Lindsey Buckingham's complaint against FM - Filed 10/9/18 in Los Angeles - document

[ali101]

Lindsey Buckingham's complaint against Fleetwood Mac - Filed 10/9/18 in Los Angeles Superior Court

https://www.scribd.com/document/390686837/Lindsey-Buckingham-Fleetwood-Mac-Complaint

The whole document is there including the email sent from LB to MF, finishing with the words “I love you all no matter what. Lindsey “

It mentions that he received only two cryptic written responses but strangely enough these are not included as exhibits. I’m Assuming that they think that gives them chance to make a settlement without further detailed mess. But it’s already a sorry affair.

[Jondalar]

About time he sues. All he ever gets is misery.

[BombaySapphire3]

About time he sues. All he ever gets is misery.

History is filled with tales of good people suffering while the wicked prosper.

[DownOnRodeo]

"in addition to his role as the musical director of the band's live performances"

This is fascinating reading. Thanks for posting.

[KenshiMaster16]

I want to know who wanted to ditch John after the cancer scare. What a horrible suggestion.

[dreamsunwind]

I want to know who wanted to ditch John after the cancer scare. What a horrible suggestion.

So do I. What an awful thing to even think about.

[jwd]

Lindsey Buckingham's complaint against Fleetwood Mac - Filed 10/9/18 in Los Angeles Superior Court

https://www.scribd.com/document/390686837/Lindsey-Buckingham-Fleetwood-Mac-Complaint

The whole document is there including the email sent from LB to MF, finishing with the words “I love you all no matter what. Lindsey “

It mentions that he received only two cryptic written responses but strangely enough these are not included as exhibits. I’m Assuming that they think that gives them chance to make a settlement without further detailed mess. But it’s already a sorry affair.


Classy. Makes me want to cry.

[DownOnRodeo]

At one point during the On With The Show tour, one of the Partners in Fleetwood Mac was diagnosed with a serious illness. When another Partner proposed replacing the unwell Partner and continuing the tour, Buckingham insisted that the Band postpone the remaining dates until the other Partner could perform with the Band. This was consistent with Buckingham's history of taking care of the other Partners in Fleetwood Mac during their times of need and standing up for the legacy of Fleetwood Mac.

Well, that's clearly Mick. :rolleyes:

[dreamsunwind]

"On December 11th 2017, the partners held a meeting in Los Angeles to discuss the upcoming Fleetwood Mac tour. Several of the Partners wanted to begin rehearsals for the tour in June of 2018 and begin the tour in August of 2018. Buckingham had previously explained to the other partners that he was planning on releasing a solo album in April 2018 and planned to embark on a brief solo tour to promote his album. Buckingham again requested that the Band begin rehearsals for the tour in September and commence the tour in early November of 2018. The other Partners refused to make any compromises to their preferred timeline for the tour and by December 15, 2017, Buckingham had agreed to the Fleetwood Mac tour schedule insisted upon by the other Partners."

Read it and weep.

[Storms123]

So do I. What an awful thing to even think about.
I'll take a crack at it----Christine wasn't back yet, I doubt it was Stevie.....so my guess it was his best mate and founding partner...."John,you must understand, I have alimony, child support and another bankruptcy looming....."

[button-lip]

When I thought I couldn't be more upset. John's cancer.... and Buckingham McVie was supposed to be FM.

This is much, much worse than we all suspected. :distress::distress:

[secondhandchain]

The Stevie defenders can try and try to defend her, but there is NO defending her or Mick. They are scum.

[ali101]

When I thought I couldn't be more upset. John's cancer.... and Buckingham McVie was supposed to be FM.

This is much, much worse than we all suspected. :distress::distress:

We’ve only heard 50% of it yet and there will be a heck of a lot more if it’s disputed.

If it was Mick with the idea of replacing John, did the rest know or was it just discussed with Lindsey and its included within this document to make sure that the remaining band members now know and to cause undoubted friction and issues of trust? Or whoever it was for that matter.

[aleuzzi]

It’s a gripping read. Only John wrote back...

[jmn3]

The Stevie defenders can try and try to defend her, but there is NO defending her or Mick. They are scum.

Oh but they will continue to defend her. Some of the ridiculous things that they've brought up from the past or even suggested happened at MusicCares (seriously, the implication that Lindsey, what, punched Karen or something?). Or my favorite, the poster who continues to go after Kristen Buckingham, quoting the Kanye gold digger song regarding her earlier? Jesus....it's like they too are bitter that he had kids and got married.

[button-lip]

We’ve only heard 50% of it yet and there will be a heck of a lot more if it’s disputed.

If it was Mick with the idea of replacing John, did the rest know or was it just discussed with Lindsey and its included within this document to make sure that the remaining band members now know and to cause undoubted friction and issues of trust? Or whoever it was for that matter.

That was my idea too. I wonder if John knows. This could be a tactic to bring John to Lindsey's side. And Christine, for that matter, who has clearly been fighting with that idea for a long time, if what Lindsey's telling about her fragile state is true.

It's gonna be an interesting show tomorrow night.... :distress::distress:

[Frankenstein]

I want to know who wanted to ditch John after the cancer scare. What a horrible suggestion.

My guess would also be Mick but it doesn’t matter who.. it just shows what these people are truly like.

[SteveMacD]

It’s a gripping read. Only John wrote back...

So, basically, the radio silence is coming from management and legal, probably in anticipation of the lawsuit.

[Buster]

At least this sad, ugly ordeal will bring out everything that happened- if there is more to the story. If there was something that Lindsey did other than have some disagreements over the tour that got resolved and smirking, it will come out. My guess is that he didn’t do anything horrible because he wouldn’t have sued if he did.

[Storms123]

So, basically, the radio silence is coming from management and legal, probably in anticipation of the lawsuit.

Exactly--I don't think anyone is surprised there's a lawsuit. I am surprised it took so long to file.

[SteveMacD]

At least this sad, ugly ordeal will bring out everything that happened- if there is more to the story. If there was something that Lindsey did other than have some disagreements over the tour that got resolved and smirking, it will come out. My guess is that he didn’t do anything horrible because he wouldn’t have sued if he did.

I think it’s related to the Classic shows, and I think it’s a management decision. Nothing about what Stevie supposedly said would be a fireable offense, however, I think management used that to justify his firing. Honestly, if he didn’t sign a contract for the tour, his oral agreement probably won’t hold up.

[StreetAngel86]

Lindsey Buckingham's complaint against Fleetwood Mac - Filed 10/9/18 in Los Angeles Superior Court

https://www.scribd.com/document/390686837/Lindsey-Buckingham-Fleetwood-Mac-Complaint

The whole document is there including the email sent from LB to MF, finishing with the words “I love you all no matter what. Lindsey “

It mentions that he received only two cryptic written responses but strangely enough these are not included as exhibits. I’m Assuming that they think that gives them chance to make a settlement without further detailed mess. But it’s already a sorry affair.

this drahmah is better than Days of Our Lives ...

ETA: what's this Stevie only wanted 3 shows a week nonsense? if Lindsey wanted to concurrently tour solo ... there would have been FOUR days a week for him to do that.
seems like that would have been a reasonable suggestion. if they were doing FIVE shows a week ...well that would be different. i thought this could be Stevie being generous BUT it seems more like she wanted to prolong the tour for sooooooooooo looooooong so lindsey COULDNT tour solo faster? WTH

[secondhandchain]

Can you imagine what Stevie's RARHOF speech is going to be after this? Will she even mention LB? She's done screwed everything up.

[bombaysaffires]

it's interesting that per the document no one in Stevie's management had mentioned to her that LB was asking to do solo shows in between Mac shows.

Makes you wonder if she finally got told right before the Musicares event and was already pissed at him when she found out., adding to her displeasure. :shrug:

[jmn3]

Can you imagine what Stevie's RARHOF speech is going to be after this? Will she even mention LB? She's done screwed everything up.

Not at all. "In 1981 I released my first solo album...Tom Petty...and Tom Petty....and Tom....and Mike...and Tom Petty...and Don Henley...and Tom....and Sheryl Crow....and then Tom died..."

She's going to ride the Petty train for as long as she can.

[StreetAngel86]

Can you imagine what Stevie's RARHOF speech is going to be after this? Will she even mention LB? She's done screwed everything up.

i am SO happy
i am twirling in my living room EVERY night
i couldn't have done it without my belief in myself
i am so happy to be here. with no help from anybody.

[Angel75]

I want to know who wanted to ditch John after the cancer scare. What a horrible suggestion.

Mick

I mean c'mon...who wouldnt kick their best mate out of the band & to the curb and try and replace him with another bass player, all the while when he is critically ill with cancer.......seems normal to me
:eek::shocked::confused:

[gldstwmn]

I can't wait to see Fleetwood Mac's response.

[secondhandchain]

I can't wait to see Fleetwood Mac's response.

On that we both agree.

[Aisling]

I've been keeping up with the twists and turns via the Ledge, but haven't commented since the initial ousting because frankly this whole saga is EXHAUSTING and my life is tiring enough. But this, I could not let pass without throwing my thoughts into the ring.

Given what we know about Christine's life prior to rejoining the band-- the seclusion, the depression, the phobias, the drinking-- I've no doubt she's in a fragile state over all of this, as Lindsey's email alludes to. But it is past time for her to put her big girl pants on and have some serious, long chats with her therapist over why it is she feels fragile. Guilt, perhaps?

I don't for a second think she cares about what Stevie wants. I think the only person she cares about in this equation is Mick, and that's because she erroneously believes Mick would do anything for her, so she's prepared to do anything for him. If it's true that he was the one who wanted to replace John, I hope that is enough of a wake up call for her to stop letting him lead her down the garden path. Because the truth is that he would push Chris in front of a moving bus for a twenty dollar bill. Probably for even less than that.

I really thought this whole sh*tshow could not make me any more disgusted than I was last spring. I should never have doubted Fleetwood Mac's ability to astound and amaze, because I am 100% more nauseous now.

[DownOnRodeo]

Because the truth is that [Mick] would push Chris in front of a moving bus for a twenty dollar bill. Probably for even less than that.

:laugh: :laugh:

[Nicks Fan]

Mick's loyalty is about as deep as a birdbath.

[HomerMcvie]

I think the only person she cares about in this equation is Mick, and that's because she erroneously believes Mick would do anything for her, so she's prepared to do anything for him. If it's true that he was the one who wanted to replace John, I hope that is enough of a wake up call for her to stop letting him lead her down the garden path. Because the truth is that he would push Chris in front of a moving bus for a twenty dollar bill. Probably for even less than that.

Mick is a f*cking scumbag. Truth be told, he's worse than $tevie. He'd desecrate Biddy's grave for a nickel!

[Aussie W/Heart]

We dont know for certain what was said behind the scene's regarding John's cancer at that time.

Just maybe, John initiated for the tour to still go ahead without him, wanting the band to find a suitable replacement Bass player, instead of cancelling. So the band considered this option, Lindsey put his foot down said replacing John would be wrong on all levels.. :shrug:

[StevieandChris]

On that we both agree.

Yes, me too. As someone posted, we have 1/2 of the story right now; Lindsey’s interpretation of what happened. We’ll see what the other four have to say, or 6 if the newbies chime in.

[Aisling]

Truth be told, he's worse than $tevie.

Honestly, I've felt the same way for some time now. At least in Stevie's case, her actions are a consequence of deeply (wrongly and immaturely) held convictions regarding Lindsey. With Mick, there are no such complex reasons. He probably wakes up every day and has to check his bank balance before he can decide on how he'll feel.

One other thing I'll add is that I'm sure no one is shocked LBCM was originally intended as an FM album, as has been speculated from the start. But seeing it spelled out at last definitely makes me feel like the project was on Stevie's shortlist of provocations. If it had truly been something Lindsey and Chris cooked up on their own, sure, I could see Stevie being a bit jealous. But that it was an FM album she said no to, only to have them solider on without her, takes all the power out of her hands. I think she realized going forward she might have problems with the two of them banding together on future Mac related issues. Alone, she knows that Christine is not a threat in her "fragile" state. But the possibility of Lindsey having Chris's ear probably pushed her over the edge. She's never going to concede an inch to that man, and her whole life right now seems dedicated to letting him know that.

[HomerMcvie]

Honestly, I've felt the same way for some time now. At least in Stevie's case, her actions are a consequence of deeply (wrongly and immaturely) held convictions regarding Lindsey. With Mick, there are no such complex reasons. He probably wakes up every day and has to check his bank balance before he can decide on how he'll feel.

One other thing I'll add is that I'm sure no one is shocked LBCM was originally intended as an FM album, as has been speculated from the start. But seeing it spelled out at last definitely makes me feel like the project was on Stevie's shortlist of provocations. If it had truly been something Lindsey and Chris cooked up on their own, sure, I could see Stevie being a bit jealous. But that it was an FM album she said no to, only to have them solider on without her, takes all the power out of her hands. I think she realized going forward she might have problems with the two of them banding together on future Mac related issues. Alone, she knows that Christine is not a threat in her "fragile" state. But the possibility of Lindsey having Chris's ear probably pushed her over the edge. She's never going to concede an inch to that man, and her whole life right now seems dedicated to letting him know that.
I've said it before, but, she may have won the game of Fleetwood Mac, but he won the game of life(at least in comparison to her miserable life).

And $he HATES it. Bitter hag.

[secondhandchain]

I've said it before, but, she may have won the game of Fleetwood Mac, but he won the game of life(at least in comparison to her miserable life).

And $he HATES it. Bitter hag.

SO SPOT ON! He has a gorgeous wife and absolutely beautiful children. I mean they are stunning looking .....and the old hag who stays up taking selfies can't STAND IT. Who does that? Stays up taking pics of themselves with full lighting. I mean? What a loon!

[HomerMcvie]

SO SPOT ON! He has a gorgeous wife and absolutely beautiful children. I mean they are stunning looking .....and the old hag who stays up taking selfies can't STAND IT. Who does that? Stays up taking pics of themselves with full lighting. I mean? What a loon!

But her PAID ass kissers tell her how wonderful $he is.

[secondhandchain]

But her PAID ass kissers tell her how wonderful $he is.

The girl in the chiffon bubble.

[lilyfee]

Honestly, I've felt the same way for some time now. At least in Stevie's case, her actions are a consequence of deeply (wrongly and immaturely) held convictions regarding Lindsey. With Mick, there are no such complex reasons. He probably wakes up every day and has to check his bank balance before he can decide on how he'll feel.


I agree with this. Regardless of whether you like Stevie or not, she and Lindsey’s relationship offstage has seemed entirely antagonistic since SYW at least. She is sensitive and does not take kindly to mocking from Lindsey. What I do not understand is why the rest of the band would go along with this and move forward so quickly without Lindsey if it was an impulsive spur of the moment decision as described here. I’ve been waiting for Lindsey’s side of the story and I hope that Fleetwood Mac gives some explanation for their actions as well.

My takeaways from the lawsuit:

1. Why is Christine in a fragile state? That jumped out to me.

2. Does it read to anyone else like Lindsey actually still wants to tour with them??

[HomerMcvie]

2. Does it read to anyone else like Lindsey actually still wants to tour with them??

I think it only has to do with the lawsuit. If he's being cheated out of the money, he has to show that he's still ready, willing, and able. Now pay me!

[button-lip]

At least this sad, ugly ordeal will bring out everything that happened- if there is more to the story. If there was something that Lindsey did other than have some disagreements over the tour that got resolved and smirking, it will come out. My guess is that he didn’t do anything horrible because he wouldn’t have sued if he did.


Well, yeah, exactly! We have been telling that for the past 8 months. But he sure "must have done something wrong".
They ignored his calls asking for an explanation, and that's a FACT.
So, they can't argue with that. I also can't wait to hear their response, because they have nothing against him.


Can you imagine what Stevie's RARHOF speech is going to be after this? Will she even mention LB? She's done screwed everything up.

I wouldn't be surprised if she mentions him. After all, she's clearly insane. :]:]:]

[button-lip]

I agree with this. Regardless of whether you like Stevie or not, she and Lindsey’s relationship offstage has seemed entirely antagonistic since SYW at least. She is sensitive and does not take kindly to mocking from Lindsey. What I do not understand is why the rest of the band would go along with this and move forward so quickly without Lindsey if it was an impulsive spur of the moment decision as described here. I’ve been waiting for Lindsey’s side of the story and I hope that Fleetwood Mac gives some explanation for their actions as well.

