The Ledge

Go Back   The Ledge > Main Forums > Rumours
User Name
Password
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Mark Forums Read


Make the Ads Go Away! Click here.
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #16  
Old 08-17-2022, 06:24 PM
UnwindedDreams UnwindedDreams is offline
Addicted Ledgie
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 4,395
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by David View Post
But how do we know how much they really did that? It’s just that we see her do that on the St. Louis film — and then, what? assume that she did that the entire tour? It’s like everyone saying she did the Charleston on “Angel” every night just because you see her do it in St. Louis, or that she had her hair in a Gibson bun for “Sara” all the time. Sometimes she did and sometimes she didn’t, I bet. We can’t just watch one film and then say, oh, that was the formula for ten months of touring.

We could check the Landover/Largo 1979 film, too, but we don’t have much visual evidence for anything.
I was speaking for Sara from 2004 onward, which had some acts in it that were as reliable as the Stand Back kick.

But those Saras with the red chiffon and bun were to die for! I like how she paid tribute to Tusk Tour Sara with her red coat in 2004.
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 08-17-2022, 07:32 PM
SteveMacD's Avatar
SteveMacD SteveMacD is offline
Addicted Ledgie
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: The Buckeye State
Posts: 8,299
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by David View Post
But how do we know how much they really did that? Itís just that we see her do that on the St. Louis film ó and then, what? assume that she did that the entire tour? Itís like everyone saying she did the Charleston on ďAngelĒ every night just because you see her do it in St. Louis, or that she had her hair in a Gibson bun for ďSaraĒ all the time. Sometimes she did and sometimes she didnít, I bet. We canít just watch one film and then say, oh, that was the formula for ten months of touring.

We could check the Landover/Largo 1979 film, too, but we donít have much visual evidence for anything.
Thereís also the rehearsal videos.
__________________
On and on it will always be, the rhythm, rhyme, and harmony.



THE Stephen Hopkins
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 08-18-2022, 08:03 AM
jmn3 jmn3 is offline
Addicted Ledgie
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Posts: 1,477
Default

Well, I dug out my old external HD with all my MP3's on it and went through tons of Mac stuff and alas, I do not have any Sara's from 1988. Now, I know I've heard one and I swore I had one, but, nope. From what I recall, it was very perfunctory in its execution. Not a bad performance, but nothing special. To me, Sara peaked immediately upon being played live during the Tusk Tour. Some of those recordings are incredible - certainly the Live album and what came out on the Tusk Deluxe - but also bootlegs like Melbourne always stuck out to me as peak performances of the song. After 1980 there was always less magic IMO. Her solo performances were always meh and even on the Mirage Tour, they altered it just slightly enough to make it lesser.

The modern Sara's (2004-2017) were, like most songs in that era, performed well and somewhat true to the recorded version (as best as the band and the backing band could do it), but still rather perfunctory. The dance and the theatrics with Lindsey and Stevie were really stupid of course. "OMG SHE USED HIS MIC!!?!?!?!!?!?" Kill me.
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 08-18-2022, 08:07 AM
jmn3 jmn3 is offline
Addicted Ledgie
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Posts: 1,477
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Macfan4life View Post
The song was never performed during the 1987 Tango tour. I saw the show very early in the tour and no Sara. The band did perform Sara the next year in Europe but only a few stops. Believe it or not but they did not even drop a song to perform Sara. Their standard set was 20 songs but for a few lucky Euro stops they got 21 songs and Sara.
Sara no doubt is not easy to perform live since its very intricate. But guess what? The Mac nailed it every time. I never bought that reason. I don't find it a coincidence that once the Don Henley article was released, Sara disappeared in the set for an entire decade except these few Euro stops. I was in shock in 1988 when I read Sara was performed in Europe. I was like...what gives? Is there not an article in the Greatest Hits package that talks about the band and mentions Stevie dressed in red performing Sara in Europe? Or that was from somewhere else. I just remember being in shock the band chose to perform it there instead of the states. But maybe they just wanted to try it out there and was not crazy the way it sounded.

