Karl Rove

[gldstwmn]

Originally Posted by strandinthewind

Yes it does - and I would like to remind everyone that this is a bitter pill to swallow when the chips fall in favor of the opponent, which they did not here. But, the rule of law must govern and it will.

I'm just grateful that the rule of law still prevails because I was getting very, very worried there for a while.

[SuzeQuze]

Originally Posted by Nixxxed

A former WH Counsel for Nixon was just on Countdown (sorry, didn't catch his name), and basically called the Shrub Admin cowards and liars.

He said letting the reporters go down, as opposed to whoever revealed the info stepping up and admitting so, is the same thing that drug cartel czars and Mafia kingpins do.

That's wicked pissa! So true. Thanks for sharing.

[SuzeQuze]

Originally Posted by gldstwmn

We're talking about a couple of different things here. First of all, Time magazine, who Matt Cooper works for was asked by Special Prosecutor Fitzgerald for his notes or they would be penalized on daily basis.
Wanting to avoid that and hoping to grease the wheels a bit for Cooper, Time handed them over. Fitz said that's nice but Cooper and Judith Miller of the New York Times still need to testify. He also pretty much laughed off Miller's request for house arrest.
Now, I'm not sure if you're aware of what Miller's role in all of this is. She never published a story. But the New York Times issued an unprecedented apology due to a string of Miller stories in the run up to the war that were complete propaganda.

http://www.manticeye.com/article.php?id=303_0_4_0_C

...

So while you're going to watch the corporate media whores spin that this is about protecting sources, I can assure you that it is not.
We are talking about national security here. These journalists not only betrayed the CIA and Valerie Plame, they betrayed the public whose best interest they are supposed to be working in.
Plame's duties included work with WMD'S and nuclear proliferation. Ponder for just a minute how long it has taken to put that network together. With a vengeful little phone call, in fact many phone calls, Plame was outed as a CIA agent and everyone who ever came in contact with, and everyone who came in contact with them and so on was suspect. We have no idea how many people have been killed because of this. It's effectively destroyed a good part of our intelligence network on WMD'S and nuclear proliferation, making us less safe as a nation.
Again, this is not about protecting a journalist's sources. This trumps that. Whoever did this put our country's security at stake. And isn't that a big part of W's line? He's gonna make us safer. The red state folks think he'll keep us safer?
I'll get into the part where this could very well lead to the vice president later.

Well, now that I am a bit better informed. I say lock her the hell up. She felt no responsibility to report the truth for whatever reason, whether ideological, monetary (follow the money, did she benefit financially?), or just plain laziness. I don't know, I know that her reporting in Iraq though is not directly related to her outing the CIA agent, if she did that. Man this is confusing.

Also, I'm surprised the Times even bothered to apologize. Its been so long, WTF? I'm so mad at the media right now, again.

[irishgrl]

Originally Posted by SuzeQuze

Well, now that I am a bit better informed. I say lock her the hell up. She felt no responsibility to report the truth for whatever reason, whether ideological, monetary (follow the money, did she benefit financially?), or just plain laziness. I don't know, I know that her reporting in Iraq though is not directly related to her outing the CIA agent, if she did that. Man this is confusing.

Also, I'm surprised the Times even bothered to apologize. Its been so long, WTF? I'm so mad at the media right now, again.

Im not disputing this is a huge issue, I wasnt completely aware of all the implications...all I was saying is that Journalists are adamant about protecting sources, but, like Suze, I now have a bit clearer picture and I agree: Lock her up, hell: Lock them ALL up, including Novak (especially Novak!)

I would LOVE to be a fly on the wall over at the White House, it must be PANIC time for the eejits over there....

[irishgrl]

Originally Posted by gldstwmn

I'm just grateful that the rule of law still prevails because I was getting very, very worried there for a while.

heck, Im STILL worried, those jerks in the White House are expert liars and spinners and I dont doubt they are formulating a web of deceit even now...
I just hope the truth comes OUT in spite of their tricks...

[SuzeQuze]

Originally Posted by irishgrl

heck, Im STILL worried, those jerks in the White House are expert liars and spinners and I dont doubt they are formulating a web of deceit even now...
I just hope the truth comes OUT in spite of their tricks...