My takeaways from the lawsuit:

1. Why is Christine in a fragile state? That jumped out to me.

2. Does it read to anyone else like Lindsey actually still wants to tour with them??

Stevie does not take kindly to Lindsey being married to another woman and having children with her. Period.

I think Lindsey doesn't want the legacy to end this way, like he claimed in his mail. They could never tour again. Not without him taking care of every move in front of Stevie. :]:]:]

[David]

This is like "Shark Week" on National Geo.

[HomerMcvie]

This is like "Shark Week" on National Geo.

More like Goat Week.

Or As The Goat Turns.

Goats Turning.

Stop Dragging My Goat Around.

Okay, I'm done...

[KenshiMaster16]

More like Goat Week.

Or As The Goat Turns.

Goats Turning.

Stop Dragging My Goat Around.

Okay, I'm done...

When I See Goat Again

After the Goat Fades

And we cannot forget Mick's classic - Second Hand Balls

[Macfan4life]

The band is heartless with taking advice from managers and lawyers...not even speaking to Lindsey when he was fired.
I cant help to think of Bob Welch and how horribly he was treated 20 years ago. It made no sense to kick him to the curb and not allow him in the Rock n Roll Hall of fame. He was such a vital member and first American who really steered the band towards the Buckingham/Nick era. But they were heartless towards him because he wanted royalties from the albums he was a member of.
This heartlessness reminds me of this. But its even worse because its all coming from one member who the rest circle around because of big bucks $$$$$$$$$.

Keeping Stevie and making money was more important than their legacy and how they treat their most important member; guitarist, producer, singer, songwriter, etc.

Its almost like they knew they were going to be sued so they cut off all contact with him and pretend he does not exist. So this is why Bob Welch comes to mind. They really are heartless. I cant believe they are performing his songs on this tour.

[mirror69]

Lindsey Buckingham's complaint against Fleetwood Mac - Filed 10/9/18 in Los Angeles Superior Court

https://www.scribd.com/document/390686837/Lindsey-Buckingham-Fleetwood-Mac-Complaint

The whole document is there including the email sent from LB to MF, finishing with the words “I love you all no matter what. Lindsey “

It mentions that he received only two cryptic written responses but strangely enough these are not included as exhibits. I’m Assuming that they think that gives them chance to make a settlement without further detailed mess. But it’s already a sorry affair.




are all like a children of 70 years what is so stupid....all are losers no wins...and much important the music from them has lost..:mad:

[fleetwoodguy79]

On the surface, I think Lindsey’s argument is strong.

Though I am very, very worried about him.

I wouldn’t put it past Stevie to come up with an “abuse” defense as part of her narrative. In our current social climate, there are a lot of old stories that are coming out. Some that are legitimate and horrifying, others that borderline manipulation for the betterment of one’s position. Stevie has the latter. She can drag him through the mud and might have gotten to the point of recognizing this is the right social climate to let it all out if he fights her on it.

Any way this goes, it will have damaged this band’s legacy. I don’t know why Lindsey is the only one that cares about that. Oh wait, yeah, sorry, I do... $$$$$.

[lennonfan]

More like Goat Week.

Or As The Goat Turns.

Goats Turning.

Stop Dragging My Goat Around.

Okay, I'm done...

no, you asked for it, now yer gonna get it..
you can Goat your own way
when I Goat you again
Goat Dust Woman
Goatslide
Beautiful Goat

[DownOnRodeo]

when I Goat you again

KenshiMaster16's "When I See Goat Again" was better, but your others are funny. :thumbsup:

[fleetwoodguy79]

no, you asked for it, now yer gonna get it..
you can Goat your own way
when I Goat you again
Goat Dust Woman
Goatslide
Beautiful Goat

Needs more outside balance from others in the band...

You Make (Goat) Loving Fun

Goat and I, pt. 2

(Goat) Dreams

And don’t forget,

Rhiaaaaaaaaaahehehehennnnnnaon

[lennonfan]

Needs more outside balance from others in the band...

You Make (Goat) Loving Fun

Goat and I, pt. 2

(Goat) Dreams

And don’t forget,

Rhiaaaaaaaaaahehehehennnnnnaon

ok, I'll play again;)
Goatbird
Never going Goat again
Second Hand Goat
Think about Goat
What makes you think you're the Goat?

[DownOnRodeo]

Tangoat in the Night
Big Goat
Seven Goaters
Everygoat
Goatiline
Tangoat in the Night
Goatified
Goatie Lies
Family Goat
Welcome to the Goat... Sara
Isn't it Goatnight
When I See Goat Again
Goat and I, Part II

[StevieandChris]

This was interesting from Variety, acknowledging we still don’t know everything:

“So why did Buckingham get forced out? Loeb & Loeb evidently decided the lawsuit was not the place to go there, even as they attempt to methodically knock down all the official explanations that Nicks, Fleetwood and the two McVies have offered up in interviews. But Buckingham did offer further theories or clues in an interview published by Rolling Stone Wednesday.”

Then it goes on to paraphrase the RS article.

[Buster]

SO SPOT ON! He has a gorgeous wife and absolutely beautiful children. I mean they are stunning looking .....and the old hag who stays up taking selfies can't STAND IT. Who does that? Stays up taking pics of themselves with full lighting. I mean? What a loon!

Claiming to know what Stevie’s life or happiness is or isn’t is as creepy as it is absurd.

[lilyfee]

On the surface, I think Lindsey’s argument is strong.

Though I am very, very worried about him.

I wouldn’t put it past Stevie to come up with an “abuse” defense as part of her narrative. In our current social climate, there are a lot of old stories that are coming out. Some that are legitimate and horrifying, others that borderline manipulation for the betterment of one’s position. Stevie has the latter. She can drag him through the mud and might have gotten to the point of recognizing this is the right social climate to let it all out if he fights her on it.

Any way this goes, it will have damaged this band’s legacy. I don’t know why Lindsey is the only one that cares about that. Oh wait, yeah, sorry, I do... $$$$$.

I’ve wondered if Stevie might say something like this, especially since the recent unauthorized biographer phrased it as abuse in the press however I think if Stevie had anything new to say on this matter she would. I don’t think her intention is to ruin Lindsey’s life... I think her intention is simply to keep him away from her.

Most surprising to me is that no one in the band will talk about what happened. The canned answers and lack of transparency imply that there’s some reason for kicking Lindsey out that we haven’t heard. I get Stevie’s logic - she doesn’t want to be near Lindsey, period - but the rest of them confuse me. Even Stevie has never had a problem bashing people in the press or “speaking her mind” in public. Why not just say she felt like Lindsey was disrespectful towards her? Why make it about the scheduling?

[Buster]

I've been keeping up with the twists and turns via the Ledge, but haven't commented since the initial ousting because frankly this whole saga is EXHAUSTING and my life is tiring enough. But this, I could not let pass without throwing my thoughts into the ring.

Given what we know about Christine's life prior to rejoining the band-- the seclusion, the depression, the phobias, the drinking-- I've no doubt she's in a fragile state over all of this, as Lindsey's email alludes to. But it is past time for her to put her big girl pants on and have some serious, long chats with her therapist over why it is she feels fragile. Guilt, perhaps?

I don't for a second think she cares about what Stevie wants. I think the only person she cares about in this equation is Mick, and that's because she erroneously believes Mick would do anything for her, so she's prepared to do anything for him. If it's true that he was the one who wanted to replace John, I hope that is enough of a wake up call for her to stop letting him lead her down the garden path. Because the truth is that he would push Chris in front of a moving bus for a twenty dollar bill. Probably for even less than that.

I really thought this whole sh*tshow could not make me any more disgusted than I was last spring. I should never have doubted Fleetwood Mac's ability to astound and amaze, because I am 100% more nauseous now.

Yes, all of this x1000

[StevieandChris]

I’ve wondered if Stevie might say something like this, especially since the recent unauthorized biographer phrased it as abuse in the press however I think if Stevie had anything new to say on this matter she would. I don’t think her intention is to ruin Lindsey’s life... I think her intention is simply to keep him away from her.

Most surprising to me is that no one in the band will talk about what happened. The canned answers and lack of transparency imply that there’s some reason for kicking Lindsey out that we haven’t heard. I get Stevie’s logic - she doesn’t want to be near Lindsey, period - but the rest of them confuse me. Even Stevie has never had a problem bashing people in the press or “speaking her mind” in public. Why not just say she felt like Lindsey was disrespectful towards her? Why make it about the scheduling?

Yes. Now they will have to respond. The Variety article I quoted from earlier agrees the complaint filed does not cover why he was fired. Other than the Rhiannon intro and smirking, whatever was in that list of complaints hinted at in the RS article remains unknown.

[Buster]

All these people claiming to have the inside scoop about Stevie’s miserable life with no family conveniently leave out that she had a close loving relationship with her parents that most could only dream of having. I’m sure it brought her great joy. Who knows what her life is like - probably like most people is a mix of joy, regret, happiness, sadness, and a lot in between. Claiming that Stevie’s life has been about pining over a man and anger someone else married him is just more sexism that permeates this board.

Yes, Lindsey has a wife and kids but I’m sure his life is more complicated than that. He clearly has lived with anger much of his life, demonstrated by his often poor and childish behavior in the past. And that fueled writing some brilliant songs.

There is a line between being a hard core fan and an obsessive one that thinks they really “know” the star.

[Storms123]

All these people claiming to have the inside scoop about Stevie’s miserable life with no family conveniently leave out that she had a close loving relationship with her parents that most could only dream of having. I’m sure it brought her great joy. Who knows what her life is like - probably like most people is a mix of joy, regret, happiness, sadness, and a lot in between. Claiming that Stevie’s life has been about pining over a man and anger someone else married him is just more sexism that permeates this board.

Yes, Lindsey has a wife and kids but I’m sure his life is more complicated than that. He clearly has lived with anger much of his life, demonstrated by his often poor and childish behavior in the past. And that fueled writing some brilliant songs.

There is a line between being a hard core fan and an obsessive one that thinks they really “know” the star.

Agreed. "LIFE" whether it's personal lives or the overall LIFE experiences they've had have enabled both of them to write extraordinary music and have made indelible marks in music and this band (and as a result, other peoples lives) Any speculation, innuendo beyond that seems inappropriate

[secondhandchain]

Claiming to know what Stevie’s life or happiness is or isn’t is as creepy as it is absurd.

She said performing is all she has. I can put the recent wuoitd up.

[DownOnRodeo]

She said performing is all she has. I can put the recent wuoitd up.

Exactly. She talks so much that it's more a question of what don't we know about Stevie Nicks.

[lovethemac1]

I’ve wondered if Stevie might say something like this, especially since the recent unauthorized biographer phrased it as abuse in the press however I think if Stevie had anything new to say on this matter she would. I don’t think her intention is to ruin Lindsey’s life... I think her intention is simply to keep him away from her.

Most surprising to me is that no one in the band will talk about what happened. The canned answers and lack of transparency imply that there’s some reason for kicking Lindsey out that we haven’t heard. I get Stevie’s logic - she doesn’t want to be near Lindsey, period - but the rest of them confuse me. Even Stevie has never had a problem bashing people in the press or “speaking her mind” in public. Why not just say she felt like Lindsey was disrespectful towards her? Why make it about the scheduling?

Maybe they haven’t commented because there actually ISN’T anything else?

They’ve already lied about why they fired him. That smacks of making things up to justify an action.

[sodascouts]

I am very, very worried about him.

I wouldn’t put it past Stevie to come up with an “abuse” defense as part of her narrative. In our current social climate, there are a lot of old stories that are coming out. Some that are legitimate and horrifying, others that borderline manipulation for the betterment of one’s position. Stevie has the latter. She can drag him through the mud and might have gotten to the point of recognizing this is the right social climate to let it all out if he fights her on it.


Me too (no pun intended). It takes so little to get the media up in arms; those who have made a career of being righteously indignant appearing on the talk shows and the cable "news" programs, demanding that his life be ruined; the Twitter crowd frothing at the mouth and screaming of boycotts; the labels, stores, venues, etc. rushing to separate themselves from any hint of association with an "abuser."

All she has to do is accuse him...

Surely even she wouldn't do that to the man who she was once "as good as married" to - plus such an accusation would make her look ridiculous after she's been hugging him for decades during shows.

[lilyfee]

Maybe they haven’t commented because there actually ISN’T anything else?

They’ve already lied about why they fired him. That smacks of making things up to justify an action.

If you have to make something up to justify the action, what is the actual reason for the action though? I doubt it was over smirking, and Lindsey’s lawsuit disputes the claim that there was a scheduling conflict. Maybe his reaction to walking out to a recording was more of a blowout than he’d like to admit and that was the last straw? I just don’t get why they’d lie. Stevie and Mick are generally forthcoming with their opinions so I don’t see the point of lying. As a huge Stevie fan I’d be more likely to accept and respect this decision if there was actual reasoning behind it. If Stevie said he was disrespectful towards her I’d believe it and I’d be upset about it but it would make sense. But this back and forth does not make sense and none of it sits well with me.

[sodascouts]

If you have to make something up to justify the action, what is the actual reason for the action though? I doubt it was over smirking, and Lindsey’s lawsuit disputes the claim that there was a scheduling conflict. Maybe his reaction to walking out to a recording was more of a blowout than he’d like to admit and that was the last straw? I just don’t get why they’d lie. Stevie and Mick are generally forthcoming with their opinions so I don’t see the point of lying. As a huge Stevie fan I’d be more likely to accept and respect this decision if there was actual reasoning behind it. If Stevie said he was disrespectful towards her I’d believe it and I’d be upset about it but it would make sense. But this back and forth does not make sense and none of it sits well with me.

If she were looking for any reason to fire him to bring in Mike Campbell.... that would not be something she would want to admit.

Just speculation, but it's one of the few reasons that I can imagine where they have to make up something because Lindsey didn't really do anything that horrible, yet Stevie is still keen to get rid of him and loath to say why.

I remember a while back, a TMZ reporter asked Mick if that were the case re: Campbell. A TMZ reporter also asked Mick if there had been an ultimatum. One of those turned out to be true. Maybe the other is as well.

[DownOnRodeo]

All she has to do is accuse him...

I wouldn't worry about that.

Counsel: "Your honor, let the record show that the accuser's bark is worse than the defendant's bite."
Judge: (Having endured Stevie's rambling testimony) "Agreed! Case dismissed."

[bombaysaffires]

If you have to make something up to justify the action, what is the actual reason for the action though? I doubt it was over smirking, and Lindsey’s lawsuit disputes the claim that there was a scheduling conflict. Maybe his reaction to walking out to a recording was more of a blowout than he’d like to admit and that was the last straw? I just don’t get why they’d lie. Stevie and Mick are generally forthcoming with their opinions so I don’t see the point of lying. As a huge Stevie fan I’d be more likely to accept and respect this decision if there was actual reasoning behind it. If Stevie said he was disrespectful towards her I’d believe it and I’d be upset about it but it would make sense. But this back and forth does not make sense and none of it sits well with me.

maybe because there is no one, single thing that is the sole reason. It seems like it's more an accumulation of fights, stresses, arguments, and tension over many years. Any of the things on the night of Musicares wouldn't seem likely to stand on their own as sufficient reason to fire him (though there still remains the possibility of something else going on backstage no one is aware of) . If you take her at face value in her public interviews she's basically said after 40 years I had enough. And that's fair enough, if she doesn't want to work with him anymore (and many of us have --correctly it seems-- interpreted her behavior as showing she has zero interest in recording with him ever again) that's fine. She didn't want to record, but she did tour. That was a workable compromise, though he made it clear it didn't make him happy.

So no one can be surprised really that she got to a point where she decided you know what, I don't even want to tour with him. But her method of handling it -- giving the band an ultimatum (and she knows Mick well enough to know how he'd choose)-- and most importantly the band's response-- ok well, you bring more money so we'll kick him out with a total disregard is utterly shameful. And then the refusing to even talk to him just reeks of them hiding behind their lawyers' advice of don't talk to him so you won't say or do anything that undoes our case.

I think they expected him to do what FM has always done, unite behind whatever bs cover story they've concocted for the press. His filing seems like him telling them he's not going to enable their dysfunction any more.

