Please Die Fighting for My Rights

[Miss Vicky]

Originally Posted by mylittledemon

I dont feel I've been on a high horse.

Is that so?

Originally Posted by mylittledemon

Do you even understand God, or believe in one? I mean...take someone like Hitler...

Tell me, how's the view from up there?

[carrie721]

Originally Posted by Miss Vicky

Is that so?

or how about telling vanessa her beliefs are baseless?

[mylittledemon]

Originally Posted by carrie721

or how about telling vanessa her beliefs are baseless?

Uh oh...a team up is brewing against me.

Umm...I'm waiting on V's response to my responding post. I wanted to know where her belief in a Nothingness came from. If it's her own opinion and she's not basing it on anything (least of all, some narrow view of dogma)...then I was right in saying it was baseless dont you think? My views my oppose from yours but I'm basing it on something Biblical. That's where the opposing opinions come in, which I can respect.

I'm not continuing in this thread to offend anyone...I'm completely interested in what everyone thinks and feels. If I came across rude or pig-headed, I am sorry for that.

[carrie721]

Originally Posted by mylittledemon

Uh oh...a team up is brewing against me.

Umm...I'm waiting on V's response to my responding post. I wanted to know where her belief in a Nothingness came from. If it's her own opinion and she's not basing it on anything (least of all, some narrow view of dogma)...then I was right in saying it was baseless dont you think? My views my oppose from yours but I'm basing it on something Biblical. That's where the opposing opinions come in, which I can respect.

I'm not continuing in this thread to offend anyone...I'm completely interested in what everyone thinks and feels. If I came across rude or pig-headed, I am sorry for that.

please, nobody is ganging up on you.

it's extremely arrogant to say that someone's beliefs are baseless. why does vanessa have to base her beliefs on anything to make them credible? it works for her. that's all that matters.

[mylittledemon]

Originally Posted by carrie721

please, nobody is ganging up on you.

it's extremely arrogant to say that someone's beliefs are baseless.

HAHA...NOT if it's LITERALLY based on nothing. Maybe the word baseless just sounds crass.

[carrie721]

Originally Posted by mylittledemon

HAHA...NOT if it's LITERALLY based on nothing. Maybe the word baseless just sounds crass.

it's based in her own thoughts and life experiences. that is all she (or anyone) needs.

[strandinthewind]

Originally Posted by carrie721

. . . it's extremely arrogant to say that someone's beliefs are baseless. why does vanessa have to base her beliefs on anything to make them credible? it works for her. that's all that matters.

I would not say it is arrogant in the true sense of that term. I would use something like ethnocentric instead. I watched a show the other day on Wiccans. When asked if they were satan worshippers, against God, etc. One replied that they could not answer that. The questioner took that to mean yes, they were satan worshippers. The Wiccan then explained that the question could not be answered because they did not believe in the concept of satan, God, Heaven, or hell.

I think that applies here. Brandon used the term baseless within the confines of Christianity, which is his religion, and other major religions of the world. He is correct from that vantage point. However, he is incorrect to assume the existence of any foundation for an atheistic belief in one who does not believe in Christianity. In other words, Christian axioms cannot be applied against someone who does not believe in Chriatianity at all. I think a more correct reply would have been, there is no bases in Christianity or any of the world's other religions for your belief in no God at all. That statement is true and cannot be proven false.

[carrie721]

Originally Posted by strandinthewind

I would not say it is arrogant in the true sense of that term. I would use something like ethnocentric instead. I watched a show the other day on Wiccans. When asked if they were satan worshippers, against God, etc. One replied that they could not answer that. The questioner took that to mean yes, they were satan worshippers. The Wiccan then explained that the question could not be answered because they did not believe in the concept of satan, God, Heaven, or hell.

I think that applies here. Brandon used the term baseless within the confines of Christianity, which is his religion, and other major religions of the world. He is correct from that vantage point. However, he is incorrect to assume the existence of any foundation for an atheistic belief in one who does not believe in Christianity. In other words, Christian axioms cannot be applied against someone who does not believe in Chriatianity at all.

hang on suzanne, let me pull out your favorite argument technique

ar·ro·gant (ăr'ə-gənt) pronunciation
adj.

1. Having or displaying a sense of overbearing self-worth or self-importance.
2. Marked by or arising from a feeling or assumption of one's superiority toward others: an arrogant contempt for the weak.

i think that that level of ethnocentricity (if that's what you want to call it) clearly displays "a sense of overbearing self-worth."

I think a more correct reply would have been, there is no bases in Christianity or any of the world's other religions for your belief in no God at all. That statement is true and cannot be proven false.

i agree, but i don't think he was trying to say there is no base for her beliefs in christianity. i think he was trying to say that her beliefs weren't valid at all.

[strandinthewind]

Originally Posted by carrie721

hang on suzanne, let me pull out your favorite argument technique

ar·ro·gant (ăr'ə-gənt) pronunciation
adj.

1. Having or displaying a sense of overbearing self-worth or self-importance.
2. Marked by or arising from a feeling or assumption of one's superiority toward others: an arrogant contempt for the weak.

i think that that level of ethnocentricity (if that's what you want to call it) clearly displays "a sense of overbearing self-worth."



i agree, but i don't think he was trying to say there is no base for her beliefs in christianity. i think he was trying to say that her beliefs weren't valid at all.

I disagree and I think he has said as much in his replies. If he meant anything different, then he is incorrect. But, I do not see his argument from his faith as arrogent in way that term is defined. I do not think he was asserting that he is self important nor do I think he was acting in a superior manner, though some obviously, and IMO incorrectly, took his post as that. I think that is not like him. Again, I think he merely was arguing from the vantage point of his faith and did not consider the statement outside of that vantage point.

[mylittledemon]

Originally Posted by carrie721

i think that that level of ethnocentricity (if that's what you want to call it) clearly displays "a sense of overbearing self-worth."

i agree, but i don't think he was trying to say there is no base for her beliefs in christianity. i think he was trying to say that her beliefs weren't valid at all.

I never said they were invalid...baseless. There is a BIG difference. We're all mincing words. And if you knew me at ALL...an overbearing sense of self worth is the LAST fuc*king thing I've got on my list of traits.

[mylittledemon]

Originally Posted by Miss Vicky

Is that so?



Tell me, how's the view from up there?

Hey, I've been the first to say I'm not perfect. I was using Hitler as an example, because I think we all can agree he was a monster.

You seem to want to point that out personally and not contribute to the discussion...so perhaps you're the one on the horse. Oops, I better get off the horse..

[Miss Vicky]

Originally Posted by mylittledemon

I was using Hitler as an example, because I think we all can agree he was a monster.

I wasn't talking about the Hitler statement. I was talking about your questioning of someone's understanding of God.

It's an extremely condescending thing to say in a "civil" conversation.

[mylittledemon]

Originally Posted by Miss Vicky

I wasn't talking about the Hitler statement. I was talking about your questioning of someone's understanding of God.

It's an extremely condescending thing to say in a "civil" conversation.

Starling's original comment had referred to his god having nothing to do with "vengeance" and what i should have said was that (at least in all the major religions of the world) that the deity's claim vengeance or recompense in some form or another. Thus my seemingly rude "Do you even understand God" comment...It just came across as an opinion, not a fundamental thing to say. Which is ok too.