Rolling Stone: McVie comments on FM and Songbird

[SteveMacD]

Originally Posted by justcrazylove

I agree, even if in this instance I was both the instigator and the culprit.

I asked a question earlier this week in one of the seldom times I've posted, it was a question relevant to this thread and was totally ignored.

We are losing people within this community who hold a wealth of information and expertise regarding this band. What is left is conversations about samples, Richard Thompson, how Stevie is *insert horrible name tinged in misogyny* and how Lindsey is a monster. BORING

Do you know how I even landed on Richard Thompson’s music? Lindsey and Richard are/were consistently compared to one another in way too many guitar magazines because they’re both brilliant acoustic and electric lead guitarists. Curiosity got the better of me, and only about a decade ago. It’s not some out of nowhere reference.

[bwboy]

Originally Posted by UnwindedDreams

Hi bwboy, I wrote lineup debut. Unleashed was not a lineup debut. And I don't mean recorded music either, on the Time Tour they sang new songs that were not released yet.

Interesting about those 2018 performances being new music to you! If they had performed "Baby Got Back" in 2018, would that have been new music?

I had to look up who sang Baby Got Back- well, I have a hard time picturing Lindsey singing it, but I do think Christine could pull it off LOL! But I guess since FM had written Black Magic Woman, and since Neil had written DDIO and IGY, and since Christine had written AOA, I don’t see those as covers. Free Falling, I see that as a cover, but I don’t mind, I appreciated the sentiment behind it. And Blue Letter is one of my favorite FM songs. I just don’t care who wrote a particular song or who recorded it first, ultimately. I’d never heard FM perform those songs before, so to me, it was like new music.

I would love to hear your thoughts about deep cuts versus new material.

[UnwindedDreams]

Originally Posted by bwboy

I had to look up who sang Baby Got Back- well, I have a hard time picturing Lindsey singing it, but I do think Christine could pull it off LOL! But I guess since FM had written Black Magic Woman, and since Neil had written DDIO and IGY, and since Christine had written AOA, I don’t see those as covers. Free Falling, I see that as a cover, but I don’t mind, I appreciated the sentiment behind it. And Blue Letter is one of my favorite FM songs. I just don’t care who wrote a particular song or who recorded it first, ultimately. I’d never heard FM perform those songs before, so to me, it was like new music.

I would love to hear your thoughts about deep cuts versus new material.

Black Magic Woman, Man of the World, Tell Me, Oh Well, Hypnotized aren't covers to me because it's a Fleetwood Mac concert and those are FM songs. But I don't want to hear them, HA!
I like deep cuts but I'm a Stevie fan so the 2018 set was disappointing for me. I did see four shows.
The only Stevie deep cut was Storms and it wasn't a surprise because she did it 80 times on Unleashed. I buy a ticket for a FM show with Stevie in the lineup to hear songs from albums that Stevie was on. I don't want to hear Stevie sing Black Magic Woman, Don't Dream It's Over, I Got You, and Free Fallin, I want to hear Crystal, Love is Dangerous, Angel and I Don't Want To Know. But I know there's an audience for pre-Nicks material so I know 2018 was perfect for them, though it was still a pretty hits heavy set which I get the band has to please people.

[DownOnRodeo]

Originally Posted by justcrazylove

I booked flights from Broken Hill Australia, in the middle of the outback to Paris to see the European tour.

That's amazing! It will be such a memorable trip. The British band members are getting very frail. But Lindsey keeps healthy and is at the top of his game. You won't regret your trek to see him in concert on the other side of the world.

[SteveMacD]

Originally Posted by bwboy

Free Falling, I see that as a cover,

Even then, Mike co-produced and played guitar on the original as well as Stevie’s solo version, so it’s not a total cover anymore than the Peter Green stuff was a cover.

[bwboy]

Originally Posted by UnwindedDreams

Black Magic Woman, Man of the World, Tell Me, Oh Well, Hypnotized aren't covers to me because it's a Fleetwood Mac concert and those are FM songs. But I don't want to hear them, HA!
I like deep cuts but I'm a Stevie fan so the 2018 set was disappointing for me. I did see four shows.
The only Stevie deep cut was Storms and it wasn't a surprise because she did it 80 times on Unleashed. I buy a ticket for a FM show with Stevie in the lineup to hear songs from albums that Stevie was on. I don't want to hear Stevie sing Black Magic Woman, Don't Dream It's Over, I Got You, and Free Fallin, I want to hear Crystal, Love is Dangerous, Angel and I Don't Want To Know. But I know there's an audience for pre-Nicks material so I know 2018 was perfect for them, though it was still a pretty hits heavy set which I get the band has to please people.

