The doc!!!

[diamondsnake]

Originally posted by Johnny Stew
Yikes, those last six pages gave me a headache!

This entire thread can give anyone a headache. Almost thirty pages in a matter of less then a week! And it seems like every five pages the topic changes to something completely different. 5 pages about the doc, 5 pages about bob dylan, 5 pages of bickering, 5 pages of comparing lindsey to stevie, 5 pages of "switching tenses".... this is a very strange thread!

[diamondsnake]

Originally posted by Johnny Stew
# 2. When one member is missing from the concert equation (Lindsey from the Shakin' The Cage & Behind The Mask tours, Christine from the Say You Will tour) the band can still draw huge crowds, but not quite as huge as when the three leads are all present.
And when all three are missing, the band is forced to do the Summer-fest nostalgia circuit (ouch).

Is that true though? I thought the SYW tour has been more successful then the dance was (when all five members were there)

[Johnny Stew]

Originally posted by diamondsnake
Is that true though? I thought the SYW tour has been more successful then the dance was (when all five members were there)

The 'Dance' tour could have easily gone on for about four times as long as it did. It was hugely successful.

But they're doing great business this time out, too... otherwise they wouldn't continue this for so long.

[wildangel]

hey dis where are you getting the #s for stevie's tours? I cant find them online anywhere.
I went to her Enchanted and TISL shows at Blossom in Cleveland and they were full and to her show at the DTE center in Detroit that was full also. I don't expect her to compete with FM tours, (that is just silly) ofcourse the the other members pull in additional people. Stevie will always have a loyal fanbase that will attend her shows, so I am sure she made decent money and the tours were considered a success. For me a stevie show is just as good as a mac show so I am happy to get the discount

[Sugar]

Lindsey should next colloborate with Christina Agulaira and Gwen Stefani (since no one really cares about the other guys in that band either) because that would then be a draw that would eclipse anything Fleetwood Mac (or its parts) have seen since the early 80's! And because the draw would be so huge, it would obviously translate in some of the highest quality material for Lindsey to date! Hopefully Lindsey wouldn't bring the quality of their music down since he is, admittedly, less of a draw.

That is the hypothesis we're working with here...right folks?

[David]

Originally posted by diamondsnake
Yup, she sold better, i imagine, and she was promotiing what is known as her worst album, Street Angel.

So Stevie's worst sold better then Lindsey's best.

Apples & oranges (subjective quality of work vs. objective sales). It's only an opinion that "Street Angel" is Stevie's worst album (I happen to think it's one of her three best) or that "Cradle" is Lindsey's best album (I think "Law & Order" is his best). Sales, on the other hand, are just a verifiable number that isn't defined by someone's opinion.

I can't believe (on second thought, yes I can) that the argument over which member sells more stuff is ongoing. Stevie is, by far, the single biggest selling member in the band -- from 1967 to the present -- as a solo act. She's also the single biggest draw as a concert act. I've seen Lindsey perform solo, Christine perform solo, the Zoo perform, Peter perform & Bob Welch perform, & Stevie in her heyday drew the biggest crowds throughout the entire run of several tours.

But all this sales talk is sordid. Fans often browbeat the band for being too commercial, & then turn around & talk about sales & concert tickets sold as if the total number of hoi polloi out there buying FM albums or attending shows lent some sort of strength to the argument of a particular member's artistry. I see it the other way: the less you sell in the commercial climate of pop music, the more likely you are to create something extraordinary & not just disposable, easily digested radio fodder. Of course, being a poor seller isn't a guarantee of that, but it's often a sign.

Some of Stevie's best work just didn't appeal to as many people as some of her ordinary work did. "Stand Back" was a bigger chart hit than "Rhiannon," wasn't it?

[teedee]

Originally posted by dissention
Let me adjust my last number. Her last tour didn't do $14, it was $10. And I firmly believe that if it was Lindsey, Mick, and John, it would sell at least that.

i firmly believe that it wouldnt.

[teedee]

Originally posted by diamondsnake
because he wouldn't be able to fill the first ten rows of an arena is my guess.

Seriously though, Lindsey Buckingham is not exactly a household name. Stevie Nicks is. So Stevie can play at amps and arenas, not that lindsey is any less of a musician- just not as commercial as the queen of rock and roll, stevie nicks!

I know , i was just making a point as to
"how Come"

[David]

Originally posted by diamondsnake
I wish Stevie weren't as popular as she is.

But then how would you win Stevie vs. Lindsey arguments on the Ledge?

[teedee]

Originally posted by dissention
Stevie couldn't fill the first ten rows of an ampitheatre based on tour data.

That's where you're wrong; Stevie can't fill arenas, even during the Timespace tour or other tours after that. I mean, she even played the Ohio State Fair.

now your just talking crazy. i dont think your tour data is too accurate. but i really dont go by what critics or record company's say was a success and what was a disaster. as for what the naked eye can see, i have never imagined a full house when in fact it was half empty, i have just never been at a stevie concert and saw half the seats empty, never.

[Sugar]

Someone on the burnish board posted that Vanessa Carleton just leaked that Lindsey has a guitar solo on the first single from her next album. Not my first choice, but it should be interesting, no?

[David]

Originally posted by diamondsnake
i'll bet timespace was a more successful tour and that is regarded as her worst timeperiod in the business.

It was her worst timespace in the business.

[sodascouts]

I'm not quite sure what the point of all this was, but I think most of us know the obvious: 1) Stevie is a bigger draw than Lindsey when they are solo. 2) Stevie and Lindsey together is the biggest draw of all. The latter does not make the former any less true, despite all the rhetorical circles we dance around in. I'm not saying it's right, but it's reality, although many people are quick to utilize the good old hypothetical scenario when reality isn't working for them.

Lindsey is so underappreciated. What he's done for Rhiannon and Gypsy, to name two "classic" examples, really took them to another level that they would never have acheived without him. However, immediately assuming that this is/would be true for anything Stevie ever did is unfair. Would Lindsey himself even make that claim? I doubt it - I don't think he's full of himself.

I will continue to be brutally honest and say that within Fleetwood Mac, it is apparent that Lindsey helps out Stevie on her songs much more than vice versa. On the other hand, Stevie can and has thrived without Lindsey - again, the truth of one doesn't cancel out the truth of the other.

What gets me is why people will try to minimize or even obliterate the contributions of one member in order to build up the other. It's something that's been happening around here for a long time, and it always saddens me. We all have our opinion as to who's "better" (except me, I love them both the same lol) but why must we tear down the one who comes in second?

A timeless question that will never be answered! lol

[David]

Originally posted by teedee
now your just talking crazy. i dont think your tour data is too accurate. but i really dont go by what critics or record company's say was a success and what was a disaster. as for what the naked eye can see, i have never imagined a full house when in fact it was half empty, i have just never been at a stevie concert and saw half the seats empty, never.

I have. Arco Arena in north Sacramento, Aug. 29, 1994.

But it was still cool!