I do too, up until now they've been so slippery. On Morning Sedition Mark just said that Plame's husband said right away, after the leak of her name, that he thought the trail would lead straight to Rove, which it has.

[strandinthewind]

I just think whoever it is is a coward to let people go to jail for them, esp. a woman (I am Southern ya know ) -- I mean own up to it and be a man.

[gldstwmn]

Originally Posted by SuzeQuze

Well, now that I am a bit better informed. I say lock her the hell up. She felt no responsibility to report the truth for whatever reason, whether ideological, monetary (follow the money, did she benefit financially?), or just plain laziness. I don't know, I know that her reporting in Iraq though is not directly related to her outing the CIA agent, if she did that. Man this is confusing.

Also, I'm surprised the Times even bothered to apologize. Its been so long, WTF? I'm so mad at the media right now, again.

I'm pressed for time right now but I'll explain Judy's predicament a little better later on.

[gldstwmn]

Originally Posted by irishgrl

Im not disputing this is a huge issue, I wasnt completely aware of all the implications...all I was saying is that Journalists are adamant about protecting sources, but, like Suze, I now have a bit clearer picture and I agree: Lock her up, hell: Lock them ALL up, including Novak (especially Novak!)

I would LOVE to be a fly on the wall over at the White House, it must be PANIC time for the eejits over there....

I am of the mind that Novak sang, so he won't be going to jail.

[gldstwmn]

Originally Posted by irishgrl

heck, Im STILL worried, those jerks in the White House are expert liars and spinners and I dont doubt they are formulating a web of deceit even now...
I just hope the truth comes OUT in spite of their tricks...

So do I. Did you know that the war is costing us $5 billion a month?

[gldstwmn]

Originally Posted by strandinthewind

I just think whoever it is is a coward to let people go to jail for them, esp. a woman (I am Southern ya know ) -- I mean own up to it and be a man.

Hey, it takes two to tango. Miller is just as complicit as the leaker. Hell, one of her sources on the WMD stories was Chalabi.

[SuzeQuze]

Originally Posted by gldstwmn

I am of the mind that Novak sang, so he won't be going to jail.

Yes, I completely agree.

[strandinthewind]

Originally Posted by gldstwmn

Hey, it takes two to tango. Miller is just as complicit as the leaker. Hell, one of her sources on the WMD stories was Chalabi.

true - but only one is dancing (does that sound like bad 40's movies dialogue )

[strandinthewind]

Originally Posted by gldstwmn

So do I. Did you know that the war is costing us $5 billion a month?

I think that is for all operations - not just Iraq - But and in any event, that is public knowledge so I am unsure of your point other than you think we should not have invaded Iraq and now it is costing us a fortune despite W's assurances that Iraq's oil rev. would pay for the purportedly at the time far less costly invasion - which I agree is and was a horrible thing.

[gldstwmn]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/reporters_contempt

Time Reporter to Testify in CIA Leak Case

WASHINGTON - Time magazine reporter Matthew Cooper agreed Wednesday to testify about his sources in a government leak of a CIA operative's identity, while New York Times reporter Judith Miller refused to reveal her source in a protracted First Amendment wrangle with the government.

Both reporters faced threats of jail time.

Cooper told U.S. District Judge Thomas Hogan that he would now cooperate with a federal prosecutor's investigation because his source gave him specific authority to discuss their conversation. "I am prepared to testify. I will comply" with the court's order, Cooper told Hogan.

Cooper's turnaround came at a hearing at which Hogan was to consider whether to jail Cooper and Miller for defying his order to testify about their confidential sources in the leak of CIA operative Valerie Plame's identity.

Cooper took the podium in the court and told the judge, "Last night I hugged my son goodbye and told him it might be a long time before I see him again."

"I went to bed ready to accept the sanctions" for not testifying, Cooper said. But he told the judge that not long before his early afternoon appearance, he had received "in somewhat dramatic fashion" a direct personal communication from his source freeing him from his commitment to keep the source's identity secret.

