Please Die Fighting for My Rights - Page 4

carrie721 · #46 08-12-2007, 02:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gldstwmn

For every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction.

i agree with that statement. i just don't agree that it happens at the hands of god.

danax6 · #47 08-12-2007, 02:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mylittledemon

You should read Michael Ende's "The NeverEnding Story"...In it, those that go into the "Nothing" become lies in the true world. Fiction yes, but it kinda supports your baseless belief. *wink*

Thank you, I appreciate you telling me that my belief is 'baseless'. Just because I think that there is just not going to be anything after you pass away, that makes my belief baseless? I can come up with hundreds of arguments why I think what I think, just like you can come up with probably the same amount, it doesn't make either belief more founded than the other. Neither can be proven or disproven, so until then it will always remain a matter of opinion.

danax6 · #48 08-12-2007, 02:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by strandinthewind

One day, I gotta cross the pond again and me, you, and Gerald are sitting for a few hours in a seedy pub!

You wouldn't survive us.

DrummerDeanna · #49 08-12-2007, 02:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by trackaghost

And yes, if there is a heaven I'd imagine that a non-believer who has lived a good life would deserve to go there when they die and would be accepted with open arms. Do you think really think that not believing in God, or the right God or whatever, voids all their good deeds? The fact that you equate someone who doesn't believe in God with someone who deserves to burn in hell disturbs me. Having been brought up Catholic let me tell you, believing in God and even devoting your life to Him, doesn't automatically make you a good person.

Very well said. I am a Christian. But I don't follow the doctrine of any one relegion - and I don't believe the Bible is concrete fact (merely a TOOL to be used for guidance).

I believe everyone goes to "heaven" - or enjoys something in the afterlife- because God is a loving and FORGIVING God (is forgiveness not one of the main teaching of Christianity?). But I do believe there is a hell - and it's reserved for those who don't want forgiveness - who don't and never will see that the "bad" they did is, in fact, bad - extreme cases I guess - it's hard for me to actually put my feelings on that in writing because well it sounds a little kooky.

I hate the whole "you have to accept Jesus as your savior in order to get to heaven" thing. It's crap. With that belief the millions of people killed in Holocaust or many of those being killed in Darfur are automatically hell-bound. That's ridiculous.

In all - the people who cancel services because someone is gay are not Christian. People who judge other people because of what they believe or who they love are not Christian - they are taking Christian teachings and tossing them aside in the name of God. Not what we are called to do.

"And they'll know we are Christians by our love" -- not so true anymore...the opposite is pretty much true and I hate how fundies and judgemental bigots have distorted Christianity - it makes me very sad.

carrie721 · #50 08-12-2007, 03:05 PM

^^

The Tower · #51 08-12-2007, 03:49 PM

I don't believe in anything supernatural, nor do I subscribe to any religious dogma that man created in order to explain things/concepts that they couldn't understand or answer for at the time that the dogma was created.

With that said-

If I were the family from this thread, I would have had a private gathering honoring his life without considering sanction from some religious institution.

**mylittledemon** · #52 08-12-2007, 04:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by danax6

Thank you, I appreciate you telling me that my belief is 'baseless'. Just because I think that there is just not going to be anything after you pass away, that makes my belief baseless? I can come up with hundreds of arguments why I think what I think, just like you can come up with probably the same amount, it doesn't make either belief more founded than the other. Neither can be proven or disproven, so until then it will always remain a matter of opinion.

Not just because that's what you think...but baseless in literal terms. I dont know where folks get that "there is no God" belief. All the great religions of the world revolve around the deity. Is it because you want to believe that the rest of the world is wrong? Or you just want to believe that what you do here has no meaning whatsoever? The proof of God is all around you. In conception...in nature...in love. At the risk of sounding New Age, I dont know how you cant look at the beauty that is in the world and feel God. That was very "Jedi" but I cant think of a more simple way to put it.

**mylittledemon** · #53 08-12-2007, 04:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DrummerDeanna

I am a Christian.

But I don't follow the I don't believe the Bible is concrete fact (merely a TOOL to be used for guidance).

I believe everyone goes to "heaven" -

But I do believe there is a hell - and it's reserved for those who don't want forgiveness

I hate the whole "you have to accept Jesus as your savior in order to get to heaven" thing. It's crap.

Everything you said below the first sentence was contradictory to the first statement. I am by no means perfect, but if I was saying what you are saying, I'd re-examine my heart.

Miss Vicky · #54 08-12-2007, 04:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mylittledemon

I dont know how you cant look at the beauty that is in the world and feel God.

One might counter this argument by saying: "I don't know you can look at all the suffering, cruelty, and hatred in this world and still feel God."

And neither view is wrong or right. Get off your high horse. Believe what you will and let others do the same.

**mylittledemon** · #55 08-12-2007, 04:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by trackaghost

Erm, okay. So a good person who doesn't believe in god is as bad as, say, a pedophile priest. That's how that statement comes across.

Well, I'm not going to change your mind but it does make me sad, that you are living your life out of fear rather than love and you are basically judging people based on their beliefs rather than their actions.

I'm not judging anyone...at least, I try my best not to. Lets just put it this way...everything I have said, for the most part...I try to apply to my OWN life. Its what feels right for me. I would never brow-beat someone into believing something.

And defines a "good" man? A married man with 2 children may provide for them, put them thru school...put food on the table...and yet it he betrays his friends and lies to his wife...where is the distinction? Who draws that line?

I think any person of faith (of any faith) could appreciate that. I dont live my life out of fear...and in that sense you have judged me too. I in fact, feel a little fear is a good thing. Fear of your parents...fear of your king...fear of your God...And by fear I mean a deep rooted honour/respect.

**mylittledemon** · #56 08-12-2007, 04:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Miss Vicky

One might counter this argument by saying: "I don't know you can look at all the suffering, cruelty, and hatred in this world and still feel God."

And neither view is wrong or right. Get off your high horse. Believe what you will and let others do the same.

Those evil things come from the hearts of men.

I dont feel I've been on a high horse. We're all having a discussion about what we believe. I've been getting my ideas across in a civil manner...and no one has gotten ugly yet. I think we all respect one another for the most part. Let's keep it that way.

Miss Vicky · #57 08-12-2007, 04:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mylittledemon

I dont feel I've been on a high horse.

Is that so?

Quote:

Originally Posted by mylittledemon

Do you even understand God, or believe in one? I mean...take someone like Hitler...

Tell me, how's the view from up there?

BlackWidow · #58 08-12-2007, 04:19 PM

We are all lamps and God is the electricity.
Whether you choose to plug in - is up to you.

carrie721 · #59 08-12-2007, 04:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Miss Vicky

Is that so?

or how about telling vanessa her beliefs are baseless?

**mylittledemon** · #60 08-12-2007, 04:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Miss Vicky

Is that so?

Tell me, how's the view from up there?

Hey, I've been the first to say I'm not perfect. I was using Hitler as an example, because I think we all can agree he was a monster.

You seem to want to point that out personally and not contribute to the discussion...so perhaps you're the one on the horse. Oops, I better get off the horse..