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  #46  
Old 04-19-2022, 05:06 PM
michelej1 michelej1 is offline
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Yes. IDWTK is definitely a Stevie song and neither one of them would not mention that it wasn’t after all these lo 100 years. Stevie probably just doesn’t like it because Lindsey made her sick of it even before they joined FM. She wanted to move on to her new material and have a song on Rumours that didn’t include so much of his vocals.
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  #47  
Old 04-19-2022, 10:16 PM
bombaysaffires bombaysaffires is offline
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Lindsey recently said that in the past he often gave Stevie tracks to write to which he said "she used to like". IDWK feels like it could definitely be such a song. He didn't name any songs where that might be the case and it would appear he never took any credit for doing so, and that would make one more piece of the puzzle that explains why he has been so angry and took any number of digs at her over the years... I've always felt the extent of his grudge had to go further than just a spurned lover and had just as much if not more to do with his belief that without his playing, arranging and producing her songs she would never have had the level of success she had. If you add to that that he provided music for her to write to and didn't take credit, that would explain a LOT. (For those who think he wouldn't do that, recall she totally wrote at least part of Wild Heart to his track for Can't Go Back and I've never seen him credited as a cowriter).
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  #48  
Old 04-19-2022, 10:38 PM
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Originally Posted by bombaysaffires View Post
Lindsey recently said that in the past he often gave Stevie tracks to write to which he said "she used to like". IDWK feels like it could definitely be such a song. He didn't name any songs where that might be the case and it would appear he ever took any credit for doing so, and that would make one more piece of the puzzle that explains why he has been so angry and took any number of digs at her over the years... I've always felt the extent of his grudge had to go further than just a spurned lover and had just as much if not more to do with his belief that without his playing, arranging and producing her songs she would never have had the level of success she had. If you add to that that he provided the music for her to write to and didn't take credit, that would explain a LOT. (For those who think he wouldn't do that, recall she totally wrote at least part of Wild Heart to his track for Can't Go Back and I've never seen him credited as a cowriter).
That's because she's a bitter old shrew, who surrounded herself with a Yes Army 40 years ago, who tell her that her gas smells like honey. And she believes every bit of smoke they blow up her arse. No wonder she's crazy...
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  #49  
Old 04-20-2022, 01:04 AM
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Originally Posted by bombaysaffires View Post
Lindsey recently said that in the past he often gave Stevie tracks to write to which he said "she used to like". IDWK feels like it could definitely be such a song. He didn't name any songs where that might be the case and it would appear he ever took any credit for doing so, and that would make one more piece of the puzzle that explains why he has been so angry and took any number of digs at her over the years... I've always felt the extent of his grudge had to go further than just a spurned lover and had just as much if not more to do with his belief that without his playing, arranging and producing her songs she would never have had the level of success she had. If you add to that that he provided the music for her to write to and didn't take credit, that would explain a LOT. (For those who think he wouldn't do that, recall she totally wrote at least part of Wild Heart to his track for Can't Go Back and I've never seen him credited as a cowriter).
Not sure about the music per se, but as for the lyrics alone I could easily believe that Lindsey wrote the verse (which is fairly inane and repetitive) and Stevie wrote the chorus (which has very Stevie lyrics). Also in terms of the story the lyrics tell, the verses sound like Lindsey talking to Stevie and the chorus sounds like Stevie talking to Lindsey--whether in 1974 or in 2018.
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  #50  
Old 04-20-2022, 04:51 PM
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Not sure about the music per se, but as for the lyrics alone I could easily believe that Lindsey wrote the verse (which is fairly inane and repetitive) and Stevie wrote the chorus (which has very Stevie lyrics).
I’m fairly certain that it was written on a guitar (not a piano or anything else) — just the way it moves along, bar to bar, modulates on upbeats and downbeats in a really straightforward way with some syncopation on 2 and 4, “communicates” with the bass, and lays rhythm down for the vocal, etc. That song was written on rhythm guitar, and I don’t think Stevie has ever written an up-tempo guitar song. (Sometimes I think she wrote “Angel” on guitar.)

I think many of the words, too, are Lindseyish, but that’s harder to pin down. Now you tell me that I’m crazy/It’s nothin’ that I didn’t know — Lindsey has written a million other songs with that sort of humor and sarcastic self criticism (I didn’t wanna be this late/So don’t make me wait). Stevie doesn’t write stuff like that. She doesn’t admit to her character flaws with quite so much tongue in cheek. But maybe she wrote this lyric to mimic her man’s hippie/mountain man voice. Maybe that’s part of what the song means: Our relationship is hot and cold so often that we can’t even keep up with it, and I’m starting to sound like you.
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  #51  
Old 04-20-2022, 06:38 PM
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Back to Paper Doll, I just looked up the Wikipedia entry for the song, and apparently it made #9 in Canada??? Like #9 on the pop chart, not even adult contemporary. That kinda blows my mind if it’s true.

