I miss Christine!

[Cristian]

Originally posted by face of glass
But Chris definitely doesn't need Lindsey and Stevie to make her music work either. I think all of her songs on Time range from good to great. She's very capable of surviving on her own and I'm glad Ken Caillat has been helping her with the upcoming one.

Yep, I agree. I miss Christine, her sound is missed, but it's the story of Fleetwood Mac - think about it, in 1969 or 1970 they lost they FOUNDER Peter Green; two years later they lost one of the most creative members (Danny Kirwan) then in 1974 they lost they main songwriter Bob Welch... then they had lost Buckingham and Nicks... and it always went on.

I don't see why it shouldn't go on this time. Christine's happy living her life, I hope her album comes out soon, and whilst I do believe Say You Will is not amongst Fleetwood Mac's best offerings (far from that!), I do think it is a Fleetwood Mac album -- it has Mick Fleetwood on drums and John McVie on bass. Period.


Song of the moment - My Heart Beat Like A Hammer

[Nicks Fan]

I have to say that as much I missed Chris on this album / tour. I have moved on. I don't obsess over it. Yes it is sad but I feel what is more sad is that the band refuses to stray away from the tried and true and play more of the old songs that they have either never played or have not played in a while.. This being my first tour I didn't mind what I heard as I was hearing it live for the fisrt time (at a concert ). I enjoyed myself but if they plan to tour this spring they will HAVE to play new stuff or else why bother touring. Virtually anyone who has gone to the first set of us shows won't bother going again if they are going to copy everything (even the speeches) from the first leg. Change it up already.


Matt

[SteveMacD]

Originally posted by 4Buck
>>>We have Buckingham in his own words on why he left the band......and we hear from various FM members on why Christine left the band......

But did anyone ever hear CHRISTINE'S words on why she>>> herself>>> left????

Not in so many words, however, it's easy to piece together why she left the band. She didn't want the stress of being in a band. Listen to the lyrics of "All Over Again" on "Time." It's obvious that she was going to quit the band. In fact, Dave Mason said right after "Time" was released that he thought it would be Christine's last album with the band. And basically, he was right. Sure she did "The Dance," but "Time" was her last studio album.

[SteveMacD]

Originally posted by David
Another point I want to address is the view (common even among the bandmembers themselves) that the sound is more guitar-based because Christine is out of the picture. That's ridiculous. Christine was never Keith Emerson or Billy Joel. Her keyboards on FM albums didn't occupy a central place like the playing of those guys. In fact, the parts she recorded on most of the songs were generally a subtle addition to the rhythm, not a lavish piano arrangement in the spotlight.

I agree that her parts were more rhythmic in nature, but Christine's keyboards were a major driving force on many great Mac songs. Songs that I think are the best example of this are "Morning Rain," SYLM, YMLF, "I Do," and "Nights In Estoril."

Now, that driving force is gone, and Lindsey has found creative was (as we knew he would) to fill that void. Also, I think John really stands out more with Christine not being there. Granted, it's not rocket science, it is an interesting variation on a classic sound.

Originally posted by Nicks Fan
I enjoyed myself but if they plan to tour this spring they will HAVE to play new stuff or else why bother touring. Virtually anyone who has gone to the first set of us shows won't bother going again if they are going to copy everything (even the speeches) from the first leg. Change it up already.
Matt

Exactly. First of all, i spent about $500 on FM tickets. Now, i didn't have to go to three shows, but i did. I am currently working a sucky job and finishing up college (as old as i am) and the funds are not really there this year. So, i am quite hesitant to go this year just based on that. What further cements my decision is the lack of change in the setlist. If there is no change when they come back to America, i'm definately not going, or, i may go and get the cheapest seats possible. I find it redundant to go again if it's going to be the same exact show(s) i saw last year.

[Johnny Stew]

Take it for what it's worth, but Stevie said they'd only be changing the setlist once they returned to America for the Spring 2004 tour.

She had said that that would be the longest period of time where they'd have the best opportunity to rework the setlist and then rehearse it.

It actually surprises me that anyone's surprised they didn't change the set for the Australian shows.

[tommer]

1. it's still hard for me understand how can people consider themselves FM fans and still not realize that songs like Goodbye Baby, Peacekeeper, Smile At You, Murrow or Destiny Rules are some of this band's proudest moments ever.

2. was christine a wonderful recording artist? yes. when was the last time she pulled a truely brilliant song? i think it was 1990. could her presence make SYW bigger? i doubt it. last time she propelled a fleetwood mac album was at the time when the New Kids On The Block were considered to be cool.

3. compare this tour to The Dance tour, it's like they paid a visit to the fountain of youth or something.
christine as a stage performer is cool, but a FAR cry from stevie or lindsey's charismatic personas. in other words, if you lose a christine minute, but in return you get 30 lindsey seconds and 30 stevie seconds at a concert- you got yourself an excellent deal.

4. i think it's possible that christine's new album's gonna be her greatest work yet (depending whether she can still write killer songs or not) but as far as fleetwood mac goes... (no. i must stop here. i do respect christine and i don't wanna undermine her contribution to the band for so many years. i think you get my drift there anyway)

[jbrownsjr]

Originally posted by tommer
1. it's still hard for me understand how can people consider themselves FM fans and still not realize that songs like Goodbye Baby, Peacekeeper, Smile At You, Murrow or Destiny Rules are some of this band's proudest moments ever.

