Poll: best song from 1988-1995

[HomerMcvie]

Originally Posted by aleuzzi

If I could remove one album from the FM catalog, it would be Behind the Mask. When it came out, I was first crestfallen, then embarrassed.

Its Supermarket charms depress me.

Many would say Time. BUT, that wasn't the supergroup.

So you're right, neither was BTM. Their creative genius had flown the coop.

So firing him in 2018 made complete sense, right?

The day Old Goatsy became CEO of FM is the day the band died.

[Mr Scarrott]

Originally Posted by aleuzzi

If I could remove one album from the FM catalog, it would be Behind the Mask. When it came out, I was first crestfallen, then embarrassed.

Its Supermarket charms depress me.

Pretty much exactly how I felt, Aleuzzi. Maybe it was for the best. If Lindsey had had to fashion some of the tracks he was fashioning into Out of the Cradle into Mac songs, it would have been a very weird and uneven album even with the best (or least bad) of Christine and Stevie's BTM offerings.

[aleuzzi]

Originally Posted by Mr Scarrott

Pretty much exactly how I felt, Aleuzzi. Maybe it was for the best. If Lindsey had had to fashion some of the tracks he was fashioning into Out of the Cradle into Mac songs, it would have been a very weird and uneven album even with the best (or least bad) of Christine and Stevie's BTM offerings.

Thing is: I think some of those Christine songs (NOT Skies) are potentially very good. They just have bloated, sickly-sweet arrangements. If you strip back Save Me, get rid of the awful synth, it’s pretty good. The title tune has potential, too. The production is just awful.

[Macfan4life]

Originally Posted by aleuzzi

Thing is: I think some of those Christine songs (NOT Skies) are potentially very good. They just have bloated, sickly-sweet arrangements. If you strip back Save Me, get rid of the awful synth, it’s pretty good. The title tune has potential, too. The production is just awful.

That is an understatement about the title track. I agree and so many rave about it and I could never get into it. I want to like it so bad because its a dark Chris song that is rare but it just does not click for me. I don't like how the chorus is sung. Like you said its not a bad song and had so much potential but the arrangement keeps it an average song at best. The worst part is the Stevie's moan that is layered in. When I listen today its like nails down a chalkboard because its so obviously layered in. But back in 1990 I thought it was really cool. I once heard the song at the Brown Derby (restaurant) in 1990 which I thought was really cool when I thought the album was going to be really big.

As far as the album, half of it is good to really good. The other half is meh to bad. I think Hard Feelings, Affairs of the Heart, and Second Time are some of the worst songs the Mac ever recorded.

The thing I like most about the album is it does not try to be pop like Tango but that is why it was not successful. This kind of music was instinct in 1990. I dont care for most of Tango for its synth programmed pop that mostly has no Fleetwood Mac sound. BTM does many times sound like Fleetwood Mac. Even if you don't care for Skies, if you only heard those opening keyboards many would guess it was Christine by the way it was played. She has some very classic and fabulous keyboard solos on the album which was missing from Tango. As Chris would say the Mac had the best rhythm (blues) section around. On many of the songs you can hear that section again with Mick, Chris and John. Mick, Chris, and John play on every song unlike Tango. For that reason alone I like the album. I recently bought the CD and have rediscovered it. I never upgraded the cassette I bought in 1990. But I think I understand your distaste for the album. Much of it is studio musician tracks without much greatness. Its safe but IMHO does have some creativity. I loved In The Back Of My Mind from the first time I heard it. Personally I think Billy is a horrible singer but its my favorite track on the album. Affairs of the Heart and Second Time put me instantly in a K-hole (klonopin hole).

[WalkAThinLine.]

Originally Posted by Macfan4life

That is an understatement about the title track. I agree and so many rave about it and I could never get into it. I want to like it so bad because its a dark Chris song that is rare but it just does not click for me. I don't like how the chorus is sung. Like you said its not a bad song and had so much potential but the arrangement keeps it an average song at best. The worst part is the Stevie's moan that is layered in. When I listen today its like nails down a chalkboard because its so obviously layered in. But back in 1990 I thought it was really cool. I once heard the song at the Brown Derby (restaurant) in 1990 which I thought was really cool when I thought the album was going to be really big.

As far as the album, half of it is good to really good. The other half is meh to bad. I think Hard Feelings, Affairs of the Heart, and Second Time are some of the worst songs the Mac ever recorded.

