Who are The Cholos?

[Villavic]

At my usual weekly check at Lindsey's networks, I found he posted today "Performing live on SNL 1982 captured by Al Levine" . There are three cool pics, one of them shows Mick at drums.

I wanted to know if that was before or after Mirage, the post doesn't specify. So after a quick research I found the SNL episode is S7 E11 "James Coburn/Lindsey Buckingham & The Cholos", Feb 6 1982

The "&" sounds like a band accompanying Lindsey, though probably not since the picture doesn't show a big band, I never heard that name associated to Lindsey, and I didn't find any The Cholos band in the web. Was it a second performer in that episode? Does anybody remember?

IMDB says Lindsey Buckingham performed "Bwana" and "Trouble". Cool pictures.

[HomerMcvie]

Thee used to be videos of him on SNL on Youtube, but they seem to be gone now.

I have it on VHS, somewhere.

[Villavic]

Originally Posted by HomerMcvie

Thee used to be videos of him on SNL on Youtube, but they seem to be gone now.

I have it on VHS, somewhere.

Yes, I looked for it at YouTube and didn't find it. But now, making another kind of search, I found it in Vimeo

https://vimeo.com/442118162

[WalkAThinLine.]

This is from Billy's December 2022 interview with Rolling Stone

You started out in Mick’s band the Cholos, which later became the Zoo.
Yeah. Lindsey was in the Cholos, too, at first. We did some tracks, but who knows what happened to them? Mick and I put together the Zoo. We used Stevie and Christine and Lindsey. The whole band was on everything, pretty much.

https://www.rollingstone.com/music/m...ie-1234639670/

[David]

The Cholos appeared at some LA clubs (like the Palomino and the Golden Bear) a few times in 1981, maybe into 1982. The LA Times advertised the shows (all club shows were advertised). I never actually made it out to one. Later on, somebody reported that the name was derogatory, so Mick and the others stopped using it.

[HomerMcvie]

Originally Posted by David

The Cholos appeared at some LA clubs (like the Palomino and the Golden Bear) a few times in 1981, maybe into 1982. The LA Times advertised the shows (all club shows were advertised). I never actually made it out to one. Later on, somebody reported that the name was derogatory, so Mick and the others stopped using it.

So you're saying that Mick, a man who paraded a DILDO named Harold on stage, would care that something was derogatory?

[Villavic]

Originally Posted by HomerMcvie

So you're saying that Mick, a man who paraded a DILDO named Harold on stage, would care that something was derogatory?

Probably in the 80s the answer was yes, he cared. In 2014 he was asked about Harold, and he said it doesn't exist anymore. And by the expression on his face it seemed like he didn't like the question; he also hinted that being something rude, it was no longer something he enjoyed having.

Just for general culture, in Peru calling someone cholo can be derogatory as well as an expression of affection. It all depends on the way you say it.

[HomerMcvie]

Originally Posted by Villavic

Probably in the 80s the answer was yes, he cared. In 2014 he was asked about Harold, and he said it doesn't exist anymore. And by the expression on his face it seemed like he didn't like the question; he also hinted that being something rude, it was no longer something he enjoyed having.

Just for general culture, in Peru calling someone cholo can be derogatory as well as an expression of affection. It all depends on the way you say it.

Once he'd become accustomed to the Stevie Nicks lifestyle, there was no going back. Keeping paychecks coming in has become his only goal for the past 48 years. So he adopted a filter.

[FuzzyPlum]

Just read the relevant pages in Billy’s book….

Paraphrasing….
Billy was at a dinner for Dick Clark. He was sat at a table with Mick. They hit it off.

‘About a week later I got a call from mick to meet him and Lindsey in Malibu. They asked me if I wanted to join a band. I said you already have one. Lindsey explained he wanted to start a band without the girls. Lindsey liked my album at the time and I joined the Cholos. Mick, Lindsey, George Hawkins, Steve Ross and me.

In 1982 our debut gig was SNL. Lindsey had a single out at the time called Trouble. We spent 2 days rehearsing that and Bwana. James Coburn was the guest presenter. I was in tremendous pain. I’d been in a leg brace and was due an operation. On the way to the stage I banged my leg on a coffee table. It hurt like hell. But Martell and cocaine got me through it.

Then, the Cholos were in the bar at Berkshire hotel and Dan ackroyd and John candy came over. They asked us to be on the letterman show with them. I don’t know why we didn’t do it.

When we got back from doing SNL we found out we couldn’t use the name Cholos. The Mexican consulate made us change it because it was the name of a Mexican gang. We changed the name to the zoo. Lindsey was in the band when we first put it together. He quit in the middle of making a record. But he was the one who actually got me in the band in the first place.

Terri Garr was the host when we did SNL for the second time with mick Fleetwood zoo on 12th November 1983’

[bombaysaffires]

Originally Posted by FuzzyPlum

Just read the relevant pages in Billy’s book….

Paraphrasing….
Billy was at a dinner for Dick Clark. He was sat at a table with Mick. They hit it off.