2. was christine a wonderful recording artist? yes. when was the last time she pulled a truely brilliant song? i think it was 1990. could her presence make SYW bigger? i doubt it. last time she propelled a fleetwood mac album was at the time when the New Kids On The Block were considered to be cool.

3. compare this tour to The Dance tour, it's like they paid a visit to the fountain of youth or something.
christine as a stage performer is cool, but a FAR cry from stevie or lindsey's charismatic personas. in other words, if you lose a christine minute, but in return you get 30 lindsey seconds and 30 stevie seconds at a concert- you got yourself an excellent deal.

4. i think it's possible that christine's new album's gonna be her greatest work yet (depending whether she can still write killer songs or not) but as far as fleetwood mac goes... (no. i must stop here. i do respect christine and i don't wanna undermine her contribution to the band for so many years. i think you get my drift there anyway)

I am not saying they are better or worse because of her absence, (seems like you are doing that). I am simply saying I miss some of her contributions which in my opinion were amazing. She's been a great songwriter from day one to the end of her career.

Hell I miss Bob Welch and Danny Kirwan a hellva lot. Doesn't mean I don't like Say You Will. I agree there are some proud moments on that album. I listen to it over and over again! Enjoy it!

And if I didn't like Say You Will, how does this take away my title of "FM Fan"?

[ryan8472]

Originally posted by Johnny Stew
Take it for what it's worth, but Stevie said they'd only be changing the setlist once they returned to America for the Spring 2004 tour.

She had said that that would be the longest period of time where they'd have the best opportunity to rework the setlist and then rehearse it.

It actually surprises me that anyone's surprised they didn't change the set for the Australian shows.

I totally agree. My dad and I have had this discussion many times. Neither of us can understand why they would play the same setlist, every night, on every leg of the tour. Wouldn't this get boring? They have had two rather long breaks already (In August and in November/December.January) to rehearse something new. And for a band with such an enormous catelogue of music, I can't understand why they don't play something else once in a while. Plus, we KNOW they can play the new songs live as well, after Lindsey's PBS special. It's not like they'd forget how to play the songs - They wrote them!

Unfortunatly, this is Fleetwood Mac we are talking about, not The Grateful Dead . When Stevie said they would change the set, she probably meant they might switch one new song for another new song. That's about it. And that stinks. But that's just my view on it.

[ryan8472]

Oh and as a reply to the actual topic...

I miss Christine too!!!

But nonetheless, Fleetwood Mac rocks just as hard without her!

[tommer]

Originally posted by [email protected]

And if I didn't like Say You Will, how does this take away my title of "FM Fan"?

because i think it means that you were probably biased against them to begin with, and in a way it also seriously questions your abilties as an objective critic in general.

[jbrownsjr]

Originally posted by tommer
because i think it means that you were probably biased against them to begin with, and in a way it also seriously questions your abilties as an objective critic in general.

So what your saying is as a fan must like every album otherwise they are biased against FM, and to be a good critic - "you are only objective if you take to something in a positive matter.

That's the most interesting view on objectivity I've ever seen....

[chiliD]

Originally posted by [email protected]
And if I didn't like Say You Will, how does this take away my title of "FM Fan"?

Originally posted by tommer
because i think it means that you were probably biased against them to begin with, and in a way it also seriously questions your abilties as an objective critic in general.

By this logic, all the Behind The Mask & Time haters and fans of the "fireflies" incarnation only cannot rightfully claim to be Fleetwood Mac fans.

[Johnny Stew]

I think Tommer's trying to say that one shouldn't just say, "Oh, well, Christine (or Stevie, or Lindsey, or Bob, or Peter, etc., etc.) isn't there, so the album is automatically lacking something."

Fleetwood Mac's lineup has been in a perpetual state of flux pretty much from the beginning (when Bob Brunning stood in for John McVie), so it's usually better to focus on who IS in the band at any given time, rather than bemoan the fact that someone else isn't.

[tommer]

Originally posted by [email protected]
So what your saying is as a fan must like every album otherwise they are biased against FM, and to be a good critic - "you are only objective if you take to something in a positive matter.
That's the most interesting view on objectivity I've ever seen....

i never claimed to be a big post modernist, i believe that generally there is good and there is bad. period.
i am also very proud to say i'm quite knowledgeable about music, i can definetly differentiate bad from good music. i'm not meaning that whatever i like is "good" (in fact, some of my music cabinet should make every sane person cringe), and the other way around- i don't like everything i can define as "good".
to me there are many parameters when i come to analize music (the singing, the playing, sound production, writing ect...) and of course those parameters must variate from one genre or purpuse to another. (basically, one's own taste is the way those parameters are balanced in terms of personal importance). apparently i'm not the only person in the world who respects my abilities on this subject, i made quite a nice living for quite a few years from this knowledge.
i can critisize SYW from here to eternity, but i won't even start. i don't think by any means that it is a perfect album if that's what you're thinking.
but on the other hand, i think in other parts it contains some of their most innovative and best-performed recordings ever, and no, i don't think it's very questionable.
i strongly believe that this album's merits shine so brightly, that you must shut your eyes REAL strong to avoid the light.