[sasja]

I would not put it past the woman to try and throw around abuse accusations, but she cannot have it both ways, after all her shenanigans clinging to him over the past decades for financial gain.

But if FM goes there, and comes with a counter complaint, we'll never need any memoirs written anymore, their lifetimes will be laid bare into the minutiae:]:laugh:

[secondhandchain]

We all know she was looking for any reason to bring in Mike Campbell, hence making her a Heartbreaker. That has been her dream forever as silly and gross as it is. She got her wish now I hope it haunts her like a ghost through a fog forever.

[kak125]

Lindsey has been tweeting today -

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Not sure when you’ll get a book from me, but I certainly have a story to tell! <a href="https://t.co/n1TerIuZb1">https://t.co/n1TerIuZb1</a></p>&mdash; Lindsey Buckingham (@LBuckingham) <a href="https://twitter.com/LBuckingham/status/1050777574165684231?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">October 12, 2018</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

[NotonRodeo]

I'm a bit nonplussed by some of the posts about John's cancer--I always assumed it was common knowledge that when they found out he was ill, S & M desperately searched for a replacement, so they could keep the advance from the tour promoters from Australia and NZ. I forgot where I read it and how it was settled, but I assumed every one here knew :confused:

[SteveMacD]

They’ve already lied about why they fired him.

You know, having read through most of it, I like how he admits LBCM was intended to be a Fleetwood Mac album.

However, that means he was lying the whole time about how it just felt like a duet album.

Point being that they all lie, even Lindsey, when it behooves them.

[SteveMacD]

I'm a bit nonplussed by some of the posts about John's cancer--I always assumed it was common knowledge that when they found out he was ill, S & M desperately searched for a replacement, so they could keep the advance from the tour promoters from Australia and NZ. I forgot where I read it and how it was settled, but I assumed every one here knew :confused:

I never heard about that. I assumed they were considering substitutes in case they couldn’t get out of their obligations, but it wouldn’t have been a permanent replacement. When they were able to get out, tour canceled. The cancellation was announced the day after their last European show.

[DownOnRodeo]

Point being that they all lie, even Lindsey, when it behooves them.

That's one point you could glean from it, although I don't think it's much of a point ("adults tell white lies"?).

The more salient point I would think is that, due to his (apparently misplaced) desire to protect the legacy of the band's unity, he was forced into the position of either selling it as something that they wanted to keep as a duet from fairly early on in the process (btw, it's not like he said that they set out to make a duet album from the outset) or shelving the project after Stevie refused to come on board.

So we should be commending his efforts and commiserating with his position, not saying "Lindsey lied when it behooved him."

[StevieandChris]

I never heard about that. I assumed they were considering substitutes in case they couldn’t get out of their obligations, but it wouldn’t have been a permanent replacement. When they were able to get out, tour canceled. The cancellation was announced the day after their last European show.

And I doubt John cared at that point.

[Sugar Mouse]

I understand that Lindsey didn't have a written contract with Live Nation or Fleetwood Mac in regards to the current tour. If that's true, it's going to be challenging for Lindsey to win a lawsuit if the band declines to settle.

[TrueFaith77]

You know, having read through most of it, I like how he admits LBCM was intended to be a Fleetwood Mac album.

However, that means he was lying the whole time about how it just felt like a duet album.

Point being that they all lie, even Lindsey, when it behooves them.

I don't think it's a lie. It's one thing to say it was always INTENDED as a duets album (which by definition is impossible since the Lindsey demos were explicitly done as a bid for a FM album).

However, to say that when it turned out it HAD to be a duets album that it made sense (faith in cycles etc), I don't disagree with that. Maybe TITN should have been a duets album ;)

[jeets2000]

You know, having read through most of it, I like how he admits LBCM was intended to be a Fleetwood Mac album.

However, that means he was lying the whole time about how it just felt like a duet album.

Point being that they all lie, even Lindsey, when it behooves them.

But in that case, lying didn't behoove Lindsey at all? It protected the band's legacy and arguably hurt LB/CM. If he had done interviews alongside Chris and said, "This was going to be a Fleetwood Mac album, can't you just imagine Stevie singing on these tracks?" it likely would have earned them more buzz, if not album sales and concert tickets.

I know we're stepping in to the realm of the hypothetical here, which is dangerous and often a huge waste of time, but it always struck me that LB was "taking one for the team" with all that duo album talk.

[NotonRodeo]

I understand that Lindsey didn't have a written contract with Live Nation or Fleetwood Mac in regards to the current tour. If that's true, it's going to be challenging for Lindsey to win a lawsuit if the band declines to settle.

An oral contract is just as binding as a written one. Basic contract law.

[TrueFaith77]

An oral contract is just as binding as a written one. Basic contract law.

Now, Sugar Mouse is going to be a legal expert.

[StevieandChris]

An oral contract is just as binding as a written one. Basic contract law.

Now we have to see if his interpretation of the oral contract matches the other members’ and their reps’ interpretation.

[ryan4136]

An oral contract is just as binding as a written one. Basic contract law.

This is why Azoff called to say the tour was off. And it wasn’t until after he was let go that a “new” tour with some hired guns was established starting at a different time. We’ll see if that holds up in court though.

[sodascouts]

This is why Azoff called to say the tour was off. And it wasn’t until after he was let go that a “new” tour with some hired guns was established starting at a different time. We’ll see if that holds up in court though.

This is why they stopped doing interviews. The band themselves were characterizing it as carrying on with the tour they had planned, but which Lindsey had supposedly refused to do on their timeline. That does not fit the narrative of an entirely separate tour, especially with Christine letting it slip that she had gone to London with the impression Lindsey would be on the tour!

[NotonRodeo]

This is why Azoff called to say the tour was off. And it wasn’t until after he was let go that a “new” tour with some hired guns was established starting at a different time. We’ll see if that holds up in court though.

Very sneaky of Azoff and the band. Perhaps a bit too sneaky to pass the smell test ...

[ryan4136]

This is why they stopped doing interviews. The band themselves were characterizing it as carrying on with the tour they had planned, but which Lindsey had supposedly refused to do on their timeline. That does not fit the narrative of an entirely separate tour, especially with Christine letting it slip that she had gone to London with the impression Lindsey would be on the tour!

Agreed Azoff must’ve freaked

[SteveMacD]

I think management, promoters, and legal had more to do with his firing than Stevie. I don’t doubt for a second that Stevie had a major outburst and gave an ultimatum. I also think that was a fire they (management and legal) could have put out, if they had been so inclined. They could have talked Stevie down. (BTW, I have no doubt that Mick and Christine heard about their dancing, too. But they have a very different relationship with Stevie.)

But, Lindsey’s comments before Classic West and what many perceived as a lackluster performance on his part, especially compared to his enthusiastic performances with LBCM, ultimately did him in. A concurrent tour? He’d already proven to management and promoters (which was pretty much one and the same with Classic West) that he couldn’t maintain his enthusiasm for Fleetwood Mac when he was also promoting a new project. It was one of the biggest things Azoff ever did, and Lindsey basically took a dump on it when they were still selling tickets. I think Lindsey made himself a liability in management’s eyes.

I could be wrong, but there’s enough between the lines..

[Jondalar]

This is why they stopped doing interviews. The band themselves were characterizing it as carrying on with the tour they had planned, but which Lindsey had supposedly refused to do on their timeline. That does not fit the narrative of an entirely separate tour, especially with Christine letting it slip that she had gone to London with the impression Lindsey would be on the tour!

That won't pass the smell test, especially when Lindsey points out that when John had cancer Mick and Stevie went looking for a new bass player and weren't going to cancel the tour. Plus, Fleetwood Mac has a history of NOT stopping a tour, when a members leaves. They can't just lie and get away with it. I think Lindsey is going to win a lot of money.

[Jondalar]

I think management, promoters, and legal had more to do with his firing than Stevie. I don’t doubt for a second that Stevie had a major outburst and gave an ultimatum. I also think that was a fire they (management and legal) could have put out, if they had been so inclined. They could have talked Stevie down. (BTW, I have no doubt that Mick and Christine heard about their dancing, too. But they have a very different relationship with Stevie.)

But, Lindsey’s comments before Classic West and what many perceived as a lackluster performance on his part, especially compared to his enthusiastic performances with LBCM, ultimately did him in. A concurrent tour? He’d already proven to management and promoters (which was pretty much one and the same with Classic West) that he couldn’t maintain his enthusiasm for Fleetwood Mac when he was also promoting a new project. It was one of the biggest things Azoff ever did, and Lindsey basically took a dump on it when they were still selling tickets. I think Lindsey made himself a liability in management’s eyes.

I could be wrong, but there’s enough between the lines..

This is ridiculous. Blame the victim why don't you. #himtoo

[StevieandChris]

This is ridiculous. Blame the victim why don't you. #himtoo

He is not a victim.

[Sugar Mouse]

That won't pass the smell test, especially when Lindsey points out that when John had cancer Mick and Stevie went looking for a new bass player and weren't going to cancel the tour. Plus, Fleetwood Mac has a history of NOT stopping a tour, when a members leaves. They can't just lie and get away with it. I think Lindsey is going to win a lot of money.

The reports are that Lindsey didn't have a written contract for the tour. If that's true, he will have a very difficult time winning this case.

[HomerMcvie]

The reports are that Lindsey didn't have a written contract for the tour. If that's true, he will have a very difficult time winning this case.

I'm reminded of herpes...

[sodascouts]

I think management, promoters, and legal had more to do with his firing than Stevie. I don’t doubt for a second that Stevie had a major outburst and gave an ultimatum. I also think that was a fire they (management and legal) could have put out, if they had been so inclined. They could have talked Stevie down. (BTW, I have no doubt that Mick and Christine heard about their dancing, too. But they have a very different relationship with Stevie.)

But, Lindsey’s comments before Classic West and what many perceived as a lackluster performance on his part, especially compared to his enthusiastic performances with LBCM, ultimately did him in. A concurrent tour? He’d already proven to management and promoters (which was pretty much one and the same with Classic West) that he couldn’t maintain his enthusiasm for Fleetwood Mac when he was also promoting a new project. It was one of the biggest things Azoff ever did, and Lindsey basically took a dump on it when they were still selling tickets. I think Lindsey made himself a liability in management’s eyes.

I could be wrong, but there’s enough between the lines..

Once again, we get the claim that his performance at Classic West was "lackluster." It was not perceived that way by anyone but hypercritical fans, and therefore did not damage Fleetwood Mac at all. I have posted in the past gushing reviews from actual critics and have refuted this "lackluster" argument before but sadly, that doesn't keep it from getting repeated.

BTW, I wonder which sells more tickets: the Rumours 5 (even after Lindsey makes one comment about doing CW for the money), or a not-really-what-you-remember version of the band with two new guys (one of whom is almost unknown in America) which has alienated fans on an unprecedented level?

You can bet Azoff knew the answer to that question long before the band found it out the hard way.

No, I'm not pinning this on him.

[Sugar Mouse]

The reports are that Lindsey didn't have a written contract for the tour. If that's true, he will have a very difficult time winning this case.

I checked and Lindsey is suing for breach of oral contract; he apparently didn't have a written contract making this a very difficult case for him to win.

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/10/11/arts/music/fleetwood-mac-lindsey-buckingham-lawsuit.html

[Feather Blade]

I'm reminded of herpes...

You mean it's what you get if you don't keep your little demon from going after people?

[wilsonmac]

I think management, promoters, and legal had more to do with his firing than Stevie. I don’t doubt for a second that Stevie had a major outburst and gave an ultimatum. I also think that was a fire they (management and legal) could have put out, if they had been so inclined. They could have talked Stevie down. (BTW, I have no doubt that Mick and Christine heard about their dancing, too. But they have a very different relationship with Stevie.)

But, Lindsey’s comments before Classic West and what many perceived as a lackluster performance on his part, especially compared to his enthusiastic performances with LBCM, ultimately did him in. A concurrent tour? He’d already proven to management and promoters (which was pretty much one and the same with Classic West) that he couldn’t maintain his enthusiasm for Fleetwood Mac when he was also promoting a new project. It was one of the biggest things Azoff ever did, and Lindsey basically took a dump on it when they were still selling tickets. I think Lindsey made himself a liability in management’s eyes.

I could be wrong, but there’s enough between the lines..

I agree with a lot of this. I think this has even more to do with management than bad blood with Stevie. I believe that Mick is still hurting financially from his last divorce and they quietly whispered to him and the rest of the band, you will make more if you get rid of him. Lindsey as far as i know is the wealthiest of the group; he has made smart financial decisions. The way in which this has played out makes my skin crawl. I hope they all have trouble sleeping at night.

I wouldn't pay $1.00 to see Fleetwood Mac

[Sugar Mouse]

He is not a victim.

The courts will ultimately decide if Lindsey was a victim here but he's got a very tough road to winning the case. He's suing for breach of fiduciary duty, breach of oral contract, and international interference with prospective economic advantage. He has a weak case for breach of contract as oral contracts don't often hold up these days. He has an even weaker case for international interference with prospective economic advantage. He would have to prove that the band interfered with his solo career. If anything, all the media attention is helping his solo career. His only decent case is for breach of fiduciary duty but that's not a strong case as he apparently doesn't have a written contract. I wish Lindsey the best in settling this case because the band is likely to win if it goes to court.

[jmn3]

The courts will ultimately decide if Lindsey was a victim here but he's got a very tough road to winning the case. He's suing for breach of fiduciary duty, breach of oral contract, and international interference with prospective economic advantage. He has a weak case for breach of contract as oral contracts don't often hold up these days. He has an even weaker case for international interference with prospective economic advantage. He would have to prove that the band interfered with his solo career. If anything, all the media attention is helping his solo career. His only decent case is for breach of fiduciary duty but that's not a strong case as he apparently doesn't have a written contract. I wish Lindsey the best in settling this case because the band is likely to win if it goes to court.

Hopefully the folks at Loeb and Loeb know how to contact you for legal advice.

[SteveMacD]

Once again, we get the claim that his performance at Classic West was "lackluster." It was not perceived that way by anyone but hypercritical fans, and therefore did not damage Fleetwood Mac at all. I have posted in the past gushing reviews from actual critics and have refuted this "lackluster" argument before but sadly, that doesn't keep it from getting repeated.

BTW, I wonder which sells more tickets: the Rumours 5 (even after Lindsey makes one comment about doing CW for the money), or a kinda-not-really-"classic" version of the band since it has two new guys (one of whom is almost unknown in America) which has alienated fans on an unprecedented level?

You can bet Azoff knew the answer to that question long before the band found it out the hard way.

No, I'm not pinning this on him.
The show got a terrible review in the L.A. Times (http://www.latimes.com/entertainment/music/la-et-ms-fleetwood-mac-classic-west-20170717-story.html), which is probably the most important review as far as they were concerned.

[Sugar Mouse]

Hopefully the folks at Loeb and Loeb know how to contact you for legal advice.

I'm sure the lawyers at Loeb and Loeb know they have a very weak case. That's why they released the legal documents to the press rather than sending them to the band. US Weekly received the legal papers before the band did. The goal of the lawyers is to drive up media support for Lindsey with the hope that the band settles quickly. Without a written contract, they know that they are likely to lose if this goes to court.

[saniette]

The show got a terrible review in the L.A. Times (http://www.latimes.com/entertainment/music/la-et-ms-fleetwood-mac-classic-west-20170717-story.html), which is probably the most important review as far as they were concerned.

Yes, and that review criticizes the entire band's performance, not just Lindsey's. Lindsey shouldn't have made that comment, but that review implies that the whole band had the same tacit attitude toward Classic West, hence their uninspired performance.

And why would management wait until Stevie issued an ultimatum to fire Lindsey? The 2018 tour plans with Lindsey were on until something happened between him and Stevie at MusiCares.

[Jondalar]

The reports are that Lindsey didn't have a written contract for the tour. If that's true, he will have a very difficult time winning this case.

Oral contracts count too to an extent.

[saniette]

I'm sure the lawyers at Loeb and Loeb know they have a very weak case. That's why they released the legal documents to the press rather than sending them to the band. US Weekly received the legal papers before the band did. The goal of the lawyers is to drive up media support for Lindsey with the hope that the band settles quickly. Without a written contract, they know that they are likely to lose if this goes to court.

How are you so sure of this? It amazes me how all this supposition is allowed with Lindsey, but never with Stevie. There's never an ulterior motive where she's concerned.

