Stevie Nicks - IYD is now available for pre-order on iTunes.

[WildHearted]

Originally Posted by Dex

The infamous Thrown Down clip, where Stevie is explaining the difference between Dave's "suggestions" and Lindsey "telling her what to do" was an interesting inclusion in the film, and a bit of a headscratcher for me. The way she wrote off Lindsey's approach. "He was telling me what to do!!!! GRRR!!!! >=(!!!!!" Really Stevie? Sure sounded to me like he was making a suggestion I guess their history has just made her naturally defensive and a bit flinchy. Though it was great to see them together on this film, working seemingly peacefully and appreciatively.

I think you hit the nail on the head. In reality, Lindsey was just making a suggestion and you can actually tell he was very cautious in the way he was wording it (presumably in an attempt not to offend her). But clearly it didn't come off that way to Stevie. It's understandable given their history, I suppose, but that she would distinguish the two different approaches (when really I think the approach was the same, only the person doing the approaching was different) and highlight them in the documentary is telling, to me. There's an ego there and there's a sensitivity there when Lindsey is involved (or at least, there was at that time) that doesn't exist so strongly with others.

Anyway, I loved the documentary. Planning on watching it again to pick up on anything I may have missed. Like most of you, my favorite part was seeing all of the songs worked out in the studio and getting to observe some more candid moments. I liked the footage of the fireworks show in Italy and also the video recordings of the FWIW and Soldier's Angel and Moonlight demos.

[Dex]

Originally Posted by WildHearted

I think you hit the nail on the head. In reality, Lindsey was just making a suggestion and you can actually tell he was very cautious in the way he was wording it (presumably in an attempt not to offend her). But clearly it didn't come off that way to Stevie. It's understandable given their history, I suppose, but that she would distinguish the two different approaches (when really I think the approach was the same, only the person doing the approaching was different) and highlight them in the documentary is telling, to me. There's an ego there and there's a sensitivity there when Lindsey is involved (or at least, there was at that time) that doesn't exist so strongly with others.

Nailed it. But it's a little disappointing to me that Stevie can't see that after having undoubtedly watched that clip a few times. If I got a chance to see moments in my life replayed from a third-party perspective, I like to think I'd gain a little more self awareness... Oh well. That's our Stevie.

[michelej1]

Originally Posted by WildHearted

I think you hit the nail on the head. In reality, Lindsey was just making a suggestion and you can actually tell he was very cautious in the way he was wording it (presumably in an attempt not to offend her).

Yes, he was definitely trying not to offend her. I don't know why he bothered saying anything at all, but he said it in the most respectful way possible. Also, she didn't tell him off in that clip, like I guess she thinks he did. He could easily have responded to her Dylan comment. He consciously chose not to, but I know that there was an answer to her right on the tip of his tongue. He just really wanted an album and tour I guess, so he said nothing.

Michele

[michelej1]

Originally Posted by Dex

Really? She actually surprised me by seeming downright pleasant and fun a lot of the time. I agree with you that she has her cringe-y moments of extreme arrogance ("Give this to the owner of the hotel. Some day it will be something really important." Jeesh.)

That was hilarious. She checked to make sure it wasn't a chain first. Like she didn't want to give it to some Conrad Hilton executive. She was happy to find out it was family-owned.

Michele

[editme2]

I bought In Your Dreams (the film) yesterday and watched it last night. I liked it. It’s certainly not going to win Stevie any awards, but I appreciated her attempt to tell the story behind what is clearly an album she loves. I enjoyed her playfulness and humor and came to see how, with the right person, Stevie is a fantastic collaborator. She’s no pushover and has a clear vision (even if she can’t always articulate it) about what her she wants her songs to sound like.

What I found most disappointing, though, was that we didn’t get to see enough of the creation of the songs. Dave kept interrupting with shots of a mysterious Poe character or the night sky or flashes of lightning. I wanted to hear more of the raw vocal performances and see how the songs evolved from demos to full-fledged songs. I wanted to be in on the conversations that took place about why a certain poem was good enough to set to music. It annoyed me every time Stevie would sit down at the mike to sing and then the scene would fade out and the music video would start to play, or we’d hear the final vocal track when clearly she was laying down an early vocal. I would have saved all the professionally done videos for the DVD release.

The segments I enjoyed most were the recordings of FWIW, New Orleans, and In Your Dreams because we did get to hear how the songs evolved from Stevie’s rough demos to the final product. I was disappointed in the Moonlight and Italian Summer segments simply because they relied too heavily on the final produced versions of the songs. With Italian Summer, I don't think we even got to see Stevie in the studio working on the song. It was just an interview and some grainy video that was shot from her hotel window. And did I miss something or was there nothing on Wide Sargasso Sea?

Nonetheless, it was fun to see Stevie at work. Clearly, she felt invigorated by the making of this album and I hope she can approach making new music, whether it’s with Fleetwood Mac or solo, with the same humor and passion.

