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[Jondalar]

Originally Posted by Macfan4life

FISA Judge 1: Republican
FISA Judge 2: Republican
FISA Judge 3: Republican
FISA Judge 4: Republican
Robert Mueller: Republican
Rod Rosenstein: Republican
Attorney General: Republican
FBI Director: Republican
House: Republican
Senate: Republican

The Trump and Nunes conspiracy
BTW I would imagine most FBI agents did not vote for Hillary Clinton and voted for Trump like all other law enforcement agencies

Yeah, and the fake Dossier payed for by Clinton is why he is even being investigated by Mueller. Don't get me started on conspiracies. Clinton lied over and over again, deleted emails..... Lorretta Lynch on the tarmack with Bill Clinton.... nothing ever happened to her. The justice system protected her over and over again. The Clinton Foundation... Uranium.... Comey got sooo much crap from his own people for letting her off the hook that it backfired.

[FuzzyPlum]

Originally Posted by Jondalar

Yeah, and the fake Dossier payed for by Clinton is why he is even being investigated by Mueller. Don't get me started on conspiracies. Clinton lied over and over again, deleted emails..... Lorretta Lynch on the tarmack with Bill Clinton.... nothing ever happened to her. The justice system protected her over and over again. The Clinton Foundation... Uranium.... Comey got sooo much crap from his own people for letting her off the hook that it backfired.

Is that the investigation and resulting dossier that was first set up by conservatives to discredit Trump?
Anyway, the net is tightening- they're getting out while they still can and the canaries are singing.

[elle]

Originally Posted by iamnotafraid

Ever wonder how many minds we've
changed here by arguing?

At least I know I'm right.

i've been checking here from time to time, just out of curiosity. i have to say that i'm puzzled why people keep re-arguing what happened more than a year ago.

why not discuss current events? there's so much important stuff happening right now, including tax cuts, education, foreign policy, environment, immigration, gun control, healthcare, infrastructure (well doesn't seem like much is happening there) that all has consequences for both now and the future, yet all i read here is re-litigating something that's long over and done.

[Jondalar]

Originally Posted by elle

i've been checking here from time to time, just out of curiosity. i have to say that i'm puzzled why people keep re-arguing what happened more than a year ago.

why not discuss current events? there's so much important stuff happening right now, including tax cuts, education, foreign policy, environment, immigration, gun control, healthcare, infrastructure (well doesn't seem like much is happening there) that all has consequences for both now and the future, yet all i read here is re-litigating something that's long over and done.

Because the Democratic Party won't move on. They keep blaming their loss on the president and Russia and won't take any responsibility for their own mistakes. It's time to move on but they won't let it happen. It would mean they would actually have to admit to responsibility for their bad decision making. They also don't want to cater to the white working people in the Rust Belt to win back the votes they lost.

[elle]

Originally Posted by Jondalar

Because the Democratic Party won't move on. They keep blaming their loss on the president and Russia and won't take any responsibility for their own mistakes. It's time to move on but they won't let it happen. It would mean they would actually have to admit to responsibility for their bad decision making. They also don't want to cater to the white working people in the Rust Belt to win back the votes they lost.

that makes no sense. democratic party is completely irrelevant right now. they have no power whatsoever, so why would you pay any attention or worry about anything they say or do, or any candidates they had in the past and are long out of any kind of influence sphere.

[Jondalar]

Originally Posted by elle

that makes no sense. democratic party is completely irrelevant right now. they have no power whatsoever, so why would you pay any attention or worry about anything they say or do, or any candidates they had in the past and are long out of any kind of influence sphere.

It makes total sense. They are trying to get him impeached. They have from the beginning. All they want to do is disrupt his presidency. They are not treating him like a president. They are still upset over the election.

[elle]

Originally Posted by Jondalar

It makes total sense. They are trying to get him impeached. They have from the beginning.

they cannot impeach him. republicans have both the house and the senate.

again, democrats have no power. you are worrying about people without power and stuff that cannot happen, instead of making sure that people who are actually in power do what they promised they would do for you. like drain the swamp for example!

then again, as a FM fan i guess one is used to pondering about stuff that won't happen!

[Macfan4life]

Originally Posted by Jondalar

Yeah, and the fake Dossier payed for by Clinton is why he is even being investigated by Mueller. Don't get me started on conspiracies. Clinton lied over and over again, deleted emails..... Lorretta Lynch on the tarmack with Bill Clinton.... nothing ever happened to her. The justice system protected her over and over again. The Clinton Foundation... Uranium.... Comey got sooo much crap from his own people for letting her off the hook that it backfired.

That's actually false but its not me to try to prove anything to you. Google or do your own fact searching. The FBI investigation into the Trump campaign happened well before the Dossier. The Dossier was political research that stumbled upon Russian connections that was also reported to the FBI. However, the FBI already had an investigation going. On a side note, nothing in the Dossier has ever been proven to be false.
That is what Nunes wont tell you trying to fool everyone that the FBI investigation came only from the Dossier. That is wrong. As we learned from the Trump people who have pled guilty, the FBI investigation started with one guy's loose lips and bragging to other people.
Something that could help you in life is never trust just one news source. Do your own investigation. Never take something for granted that someone is spoon feeding you.

[Macfan4life]

Originally Posted by FuzzyPlum

Yes, I know that. I didn't mean they literally stole an election.
You don't seem to have the most democratic example of democracy in the world though when the most popular candidate to the tune of 3 million votes (more than 2% of the electorate) loses- but that's another story.

