreams Into. He would tell the story of his and his wife's argument New York after the Fleetwood Mac show he says this

" She had left to go back to L.A and I was sitting alone the hotel room thinking about what we talked about and it occurred to me that if you have held onto a dream, a goal, and idea for a long, long time it can be difficult to know when it is appropriate to let go of that and also it occurred to me that when you do finally come to that clarity it can be helpful to be left alone for while to mourn the loss of that idea and also to simultaneously celebrate what might come from having made that change.

Here's the video:

http://http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gsqPyoeq2M0

yes, that doesn't say absolutely anything about SN. clarity, loss of a dream, an idea... doesn't say it's about a person even.

see my post above, plus look at that whole thread i linked to for different interpretations. there are some really good ones there, once a person takes off S+L blinders.