It got to #8 on Bubbling Under Hot 100 in the US.

I like the song, except for the lead vocal. Her voice sounds really blown out to me on this one.
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  #52  
Old 04-20-2022, 07:45 PM
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David, are you trying to tell me that you can't see Stevie composing a song in the key of B on the piano? You wouldn't say that to Dvořák!
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  #53  
Old 04-20-2022, 07:50 PM
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I like the song, except for the lead vocal. Her voice sounds really blown out to me on this one.
Not only is the vocal subpar, to me it sounds very "tacked on", not integrated into the music, like it was recorded in a different time zone.

I also think it might sound a bit better with Christine singing the verses, Stevie singing the bridge, and everyone singing the chorus.
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  #54  
Old 04-20-2022, 10:07 PM
bombaysaffires bombaysaffires is offline
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Originally Posted by David View Post
I’m fairly certain that it was written on a guitar (not a piano or anything else) — just the way it moves along, bar to bar, modulates on upbeats and downbeats in a really straightforward way with some syncopation on 2 and 4, “communicates” with the bass, and lays rhythm down for the vocal, etc. That song was written on rhythm guitar, and I don’t think Stevie has ever written an up-tempo guitar song. (Sometimes I think she wrote “Angel” on guitar.)

I think many of the words, too, are Lindseyish, but that’s harder to pin down. Now you tell me that I’m crazy/It’s nothin’ that I didn’t know — Lindsey has written a million other songs with that sort of humor and sarcastic self criticism (I didn’t wanna be this late/So don’t make me wait). Stevie doesn’t write stuff like that. She doesn’t admit to her character flaws with quite so much tongue in cheek. But maybe she wrote this lyric to mimic her man’s hippie/mountain man voice. Maybe that’s part of what the song means: Our relationship is hot and cold so often that we can’t even keep up with it, and I’m starting to sound like you.
To your point, the line "hanging on to you" just doesn't sound Stevie to me at all and never has. And given what we know about their relationship as it fell apart, and each of them saying that the more ambivalent she got about staying with him the harder he hung onto her and the more controlling he became, that line feels very like him at that time and not like her at all.
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  #55  
Old 04-20-2022, 10:36 PM
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Y'all spend way too much time thinking about the dynamic between them, when their relationship ended a half century ago.
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  #56  
Old 04-20-2022, 11:56 PM
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Originally Posted by bombaysaffires View Post
To your point, the line "hanging on to you" just doesn't sound Stevie to me at all and never has. And given what we know about their relationship as it fell apart, and each of them saying that the more ambivalent she got about staying with him the harder he hung onto her and the more controlling he became, that line feels very like him at that time and not like her at all.
Yes, that line at the end is an inconvnient flaw in my theory... Hoped no-one would zoom in on it. (Sticks fingers in ears.) I don't want to know!
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  #57  
Old 04-21-2022, 07:54 AM
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Originally Posted by DownOnRodeo View Post
Not only is the vocal subpar, to me it sounds very "tacked on", not integrated into the music, like it was recorded in a different time zone.

I also think it might sound a bit better with Christine singing the verses, Stevie singing the bridge, and everyone singing the chorus.
Now that's funny "recorded in a different time zone" But its funny because I know what you are saying. Paper Doll is ok but IMHO it always just seemed like a rushed recorded song to me. Hurry up, Stevie has a solo career going and just record something and slap it on the greatest hits package.
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  #58  
Old 04-21-2022, 09:27 AM
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It’s interesting to me that people have mentioned Stevie’s vocals, but no one seems to mind the bizarre… I’m not sure what the word is… cartoon-like sound effects prevalent throughout the song that makes me think the video for Paper Doll could feature the Road Runner being chased by Wile E. Coyote.

Beep beep indeed!
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  #59  
Old 04-21-2022, 08:12 PM
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It’s interesting to me that people have mentioned Stevie’s vocals, but no one seems to mind the bizarre… I’m not sure what the word is… cartoon-like sound effects prevalent throughout the song that makes me think the video for Paper Doll could feature the Road Runner being chased by Wile E. Coyote.

Beep beep indeed!
Now I'm going to be picturing Road Runner whenever I hear Sugar Daddy.
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  #60  
Old 04-21-2022, 09:33 PM
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Now I'm going to be picturing Road Runner whenever I hear Sugar Daddy.
Roadrunner and Sugar Daddy are way better songs.
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