[WildHearted]

Originally Posted by editme2

I bought In Your Dreams (the film) yesterday and watched it last night. I liked it. It’s certainly not going to win Stevie any awards, but I appreciated her attempt to tell the story behind what is clearly an album she loves. I enjoyed her playfulness and humor and came to see how, with the right person, Stevie is a fantastic collaborator. She’s no pushover and has a clear vision (even if she can’t always articulate it) about what her she wants her songs to sound like.

What I found most disappointing, though, was that we didn’t get to see enough of the creation of the songs. Dave kept interrupting with shots of a mysterious Poe character or the night sky or flashes of lightning. I wanted to hear more of the raw vocal performances and see how the songs evolved from demos to full-fledged songs. I wanted to be in on the conversations that took place about why a certain poem was good enough to set to music. It annoyed me every time Stevie would sit down at the mike to sing and then the scene would fade out and the music video would start to play, or we’d hear the final vocal track when clearly she was laying down an early vocal. I would have saved all the professionally done videos for the DVD release.

The segments I enjoyed most were the recordings of FWIW, New Orleans, and In Your Dreams because we did get to hear how the songs evolved from Stevie’s rough demos to the final product. I was disappointed in the Moonlight and Italian Summer segments simply because they relied too heavily on the final produced versions of the songs. With Italian Summer, I don't think we even got to see Stevie in the studio working on the song. It was just an interview and some grainy video that was shot from her hotel window. And did I miss something or was there nothing on Wide Sargasso Sea?

Nonetheless, it was fun to see Stevie at work. Clearly, she felt invigorated by the making of this album and I hope she can approach making new music, whether it’s with Fleetwood Mac or solo, with the same humor and passion.

There was a whole section on Wide Sargasso Sea.

I agree. Personally, I could have done without the music video portions in the documentary entirely. That could have been a bonus feature on the DVD or something. I would much rather have that time spent on more footage of them working in the studio, like you said.

However, I did enjoy Stevie's personal footage re: Italian Summer, FWIW, etc.

[J.Miller]

I think this movie will work well on music oriented programming such as Palladia and AXS TV. It has a good balance of on how the music was made, the video segments and the goofball moments. I would mind watching this on TV on a cold winter holiday all cozied up.

[Macfanforever]

Maybe PBS will pick it up and run it like her other videos and have a DVD made up and offer it.I will put a pledge in.

Or sell it like the others.

Start haunting PBS to pick it up.

[bombaysaffires]

Originally Posted by editme2

I bought In Your Dreams (the film) yesterday and watched it last night. I liked it. It’s certainly not going to win Stevie any awards, but I appreciated her attempt to tell the story behind what is clearly an album she loves. I enjoyed her playfulness and humor and came to see how, with the right person, Stevie is a fantastic collaborator. She’s no pushover and has a clear vision (even if she can’t always articulate it) about what her she wants her songs to sound like.

What I found most disappointing, though, was that we didn’t get to see enough of the creation of the songs. Dave kept interrupting with shots of a mysterious Poe character or the night sky or flashes of lightning. I wanted to hear more of the raw vocal performances and see how the songs evolved from demos to full-fledged songs. I wanted to be in on the conversations that took place about why a certain poem was good enough to set to music. It annoyed me every time Stevie would sit down at the mike to sing and then the scene would fade out and the music video would start to play, or we’d hear the final vocal track when clearly she was laying down an early vocal. I would have saved all the professionally done videos for the DVD release.

The segments I enjoyed most were the recordings of FWIW, New Orleans, and In Your Dreams because we did get to hear how the songs evolved from Stevie’s rough demos to the final product. I was disappointed in the Moonlight and Italian Summer segments simply because they relied too heavily on the final produced versions of the songs. With Italian Summer, I don't think we even got to see Stevie in the studio working on the song. It was just an interview and some grainy video that was shot from her hotel window. And did I miss something or was there nothing on Wide Sargasso Sea?

Nonetheless, it was fun to see Stevie at work. Clearly, she felt invigorated by the making of this album and I hope she can approach making new music, whether it’s with Fleetwood Mac or solo, with the same humor and passion.

Totally agree. But I wonder how much of that was Dave and how much Stevie.... given that the FM docs always seem to gloss over everything and never really let us see the true workings of how things get done (one or two very minor moments of chafe in each documentary but otherwise the whole experience is portrayed as a wonderful fabulous we all got along thing) which is how Stevie likes things. She only ever wants to show the good parts. This film reinforces my sense that if she ever does do an autobiography it will be the same. It's like eating a meal and realizing you're starving barely an hour later... you think it filled you up but it was really a lot of empty calories. I think this movie was fun to watch but not sure it withstands lots of re-watches... except for select favorite bits.

I think of other truer, grittier rock docs like Metallica's for one, and realize we'll never, ever get something that real from Stevie or from Mac for that matter.