Thanks, UnwindedDreams! I see your point about how some of those songs you don’t consider covers, but you still didn’t want to hear them live. Crystal and I Don’t Want to Know are two of my absolute favorite FM songs, and I really was hoping Stevie and Neil would have performed them on that tour. I think Neil would have done a great job on both of them. I hated when Stevie redid Crystal- ugh. But if she had just sang the chorus and let Neil sing the rest, I would have loved it to heard it live. And Angel and Love is Dangerous would have been nice, too. I would have even taken Freedom, considering she wrote it with Mike Campbell- that would have been pretty ballsy of them to perform.

[SteveMacD]

Originally Posted by elle

if the reason to oust Lindsey was that he's such an ahole, then he should have been ousted when he in fact was an ahole.

That’s a strawman. Nobody said he was fired for being an a-hole.

current Lindsey wrote On The Wrong Side, Rock Away Blind, That's The Way Love Goes and Love Is Here To Stay.

Not helping your argument.

[SteveMacD]

Originally Posted by UnwindedDreams

Was 2018 Fleetwood Mac the first lineup debut that didn't perform new songs?

Technically the 1987 tour didn’t have any new to them songs in the setlist. Yeah, TITN was new and they played new songs from it, but it wasn’t recorded by that particular lineup. It’s really not too different from the 2018 playing “All Over Again” in 2018.

I hope you have a fantastic birthday.

Thanks! It was alright (except for the old lady getting into a fender bender).

[UnwindedDreams]

Originally Posted by SteveMacD

It’s really not too different from the 2018 playing “All Over Again” in 2018.

But 23 years after All Over Again was released? Maybe 2018-2019 should have been called the Time Tour

[Mr Scarrott]

Originally Posted by UnwindedDreams

But 23 years after All Over Again was released? Maybe 2018-2019 should have been called the Time Tour

Or perhaps they should have "called time" on the whole endeavour. Having said that there were some left-field and welcome additions to the set,particularly early on. It's a pity that they would have sailed over the heads of the vast majority of the crowds as they headed to the loos or bar.

I suspect that will be the end of things, Christine's been telegraphing that fairly clearly. A closing EP and a couple of gigs from the five would be nice but I doubt that there's much chance of that.

An end without a proper ending, I think.

[jmn3]

Originally Posted by bwboy

I really wish FM would have toured when they rereleased their Deluxe Editions- how I would have loved a tour where they played Tusk, but also Sara, IKINW, Storms, Think About Me, Brown Eyes, and some more. Or imagine a tour with Mirage songs- not just Gypsy, but also Hold Me, Love in Store, Eyes of the World, Wish You Were Here, That’s Alright, and Book of Love. Lost opportunities, but honestly I would have rather heard those deep cuts instead of new material like the EP or Say You Will.

Once it became clear that she wasn't going to record with Lindsey anymore, this is exactly how I would have wanted them to handle some of the tours. 2009 was the perfect opportunity. It was the 30th anniversary of Tusk. THAT should have been when they released the Deluxe Tusk and that should have been the tour, instead of Unleashed (since that was a stupid way of just saying "a tour for the sake of touring). I know Fleetwood Mac is too conservative and just generally dumb to actually play the whole album (in particular Tusk, especially without Christine)...but I would have rather seen a 2009 Tour that did a big Tusk set within the setlist. Same in 2012 (instead of 2013) with Mirage. When Chris came back - the obvious choice would have been to play all of Rumours live similar to what Eagles have been doing with Hotel California.

Something like the below for Tusk in 2009. But there isn't even any chance they would have done this out of fear that the audience would have been all for the first half.

Tusk
Angel
I Know I'm Not Wrong
Sara
Save Me a Place
Storms
Beautiful Child
Not That Funny
What Makes You Think You're The One
Sisters of the Moon
Big Love
Landslide
The Chain
Dreams
Go Insane
Rhiannon
Oh Well
Gold Dust Woman
I'm So Afraid
Stand Back
Go Your Own Way
World Turning
Don't Stop
Silver Springs

[bwboy]

Originally Posted by jmn3

Once it became clear that she wasn't going to record with Lindsey anymore, this is exactly how I would have wanted them to handle some of the tours. 2009 was the perfect opportunity. It was the 30th anniversary of Tusk. THAT should have been when they released the Deluxe Tusk and that should have been the tour, instead of Unleashed (since that was a stupid way of just saying "a tour for the sake of touring). I know Fleetwood Mac is too conservative and just generally dumb to actually play the whole album (in particular Tusk, especially without Christine)...but I would have rather seen a 2009 Tour that did a big Tusk set within the setlist. Same in 2012 (instead of 2013) with Mirage. When Chris came back - the obvious choice would have been to play all of Rumours live similar to what Eagles have been doing with Hotel California.

Something like the below for Tusk in 2009. But there isn't even any chance they would have done this out of fear that the audience would have been all for the first half.