Anyway, I see there were positive comments from your President regarding gun control yesterday. That's a step in the right direction. I'd be happy for you all if he manages to get something done- He's gone up one notch in my estimation, though the bar is still pretty low. Of course, he might speak to somebody else tomorrow and change his mind.

Our founders were brilliant men. But they were highly suspicious of common and ignorant men. When they created the government not only did they put checks and balances on all branches of government but they also created a check and balance on the people's power. For example only land owners were allowed to vote. The Congress they created was 2 houses. House of representatives elected by the people and the Senate where the Senators where appointed by the governors in each state. The Senate approves treaties, judges, etc. They wanted educated men in these positions so the elected power was not given to popular vote until 1917 when the constitution was changed to allow popular vote of Senators. The electoral college does many things but the most important thing it does is a chance for the college to over turn the popular vote in case the people voted for a flawed candidate. Its perfectly legal for any member of the electoral college to vote for anyone they want. However tradition is they vote the way their district does. But they are not bound by it at all. Many times over the years not all members of the electoral college vote for the president their district did. For example in 1988 one member did not vote for either major candidate for president. His one vote made no difference in the election and it was more of a protest vote. After the election of Trump many lobbied members of the electoral college not to vote for Trump. But most of the college voted how their district did which elected Trump.
The electoral college will be repealed in the next 50 years. Right now the rural states feel powerful but in about 20 years you can win the presidency by only winning 8 most popular states. You could win 42 states and still lose the presidency. Democrats are wimps lost 2 presidential elections in the last 25 years to the electoral college but winning the popular vote. If this happened once to Republicans, they would definitely move to abolish the electoral college. But once 8 or 9 states decide the presidency with the major cities, they will change their minds.

[Jondalar]

Originally Posted by Macfan4life

That's actually false but its not me to try to prove anything to you. Google or do your own fact searching. The FBI investigation into the Trump campaign happened well before the Dossier. The Dossier was political research that stumbled upon Russian connections that was also reported to the FBI. However, the FBI already had an investigation going. On a side note, nothing in the Dossier has ever been proven to be false.
That is what Nunes wont tell you trying to fool everyone that the FBI investigation came only from the Dossier. That is wrong. As we learned from the Trump people who have pled guilty, the FBI investigation started with one guy's loose lips and bragging to other people.
Something that could help you in life is never trust just one news source. Do your own investigation. Never take something for granted that someone is spoon feeding you.

Well somebody has been reading Politico and taking whatever Adam Schiff says as gospel. Your research try’s to debunk how important the Clinton paid for Dossier was to getting the court to let them to spy on Trump. By the way, of course the FBI, and the Swamp in Washington DC were investigating Trump. All they have wanted to do from the beginning is discredit him. Just because they started investigation, doesn’t mean they are just. However they had the courts approval to spy on him because of the dossier.

Trump was not part of the swamp. He didn’t know enough about politics to rig an election. Clinton lied over and over again. Nothing ever happened to her. The Clintons dirty dealings are all over Washington.

[elle]

Originally Posted by Jondalar

Trump was not part of the swamp. He didn’t know enough about politics

wasn't that exactly his argument on why he can drain the swamp - because he knows it too well from being on the other side, from years of giving money to politicians to try to gain influence? so he'd be perfectly suited to drain the swamp, making sure that his decisions don't depend on who can give more money for something that may benefit him or his businesses since he's independently wealthy. i have not been following much lately, how's that been going?

[Jondalar]

Originally Posted by elle

wasn't that exactly his argument on why he can drain the swamp - because he knows it too well from being on the other side, from years of giving money to politicians to try to gain influence? so he'd be perfectly suited to drain the swamp, making sure that his decisions don't depend on who can give more money for something that may benefit him or his businesses since he's independently wealthy. i have not been following much lately, how's that been going?

No that wasn’t his argument. And your statement is full of negative twists against Trump. It’s going well.

[FuzzyPlum]

Drain the swamp?
From what I read Jared Kushner is single-handedly turning Washington DC into Louisiana.

[Jondalar]

Originally Posted by FuzzyPlum

Drain the swamp?
From what I read Jared Kushner is single-handedly turning Washington DC into Louisiana.

You worry about the United States too much and CNN and the Huffington Post are more like terrorist organizations than media outlets. All they do is lie, racebait to try and incite and spread Fake News to further the Democratic agenda, which is now a socialist agenda. There is Fox News and then there is everything else. Most news organizations are just branches of the Democratic Party. FOX is soo popular because it's the only alternative.

[FuzzyPlum]

Originally Posted by Jondalar

You worry about the United States too much and CNN and the Huffington Post are more like terrorist organizations than media outlets. All they do is lie is try to incite and spread Fake News. There is Fox News and then there is everything else. Most news organizations are just branches of the Democratic Party. FOX is soo popular because it's the only alternative.

I must admit I do spend too much of my time following American political news but I can't help it... I find it intriguing and...well... entertaining. Its like watching a Shakespearean play- often tragic. often laughable, sometimes horrific.

Don't think I've ever read Huff Post and I rarely look at CNN. I mostly read British newspapers online; Independent and The Guardian. I'll also admit to being addicted to openly left wingers like TYT, Bill Maher and Stephen Colbert.

Fox News and then everything else; there are normal views and regular opinions, and then there are extreme views as pushed by Fox. That Fox is one of the very few major news outlets that push such a far right wing agenda should tell you all you need to know. There is a reason why the much maligned 'mainstream media' are called the mainstream.