My guess is this will never go to court, as it's in no one's interests to drag this out. Lindsey might not get the amount he's seeking, but he will probably get a settlement of several million. I'd be surprised if the band fights this lawsuit, as it is bad publicity.

[Storms123]

How are you so sure of this? It amazes me how all this supposition is allowed with Lindsey, but never with Stevie. There's never an ulterior motive where she's concerned.

My guess is this will never go to court, as it's in no one's interests to drag this out. Lindsey might not get the amount he's seeking, but he will probably get a settlement of several million. I'd be surprised if the band fights this lawsuit, as it is bad publicity.

It wasn’t sent to the media first. That may be how the band first heard of it, but it’s a matter of public record once it’s filed. Anyone can access it for a fee, hence RS, US weekly and radar on line. I think it’s pretty apparent, all relevant parties are none too shocked he filed. Totally agree with you it won’t go to court. I am sure there is a lot more dirty laundry that needs to be protected

[Jondalar]

He is not a victim.

He is a total victim.

[StevieandChris]

How are you so sure of this? It amazes me how all this supposition is allowed with Lindsey, but never with Stevie. There's never an ulterior motive where she's concerned.

My guess is this will never go to court, as it's in no one's interests to drag this out. Lindsey might not get the amount he's seeking, but he will probably get a settlement of several million. I'd be surprised if the band fights this lawsuit, as it is bad publicity.

:] :thumbsup: :xoxo: :]

Are you kidding? Most of the posts for years — way before this latest drama happened — has been supposition about Stevie, from every facet of her life!

[saniette]

:] :thumbsup: :xoxo: :]

Are you kidding? Most of the posts for years — way before this latest drama happened — has been supposition about Stevie, from every facet of her life!

I don't know about "most of the posts" being supposition about Stevie. In this specific case of Lindsey's firing, any supposition about Stevie tends to get slammed, yet the same people indulge in wild conspiracies about Lindsey's motives. You seem to require hard evidence for anything that might reflect poorly on Stevie, but no such requirement exists for Lindsey. Just an observation. :wavey:

[HomerMcvie]

You mean it's what you get if you don't keep your little demon from going after people?

Like some posters, it won't go away.

[HomerMcvie]

Hopefully the folks at Loeb and Loeb know how to contact you for legal advice.

$he's a ma$ter of all thing$.

[Feather Blade]

Like some posters, it won't go away.

Hmm...yes indeed... ;)

[bombaysaffires]

It wasn’t sent to the media first. That may be how the band first heard of it, but it’s a matter of public record once it’s filed. Anyone can access it for a fee, hence RS, US weekly and radar on line. I think it’s pretty apparent, all relevant parties are none too shocked he filed. Totally agree with you it won’t go to court. I am sure there is a lot more dirty laundry that needs to be protected

yes, it's public, but you'd have to know to go look for it. the accusation is that lindsey's people would have alerted certain people in the media that it was filed or being filed so they would know to go pull it up.

[bombaysaffires]

Oral contracts count too to an extent.

they do in california.

[SteveMacD]

BTW, I wonder which sells more tickets: the Rumours 5 (even after Lindsey makes one comment about doing CW for the money), or a not-really-what-you-remember version of the band with two new guys (one of whom is almost unknown in America) which has alienated fans on an unprecedented level?

You can bet Azoff knew the answer to that question long before the band found it out the hard way.

“Two new guys...” LOL!

It’s not like they got virtual unknowns, like Billy Burnette and Rick Vito.

Mike Campbell is a rock icon and already had some measure of relevance in the Fleetwood Mac universe before joining. As for Neil, he’s had two top-ten hits in the US, and more abroad. For the record, DDIO charted higer in the US than any of Lindsey’s or Christine’s singles. Not bad for someone who’s a virtual unknown in America.

[Storms123]

yes, it's public, but you'd have to know to go look for it. the accusation is that lindsey's people would have alerted certain people in the media that it was filed or being filed so they would know to go pull it up.

Totally get that and understand that perspective. And could very well be the case. The cynic that I am also thinks there are poor interns that want jobs with Radar Online, TMZ, US weekly so badly that they troll the courts websites just for this sort of thing. I am sure they have someone on their payroll for this sort of thing alone.

[lovethemac1]

I'm reminded of herpes...

hahahaha, :lol::lol::lol:, that’s perfect.

[jeets2000]

https://twitter.com/thr/status/1050865460898615296?s=12

Fleetwood Mac's statement to @THR in response to Lindsey Buckingham's complaint: "Fleetwood Mac strongly disputes the allegations presented in Mr. Buckingham’s complaint and looks forward to their day in court"

[rhiannondontgo]

https://twitter.com/thr/status/1050865460898615296?s=12

Fleetwood Mac's statement to @THR in response to Lindsey Buckingham's complaint: "Fleetwood Mac strongly disputes the allegations presented in Mr. Buckingham’s complaint and looks forward to their day in court"

They retained Dan Petrocelli, the same lawyer who represented the Eagles against Don Felder’s suit. I sort of figured that would be the case. This will be interesting to watch to say the least. Doesn’t look like FM is going down without a fight. By the looks of their statement, they have their own side of the story and are eager to tell it.

[rhiannondontgo]

Also, for those who don’t know Petrocelli, let’s just say FM is in very good hands. He is a pretty big name when it comes to lawyers. He’s like the human personification of the blood sucking entertainment attorney stereotype. Even represents Trump and Weinstein.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daniel_M._Petrocelli

[mitzo]

They retained Dan Petrocelli, the same lawyer who represented the Eagles against Don Felder’s suit. I sort of figured that would be the case. This will be interesting to watch to say the least. Doesn’t look like FM is going down without a fight. By the looks of their statement, they have their own side of the story and are eager to tell it.

Bring it on!! I can't wait to hear the other side.

[rhiannondontgo]

Bring it on!! I can't wait to hear the other side.

Same. I’m sure there’s much more to this than we’ve been told. Otherwise they probably wouldn’t be so brazen and would be more likely to just try to settle.

[sands of time]

Even represents Trump and Weinstein.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daniel_M._Petrocelli

So FM will fit right it.

[saniette]

Bring it on!! I can't wait to hear the other side.

Didn't FM already share their side of the story back in April? Do they need to change it now? That would be kind of fishy.

[Sugar Mouse]

It wasn’t sent to the media first. That may be how the band first heard of it, but it’s a matter of public record once it’s filed. Anyone can access it for a fee, hence RS, US weekly and radar on line. I think it’s pretty apparent, all relevant parties are none too shocked he filed. Totally agree with you it won’t go to court. I am sure there is a lot more dirty laundry that needs to be protected

Sirius XM show Feedback reported that US Weekly were the first to receive the legal documents. Classless move by Lindsey's lawyers if you ask me.

[dreamsunwind]

yes, it's public, but you'd have to know to go look for it. the accusation is that lindsey's people would have alerted certain people in the media that it was filed or being filed so they would know to go pull it up.

Part of me still thinks this might've been filed quite a while ago and has already been handled. Lindsey's camp might've given the ok to release it as a way of getting a very official form of his side of the story out.


EDIT:
Nvm I just saw the band response. Major ew at them getting Weinstein's lawyer.

[saniette]

Sirius XM show Feedback reported that US Weekly were the first to receive the legal documents. Classless move by Lindsey's lawyers if you ask me.

As classless as the band never responding to Lindsey's calls and emails, and having Irving Azoff do their dirty work? Sounds like they basically expected/invited Lindsey to bring suit.

[sleepless child]

This whole thing is so darn sad. Lindsey is right. This has hurt their legacy.

I think we have gotten the whole story now from Lindsey's side. And to go forth and sue, knowing that they will sling mud back, tells me he feels justified and is not afraid of what they will say.

I think if it is settled out of court, that will tell me Lindsey is probably telling the "most" truth. These people are too old to act like this. Everything moved very quickly. They wanted him out way before Musicares. They already had Mike lined up. I'm very disappointed in this band that I have spent most of my life following. That Mick wanted to keep going on the tour after John found out he had cancer is awful. That Stevie's management wouldn't even tell her Lindsey's ideas is awful. That Chris would not stick up for Lindsey and that John, who stuck up for him, and is his neighbor would tell him he's not allowed to talk to him? Lord! I say again, I'm glad I didn't buy any tickets for this show.

[SteveMacD]

They retained Dan Petrocelli, the same lawyer who represented the Eagles against Don Felder’s suit. I sort of figured that would be the case. This will be interesting to watch to say the least. Doesn’t look like FM is going down without a fight. By the looks of their statement, they have their own side of the story and are eager to tell it.

https://media.tenor.com/images/b18adbce2a998a87c4d3cb6ca0f5b5ed/tenor.gif

[rhiannondontgo]

Didn't FM already share their side of the story back in April? Do they need to change it now? That would be kind of fishy.

Why did LB claim LB/CM wasn’t supposed to be an FM record when it was? To avoid airing the band’s dirty laundry in public of course. It’s entirely possible that FM was doing the same in their interview and didn’t necessarily want to get into the dirty details about their band’s ugly drama. The lawsuit & LB’s recent interview may have changed their minds. If there is some backstory we don’t know yet, it sounds like the band is ready to tell it.

[SteveMacD]

As classless as the band never responding to Lindsey's calls and emails, and having Irving Azoff do their dirty work? Sounds like they basically expected/invited Lindsey to bring suit.
Legal most likely instructed them to not communicate with him, knowing there would be a lawsuit.

[dreamsunwind]

This whole thing is so darn sad. Lindsey is right. This has hurt their legacy.

I think we have gotten the whole story now from Lindsey's side. And to go forth and sue, knowing that they will sling mud back, tells me he feels justified and is not afraid of what they will say.

I think if it is settled out of court, that will tell me Lindsey is probably telling the "most" truth. These people are too old to act like this. Everything moved very quickly. They wanted him out way before Musicares. They already had Mike lined up. I'm very disappointed in this band that I have spent most of my life following. That Mick wanted to keep going on the tour after John found out he had cancer is awful. That Stevie's management wouldn't even tell her Lindsey's ideas is awful. That Chris would not stick up for Lindsey and that John, who stuck up for him, and is his neighbor would tell him he's not allowed to talk to him? Lord! I say again, I'm glad I didn't buy any tickets for this show.

This probably will settle regardless of who is telling more of the truth. Cases like this, especially when it's high profile figures, VERY rarely go to court because they're just a bunch of messy he said/she said. They'll most likely just come to some settlement and sign an NDA and that will be the end of it.

[SteveMacD]

This probably will settle regardless of who is telling more of the truth. Cases like this, especially when it's high profile figures, VERY rarely go to court because they're just a bunch of messy he said/she said. They'll most likely just come to some settlement and sign an NDA and that will be the end of it.

Just like with Bob Welch.

[rhiannondontgo]

Sirius XM show Feedback reported that US Weekly were the first to receive the legal documents. Classless move by Lindsey's lawyers if you ask me.

I’m not on Lindsey’s side by any means. (In all honesty, I don’t think he deserves a penny from this tour that he is not on and had no written contract for). However, I don’t think this specific point is about class. He just wants some sort of attention and nobody in the band will acknowledge him or hear him out. He knew that they still wouldn’t respond to him even after he filed the suit, so to get his message across to them and the public, he probably felt his only option was sending his suit to the press. I get why he made that decision.

[saniette]

Why did LB claim LB/CM wasn’t supposed to be an FM record when it was? To avoid airing the band’s dirty laundry in public of course. It’s entirely possible that FM was doing the same in their interview and didn’t necessarily want to get into the dirty details about their band’s ugly drama. The lawsuit & LB’s recent interview may have changed their minds. If there is some backstory we don’t know yet, it sounds like the band is ready to tell it.

These are 2 totally different things. There must have been a band decision to not call LB/CM a Fleetwood Mac album, and Lindsey was clearly uncomfortable doing so (putting the publicist on the phone during one interview IIRC).

The corollary would be if Lindsey said we didn't release the album as FM because Stevie said No. The lie was actually protecting Stevie and the band.

In FM's interviews after the firing, they weren't protecting Lindsey - they blamed it all on him being unreasonable essentially. Which seems not to be the case now.

Many people here said the band's story didn't add up, but a lot of others accepted it as gospel. The band should have shared all the details then, as now of course any they do share will just seem self-serving.

[Storms123]

Sirius XM show Feedback reported that US Weekly were the first to receive the legal documents. Classless move by Lindsey's lawyers if you ask me.

I didn’t ask, but Yeah I am sure of all the magazines and media outlets his team would decide to send this to, first, he deemed US Weekly was the way to go.
Perhaps US weekly were the first to actually go on to the LA Superior Court website to get it?

[saniette]

I didn’t ask, but Yeah I am sure of all the magazines and media outlets his team would decide to send this to, first, he deemed US Weekly was the way to go.
Perhaps US weekly were the first to actually go on to the LA Superior Court website to get it?

I agree, it doesn't make sense they would choose US Weekly of all places.

[jmn3]

I agree, it doesn't make sense they would choose US Weekly of all places.

It’s all part of Lindsey’s evil plan to impact Stevie’s RRHOF nomination and Lincoln Nebraska FM ticket sales! I mean obviously when you get fired via telephone from a manager you should just bend over and take it.

[secondhandchain]

Sirius XM show Feedback reported that US Weekly were the first to receive the legal documents. Classless move by Lindsey's lawyers if you ask me.

You think so Mick???? BTW if you don't think not calling Linsdey after ALL The years isn't classless, you have your head up your own a$$ mick more then I think.

[secondhandchain]

Also, for those who don’t know Petrocelli, let’s just say FM is in very good hands. He is a pretty big name when it comes to lawyers. He’s like the human personification of the blood sucking entertainment attorney stereotype. Even represents Trump and Weinstein.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daniel_M._Petrocelli

Double I just threw up in my mouth.

[SteveMacD]

You think so Mick???? BTW if you don't think not calling Linsdey after ALL The years isn't classless, you have your head up your own a$$ mick more then I think.

It was probably an edict from management and legal. The nativity of thinking any of it is personal is almost cute.

[rhiannondontgo]

It was probably an edict from management and legal. The nativity of thinking any of it is personal is almost cute.

Exactly. We aren’t talking about a family squabble or a disagreement among old buddies. This is business. Lindsey said in his statement “Over the last eight months, our many efforts to come to an agreement have unfortunately proved elusive.” Meaning he has been trying since the start to either get back into the band or receive some sort of payout. The band, and their management, knew this and were fully expecting this lawsuit to materialize. So of course no band members were going to converse with him. That’s why John replied by saying he’s not supposed to speak to him. They aren’t kids in a clubhouse deciding Lindsey wasn’t their friend anymore and isn’t allowed to come around. It’s all about the impending legal dispute and all the technicalities on the business end. This is, as Lindsey would say, a “big machine”. FM is responsible for the livelihood of (now) 6 actual band members, a plethora of backing musicians and singers, roadies, security guards, managers, assistants, promoters, sound techs, etc etc. It ain’t about feelings anymore. It’s business. They’re doing what they’re told to do by their management & legal team.

[saniette]

It ain’t about feelings anymore. It’s business. They’re doing what they’re told to do by their management & legal team.

I understand all that, but why is that a valid excuse for their behavior toward Lindsey? So we can just admit this band is all about the money? I'm glad we've confirmed that at least. Obviously, money enters into the equation, but it shouldn't be the driving factor. And not every band would act like this either, so it's not a universal thing.

[rhiannondontgo]

So we can just admit this band is all about the money? I'm glad we've confirmed that at least.

This is a band most famous for their f*cked up interpersonal relationships. Their biggest hits are about hating each other. They didn’t stay together all these years because they enjoyed each other’s company. In fact, their relationships are so strained that S&L couldn’t even have hotel rooms next to each other’s because they found ways to fight through the f’ing walls. It’s never been about liking each other. They’re in this because it’s their job. Sure, they like what they do and enjoy making music and seeing their fans enjoy it. But it’s still a job. They run their business and they get paid for it with lots of money, attention, and fame. We all knew that. And Lindsey isn’t any different. You think he’d want anything to do with this band if he was wildly successful on his own and could sell out Madison Square Garden by himself? No. That’s why there’s this recurring pattern of Lindsey starting solo albums and then somehow having them evolve into FM records so he can expand the amount of people who will buy it and get tickets for the tour that follows it. He doesn’t do that because he misses or loves his band mates so much. He does it to rake in that FM money. The same FM money he’s still trying to rake in via this suit.
Of course they’re going to run this band more like a business than like a friendship. They have countless employees and already-set tour dates with thousands of tickets sold. They aren’t going to go against the advice of their managers and legal team because somebody’s feelings come first. Anybody who thinks that way has absolutely no idea what it’s like to be running a multimillion dollar empire and lives in some kind of fantasy world.