[fairydust75]

[QUOTE=michelej1;1092971]Yes, he was definitely trying not to offend her. I don't know why he bothered saying anything at all, but he said it in the most respectful way possible. Also, she didn't tell him off in that clip, like I guess she thinks he did. He could easily have responded to her Dylan comment. He consciously chose not to, but I know that there was an answer to her right on the tip of his tongue. He just really wanted an album and tour I guess, so he said nothing.


The only thing that I could add to this is that:
Destiny Rules is highly edited. With all the many, many hours they filmed we may have not seem the whole conversation.

[bombaysaffires]

Originally Posted by Dex

Although I think Lindsey has an ego to match hers, and the two of them in the studio together often may well be a nightmare. I've never actually seen Destiny Rules, but I'd really like to know. I imagine it would tell quite a different story.


And much as I love IYD, I kind of wish maybe she did listen to some third-party feedback on some of those lyrics (And YCFT as well). But I guess it could be that she didn't really get any in the first place.

I think in the early days, and LB has admitted as much, he was not diplomatic about her work at ALL much of the time and just ripped on it and said things like "this is crap" and other niceties. (I think it was on Charlie Rose that he admitted the first time she played him a song back when they first met he immediately criticized it. "Nothing changes" he then said a little sheepishly). Once she got out from under his total influence and had other people around her telling her her stuff was great and she had fame/success for her work, she just never seemed to trust that LB's comments came from anything other than jealousy and bitterness and even if he thought some of it was good he wouldn't tell her out of spite (makes me think of her line "You may have the goodness somewhere/but you'll never let me see")

If she won't listen to LB I agree with u she needs SOMEONE to act as an editor. She does seem to think her stuff comes out perfectly the first time and clearly, all good writers refine their raw material multiple times til it's right. But no rules apply to our girl.

[bombaysaffires]

Originally Posted by Fireflies

was that ever in the documentary? i think the part about the "drummer" is from this video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=62f71...Dfp0Vw&index=4

ah, that's it Fireflies! Good to know I'm not totally crazy.

It clearly is from that same conversation, curious it was in the promo clip but not the full film.

[michelej1]

Originally Posted by bombaysaffires

I think in the early days, and LB has admitted as much, he was not diplomatic about her work at ALL much of the time and just ripped on it and said things like "this is crap" and other niceties.

You think so? If I think about it, I would guess he probably said something more like what we saw in that Tusk footage, sarcastic, but not outright disparaging, like she'd say is this awful and he'd probably be like, "in a word, yes."

Or it sounded like he often withheld comments and didn't offer the praise she wanted, for instance her talking about his putting Bella Donna on a stair. She even mentioned him not listening to TISL initially, when she first gave it to him and that seemed to bother her still, 20 years after Bella Donna.

From her complaints about him, I imagined more than saying "this is dreck" he was always trying to change her stuff. I don't think he saw her raw material as being horrible. I think he always saw it as something he could work with. Like the way Christine said she heard Dreams and thought it was dull and he immediately saw the possibilities. I think they began clashing when she didn't want him to mold her songs anymore and wanted him to help her realize her vision of them, rather than just making them into his own. So, I'd be surprised to hear a "this stinks" from him when he got her demos, at least.

Now, when he hears her finished solo stuff, that's when I'd think like you do and imagine he hears it and says (maybe silently), "ugh, this is horrid," but nascent material .... I think she clashed with him most not because he told her her stuff was baseless, but because he would take such control over it that she couldn't take it in the direction she wanted, especially when she gained more experience and knew a lot more about music than she did in the seventies. She wanted/needed more of his input in their early years together and then grew more knowledgeable and needed less, but their relationship didn't evolve to accommodate that.

Michele

[michelej1]

Originally Posted by J.Miller

I think this movie will work well on music oriented programming such as Palladia and AXS TV. It has a good balance of on how the music was made, the video segments and the goofball moments. I would mind watching this on TV on a cold winter holiday all cozied up.

It seems to me that there are a lot of cable channels that would like this. Cher's mother just put out a country album and I watched a special that told how that came about a couple of weeks ago. I think that was on Lifetime. It was more of a BIO program, but we did get to hear the songs on the album. I think this would fit Lifetime's demographics.

Even OWN. OWN did a Celine Dion special, after she returned to work following the birth of her twins. Since they did a Master Class with Stevie, I don't understand why they wouldn't want to buy this.

Michele

[Phil]

It still puzzles me that Lindsey didn't correct Stevie regarding a particular lyric from "Smile At You" ("I should have turned around and ran..."). Clearly she was using the wrong tense, but because it rhymed with "can", it was seemingly deemed suitable. Very strange.
What amazes me about Stevie's undeniable arrogance is just how misplaced it is on most occasions. For example, her insistence that "the Italians will love this!" in relation to "Italian Summer". Why the **** would they? It's a dirge with an utterly leaden lead vocal. Now if she were to actually produce something of worth, her 'confidence' might be justified. Until then, I wish she'd shut the **** up.