The prosecutor, U.S. Attorney Patrick Fitzgerald responded to Miller's refusal to name her source by saying that "we can't have 50,000 journalists" each making their own decision about whether to reveal sources.

"We cannot tolerate that," he said. "We are trying to get to the bottom of whether a crime was committed and by whom."

Miller attorney Robert Bennett said that prosecutors traditionally have shown great respect for journalists and "have had the good judgment not to push these cases very often."

"The interests of justice are often served with a bit of humility and respect for people in the position Judy Miller is in and with a heavy dose of compassion and understanding," Bennett said.

Hogan held the reporters in civil contempt of court in October, rejecting their argument that the First Amendment shielded them from revealing their sources. Last month the Supreme Court refused to intervene.

In court documents filed Tuesday, Fitzgerald urged Hogan to take the unusual step of jailing the reporters, saying that may be the only way to get them to talk.

"Journalists are not entitled to promise complete confidentiality — no one in America is," Fitzgerald wrote.

Fitzgerald had disclosed Tuesday that a source of Cooper and Miller had waived confidentiality, giving the reporters permission to reveal where they got their information. The prosecutor did not identify the source, nor did he specify whether the source for each reporter was the same person.

Cooper said he had been told earlier that his source had signed a general waiver of confidentiality but that he did not trust such waivers because he thought they had been gained from executive branch employees under duress. He told the court that he needed not a general waiver but a specific waiver from his source, which he did not get until Wednesday.

"I received express personal consent" from the source, Cooper told the judge.

Hogan and Fitzgerald accepted Cooper's offer.

"That would purge you of contempt," Hogan said.

Prior to the hearing, Miller argued that it is imperative for reporters to honor their commitments to provide cover to sources who will only reveal important information if they are assured anonymity. Forcing reporters to reneg on the pledge undercuts their ability to do their job, she said.

Last week, Time Inc., last week provided Fitzgerald with records, notes and e-mail traffic involving Cooper, who had argued that it was therefore no longer necessary for him to testify. Time also had been found in contempt and officials there said after losing appeals it had no choice but to turn over the information.

The case is seen as a key test of press freedom and many media groups have lined up behind the reporters. Before Wednesday's hearing, a small rally was held in a park beside the courthouse to urge Congress to pass a federal shield law protecting reporters from having to disclose their confidential sources. The rally, organized by the Communications Workers of America, drew about three dozen people in Washington. Organizers said similar rallies were occurring in Cleveland, Denver, Minneapolis, New York and Los Angeles.

Thirty-one states and the District of Columbia have shield laws protecting reporters from having to identify their confidential sources.

Fitzgerald is investigating who in the Bush administration leaked Plame's identity. Her name was disclosed in a column by Robert Novak days after her husband, former Ambassador Joseph Wilson, impugned part of President Bush's justification for invading Iraq.

Wilson was sent to Africa by the Bush administration to investigate an intelligence claim that Saddam Hussein may have purchased yellowcake uranium from Niger in the late 1990s for use in nuclear weapons. Wilson said he could not verify the claim and criticized the administration for manipulating the intelligence to "exaggerate the Iraqi threat."

Novak, whose column cited as sources two unidentified senior Bush administration officials, has refused to say whether he has testified before the grand jury or been subpoenaed. Novak has said he "will reveal all" after the matter is resolved and that it is wrong for the government to jail journalists.

Disclosure of an undercover intelligence officer's identity can be a federal crime if prosecutors can show the leak was intentional and the person who released that information knew of the officer's secret status.

Cooper spoke to White House deputy chief of staff Karl Rove after Wilson's public criticism of Bush and before Novak's column ran, according to Rove's lawyer, Robert Luskin, who denies that Rove leaked Plame's identity to anyone. Cooper's story mentioning Plame's name appeared after Novak's column. Miller did some reporting, but never wrote a story.

Among the witnesses Fitzgerald's investigators have questioned are Bush; Vice President Dick Cheney; Rove; Cheney's chief of staff, Lewis Libby; and former White House counsel Alberto Gonzales, who is now the attorney general.

Fitzgerald has said that his investigation is complete except for testimony from Cooper and Miller.