[SteveMacD]

I understand all that, but why is that a valid excuse for their behavior toward Lindsey? So we can just admit this band is all about the money? I'm glad we've confirmed that at least. Obviously, money enters into the equation, but it shouldn't be the driving factor. And not every band would act like this either, so it's not a universal thing.

"I was going to put it less diplomatically, but I stopped myself," he said.

"Do the undiplomatic version," McVie chimed in. "What were you going to say?"

"I was going to say, 'Just close your eyes and take the money,'" Buckingham answered, and the soundstage rippled with laughter again.

[saniette]

This is a band most famous for their f*cked up interpersonal relationships. Their biggest hits are about hating each other. They didn’t stay together all these years because they enjoyed each other’s company. In fact, their relationships are so strained that S&L couldn’t even have hotel rooms next to each other’s because they found ways to fight through the f’ing walls. It’s never been about liking each other. They’re in this because it’s their job. Sure, they like what they do and enjoy making music and seeing their fans enjoy it. But it’s still a job. They run their business and they get paid for it with lots of money, attention, and fame. We all knew that. And Lindsey isn’t any different. You think he’d want anything to do with this band if he was wildly successful on his own and could sell out Madison Square Garden by himself? No. That’s why there’s this recurring pattern of Lindsey starting solo albums and then somehow having them evolve into FM records so he can expand the amount of people who will buy it and get tickets for the tour that follows it. He doesn’t do that because he misses or loves his band mates so much. He does it to rake in that FM money. The same FM money he’s still trying to rake in via this suit.
Of course they’re going to run this band more like a business than like a friendship. They have countless employees and already-set tour dates with thousands of tickets sold. They aren’t going to go against the advice of their managers and legal team because somebody’s feelings come first. Anybody who thinks that way has absolutely no idea what it’s like to be running a multimillion dollar empire and lives in some kind of fantasy world.

A lot of the dysfunction has been exaggerated in this band, and sold as part of the brand. I don't really buy into the myth. There has to be some camaraderie between the band members to function at all, even if it's just on a professional level, and there are moments you can see that even in the ways they interact on stage.

Anyway, none of this explains why Lindsey was fired. He wasn't fired for money reasons, and it would have been cheaper to keep Lindsey in the band. So clearly FM is not run like a standard corporation.

And don't feelings come into play after all? Didn't Stevie's feelings end up trumping all the business considerations? Lindsey was fired due to Stevie feeling fed up with him for whatever the reason is. So I think feelings definitely played a role in Lindsey's firing, not money considerations. Now, of course, it's all about the money, as it is at the dissolution of most relationships. That doesn't negate that feelings are involved.

[dreamsunwind]

"I was going to put it less diplomatically, but I stopped myself," he said.

"Do the undiplomatic version," McVie chimed in. "What were you going to say?"

"I was going to say, 'Just close your eyes and take the money,'" Buckingham answered, and the soundstage rippled with laughter again.

I think you're taking that comment way too seriously. I doubt Irv Azoff gives a crap about a little remark from one of the members of one of the bands he manages. This is Irving Azoff. He is a shark. Glenn Frey dying didn't phase him. As long as Lindsey and the rest of them showed up so that he could make his money, he doesn't care about the details. But when the big seat filler of Fleetwood Mac is threatening to walk, that's when he cares.

[rhiannondontgo]

"I was going to say, 'Just close your eyes and take the money,'" Buckingham answered.

Exactly. Everyone in this band knows that it’s a business first & foremost. Anybody who thinks Lindsey is any different from the rest of the group is delusional. Yes, these musicians may mean a lot to us and we love their art and may even look up to them. But we can’t delude ourselves so much that we can’t recognize that what they do is still a job. FM isn’t unique in this. The eagles don’t get along that well anymore either. Nor do the Stones. Or Heart. Or the GoGos. Pretty much none of the major bands out there record & tour together because they love being around each other. They do it for the money, the fame, and the adoration they get from the fans. It could be worse. At least Fleetwood Mac doesn’t hawk silly merch like KISS does with their coffins and pinball machines and sh*t.

[dreamsunwind]

I didn't realize the lawyer FM got is the same one that represented Don Henley and Glenn Frey against Don Felder. I guess it makes sense but is that necessarily a good idea....? Henley and Frey didn't exactly emerge victorious in that whole situation. Felder took them to the cleaners and permanently tarnished both their reputations. However, he had quite a different case than Lindsey, much more solid in his favor so who knows.

[saniette]

"I was going to put it less diplomatically, but I stopped myself," he said.

"Do the undiplomatic version," McVie chimed in. "What were you going to say?"

"I was going to say, 'Just close your eyes and take the money,'" Buckingham answered, and the soundstage rippled with laughter again.

Right, they all laughed in agreement. I never said Lindsey wasn't interested in the money too. The whole band is. But he's not the one who wants to stop making albums because they don't make money.

Clearly, he only sees greatest hits gigs like Classic West as a money-making enterprise. It was definitely a PR mistake for him to say that, but the fact that he did kind of shows that he has more of an issue with the flagrant money-grubbing gigs like Classic West. I guess that's part of the tension in the band that led to to the breakup. But that doesn't really justify Lindsey's firing. They handled this really poorly.

[rhiannondontgo]

A lot of the dysfunction has been exaggerated in this band, and sold as part of the brand. I don't really buy into the myth. There has to be some camaraderie between the band members to function at all, even if it's just on a professional level, and there are moments you can see that even in the ways they interact on stage.

Anyway, none of this explains why Lindsey was fired. He wasn't fired for money reasons, and it would have been cheaper to keep Lindsey in the band. So clearly FM is not run like a standard corporation.

And don't feelings come into play after all? Didn't Stevie's feelings end up trumping all the business considerations? Lindsey was fired due to Stevie feeling fed up with him for whatever the reason is. So I think feelings definitely played a role in Lindsey's firing, not money considerations. Now, of course, it's all about the money, as it is at the dissolution of most relationships. That doesn't negate that feelings are involved.

I disagree. Lindsey’s firing absolutely came about due to money. Unless there’s a lot more to the story than we know, it doesn’t sound like the whole band had hurt feelings. Only Stevie. Why are Stevie’s feelings dictating the band? Because of the money. When Stevie didn’t want the album to be named Tusk by Mick & Linds, she didn’t get her way. When Stevie didn’t want to listen to Lindsey & the photographer about taking off her top for the cover of BN, she didn’t get her way. When she had a problem with them doing Come live, she didn’t get her way. Her “feelings” then were not any more valued than Lindsey’s are now. Right now it’s her monetary value dictating these decisions, not consideration for her feelings. She isn’t just complaining anymore, she’s saying flat out that she does not want to be around Lindsey Buckingham at all. The band knew they had a tour already planned out, promoters all ready, and fans excited. And now the “face” of the band was threatening to refuse to participate. Yeah FM could’ve just disbanded all together, but that would equal no money for anybody. Or they could’ve let her leave and toured with Lindsey and not her, which would mean some money but not as much as previously thought since literally every promoter (and the vast majority of casual fans) would prefer a Lindsey-less band to a Stevie-less band. They chose to give him the boot because this band is still a business and keeping her happy makes them the maximum amount of money. Simple as that. They don’t care that she’s sad, they only care that she rakes in the big bucks. I wouldn’t be surprised if some members had no problem with LB at all (until this lawsuit of course). But it wasn’t about anybody’s feelings, it was about what made the most sense for their business and their income. Which is also why none of them responded to Lindsey afterwards. It’s all about preserving what’s left of their band and maximizing their future opportunities.
It could very well be about longevity also. They’re bound to last longer and continue carrying on a fan base if they have Stevie around than if they only had Linds around. How many people would buy an FM record without her? Not many. In this situation, from a business perspective, the only real option for them to continue their commercial success and have job security is to keep her around.
If Lindsey was the more successful of the group, they would’ve thrown Stevie out in two seconds. And I doubt Lindsey would’ve objected. Business trumps feelings.

[dreamsunwind]

I disagree. Lindsey’s firing absolutely came about due to money. Unless there’s a lot more to the story than we know, it doesn’t sound like the whole band had hurt feelings. Only Stevie. Why are Stevie’s feelings dictating the band? Because of the money. When Stevie didn’t want the album to be named Tusk by Mick & Linds, she didn’t get her way. When Stevie didn’t want to listen to Lindsey & the photographer about taking off her top for the cover of BN, she didn’t get her way. When she had a problem with them doing Come live, she didn’t get her way. Her “feelings” then were not any more valued than Lindsey’s are now. Right now it’s her monetary value dictating these decisions, not consideration for her feelings. She isn’t just complaining anymore, she’s saying flat out that she does not want to be around Lindsey Buckingham at all. The band knew they had a tour already planned out, promoters all ready, and fans excited. And now the “face” of the band was threatening to refuse to participate. Yeah FM could’ve just disbanded all together, but that would equal no money for anybody. Or they could’ve let her leave and toured with Lindsey and not her, which would mean some money but not as much as previously thought since literally every promoter (and the vast majority of casual fans) would prefer a Lindsey-less band to a Stevie-less band. They chose to give him the boot because this band is still a business and keeping her happy makes them the maximum amount of money. Simple as that. They don’t care that she’s sad, they only care that she rakes in the big bucks. I wouldn’t be surprised if some members had no problem with LB at all (until this lawsuit of course). But it wasn’t about anybody’s feelings, it was about what made the most sense for their business and their income. Which is also why none of them responded to Lindsey afterwards. It’s all about preserving what’s left of their band and maximizing their future opportunities.
It could very well be about longevity also. They’re bound to last longer and continue carrying on a fan base if they have Stevie around than if they only had Linds around. How many people would buy an FM record without her? Not many. In this situation, from a business perspective, the only real option for them to continue their commercial success and have job security is to keep her around.
If Lindsey was the more successful of the group, they would’ve thrown Stevie out in two seconds. And I doubt Lindsey would’ve objected. Business trumps feelings.


I agree about the BN photoshoot but I see no reason why the band should've not named the album Tusk or not done Come live just because Stevie didn't like it? That's not a great example of the band not caring about Stevie's feelings because those were ridiculous feelings to begin with. Things like that are just more examples of how Stevie has a childish side to her, can be quite petty and always has. However now, as you said, she's leveraged her monetary value to back that up, which is a big part of how what's happened happened.

And I think Lindsey would've objected. He objected to bringing in Sheryl Crow to take Christine's spot. And he objected to replacing John. And I'm not saying he would've objected because he cares about Stevie, but because he cares about the legacy of the band. That clearly was something that mattered to him.

[rhiannondontgo]

I agree about the BN photoshoot but I see no reason why the band should've not named the album Tusk or not done Come live just because Stevie didn't like it? That's not a great example of the band not caring about Stevie's feelings because those were ridiculous feelings to begin with. Things like that are just more examples of how Stevie has a childish side to her, can be quite petty and always has. However now, as you said, she's leveraged her monetary value to back that up, which is a big part of how what's happened happened.

And I think Lindsey would've objected. He objected to bringing in Sheryl Crow to take Christine's spot. And he objected to replacing John. And I'm not saying he would've objected because he cares about Stevie, but because he cares about the legacy of the band. That clearly was something that mattered to him.

I’m not saying all of her complaints were right or should have been followed. I’m just saying she has a long history of airing her feelings and not getting her way for it. Which is how you know this isn’t just about feelings, it’s about her monetary value which is actually being threatened for the first time in a very long time.
And in all honesty, I agree that Lindsey does care about the “legacy”. Not because he’s a saint or genuinely cares more about the fans than the others do, but because he knows the legacy is his biggest value. The way Stevie’s value is putting butts in seats and raising ticket costs. The biggest thing LB brings to the table is the nostalgic feelings you get from watching this legendary band of two feuding couples perform together. My mom (a diehard FM/Stevie fan since she was 13) first reacted to his firing with “Oh no, now we’re not gonna get all those dramatic Silver Springs moments anymore!” It wasn’t about missing his voice or his guitar playing for her. There’s other people who can sing well and play amazing guitar. I mean we’ve now replaced him two times and both times the final product of the replacements playing/singing wasn’t bad on the ears or a disgrace musically. What’s missing with LB “replacements” is the feelings and the rich history behind the performance. He knows that as well as we do. That’s why 20,000 people show up to see him sing Go Your Own Way and Second Hand News while staring right at Stevie as she sings back up, but only like a thousand people will show up to see the same guy do the same kick ass performance of the same songs on his own. It’s about the band’s (and more notably, the couple’s) history and the legacy. That’s what he brings to the table.
If the positions were switched and he was the one with all the monetary value and public notoriety, I doubt he would give a sh*t about anyone’s “legacy”. He has to care now because that’s what made him valuable to the band above anything else.

[bwboy]

I’m not saying all of her complaints were right or should have been followed. I’m just saying she has a long history of airing her feelings and not getting her way for it. Which is how you know this isn’t just about feelings, it’s about her monetary value which is actually being threatened for the first time in a very long time.
And in all honesty, I agree that Lindsey does care about the “legacy”. Not because he’s a saint or genuinely cares more about the fans than the others do, but because he knows the legacy is his biggest value. The way Stevie’s value is putting butts in seats and raising ticket costs. The biggest thing LB brings to the table is the nostalgic feelings you get from watching this legendary band of two feuding couples perform together. My mom (a diehard FM/Stevie fan since she was 13) first reacted to his firing with “Oh no, now we’re not gonna get all those dramatic Silver Springs moments anymore!” It wasn’t about missing his voice or his guitar playing for her. There’s other people who can sing well and play amazing guitar. I mean we’ve now replaced him two times and both times the final product of the replacements playing/singing wasn’t bad on the ears or a disgrace musically. What’s missing with LB “replacements” is the feelings and the rich history behind the performance. He knows that as well as we do. That’s why 20,000 people show up to see him sing Go Your Own Way and Second Hand News while staring right at Stevie as she sings back up, but only like a thousand people will show up to see the same guy do the same kick ass performance of the same songs on his own. It’s about the band’s (and more notably, the couple’s) history and the legacy. That’s what he brings to the table.
If the positions were switched and he was the one with all the monetary value and public notoriety, I doubt he would give a sh*t about anyone’s “legacy”. He has to care now because that’s what made him valuable to the band above anything else.

Rhiannondontgo, I'm at a loss for words- I really can't disagree with anything you said, and I think you actually nailed the casual fan reaction to Lindsey and Stevie's stage dynamic. Once you said this, I could totally see it in my head.

[jwd]

Some interesting points from reading the complaint filed by Lindsey.

They are all equal members. Band decisions are made by unanimous vote, not majority rules. Lindsey didn't vote himself out of FM. He's still a member, and rightfully so. So unless he did something so egregiously wrong, he's in.

He's laying claim to "FM". It's not just Mick and John's band, it's all five members' band. Due to the record of fact of what he has done for the "business" via songwriting, producing, performing, recording, directing and the commercial success the "business" has attained while doing so. Unless it can be proven that he should not legally be a member.

He's laying claim to not only 20 percent of the proceeds of the current tour, but any subsequent tour and all merchandising proceeds etc. Lindsey has a an invested stake in "FM" and should be compensated accordingly.

So Fleetwood Mac continues and pays Lindsey, or they dissolve. Unless they can prove him not to be a legal member of said partnership.


DAMN, this is going to get ugly. I firmly believe there will be no so called reunion of The Rumours Five ever. IT'S OVER!

[SteveMacD]

I think you're taking that comment way too seriously.
Am I? I remember cringing when I heard him say it and thinking that would have been a fireable offense in any other band. And low and behold he got fired.

I doubt Irv Azoff gives a crap about a little remark from one of the members of one of the bands he manages.
Azoff was also promoting a festival he was heavily invested in, and someone in the headline act publicly took a dump on it while tickets were still on sale. Do you think Lindsey made an ally with that comment?