The thing I like most about the album is it does not try to be pop like Tango but that is why it was not successful. This kind of music was instinct in 1990. I dont care for most of Tango for its synth programmed pop that mostly has no Fleetwood Mac sound. BTM does many times sound like Fleetwood Mac. Even if you don't care for Skies, if you only heard those opening keyboards many would guess it was Christine by the way it was played. She has some very classic and fabulous keyboard solos on the album which was missing from Tango. As Chris would say the Mac had the best rhythm (blues) section around. On many of the songs you can hear that section again with Mick, Chris and John. Mick, Chris, and John play on every song unlike Tango. For that reason alone I like the album. I recently bought the CD and have rediscovered it. I never upgraded the cassette I bought in 1990. But I think I understand your distaste for the album. Much of it is studio musician tracks without much greatness. Its safe but IMHO does have some creativity. I loved In The Back Of My Mind from the first time I heard it. Personally I think Billy is a horrible singer but its my favorite track on the album. Affairs of the Heart and Second Time put me instantly in a K-hole (klonopin hole).

I appear to be more favorable toward this album for most. A lot of the arguments against Behind the Mask are understandable, but I'm not really bothered by any of the songs on the album perhaps with the exception of the hokey "When the Sun Goes Down". The keyboard sounds on this album often receives criticism for sounding dated, which might be true but fortunately does not detract from my listening experience. Certain songs such as "In the Back Of My Mind" and the title track possess impressive depth due to extensive overdubbing, with "In the Back of My Mind" requiring the most amount of tracks to complete out of any Fleetwood Mac song up through that point. There's a neat instrumental of "Behind the Mask" that demonstrates the richness and care that went into the track.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-7VmV2Xm1aY

[Mr Scarrott]

Originally Posted by Macfan4life

That is an understatement about the title track. I agree and so many rave about it and I could never get into it. I want to like it so bad because its a dark Chris song that is rare but it just does not click for me. I don't like how the chorus is sung. Like you said its not a bad song and had so much potential but the arrangement keeps it an average song at best. The worst part is the Stevie's moan that is layered in. When I listen today its like nails down a chalkboard because its so obviously layered in. But back in 1990 I thought it was really cool. I once heard the song at the Brown Derby (restaurant) in 1990 which I thought was really cool when I thought the album was going to be really big.

I have always liked the title track, which reminds be of the Mystery to Me album and I would have been interested to have seen how Lindsey could have influenced its production. Ironically, the cameo he does offer- on accoustic guitar- does sound a tiny bit laboured to my ears. Billy's (and or Rick's) backing vocals are just a bit bland, but Rick's guitar work on this track is mysterious and effective IMHO; Stevie's contribution, though limited, works for me. I suppose if Lindsey had produced the song it would have lost its Bob Welchy feel. It just could never have saved the album on its own, however.

[Macfan4life]

Originally Posted by Mr Scarrott

I have always liked the title track, which reminds be of the Mystery to Me album and I would have been interested to have seen how Lindsey could have influenced its production. Ironically, the cameo he does offer- on accoustic guitar- does sound a tiny bit laboured to my ears. Billy's (and or Rick's) backing vocals are just a bit bland, but Rick's guitar work on this track is mysterious and effective IMHO; Stevie's contribution, though limited, works for me. I suppose if Lindsey had produced the song it would have lost its Bob Welchy feel. It just could never have saved the album on its own, however.

We are opposites because its one of the weaker tracks on the album IMHO. Its still one of the better ones but the chorus does not grab me. I like the opening suspense kind of music but once the chorus hits the song loses me. Lindsey's acoustic playing is the highlight for sure! It definitely has a very dark feel like In The Back Of My Mind which I think is on purpose.
I was such a Mac nerd because I ran out and bought it the day it was released and was like why is not everyone loving it? It hurt when ALAYF never charted. But Save Me tanking just as the band hit the states for the tour devastated me. I hate the way Stevie is layered in only at the end of Save Me and not on the chorus. Tango gets flack for allegedly layering in Stevie. BTM said hold my beer Lindsey!

[SteveMacD]

BTM sounds like what old men lathered in Old Spice smell like.

There’s no real edge whatsoever to the album. It’s bland, soulless, overproduced music. Even when I make an alternative version of the album, which is insanely better, it still misses a bit.

As much as I love Christine, she was never supposed to be the band’s creative driving force. She’s supposed to be the pop levity amid something deeper and darker. Stevie was in terrible shape, Rick was a glorified sideman, and Billy, who had the edgiest song on the album, brought little edge (which is sad, because his psychobilly stuff was incredible). So, Christine was the de facto leader.

Lindsey relished in that role, although to an excess and sometimes with disregard to the creative needs of others. I think that’s why the 1975 album and shows are my favorite. Lindsey took some creative control, but the Brits and Olsen kept him on a shorter leash, and I think it was the strongest group effort they’ve ever done.

[Macfan4life]

Originally Posted by SteveMacD

BTM sounds like what old men lathered in Old Spice smell like.