Standard Tango setlist from the states performed in Europe - London stop
https://www.setlist.fm/setlist/fleet...-5bd39730.html

Sara added a few London shows, Birmingham, and Scotland
https://www.setlist.fm/setlist/fleet...-53d3974d.html
Those 1987 setlists always puzzle me from Stevie's perspective. Especially with Lindsey gone, starting with Rhiannon and Gypsy in the set, only to remove both, is a real head scratcher. Given the success of both Gypsy and Hold Me on their previous album, I always thought it was strange to chug ahead without either. And yes of course Lindsey was gone and Hold Me would be different, but Chris did it on her solo tour. I suppose Gypsy and Rhiannon being left out are the price you pay for including HAEWAFY and Mick wanting to include Stand Back.
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 08-18-2022, 08:10 AM
jmn3 jmn3 is offline
Addicted Ledgie
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Posts: 1,477
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wdm6789 View Post
Sara has always sounded good live on every tour they have played it. I would even argue that sometimes it sounds better live than the album version. Sara is a beautifully crafted song. The album version is amazing and itís equally amazing when performed live. Now songs like Gypsy, Hold Me, and Everywhere donít translate as well live. They sound better with the added production on the album versions. (The Dance Everywhere is awesome though, but that was cleaned up a lot for the video).
I'd agree on Gypsy and Hold Me, but to me Everywhere is boatloads better in a live setting than on the album. Even the Billy/Rick era versions I thought were a lot more lively. The album version is good IMO, but it's a bit boring at times. I know, blasphemy!
Reply With Quote
  #21  
Old 08-18-2022, 08:15 AM
jmn3 jmn3 is offline
Addicted Ledgie
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Posts: 1,477
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by David View Post
Stevie is the gal who should be responsible for giving the song a slow build and climax, but she doesnít have that dynamic range anymore unless she is singing to acoustic backing, like ďLandslide.Ē So I blame Stevie for screwing it up. Thoughts?
It's what kills me about the modern Stevie's live performances. Her unique voice, the way she could alter a song and her phrasing were always what made her live performances stand out. Sure, the demonic Rhiannon's from the mid 70's are always going to be at the top, but even as her voice changed, she managed to add little nuances to her performances that added something to the song that's hard to describe. But, since at least 2005, she just won't do it anymore. Songs like Sara, Landslide, Dreams, Gypsy, and of course, Rhiannon, have become monotonous blahs. However, she will follow up the most nasally and boring performance of Dreams with a version of Black Magic Woman that is full of little ways of her vocally owning the song. She will put the same effort into Gold Dust Woman (although relying more on her dancing...skills...) but not the others.
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 08-18-2022, 10:40 AM
Macfan4life's Avatar
Macfan4life Macfan4life is offline
Addicted Ledgie
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Somewhere near Key Biscayne, nothing there so I came back
Posts: 5,070
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jmn3 View Post
Those 1987 setlists always puzzle me from Stevie's perspective. Especially with Lindsey gone, starting with Rhiannon and Gypsy in the set, only to remove both, is a real head scratcher. Given the success of both Gypsy and Hold Me on their previous album, I always thought it was strange to chug ahead without either. And yes of course Lindsey was gone and Hold Me would be different, but Chris did it on her solo tour. I suppose Gypsy and Rhiannon being left out are the price you pay for including HAEWAFY and Mick wanting to include Stand Back.
You caught something that I did not. That set does not include Rhiannon nor Gypsy. Both were in the set in the USA. Perhaps for Europe that is why Sara got added. Was Sara a bigger hit there than Rhiannon and Gypsy? Rhiannon was her staple and always has been. Surprised it was removed.
__________________
My heart will rise up with the morning sun and the hurt I feel will simply melt away
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 08-19-2022, 07:03 AM
Villavic's Avatar
Villavic Villavic is offline
Addicted Ledgie
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Lima Peru
Posts: 3,494
Default

Mick final words in his first book, about each member, he said this: Stevie Nicks? Better than ever, in my opinion. (Although she doesn't let us play "Rhiannon" in concert anymore.)

Well I seriously doubt she was better than ever in early 90s, but the point is about Rhiannon, I always wonder why "she didn't let" them play that song anymore, I guess because she didn't want to risk her voice with the screams, but she prove us she could perform it in a decent way since The Dance.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 08-19-2022, 08:04 AM
Macfan4life's Avatar
Macfan4life Macfan4life is offline
Addicted Ledgie
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Somewhere near Key Biscayne, nothing there so I came back
Posts: 5,070
Default

[QUOTE=Villavic;1277208]Mick final words in his first book, about each member, he said this: Stevie Nicks? Better than ever, in my opinion. (Although she doesn't let us play "Rhiannon" in concert anymore.)