And, while that remark alone likely wouldn’t be enough to get him fired from Fleetwood Mac, it certainly put him under the microscope. He very publicly expressed a lack of enthusiasm for the show, and their show was subsequently panned as being lifeless, void of chemistry and drama, like they were sleepwalking through the show. Sure, there was probably enough blame to spread all around the band for that, but the LBCM tour had been getting great reviews, especially for the chemistry between Lindsey and Christine, and there was only one member who publicly expressed a lack of enthusiasm about doing the show in the first place. It was like it became a self-fulfilling prophecy.

Then when they were negotiating, he requested a delay for a solo album, which he admittedly rescinded, but I think by that point things started snowballing. A concurrent tour was laughable. If he couldn’t bring the same level of enthusiasm he had for a new project back into the band for two major festival shows, how was a concurrent tour work?

The blowup over Rhiannon (or any of their songs) getting played prior to their grand entrance and the smirk (which I bet they all got an earful over) was just enough to set Stevie over the edge. Now, normally Azoff would be the Stevie whisperer, but Lindsey hadn’t exactly made himself an endearing figure by that point and possibly a liability in Azoff’s eyes. Since Lindsey didn’t sign off on the tour, it was just easier to replace one icon with another. Much like he did with the Eagles.

[Storms123]

Some interesting points from reading the complaint filed by Lindsey.

They are all equal members. Band decisions are made by unanimous vote, not majority rules. Lindsey didn't vote himself out of FM. He's still a member, and rightfully so. So unless he did something so egregiously wrong, he's in.

He's laying claim to "FM". It's not just Mick and John's band, it's all five members' band. Due to the record of fact of what he has done for the "business" via songwriting, producing, performing, recording, directing and the commercial success the "business" has attained while doing so. Unless it can be proven that he should not legally be a member.

He's laying claim to not only 20 percent of the proceeds of the current tour, but any subsequent tour and all merchandising proceeds etc. Lindsey has a an invested stake in "FM" and should be compensated accordingly.

So Fleetwood Mac continues and pays Lindsey, or they dissolve. Unless they can prove him not to be a legal member of said partnership.


DAMN, this is going to get ugly. I firmly believe there will be no so called reunion of The Rumours Five ever. IT'S OVER!

LOL It's definitely gonna get ugly. I still don't see it going to court, but there could be one final reunion of the Rumours 5 if only to make back all of the money could lose ( and think about all the money they would make) if they don't at least break even on this one. Mick's child support, alimony and bankruptcy's alone. Maybe they can team up with The Eagles for a "Hell Refroze" tour?
Given the legal ramifications though, do they want to make more or less on this tour? Honestly I don't know???

[jwd]

LOL It's definitely gonna get ugly. I still don't see it going to court, but there could be one final reunion of the Rumours 5 if only to make back all of the money could lose ( and think about all the money they would make) if they don't at least break even on this one. Mick's child support, alimony and bankruptcy's alone. Maybe they can team up with The Eagles for a "Hell Refroze" tour?
Given the legal ramifications though, do they want to make more or less on this tour? Honestly I don't know???

Would you attend that farce? I honestly couldn't. It's not over for just them, it's over for a lot of their fans too.

[secondhandchain]

[/B]

LOL It's definitely gonna get ugly. I still don't see it going to court, but there could be one final reunion of the Rumours 5 if only to make back all of the money could lose ( and think about all the money they would make) if they don't at least break even on this one. Mick's child support, alimony and bankruptcy's alone. Maybe they can team up with The Eagles for a "Hell Refroze" tour?
Given the legal ramifications though, do they want to make more or less on this tour? Honestly I don't know???

No WAY. They are done.

[rhiannondontgo]

Band decisions are made by unanimous vote, not majority rules. Lindsey didn't vote himself out of FM. He's still a member, and rightfully so. So unless he did something so egregiously wrong, he's in.

My question about this point is: is there any actual written contract outlining this rule or was this just an informal way that they had been conducting business to try to please as many members as possible and keep fighting to a minimum? It said at one point in the lawsuit that there “has never been an overarching band agreement detailing the various member’s rights and obligations”. So unless i’m misunderstanding this line and it doesn’t apply to the “unanimous partners” aspect, it seems like this way of doing business wasn’t any written contractual obligation. Seems to just be a casual way they chose to handle disagreements together. Like a family etching out house rules to hang on their refrigerator just to make home life more peaceful.
Also, this band has a long history of majority-rules voting. As we were discussing earlier, there’s been lots of times that a certain member was against something that happened anyway (like Stevie being against naming the album Tusk for example). So it doesn’t sound like this rule Lindsey speaks of has always been enforced. And it certainly doesn’t sound like it was a legal contractual agreement.
(I could be wrong here. I’m actually not trying to be argumentative here, i’m genuinely asking if anyone knows if this point was an actual written agreement.)

[SteveMacD]

They are all equal members. Band decisions are made by unanimous vote, not majority rules. Lindsey didn't vote himself out of FM. He's still a member, and rightfully so. So unless he did something so egregiously wrong, he's in.

He's laying claim to "FM". It's not just Mick and John's band, it's all five members' band. Due to the record of fact of what he has done for the "business" via songwriting, producing, performing, recording, directing and the commercial success the "business" has attained while doing so. Unless it can be proven that he should not legally be a member.
Mick and John are the exclusive owners of the name, but it became an equal partnership in 1976, IIRC.

Ultimately, I think this will play out like what happened with Cheap Trick and Bun E. Carlos.

From his Wikipedia page


In 2013, Carlos filed a lawsuit against his former Cheap Trick bandmates, claiming that even though they claimed that he was still a band member, he was not being allowed to participate in band-related activities. The remaining three members of Cheap Trick filed a countersuit, seeking an official affirmation of their removal of Carlos. Their lawsuit was thrown out by a Delaware judge in late 2013.[7]

On February 26, 2015, Robin Zander announced that the lawsuit was over. “We’ve settled our differences,” Zander continued. “Bun E.’s a member of the band, but he’s not touring and he’s not recording. … We’ve had our differences, but we’re all settled up now and hopefully we can forget about that era. These decisions that Cheap Trick makes, Bun E. is part of.” Carlos is a business partner in the Cheap Trick merchandising business and remains involved in their releases of older material which he participated in the recording of:

[jwd]

My question about this point is: is there any actual written contract outlining this rule or was this just an informal way that they had been conducting business to try to please as many members as possible and keep fighting to a minimum? It said at one point in the lawsuit that there “has never been an overarching band agreement detailing the various member’s rights and obligations”. So unless i’m misunderstanding this line and it doesn’t apply to the “unanimous partners” aspect, it seems like this way of doing business wasn’t any written contractual obligation. Seems to just be a casual way they chose to handle disagreements together. Like a family etching out house rules to hang on their refrigerator just to make home life more peaceful.
Also, this band has a long history of majority-rules voting. As we were discussing earlier, there’s been lots of times that a certain member was against something that happened anyway (like Stevie being against naming the album Tusk for example). So it doesn’t sound like this rule Lindsey speaks of has always been enforced. And it certainly doesn’t sound like it was a legal contractual agreement.
(I could be wrong here. I’mactyallyn not trying to be argumentative here, i’m genuinely asking if anyone knows if this point was an actual written agreement.)

I'm not a legal expert by any means, but oral agreements are legitimate. If indeed the court can determine there was such an agreement, it will stand up in a court of law. There doesn't have to be a written contract.

[jwd]

Mick and John are the exclusive owners of the name, but it became an equal partnership in 1976, IIRC.

Ultimately, I think this will play out like what happened with Cheap Trick and Bun E. Carlos.

From his Wikipedia page


I wonder how much money Lindsey would settle for. 14M is peanuts!

[rhiannondontgo]

I'm not a legal expert by any means, but oral agreements are legitimate. If indeed the court can determine there was such an agreement, it will stand up in a court of law. There doesn't have to be a written contract.

Has anybody here ever heard of them having this rule before? The band has been legally a partnership since 76 apparently, yet there’s been many times that certain members hated something but had to go through with it anyway. If it was an equal partnership and one member could put a stop to any band decision, i’m positive Stevie wouldn’t just have objected to the name Tusk but also would’ve put a stop to putting the dog on the cover (which irritated her endlessly according to band insiders). She also says she was 110% against putting I Don’t Want To Know on Rumours and dramatially claims she “had to record it with a gun to her head”. And again she was apparently very against them performing the song Come on tour.
Stevie, as much as I love her, is one of the most stubborn, petty, controlling artists I know of. If she had the power to put a stop to any of these things that she hated due to an “equal partnership ruled by unanimous voting”, there’s no way she wouldn’t have used that power to get her way time and time again.

[Storms123]

Would you attend that farce? I honestly couldn't. It's not over for just them, it's over for a lot of their fans too.

Didn't say I would attend, just said I can see it. Doesn't make sense, but nothing these people do make sense. Mick has no scruples

[jwd]

Has anybody here ever heard of them having this rule before? The band has been legally a partnership since 76 apparently, yet there’s been many times that certain members hated something but had to go through with it anyway. If it was an equal partnership and one member could put a stop to any band decision, i’m positive Stevie wouldn’t just have objected to the name Tusk but also would’ve put a stop to putting the dog on the cover (which irritated her endlessly according to band insiders). She also says she was 110% against putting I Don’t Want To Know on Rumours and dramatially claims she “had to record it with a gun to her head”. And again she was apparently very against them performing the song Come on tour.
Stevie, as much as I love her, is one of the most stubborn, petty, controlling artists I know of. If she had the power to put a stop to any of these things that she hated due to an “equal partnership ruled by unanimous voting”, there’s no way she wouldn’t have used that power to get her way time and time again.

I think some things are more important than others. Deciding what goes on an album cover or which song to be included on an album can be reached by consensus or a majority rules decision. When you're talking about dismissing a member of the band or touring conditions, that's a whole other ballgame.

[Storms123]

I'm not a legal expert by any means, but oral agreements are legitimate. If indeed the court can determine there was such an agreement, it will stand up in a court of law. There doesn't have to be a written contract.

They are completely legit if you have supportive docs---unfortunately, I know too much about this. Oral/Verbal agreements are real and it holds up in court. It's legit---Lindsey has a case, and I am sure the band has their perspective too. Will be interesting.

[rhiannondontgo]

I think some things are more important than others. Deciding what goes on an album cover or which song to be included on an album can be reached by consensus or a majority rules decision. When you're talking about dismissing a member of the band or touring conditions, that's a whole other ballgame.

I agree that Stevie’s concessions are quite minimal and not that big of a deal, but I think they have a good defense when it comes to him claiming that all band decisions have to be agreed upon unanimously. It doesn’t seem like it’s that ironclad if he has no written contract showing that this agreement existed and FM has an arsenal of examples of times certain partners opposed something that ultimately continued due to a “majority rules” school of voting.

[jwd]

Didn't say I would attend, just said I can see it. Doesn't make sense, but nothing these people do make sense. Mick has no scruples

The bigger question is whether Lindsey would still be willing to do it. Or Stevie. You know she never wants to be on stage with him ever again. Stranger things have happened. Maybe they will have one last big kumbaya moment.

[jwd]

I agree that Stevie’s concessions are quite minimal and not that big of a deal, but I think they have a good defense when it comes to him claiming that all band decisions have to be agreed upon unanimously. It doesn’t seem like it’s that ironclad if he has no written contract showing that this agreement existed and FM has an arsenal of examples of times certain partners opposed something that ultimately continued due to a “majority rules” school of voting.

I think that there would be something to substantiate that those big decisions were to be reached by unanimous vote. Testimony from the other band members perhaps or other examples in the bands' history to prove it. Here come the judge!

[jwd]

They are completely legit if you have supportive docs---unfortunately, I know too much about this. Oral/Verbal agreements are real and it holds up in court. It's legit---Lindsey has a case, and I am sure the band has their perspective too. Will be interesting.

I think a lot of it has to do with intent. They all intended to go on tour with Lindsey. That was his understanding. The band had discussions about it. There were discussions with Live Nation. That in itself constitutes an oral agreement.

[SteveMacD]

When you're talking about dismissing a member of the band or touring conditions, that's a whole other ballgame.

Is it even possible to have unanimous consent when terminating an equal partner?

[bombaysaffires]

No WAY. They are done.

People are clearly forgetting or ignoring Stevie's very clear statement that she DOES NOT WANT TO SHARE A STAGE WITH HIM AGAIN. she felt so strongly about this she issued a straight up ultimatum to the band.

She has refused to record with him since 2003, albeit in public using more evasive methods to describe it, e.g. blaming the lackluster sales of albums an such. But she was done with recording with him then and has never done it since.

She will not suddenly change her mind, imho, and miraculously want to tour with him to make more money,. She could have done this this time, and clearly did not. She felt so strongly about not sharing a stage with him again she was willing to forego the tour altogether, knowing she could go out again solo. (But she also knew which way they'd choose so how much of a gamble was it really?)

Anyway, the chances of them doing any sort of reunion on tour from where I sit is a big fat zero.

Next time they'll all be together will be in court (which won't need to happen, the lawyers will handle everything) or one of their funerals. If Stevie gets in the RRHOF LB certainly won't show up, and I doubt John will.

[Storms123]

I think a lot of it has to do with intent. They all intended to go on tour with Lindsey. That was his understanding. The band had discussions about it. There were discussions with Live Nation. That in itself constitutes an oral agreement.

Exactly! And the Live Nation component is an interesting one. Which "formation" of FM did they think they were getting and were ticket sales impacted by the "formation" they got. I am definitely not looking to go down a legal rabbit hole. I am not a lawyer (nor do I want to be one), but through no fault of my own, I can tell you 100% oral/verbal contracts are 100% real and hold up in a court of law .

[jwd]

Is it even possible to have unanimous consent when terminating an equal partner?

No! :laugh: Unless partner votes himself/herself out. You'd have to prove him "unfit", for lack of a better word, to be a member of the partnership. A serious offense detrimental to the partnership's continuation. That's where it's going to get ugly.

[Storms123]

The bigger question is whether Lindsey would still be willing to do it. Or Stevie. You know she never wants to be on stage with him ever again. Stranger things have happened. Maybe they will have one last big kumbaya moment.

I think it's been easily confirmed, Mick will do anything for a $$$. Rest of them, not so sure, but they also don't have the spending/ex-wife problem he has.

[jwd]

I recommend everyone read the complaint. It's very informative and revealing. Lindsey states his case very well. And unless FM can prove he did something seriously wrong to disrupt the partnership known as FM, I think he'll win. At least a hell of a lot of money.

[SteveMacD]

I recommend everyone read the complaint. It's very informative and revealing. Lindsey states his case very well. And unless FM can prove he did something seriously wrong to disrupt the partnership known as FM, I think he'll win. At least a hell of a lot of money.

I like how he mentions them opening for Crosby, Stills, & Nash in 1994, but conveniently leaves out that he opened for Tina Turner in 1993. He used them just as much as they used him when all of their careers were in the toilet in the mid-90s. He saw the success of the Eagles and Page-Plant reunions. They all did, as did the label, Clear Channel (iHeart Radio), Viacom, etc.

[jwd]

I like how he mentions them opening for Crosby, Stills, & Nash in 1994, but conveniently leaves out that he opened for Tina Turner in 1993. He used them just as much as they used him when all of their careers were in the toilet in the mid-90s. He saw the success of the Eagles and Page-Plant reunions. They all did, as did the label, Clear Channel (iHeart Radio), Viacom, etc.


Moral of the story is that they're better together than apart. Something we've all known for a very long time now.

[dreamsunwind]

I like how he mentions them opening for Crosby, Stills, & Nash in 1994, but conveniently leaves out that he opened for Tina Turner in 1993. He used them just as much as they used him when all of their careers were in the toilet in the mid-90s. He saw the success of the Eagles and Page-Plant reunions. They all did, as did the label, Clear Channel (iHeart Radio), Viacom, etc.

I get what you're saying but the thing is, "Lindsey Buckingham" (as in solo) was NEVER a big name and was certainly never 1/16th as big of a name as "Fleetwood Mac". Fleetwood Mac as an opening act is a genuine embarrassment for them. Lindsey solo as an opening act isn't.

[dreamsunwind]

Am I? I remember cringing when I heard him say it and thinking that would have been a fireable offense in any other band. And low and behold he got fired.


Azoff was also promoting a festival he was heavily invested in, and someone in the headline act publicly took a dump on it while tickets were still on sale. Do you think Lindsey made an ally with that comment?