‘About a week later I got a call from mick to meet him and Lindsey in Malibu. They asked me if I wanted to join a band. I said you already have one. Lindsey explained he wanted to start a band without the girls. Lindsey liked my album at the time and I joined the Cholos. Mick, Lindsey, George Hawkins, Steve Ross and me.

In 1982 our debut gig was SNL. Lindsey had a single out at the time called Trouble. We spent 2 days rehearsing that and Bwana. James Coburn was the guest presenter. I was in tremendous pain. I’d been in a leg brace and was due an operation. On the way to the stage I banged my leg on a coffee table. It hurt like hell. But Martell and cocaine got me through it.

Then, the Cholos were in the bar at Berkshire hotel and Dan ackroyd and John candy came over. They asked us to be on the letterman show with them. I don’t know why we didn’t do it.

When we got back from doing SNL we found out we couldn’t use the name Cholos. The Mexican consulate made us change it because it was the name of a Mexican gang. We changed the name to the zoo. Lindsey was in the band when we first put it together. He quit in the middle of making a record. But he was the one who actually got me in the band in the first place.

Terri Garr was the host when we did SNL for the second time with mick Fleetwood zoo on 12th November 1983’

this has appeared off and on over the years from LB and it seems like a real 'thing' for him..... I mean... I get why he might not want to do something with Stevie involved, but why not Chris?? Why does she get lumped in with "the GIRLS" like she's some high-maintenance, fussbudget? WTF is it about female presence that annoys or inhibits him?? No swearing and drinking and farting? No sex jokes? Odd. Because he did have female guitarists in his solo band for a short time.... and then pure boys club after that.

[HomerMcvie]

Originally Posted by bombaysaffires

this has appeared off and on over the years from LB and it seems like a real 'thing' for him..... I mean... I get why he might not want to do something with Stevie involved, but why not Chris?? Why does she get lumped in with "the GIRLS" like she's some high-maintenance, fussbudget? WTF is it about female presence that annoys or inhibits him?? No swearing and drinking and farting? No sex jokes? Odd. Because he did have female guitarists in his solo band for a short time.... and then pure boys club after that.

A side project from FM couldn't include all of FM.

Misogyny aside(can't really be said without it), I know several musicians who don't want to play in a band with girls. There's a whole different dynamic if there's a princess(Stevie like, not Christine like) in the band.

*don't shoot the messenger*

[Villavic]

Originally Posted by bombaysaffires

WTF is it about female presence that annoys or inhibits him?? .

I wouldn't rule out jealousy over the fact that the girls had better-known songs than him. The 1988 Greatest Hits album contains 16 songs. Only 4 songs are sung by Lindsey. Actually 3.5 cause I'm including Don't Stop.

[Macfan4life]

Originally Posted by FuzzyPlum

Just read the relevant pages in Billy’s book….

Paraphrasing….
Billy was at a dinner for Dick Clark. He was sat at a table with Mick. They hit it off.

‘About a week later I got a call from mick to meet him and Lindsey in Malibu. They asked me if I wanted to join a band. I said you already have one. Lindsey explained he wanted to start a band without the girls. Lindsey liked my album at the time and I joined the Cholos. Mick, Lindsey, George Hawkins, Steve Ross and me.

In 1982 our debut gig was SNL. Lindsey had a single out at the time called Trouble. We spent 2 days rehearsing that and Bwana. James Coburn was the guest presenter. I was in tremendous pain. I’d been in a leg brace and was due an operation. On the way to the stage I banged my leg on a coffee table. It hurt like hell. But Martell and cocaine got me through it.

Then, the Cholos were in the bar at Berkshire hotel and Dan ackroyd and John candy came over. They asked us to be on the letterman show with them. I don’t know why we didn’t do it.

When we got back from doing SNL we found out we couldn’t use the name Cholos. The Mexican consulate made us change it because it was the name of a Mexican gang. We changed the name to the zoo. Lindsey was in the band when we first put it together. He quit in the middle of making a record. But he was the one who actually got me in the band in the first place.

Terri Garr was the host when we did SNL for the second time with mick Fleetwood zoo on 12th November 1983’

Interesting. Stevie did SNL one month later.

This would have made a great trivia question about the Cholos. Sounds to me they changed the name not because it was offensive but for fear of their lives LOL
Living in LA, the Mexican Mafia gangs were pretty violent. The gang could have had a real issue with using their name. When the book says the consulate "made" them change the name. He would have no power to do that. But his advice was probably pretty scary like "you guys are crazy to keep this name."

[Villavic]

Originally Posted by WalkAThinLine.

[ You started out in Mick’s band the Cholos, which later became the Zoo.

Does anyone know why they gave the band that name?

[FuzzyPlum]

I think he more likely just wanted to do a bit of side work in general. Though billy says ‘without the girls’….I don’t think John was involved in that either. In the end, Christine did actually contribute. I guess it morphed from a Lindsey side project that happened to include his mate Mick into a Mick band.