There’s no real edge whatsoever to the album. It’s bland, soulless, overproduced music. Even when I make an alternative version of the album, which is insanely better, it still misses a bit.

As much as I love Christine, she was never supposed to be the band’s creative driving force. She’s supposed to be the pop levity amid something deeper and darker. Stevie was in terrible shape, Rick was a glorified sideman, and Billy, who had the edgiest song on the album, brought little edge (which is sad, because his psychobilly stuff was incredible). So, Christine was the de facto leader.

Lindsey relished in that role, although to an excess and sometimes with disregard to the creative needs of others. I think that’s why the 1975 album and shows are my favorite. Lindsey took some creative control, but the Brits and Olsen kept him on a shorter leash, and I think it was the strongest group effort they’ve ever done.

That's a good analysis. I will take that a bit further and say Chris was also the ringleader for the tour. The new guys were sill a bit unknown and Stevie was zonked out. Stevie had no hits or singles with this era of the band. Everything was on Chris's shoulders.

Having said that, there is so much Chris playing and singing on BTM that I can't help not to like it. I will take an overproduced album with real instruments over an overproduced synth programmed one any day Rick is a fine guitarist but he is a studio musician. Great albums are made with people with vision and a bit out of the ordinary. Is not BTM like Chris's 1984 solo album. Its very safe, does not take many chances but is pleasing to the ears.

[WalkAThinLine.]

Originally Posted by Macfan4life

That's a good analysis. I will take that a bit further and say Chris was also the ringleader for the tour. The new guys were sill a bit unknown and Stevie was zonked out. Stevie had no hits or singles with this era of the band. Everything was on Chris's shoulders.

Having said that, there is so much Chris playing and singing on BTM that I can't help not to like it. I will take an overproduced album with real instruments over an overproduced synth programmed one any day Rick is a fine guitarist but he is a studio musician. Great albums are made with people with vision and a bit out of the ordinary. Is not BTM like Chris's 1984 solo album. It's very safe, does not take many chances but is pleasing to the ears.

Behind the Mask is a very average album with more than serviceable songs. McVie's great songwriting from Tango in the Night largely continues here and Billy does a good job on this album even though I'm generally indifferent to most of his other work. It's admittedly a bit bland compared to Tango in the Night, but I'm probably more positive on Behind the Mask than most even though I would still rank it as a bottom five album in their discography.

[Mr Scarrott]

Originally Posted by WalkAThinLine.

[I]I would still rank it as a bottom five album in their discography.

I would rank it 17th out of their 17 studio albums, and to be honest, that's overrating it.

Or as English football managers are wont to say " we lost five-nil, and we were lucky to get nil".

[aleuzzi]

Originally Posted by Mr Scarrott

I would rank it 17th out of their 17 studio albums, and to be honest, that's overrating it.

Or as English football managers are wont to say " we lost five-nil, and we were lucky to get nil".

I’m with you 10000%

[WalkAThinLine.]

Originally Posted by Mr Scarrott

I would rank it 17th out of their 17 studio albums, and to be honest, that's overrating it.

.

I certainly would not rate it worse than Time. I'm also probably more likely to listen to Behind the Mask than Mr Wonderful, but comparing that album to Behind the Mask is like comparing apples and oranges.

[Mr Scarrott]

Originally Posted by WalkAThinLine.

I certainly would not rate it worse than Time. I'm also probably more likely to listen to Behind the Mask than Mr Wonderful, but comparing that album to Behind the Mask is like comparing apples and oranges.

Yeah, a half-ripe apple to a rotten orange. Peter's songs on Mr Wonderful are exactly that, they're just about about enough to make you forget the repetitive nature of Jeremy's. Of Time , only Blow by blow really grates. It's a Christine-heavy selection box,and on occasion quite fun or moody. However, as a six-piece, the band only very rarely gels (on a couple of Bekka's songs); maybe if Christine and Dave had got on, something more interesting might have come out of it- as it is they barely on the same page and only nominally seem to be bandmates. It's a much better listen than its predecessor,though.

[HomerMcvie]

Originally Posted by Mr Scarrott

Yeah, a half-ripe apple to a rotten orange. Peter's songs on Mr Wonderful are exactly that, they're just about about enough to make you forget the repetitive nature of Jeremy's. Of Time , only Blow by blow really grates. It's a Christine-heavy selection box,and on occasion quite fun or moody. However, as a six-piece, the band only very rarely gels (on a couple of Bekka's songs); maybe if Christine and Dave had got on, something more interesting might have come out of it- as it is they barely on the same page and only nominally seem to be bandmates. It's a much better listen than its predecessor,though.

I love Bekka's vocals at the end of Blow By Blow!

But I'm with you. Time is better than BTM.