And, while that remark alone likely wouldn’t be enough to get him fired from Fleetwood Mac, it certainly put him under the microscope. He very publicly expressed a lack of enthusiasm for the show, and their show was subsequently panned as being lifeless, void of chemistry and drama, like they were sleepwalking through the show. Sure, there was probably enough blame to spread all around the band for that, but the LBCM tour had been getting great reviews, especially for the chemistry between Lindsey and Christine, and there was only one member who publicly expressed a lack of enthusiasm about doing the show in the first place. It was like it became a self-fulfilling prophecy.

Then when they were negotiating, he requested a delay for a solo album, which he admittedly rescinded, but I think by that point things started snowballing. A concurrent tour was laughable. If he couldn’t bring the same level of enthusiasm he had for a new project back into the band for two major festival shows, how was a concurrent tour work?

The blowup over Rhiannon (or any of their songs) getting played prior to their grand entrance and the smirk (which I bet they all got an earful over) was just enough to set Stevie over the edge. Now, normally Azoff would be the Stevie whisperer, but Lindsey hadn’t exactly made himself an endearing figure by that point and possibly a liability in Azoff’s eyes. Since Lindsey didn’t sign off on the tour, it was just easier to replace one icon with another. Much like he did with the Eagles.

Yes I really think you are. I think you're probably one of few people who has seen it as that big of a deal. He made one little comment that I don't think many people even paid too much attention to, especially not the majority of the casual concertgoers. I highly doubt it put him under any microscopes. Everyone still showed up, the fans bought tickets, they made big bucks and so I'm sure Irv Azoff was content. And I'm absolutely positive that unless they'd ran around slandering the entire entity of Fleetwood Mac and the music industry itself, no one would have ever been fired from Fleetwood Mac had it not been for the big money maker threatening to walk.

[SteveMacD]

Moral of the story is that they're better together than apart. Something we've all known for a very long time now.
Exactly.

I get what you're saying but the thing is, "Lindsey Buckingham" (as in solo) was NEVER a big name and was certainly never 1/16th as big of a name as "Fleetwood Mac". Fleetwood Mac as an opening act is a genuine embarrassment for them. Lindsey solo as an opening act isn't.
The flip side is that Lindsey was promoting a critically acclaimed solo album that for which he made videos and did a lot of TV promotion. Fleetwood Mac only had a song on an obscure World Cup soundtrack, and never did shows in support of Time.

[David]

The show got a terrible review in the L.A. Times (http://www.latimes.com/entertainment/music/la-et-ms-fleetwood-mac-classic-west-20170717-story.html), which is probably the most important review as far as they were concerned.
Where on EARTH do you GET that idea?!

Are you actually promulgating the notion that snarky comments and negative reviews impelled these bigwig lawyers and corporate heads to take this action?

Did they just not see or decide to ignore the praise lavished on the band in publications that have every bit of the cachet of the L.A. Times?

https://www.billboard.com/articles/columns/rock/7866240/fleetwood-mac-dodger-stadium-classic-west

https://variety.com/2017/music/news/concert-review-classic-west-fleetwood-mac-journey-earth-wind-fire-classic-west-1202497817/

https://www.forbes.com/sites/stevebaltin/2017/07/17/fleetwood-macs-classic-west-performance-a-well-deserved-celebration/#2b80f0ee356e

https://ew.com/music/2017/07/17/classic-west-6-standout-moments-the-eagles-fleetwood-mac-more/

Steve, you have to let your strange notion go. It's barmy!

[SteveMacD]

Yes I really think you are. I think you're probably one of few people who has seen it as that big of a deal.
I’m also one of the few people who here who has actual experience in the music industry.

[Sugar Mouse]

No! :laugh: Unless partner votes himself/herself out. You'd have to prove him "unfit", for lack of a better word, to be a member of the partnership. A serious offense detrimental to the partnership's continuation. That's where it's going to get ugly.

Fleetwood Mac is owned by Mick Fleetwood and John McVie. All the others are technically contracted employees.

[SteveMacD]

Fleetwood Mac is owned by Mick Fleetwood and John McVie. All the others are technically contracted employees.

They own the name, but it was an equal partnership. Stevie and Lindsey were made equal partners in 1976.

[StevieandChris]

[QUOTE=dreamsunwind;1240511]Yes I really think you are. I think you're probably one of few people who has seen it as that big of a deal. He made one little comment that I don't think many people even paid too much attention to, especially not the majority of the casual concertgoers. I highly doubt it put him under any microscopes. Everyone still showed up, the fans bought tickets, they made big bucks and so I'm sure Irv Azoff was content. And I'm absolutely positive that unless they'd ran around slandering the entire entity of Fleetwood Mac and the music industry itself, no one would have ever been fired from Fleetwood Mac had it not been for the big money maker threatening to walk.[/QUOTE

I think Azoff’s feeling about Lindsey do come into play, because Azhoff had to know Lindsey would eventually fight back if the band fired him. Especially if it meant breaking a contract. So it seems Azoff must be pretty confident the band did nothing wrong or else why chance it and why not get everyone to explain to Stevie the threat she faced if Lindsey sued and won? All will come out in court.

[rhiannondontgo]

I’m also one of the few people who here who has actual experience in the music industry.

I may be the minority but I think your point is somewhat valid. While I find it impossible that Azoff would want Lindsey fired specifically for one snarky comment, I do agree that LB’s reaction to the festival could have come into play even if it’s just in a small way. If Lindsey was willing to air his grievances with the entire public that night, I would imagine he had already shared that same sentiment with Azoff & the rest of the band beforehand when it was first being presented to them. I could see his recent complaints and attitude causing Azoff not to fight that hard for him to stay. It’s definitely not why he was booted out of the band, but it probably made picking a side an even easier decision for Azoff.

[SteveMacD]

Where on EARTH do you GET that idea?!

Are you actually promulgating the notion that snarky comments and negative reviews impelled these bigwig lawyers and corporate heads to take this action?

Did they just not see or decide to ignore the praise lavished on the band in publications that have every bit of the cachet of the L.A. Times?

I think they went with the article that validated their own opinions of the show. Plus, the Times reviewer actually contrasted his opinion of CW to the OWTS concert he saw. It was arguably more nuanced than the others.

[secondhandchain]

I’m also one of the few people who here who has actual experience in the music industry.

I was in a band for years and am now a movie trailer editor. I deal with music and mx clearing all the time. All I have to do is ask for instrumentals or stems and I can get them. So there are probably more then a few. I've been trying to get FM in one of my pieces for years but it never seems to work out. If Lindsey's "don't look down" isn't good for Angry Birds 2 I don't know what is!

[HomerMcvie]

I was in a band for years and am now a movie trailer editor. I deal with music and mx clearing all the time. All I have to do is ask for instrumentals or stems and I can get them. So there are probably more then a few. I've been trying to get FM in one of my pieces for years but it never seems to work out. If Lindsey's "don't look down" isn't good for Angry Birds 2 I don't know what is!

:xoxo::xoxo::xoxo::xoxo::xoxo:

[Jondalar]

I was in a band for years and am now a movie trailer editor. I deal with music and mx clearing all the time. All I have to do is ask for instrumentals or stems and I can get them. So there are probably more then a few. I've been trying to get FM in one of my pieces for years but it never seems to work out. If Lindsey's "don't look down" isn't good for Angry Birds 2 I don't know what is!

Awesome job

[secondhandchain]

:xoxo::xoxo::xoxo::xoxo::xoxo:

And this guy up /\ there is in the mx business.

[secondhandchain]

Awesome job

Well I haven't got them in yet so... But anyway, I'm now only going to try and get LB's stuff in.
BTW,do you want to know the most money a song put in one of my trailers made? 650,000 paid, to a very famous band for use in all the movie marketing. Guess who picked the song? ME! Guess how much extra money I got for getting them that money????? NONE!

[HomerMcvie]

And this guy up /\ there is in the mx business.

I've been in the music bidness for 28 years. Paid all my bills and multiple properties off with the music bidness monies. Spend my life at 49 doing as little as possible, thanks to the music bidness. Imma needs me an award or something.:lol:

[StreetAngel86]

The courts will ultimately decide if Lindsey was a victim here but he's got a very tough road to winning the case. He's suing for breach of fiduciary duty, breach of oral contract, and international interference with prospective economic advantage. He has a weak case for breach of contract as oral contracts don't often hold up these days. He has an even weaker case for international interference with prospective economic advantage. He would have to prove that the band interfered with his solo career. If anything, all the media attention is helping his solo career. His only decent case is for breach of fiduciary duty but that's not a strong case as he apparently doesn't have a written contract. I wish Lindsey the best in settling this case because the band is likely to win if it goes to court.

where in the air did you pull that out of?
oral contracts are legally binding in the state of California



DAMN, this is going to get ugly. I firmly believe there will be no so called reunion of The Rumours Five ever. IT'S OVER!

this really is the saddest of things
but seriously, i would vomit if LB rejoined them and they all acted happy as Sh#t
unless he did something reaaaaaally vulgar and illegal to warrant his firing and loss of "membership"
they really don't deserve any kind of reconciliation from him after this

[jwd]

Fleetwood Mac is owned by Mick Fleetwood and John McVie. All the others are technically contracted employees.

Per the complaint filed by Lindsey:

During both of Buckingham's tenures with Fleetwood Mac, the Band operated as a partnership in which each of the Partners had the right to veto any major decision considered by the Partnership. During their respective tenures with the Band, the Partners always shared equally in all economic opportunities undertaken by the Partnership and owned equal shares of the entities formed to enter into specific agreements on behalf of the Partnership.

Since Buckingham and Nicks joined the band in 1975, no Partner has been involuntarily dismissed from the Partnership. In fact under the California's Uniform Partnership Act of 1994 (the "Uniform Partnership Act"), absent a written partnership agreement, no Partner in Fleetwood Mac may be terminated from the Partnership without cause.

[jwd]

this really is the saddest of things


Yep. Most of us definitely wanted a different ending to this story. Novel, adventure, trip, or whatever you want to call it. It's a lame ending. A MAJOR letdown.

[jkmaletic]

This is a band most famous for their f*cked up interpersonal relationships. Their biggest hits are about hating each other. They didn’t stay together all these years because they enjoyed each other’s company. In fact, their relationships are so strained that S&L couldn’t even have hotel rooms next to each other’s because they found ways to fight through the f’ing walls. It’s never been about liking each other. They’re in this because it’s their job. Sure, they like what they do and enjoy making music and seeing their fans enjoy it. But it’s still a job. They run their business and they get paid for it with lots of money, attention, and fame. We all knew that. And Lindsey isn’t any different. You think he’d want anything to do with this band if he was wildly successful on his own and could sell out Madison Square Garden by himself? No. That’s why there’s this recurring pattern of Lindsey starting solo albums and then somehow having them evolve into FM records so he can expand the amount of people who will buy it and get tickets for the tour that follows it. He doesn’t do that because he misses or loves his band mates so much. He does it to rake in that FM money. The same FM money he’s still trying to rake in via this suit.
Of course they’re going to run this band more like a business than like a friendship. They have countless employees and already-set tour dates with thousands of tickets sold. They aren’t going to go against the advice of their managers and legal team because somebody’s feelings come first. Anybody who thinks that way has absolutely no idea what it’s like to be running a multimillion dollar empire and lives in some kind of fantasy world.

I agree, not to mention all the more accolades that are received when Fleetwood Mac tours versus solo touring. That's part of it too. They ALL have egos.
This is a very discouraging and sad way for the Rumours 5 to end, but it seems to be fitting for them too.

Jamie

[gldstwmn]

Me too (no pun intended). It takes so little to get the media up in arms; those who have made a career of being righteously indignant appearing on the talk shows and the cable "news" programs, demanding that his life be ruined; the Twitter crowd frothing at the mouth and screaming of boycotts; the labels, stores, venues, etc. rushing to separate themselves from any hint of association with an "abuser."

All she has to do is accuse him...

Surely even she wouldn't do that to the man who she was once "as good as married" to - plus such an accusation would make her look ridiculous after she's been hugging him for decades during shows.

Please don't be an apologist for abusers. It's gross.

[gldstwmn]

I understand that Lindsey didn't have a written contract with Live Nation or Fleetwood Mac in regards to the current tour. If that's true, it's going to be challenging for Lindsey to win a lawsuit if the band declines to settle.

That was my first thought in reading this as well. They had an oral agreement, nothing in writing. Worse, the complaint clearly illustrates that all of their employment was at will.

[gldstwmn]

An oral contract is just as binding as a written one. Basic contract law.

There was no contract. It was an oral agreement.

[gldstwmn]

Hopefully the folks at Loeb and Loeb know how to contact you for legal advice.

This is a frivolous lawsuit and he knows he isn't going to get one nickel out of it. He's doing it because he's vindictive and wants to humiliate the band. Not to mention the filing is carefully edited not to mention what really happened.

[gldstwmn]

I'm sure the lawyers at Loeb and Loeb know they have a very weak case. That's why they released the legal documents to the press rather than sending them to the band. US Weekly received the legal papers before the band did. The goal of the lawyers is to drive up media support for Lindsey with the hope that the band settles quickly. Without a written contract, they know that they are likely to lose if this goes to court.

He's trying to shake them down.

[gldstwmn]

yes, it's public, but you'd have to know to go look for it. the accusation is that lindsey's people would have alerted certain people in the media that it was filed or being filed so they would know to go pull it up.

Yes. The stories were planted.

[gldstwmn]

They retained Dan Petrocelli, the same lawyer who represented the Eagles against Don Felder’s suit. I sort of figured that would be the case. This will be interesting to watch to say the least. Doesn’t look like FM is going down without a fight. By the looks of their statement, they have their own side of the story and are eager to tell it.

And now we will find out what really happened at Music Cares. I hope some of the posters here like eating crow.

[gldstwmn]

Didn't FM already share their side of the story back in April? Do they need to change it now? That would be kind of fishy.

They said some stuff and shared absolutely nothing.

[gldstwmn]

Part of me still thinks this might've been filed quite a while ago and has already been handled. Lindsey's camp might've given the ok to release it as a way of getting a very official form of his side of the story out.


EDIT:
Nvm I just saw the band response. Major ew at them getting Weinstein's lawyer.

It was filed on 10/9/18. Lawyers represent both guilty and innocent people. To associate FM with Harvey Weinstein is both ridiculous and insulting.

[gldstwmn]

As classless as the band never responding to Lindsey's calls and emails, and having Irving Azoff do their dirty work?

They were advised not to respond. They'd be foolish to ignore that advice.

[gldstwmn]

I think we have gotten the whole story now from Lindsey's side. And to go forth and sue, knowing that they will sling mud back, tells me he feels justified and is not afraid of what they will say.



He is acting out of anger and not considering the consequences. This is not new behavior for him.

[saniette]

They said some stuff and shared absolutely nothing.

What does that even mean? I guess they weren't telling the whole truth then, so I agree. But their omissions were probably self-serving.

Do you have anything to add other than Stevie's innocent and Lindsey's guilty? We get it already.

[jmn3]

There was no contract. It was an oral agreement.

You clearly lack knowledge of the law. Oral contracts do exist, are valid and enforceable.

[jmn3]

And now we will find out what really happened at Music Cares. I hope some of the posters here like eating crow.

Better than eating goat

[gldstwmn]

I agree, it doesn't make sense they would choose US Weekly of all places.

They are known for running planted stories. There's nothing wrong with that. It's just not organic.

[secondhandchain]

You clearly lack knowledge of the law. Oral contracts do exist, are valid and enforceable.

She....must....defend....Stevie....at all costs....oh she feels the need to twirl.

[gldstwmn]

It’s all part of Lindsey’s evil plan to impact Stevie’s RRHOF nomination and Lincoln Nebraska FM ticket sales! I mean obviously when you get fired via telephone from a manager you should just bend over and take it.

Now we are going to find out if he was fired for cause.

[saniette]

They were advised not to respond. They'd be foolish to ignore that advice.

Right, they'll do whatever Azoff tells them. Not exactly a moral defense though, and makes them look spineless.

[gldstwmn]

It was probably an edict from management and legal. The nativity of thinking any of it is personal is almost cute.

I agree. It's an extremely naive viewpoint. FM is a business just like GM or Starbucks. Anything they said to him after his firing could be used against them so they stopped talking. I don't know why everyone is having such a fit about that. It's standard practice.