*****************
__________________
My heart will rise up with the morning sun and the hurt I feel will simply melt away

Last edited by Macfan4life; 08-19-2022 at 08:18 AM..
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 08-19-2022, 08:15 AM
Wdm6789 Wdm6789 is offline
Addicted Ledgie
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 975
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jmn3 View Post
Well, I dug out my old external HD with all my MP3's on it and went through tons of Mac stuff and alas, I do not have any Sara's from 1988. Now, I know I've heard one and I swore I had one, but, nope. From what I recall, it was very perfunctory in its execution. Not a bad performance, but nothing special. To me, Sara peaked immediately upon being played live during the Tusk Tour. Some of those recordings are incredible - certainly the Live album and what came out on the Tusk Deluxe - but also bootlegs like Melbourne always stuck out to me as peak performances of the song. After 1980 there was always less magic IMO. Her solo performances were always meh and even on the Mirage Tour, they altered it just slightly enough to make it lesser.

The modern Sara's (2004-2017) were, like most songs in that era, performed well and somewhat true to the recorded version (as best as the band and the backing band could do it), but still rather perfunctory. The dance and the theatrics with Lindsey and Stevie were really stupid of course. "OMG SHE USED HIS MIC!!?!?!?!!?!?" Kill me.
I appreciate you looking through you stash. Thank you!!

I really liked Sara on the Mirage tour. They sped up the tempo just a little bit from the Tusk tour and it sounded really good. I think Mirage tour Sara is my favorite. Iím bummed they didnít add an entire live set to the deluxe Mirage reissue because I really wanted a live 1982 Sara.

But Stevie always sang the last line of Sara on Lindseyís mic. She started that on the Tusk tour.
Reply With Quote
  #26  
Old 08-19-2022, 08:25 AM
Macfan4life's Avatar
Macfan4life Macfan4life is offline
Addicted Ledgie
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Somewhere near Key Biscayne, nothing there so I came back
Posts: 5,070
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Villavic View Post
Mick final words in his first book, about each member, he said this: Stevie Nicks? Better than ever, in my opinion. (Although she doesn't let us play "Rhiannon" in concert anymore.)

Well I seriously doubt she was better than ever in early 90s, but the point is about Rhiannon, I always wonder why "she didn't let" them play that song anymore, I guess because she didn't want to risk her voice with the screams, but she prove us she could perform it in a decent way since The Dance.
OMG I think you cracked the code and connected the dots. This ending to the book always confused me because I read the book when it came out when the Mac was on tour in 1990. I saw them in 1987 and 1990 and Rhiannon was played in those concerts. What could Mick have meant since Rhiannon was played during every Mac tour with Stevie.
Now lets connect the dots. Rhiannon was not played in Europe or most Euro dates in 1988 and we discovered that Sara was added. In 1988 Stevie had enough of Rhiannon live and dropped it. In 1989 she also dropped it from most of her OSOTM tour too. Mick was writing his book these years and so this explains why she did not do it in 1989 either.
Having seen the Mac in the states there was no context for what Mick wrote because Rhiannon was played every tour in the states.
__________________
My heart will rise up with the morning sun and the hurt I feel will simply melt away
Reply With Quote
  #27  
Old 08-19-2022, 10:08 AM
jmn3 jmn3 is offline
Addicted Ledgie
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Posts: 1,477
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Macfan4life View Post
You caught something that I did not. That set does not include Rhiannon nor Gypsy. Both were in the set in the USA. Perhaps for Europe that is why Sara got added. Was Sara a bigger hit there than Rhiannon and Gypsy? Rhiannon was her staple and always has been. Surprised it was removed.
They dropped both Gypsy and Rhiannon in the states. I want to say Gypsy was dropped first and then Rhiannon. Certainly by the later shows in 1987 they were both gone. I have the Salt Lake City show which was end of November and the set was:

Say You Love Me
The Chain
Dreams
Isn't it Midnight
Oh Well
Seven Wonders
Rattlesnake Shake
Over My Head
Gold Dust Woman
Don't Let Me Down Again
HAEWAFY
I Loved Another Woman
Brown Eyes
World Turning
Little Lies
Stand Back
You Make Loving Fun
Go Your Own Way
Blue Letter
Don't Stop
Songbird
Reply With Quote
  #28  
Old 08-19-2022, 10:13 AM
jmn3 jmn3 is offline
Addicted Ledgie
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Posts: 1,477
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wdm6789 View Post
I appreciate you looking through you stash. Thank you!!