Tusk
Angel
I Know I'm Not Wrong
Sara
Save Me a Place
Storms
Beautiful Child
Not That Funny
What Makes You Think You're The One
Sisters of the Moon
Big Love
Landslide
The Chain
Dreams
Go Insane
Rhiannon
Oh Well
Gold Dust Woman
I'm So Afraid
Stand Back
Go Your Own Way
World Turning
Don't Stop
Silver Springs

Wow! That is a kick ass setlist! You’re right about the audience not being able to handle it though, but in all fairness, Tusk took years to be appreciated by most folks, including fans like me, so I can see how a casual fan would actually be turned off by that first half of the setlist. FM has a plethora of fantastic material, but spent too many tours sticking to most of the same songs, until recently, anyway. And now it’s too late. But your setlist would make for an unbelievable show.

[jmn3]

Originally Posted by bwboy

Wow! That is a kick ass setlist! You’re right about the audience not being able to handle it though, but in all fairness, Tusk took years to be appreciated by most folks, including fans like me, so I can see how a casual fan would actually be turned off by that first half of the setlist. FM has a plethora of fantastic material, but spent too many tours sticking to most of the same songs, until recently, anyway. And now it’s too late. But your setlist would make for an unbelievable show.

I think they had the opportunity to put on a great show with much more diversity that challenged the audience. I attended some Springsteen shows where he played full albums and not every Bruce album is full of singles (a la Born in the USA). I'm not nearly as into him as I am Fleetwood Mac and you know what, I still found myself able to enjoy the show. I think if it was billed as a Tusk show where we're going to play a partial Tusk set, it's okay. In that example, you still get most of the hit parade that people expect.

Mirage sans Christine is a bit harder. There isn't enough songs to do where you could devote/open half the show with a Mirage set unless you're going to have S&L doing Christine's songs. I could see them try it with Hold Me and get results that wouldn't be any worse than what actually happened in 2009 with Say You Love Me. I still think a 2012 Tour with a Mirage-focused mini-set would have been highly preferably to another tour with mostly the same set.

[UnwindedDreams]

Originally Posted by SteveMacD

He was fired in late January, 2018.

I would have released the new album in April, 2018 and enjoyed the free publicity from the band’s media blitz with Finn and Campbell. I mean, he was publicly getting thrown under the bus AND there was a #TeamLindsey movement behind him. He should have used all of it to his advantage.

Get a webcam, do a weekly acoustic song on YouTube/Facebook/IG/Twitter and promote the upcoming album. Then hit the road in late May/early June and stay on the road until the end of the year, still releasing the comp in October.

A golden opportunity that no amount of promotion could ever top just landed in his lap and in classic Lindsey fashion, he blew it.

I mean, wasn’t the fact he wanted to tour this album on Fleetwood Mac’s off nights one of the points of contention during the tour negotiations?

I would have loved if the self titled album was released in April of 2018 or even February. IIRC, in the months after Irving called him, Lindsey was trying to get back into the band. I disagree with that because I think he should have just accepted going solo and focused on shopping his album to a label. Mick and John were the only ones who responded to him and said they needed time to reflect or they're not supposed to speak to him(LB). I'm guessing during that time he was also meeting with attorney and getting his stuff together to file suit.
I wonder if Warner Music, Reprise, Rhino or whoever his record contract is with told him not to release new music but do a compliation instead. If they did, they were right because that sold more than his self-titled album.

And I never understood why Sheryl Louis or Stubner had a problem with Lindsey playing on off nights. As if he was taking ticket buyers away from an FM show!

[bwboy]

Originally Posted by UnwindedDreams

I wonder if Warner Music, Reprise, Rhino or whoever his record contract is with told him not to release new music but do a compliation instead. If they did, they were right because that sold more than his self-titled album.

And I never understood why Sheryl Louis or Stubner had a problem with Lindsey playing on off nights. As if he was taking ticket buyers away from an FM show!

I would almost definitively say that most artists have 0 control over when a product is released, so posts saying Lindsey should have released his album on so and so date kind of makes me chuckle. Like you, I’m certain the record company makes that decision.

I also COMPLETELY understand why not just the folks you mention (whom I have no idea who they are) but also the other members of FM would have a problem with Lindsey performing solo concerts on their nights off. I believe 100% that ticket sales for FM would have been impacted. Lindsey fans would not only be able to see him perform FM songs, but at a lower price in a smaller venue- why wouldn’t Lindsey fans do that? Just imagine if Stevie asked to do the same thing- they would have said no, and for the same reasons. But even beyond ticket sales being impacted, I believe Lindsey’s performances with FM would not be at peak performance, certainly not at the same level as his solo concerts would be. I would say that about absolutely anyone- Lindsey, Stevie, you name ‘em. We caught a glimpse of that with the 2 big shows that occurred. A solo tour with music he loves, much of which he hadn’t performed live often, and then with FM singing some of the same songs? Just my opinion.