[gldstwmn]

I think you're taking that comment way too seriously. I doubt Irv Azoff gives a crap about a little remark from one of the members of one of the bands he manages. This is Irving Azoff. He is a shark. Glenn Frey dying didn't phase him. As long as Lindsey and the rest of them showed up so that he could make his money, he doesn't care about the details. But when the big seat filler of Fleetwood Mac is threatening to walk, that's when he cares.

That little remark got a lot of attention. You can believe it didn't sit well to say the least.

[gldstwmn]

Exactly. Everyone in this band knows that it’s a business first & foremost. Anybody who thinks Lindsey is any different from the rest of the group is delusional. Yes, these musicians may mean a lot to us and we love their art and may even look up to them. But we can’t delude ourselves so much that we can’t recognize that what they do is still a job. FM isn’t unique in this. The eagles don’t get along that well anymore either. Nor do the Stones. Or Heart. Or the GoGos. Pretty much none of the major bands out there record & tour together because they love being around each other. They do it for the money, the fame, and the adoration they get from the fans. It could be worse. At least Fleetwood Mac doesn’t hawk silly merch like KISS does with their coffins and pinball machines and sh*t.

Someone once posed the question that Kiss isn't so much a band as it is a marketing plan. :lol:

[DeepBlueDee]

There was no contract. It was an oral agreement.

Isn't that pretty much the definition of an oral contract??? :confused:

While more difficult to prove, an oral contract is, to the best of my knowledge, valid and binding, with the appropriate evidence to back it up.

https://www.lawdepot.com/blog/are-verbal-agreements-legally-binding/

[saniette]

I agree. It's an extremely naive viewpoint. FM is a business just like GM or Starbucks. Anything they said to him after his firing could be used against them so they stopped talking. I don't know why everyone is having such a fit about that. It's standard practice.

... Or like Enron. So FM's just a filthy corporation then. That business model for bands is a relic from the past, like everything else about FM. Notice how Azoff only manages these dinosaur acts?

[The Chain]

He is acting out of anger and not considering the consequences. This is not new behavior for him.

Does anyone have a chiffonhead translator? Can't seem to find the setting on Google. I can sort of understand some of the basics.. "Lindsey's evil", "Stevie can do no wrong" and "I ignore facts".. oh well, its always the same, maybe I don't need one after all!:wavey:

[jmn3]

He is acting out of anger and not considering the consequences. This is not new behavior for him.

So obviously you believe that all the dirty laundry that will come out about Lindsey will do him in or something. But, the street runneth both ways. Do you not think that some pretty awful things could come out from Lindsey's side about the four of them (plus God forbid, the patron saint of chiffon, glitter farts, and wellllllll's, Karen). You're insinuation that Lindsey is nothing but an aggressive, physically abusive lout makes it seem like Mick, John, Chris and Stephanie are just angels sitting by 'taking it' from big bad Lindsey for all of these years. I'm sure the five of them could all bring down the other four in a mutually assured destruction court proceeding. This will never go to a trial.

[estranged4life]

Someone once posed the question that Kiss isn't so much a band as it is a marketing plan. :lol:

'Scheme' Gene $immons is all about the dollar/profits...sure the upcoming "final tour" (Heard that one before there Gene) will rake in more $$$.

[saniette]

I agree. It's an extremely naive viewpoint. FM is a business just like GM or Starbucks. Anything they said to him after his firing could be used against them so they stopped talking. I don't know why everyone is having such a fit about that. It's standard practice.

And I wonder how Tom Petty would feel about caving into management like that? The Last DJ, anyone? Maybe Stevie should honor Tom's legacy in actions rather than empty words? She's free falling all right...

Good call on Tom's part never letting Stevie in the Heartbreakers.

[jwd]

So obviously you believe that all the dirty laundry that will come out about Lindsey will do him in or something. But, the street runneth both ways. Do you not think that some pretty awful things could come out from Lindsey's side about the four of them (plus God forbid, the patron saint of chiffon, glitter farts, and wellllllll's, Karen). You're insinuation that Lindsey is nothing but an aggressive, physically abusive lout makes it seem like Mick, John, Chris and Stephanie are just angels sitting by 'taking it' from big bad Lindsey for all of these years. I'm sure the five of them could all bring down the other four in a mutually assured destruction court proceeding. This will never go to a trial.


It'd be the wisest thing to do. Lindsey will walk away with a lot of money. And have his freedom from a bunch of cowards.

[gldstwmn]

What does that even mean? I guess they weren't telling the whole truth then, so I agree. But their omissions were probably self-serving.

Do you have anything to add other than Stevie's innocent and Lindsey's guilty? We get it already.

I never said Stevie was innocent but I do think Lindsey is at fault for his termination.

[gldstwmn]

You clearly lack knowledge of the law. Oral contracts do exist, are valid and enforceable.

We'll see what the judge says I guess. And yeah I'm not a lawyer.

[rhiannondontgo]

There was no contract. It was an oral agreement.

The thing is, in CA oral agreements are usually treated just like written contracts. However, lawsuits over oral contracts generally are 3x harder to win than lawsuits over written contracts. Lindsey would only have a chance if he were able to prove the existence and validity of the oral agreements he claims took place. Unlike a written contact on paper with signatures, an oral agreement isn’t tangible. He has to prove that these promises were made to him orally. He could possibly prove it via witness testimony of other people who heard these agreements take place. Or perhaps even evidence in voicemails/emails/letters from managers/band members about these agreements that they supposedly made. Even if he were to prove that an agreement took place, the band could claim that said tour agreement was for Fleetwood Mac and the minute he was fired from Fleetwood Mac, he stopped being included in the agreements about the tour. So after proving that the oral agreement took place, he would still have to prove that he was wrongfully terminated without just cause and deserves to still be a partner.
I still think FM has the upper hand. But they both have a decent case IMO. Depends on how much each side can prove. We’ll see.

[gldstwmn]

Right, they'll do whatever Azoff tells them. Not exactly a moral defense though, and makes them look spineless.

I'm sure they were advised by their lawyer. We don't know what their defense it yet.

[gldstwmn]

Isn't that pretty much the definition of an oral contract??? :confused:

While more difficult to prove, an oral contract is, to the best of my knowledge, valid and binding, with the appropriate evidence to back it up.

https://www.lawdepot.com/blog/are-verbal-agreements-legally-binding/

That's for the judge to decide.

[gldstwmn]

'Scheme' Gene $immons is all about the dollar/profits...sure the upcoming "final tour" (Heard that one before there Gene) will rake in more $$$.

They will be touring via hologram after they pass. I'm sure of it. :lol:

[rhiannondontgo]

I'm sure they were advised by their lawyer. We don't know what their defense it yet.

Absolutely. I saw people irate over John replying to LB with “I’m not supposed to talk to you” as if this is some kids’ clubhouse and Stevie put a sign up that says “No Lindsey Allowed”. Ridiculous. John (and the other members) refusing to have any contact with LB isn’t personal and isn’t at the direction of any band member. They’ve been expecting this suit (Lindsey even said in his statement he’s been trying to get a settlement from them for 8 months now), so their legal teams & managers would absolutely recommend them not to interact with a man who is plotting to take them to court. That’s just common sense. If one band member were to say the wrong thing without first getting the advice of their lawyers, they could sink an entire case against them that affects not just the other 3 band members but their contracted players, management, and countless employees as well. Of course they’re going to ignore LB.

[gldstwmn]

So obviously you believe that all the dirty laundry that will come out about Lindsey will do him in or something. But, the street runneth both ways. Do you not think that some pretty awful things could come out from Lindsey's side about the four of them (plus God forbid, the patron saint of chiffon, glitter farts, and wellllllll's, Karen). You're insinuation that Lindsey is nothing but an aggressive, physically abusive lout makes it seem like Mick, John, Chris and Stephanie are just angels sitting by 'taking it' from big bad Lindsey for all of these years. I'm sure the five of them could all bring down the other four in a mutually assured destruction court proceeding. This will never go to a trial.

I don't think any of them are angels. But Lindsey was fired and brought suit and that's what we're talking about, Lindsey and his actions. I don't think he's a lout but he does have a history of abusive behavior toward men and women. I do think this is going to trial. The lawyer they hired reinforces that belief. They didn't hire a guy that is known for settling. He's one of the attorneys involved in the longest legal case in the LA court system. It's been ongoing since 1991.

[jwd]

I don't think any of them are angels. But Lindsey was fired and brought suit and that's what we're talking about, Lindsey and his actions. I don't think he's a lout but he does have a history of abusive behavior toward men and women. I do think this is going to trial. The lawyer they hired reinforces that belief. They didn't hire a guy that is known for settling. He's one of the attorneys involved in the longest legal case in the LA court system. It's been ongoing since 1991.

They'll all be dead before it's settled! :laugh: And spent a LOT of money on lawyers' fees. With their legacy irreparably damaged.

[saniette]

I don't think any of them are angels. But Lindsey was fired and brought suit and that's what we're talking about, Lindsey and his actions. I don't think he's a lout but he does have a history of abusive behavior toward men and women. I do think this is going to trial. The lawyer they hired reinforces that belief. They didn't hire a guy that is known for settling. He's one of the attorneys involved in the longest legal case in the LA court system. It's been ongoing since 1991.

I disagree. This lawsuit will probably be settled out of court, unless Lindsey really wants to stick to the figure he's asking. Dan Petrocelli represented the Eagles when they were sued by Don Felder, and that was settled. And if it's settled out of court, we'll never get all of the details and the members won't be able to discuss it. So we may never know all the dirty laundry after all.

And we're also talking about FM's actions. It's ridiculous to only look at this lawsuit as Lindsey doing something to them. They fired him, and he has every right to sue.

[Buster]

Those who are saying we now have the complete truth, or even that we have Lindsey’s full side of the story are basically saying he was fired for smirking at Stevie and complaining about an Intro song.

Is it not clear to everyone that of course there is more?

As for FM lying on CBS, perhaps that was the band protecting Lindsey by not dragging him through the mud.

I don’t know what Lindsey did or if it justified being fired but common sense says there is more. I think it started at Classic where he was clearly in a horrible mood and went through the negotiations and culminated at MusiCares.

[gldstwmn]

They'll all be dead before it's settled! :laugh: And spent a LOT of money on lawyers' fees. With their legacy irreparably damaged.

That's another thing. Lawyers are expensive. If Lindsey loses he could be on the hook for FM's legal fees.

[gldstwmn]

Those who are saying we now have the complete truth, or even that we have Lindsey’s full side of the story are basically saying he was fired for smirking at Stevie and complaining about an Intro song.

Is it not clear to everyone that of course there is more?

As for FM lying on CBS, perhaps that was the band protecting Lindsey by not dragging him through the mud.

I don’t know what Lindsey did or if it justified being fired but common sense says there is more. I think it started at Classic where he was clearly in a horrible mood and went through the negotiations and culminated at MusiCares.

Believing we have the full story supports the keep on hating Stevie contingent. There's so much sexism and misogyny wrapped up in it it's mind boggling.

[rhiannondontgo]

I do think this is going to trial. The lawyer they hired reinforces that belief. They didn't hire a guy that is known for settling. He's one of the attorneys involved in the longest legal case in the LA court system. It's been ongoing since 1991.

Yep, Petrocelli is notoriously tough and doesn’t back down. A real powerhouse. As one article said “He and his partners at O’Melveny & Myers are known as aggressive litigators who will relentlessly push their client’s position, sometimes by attacking opposing counsel, until a court tells them to stop.” And his hourly rate is absolutely astronomical. FM isn’t messing around and IMO does not intend on settling or giving up.

[saniette]

Believing we have the full story supports the keep on hating Stevie contingent. There's so much sexism and misogyny wrapped up in it it's mind boggling.

That's absurd. You don't have to hate Stevie to think she handled all this poorly. And most posters criticize Stevie and Mick, so I'm not sure what sexism has to do with it.

And what about the hate Lindsey contingent? I guess you're allowed to ignore any pesky facts that might put him in a good light, because you're waging a noble war against misogyny? Gimme a break.

[jwd]

Those who are saying we now have the complete truth, or even that we have Lindsey’s full side of the story are basically saying he was fired for smirking at Stevie and complaining about an Intro song.

Is it not clear to everyone that of course there is more?

As for FM lying on CBS, perhaps that was the band protecting Lindsey by not dragging him through the mud.

I don’t know what Lindsey did or if it justified being fired but common sense says there is more. I think it started at Classic where he was clearly in a horrible mood and went through the negotiations and culminated at MusiCares.

Common sense tells me he never would've filed a law suit if he did something so terrible that he knows he was justifiably fired by the band. According to him they were all getting along well, even right through MusiCares. He was totally blindsided by the news he was being fired. Hell, he even thought it was Stevie leaving the band! He got a list of grievances from Stevie why she never wanted to be on stage with him again. Two cited were "the smirk" and him complaining about playing "Rhiannon" as an entrance song. Okay, is there more? I certainly hope so for FM's sake, because this band has been through a whole lot more traumatic experiences than that. There's been a lot worse happen in the band than that and Lindsey was never fired then.

[saniette]

Yep, Petrocelli is notoriously tough and doesn’t back down. A real powerhouse. As one article said “He and his partners at O’Melveny & Myers are known as aggressive litigators who will relentlessly push their client’s position, sometimes by attacking opposing counsel, until a court tells them to stop.” And his hourly rate is absolutely astronomical. FM isn’t messing around and IMO does not intend on settling or giving up.

Except the Eagles, represented by Petrocelli, settled the lawsuit brought by Don Felder. Never went to court. Seems like a clear parallel to the FM/Lindsey lawsuit.

And Petrocelli also defended the CEO of Enron. That didn't go so well for him. He's still in jail.

[NotonRodeo]

I find preposterous and downright insulting the notion that criticizing Stevie makes one a misogynist. Why, is Stevie suddenly free of original sin and never makes mistakes? Geez. :rolleyes:

[jmn3]

Believing we have the full story supports the keep on hating Stevie contingent. There's so much sexism and misogyny wrapped up in it it's mind boggling.

Screw that - what an absolute pile of BS statement to make. So, it's okay to hate a man (you clearly hate Lindsey, but now you'll go on a fifteen post rant about how you don't - because that's what you do), but if someone dislikes or hates Stevie Nicks and her role in this entire debacle, it is somehow sexist or misogynist. Your posts continue to be, at best, ridiculous.

Besides, Stevie has a friend in this who is as low as they come, and that would be Mr. Michael Fleetwood.

[HomerMcvie]

I find preposterous and downright insulting the notion that criticizing Stevie makes one a misogynist. Why, is Stevie suddenly free of original sin and never makes mistakes? Geez. :rolleyes:

Exactly!!! Very well said!

[jmn3]

Yep, Petrocelli is notoriously tough and doesn’t back down. A real powerhouse. As one article said “He and his partners at O’Melveny & Myers are known as aggressive litigators who will relentlessly push their client’s position, sometimes by attacking opposing counsel, until a court tells them to stop.” And his hourly rate is absolutely astronomical. FM isn’t messing around and IMO does not intend on settling or giving up.

But he was Eagles attorney when Felder sued and settled? That's my understanding but I could be wrong.

[Lola]

Some info about Lindsey's attorney:
http://www.metnews.com/articles/2012/atty031412.htm

Mallen’s practice focuses on entertainment, media and copyright litigation in the areas of film, television and music. He has defended numerous lawsuits for copyright infringement as well as negotiated and litigated audit disputes in the motion picture, television, recording, publishing and merchandising industries, the firm said.
In addition, he has litigated many cases involving breach of contract, trademark infringement and violation of the Lanham Act, handled disputes involving the rights of publicity of celebrities, and advised on so-called “seven year” issues in the recording industry, among other entertainment litigation matters.
His clients have included Anschutz Entertainment Group, Summit Entertainment, NBC Universal, Concord Music Group, Neil Young, Brian Wilson, John Fogerty, KISS and The Rolling Stones.

[Lola]

https://www.loeb.com/experience-obtained3millionawardformusicianrkellyfromconcertpromoter

And this:
OBTAINED $3 MILLION AWARD FOR MUSICIAN R. KELLY FROM CONCERT PROMOTER
Successfully arbitrated a dispute on behalf of recording artist R. Kelly against concert promoter Rowe Entertainment resulting in an award in excess of $3,000,000.