I really liked Sara on the Mirage tour. They sped up the tempo just a little bit from the Tusk tour and it sounded really good. I think Mirage tour Sara is my favorite. Iím bummed they didnít add an entire live set to the deluxe Mirage reissue because I really wanted a live 1982 Sara.

But Stevie always sang the last line of Sara on Lindseyís mic. She started that on the Tusk tour.
The sped up Mirage tour way is one of the chief things I didn't like about it!

There was also this thing they did right before "All I ever wanted was to know that you were dreaming" on the Tusk Tour where Lindsey and Stevie sang "oooooooohhhh...SARAAAA" twice and I think it just added something special to the song.
Reply With Quote
  #29  
Old 08-19-2022, 12:01 PM
Macfan4life's Avatar
Macfan4life Macfan4life is offline
Addicted Ledgie
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Somewhere near Key Biscayne, nothing there so I came back
Posts: 5,070
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jmn3 View Post
They dropped both Gypsy and Rhiannon in the states. I want to say Gypsy was dropped first and then Rhiannon. Certainly by the later shows in 1987 they were both gone. I have the Salt Lake City show which was end of November and the set was:

Say You Love Me
The Chain
Dreams
Isn't it Midnight
Oh Well
Seven Wonders
Rattlesnake Shake
Over My Head
Gold Dust Woman
Don't Let Me Down Again
HAEWAFY
I Loved Another Woman
Brown Eyes
World Turning
Little Lies
Stand Back
You Make Loving Fun
Go Your Own Way
Blue Letter
Don't Stop
Songbird
OMG I feel lucky. I saw both Rhiannon and Gypsy in 1987. Now it all makes sense though. I always scratched my head at Mick's comments since I saw both tours and Rhiannon was played at both. Gypsy sounded pretty good. Stevie could still hit some high notes back then. I had my own personal bootleg that I recorded back then. But I threw it away many years ago

On another note we wonder why Mirage is a forgotten album when the band forgets it too. With Gypsy out of the set mid Tango that means no Mirage songs and the entire 1990 tours had no Mirage songs. They play the songs the classic rock stations play as their concert staples.

Gypsy from 1987 Were you there Homer?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=80VXq721IeU
__________________
My heart will rise up with the morning sun and the hurt I feel will simply melt away

Last edited by Macfan4life; 08-19-2022 at 05:42 PM..
Reply With Quote
  #30  
Old 08-19-2022, 07:24 PM
jmn3 jmn3 is offline
Addicted Ledgie
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Posts: 1,477
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Macfan4life View Post
On another note we wonder why Mirage is a forgotten album when the band forgets it too. With Gypsy out of the set mid Tango that means no Mirage songs and the entire 1990 tours had no Mirage songs. They play the songs the classic rock stations play as their concert staples.
It blows my mind they ignored Mirage like they did during the Tango era. Gypsy was the only song and it was dropped. It was their most recent album and it was a success with two hit singles. Hold Me in particular should have been played. Gypsy too and how cool would a Tango era Straight Back have been? Iím still befuddled that they ignored Hold Me altogether from 1982 until 2018ÖI guess 2017 if you count BuckVie.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


FLEETWOOD MAC-RUMOURS - VINILO NEW VINYL picture

FLEETWOOD MAC-RUMOURS - VINILO NEW VINYL

$25.96



LP-FLEETWOOD MAC-GREATEST HITS NEW VINYL picture

LP-FLEETWOOD MAC-GREATEST HITS NEW VINYL

$26.97



Fleetwood Mac Greatest Hits Vinyl New LP Import Sealed picture

Fleetwood Mac Greatest Hits Vinyl New LP Import Sealed

$26.99



FLEETWOODMAC 1982

FLEETWOODMAC 1982 "MIRAGE" VINYL LP 1-23607 WARNER Brothers W/ Lyrics Sleeve

$35.00



Stevie Nicks Stand Back (Walmart Exclusive) (Vinyl) picture

Stevie Nicks Stand Back (Walmart Exclusive) (Vinyl)

$27.00




All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:39 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2023, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
© 1995-2003 Martin and Lisa Adelson, All Rights Reserved