FWIW question...

[glamorousnymph]

Originally Posted by WildHearted

True. She really admits this, too, that she just wanted all the big boys to acknowledge her and say she was good.

Yep. Totally get that, being in a boys' business!

[jellyman10]

Originally Posted by glamorousnymph

I think Stevie loves any musical genius andseeks validation through him.

Thank you! It's good to be reminded once in a while that Stevie has always been turned on by musical/performing talent, as much as by a dude with a cute ass or long curly hair.

Validation? You're probably right about that, too. I wish it wasn't the case, but I think it is, and that the reason it is, is that the business has always tried to make women feel like they need it from the 'real' artists. But really: don't get me started.

On FWIW: I agree with those who think 'the great romance' is her life as a rock star. I also agree with those who don't see LB in this song, at all. Stevie is on record with a strong hint that Dallas Taylor is related to this song somehow, and I tend to think that something occurred between them that was very off-limits, and that that was probably because of the therapeutic relationship rather than simply infidelity.

As for thanking Dallas's wife - well, maybe I just know a lot of people with very odd relationships (including me), but I can easily imagine a perfectly dignified scenario for that. The mid-90s is a long time ago now and isn't it possible that a long-term relationship can have ups and downs, and that those ups and downs can include liaisons (not even necessarily sexual) that almost lead to something that breaks it up but then doesn't, and people talk about them later and are forgiven? A lot of people might want to thank someone even more, in fact, if they have been forgiven by them. Life is complicated; probably more so when recovering from addiction.

Loz

[mitzo]

Sadly, Stevie's desire for validation from Tom and the boys did nothing for her music.

[CADreaming]

Let me try to rephrase my Lindsey leaning on FWIW. Whether or not he had anything to do with her rehab, I'm reminded of him because of the autobiographical nature of the song. When she sings: "I got to sing, I got to dance. I got to be a part of a great romance." to me, she is summing up her entire career, which definitely begins (and maybe ends) with Lindsey. He's her "partner in crime" -- the one who's name she drops as if everyone on the earth knows they are forever linked, as if you say 'Stevie and Lindsey' like you say 'peanut butter and jelly' or 'cream and sugar'. She continually points out they considered themselves married and that he's as close to that as she'll ever get and how musically they "have to be in a band together for 100 years". She's even likened them to Johnny & June Cash. So, in that respect it's that unending connection that makes it her "great romance". She's said now that she's older she looks back on some other relationships and they were a mere blip on the radar comparatively. So when she sings that line in the song that's what I think of, in addition to the person she is referring to when she says "you saved my life, I won't forget it".

"I think Stevie and Lindsey were a very compatible couple...it must have been a great romance!" -- Javier Pacheco.

[Christopher]

FWIW lyrics are not linear or literal. As per usual with Stevie you need to read between her lines, she weaves assorted themes and subjects in many of her songs and FWIW is no different imo. I too, interpret "I got to sing, I got to dance, I got to be part of a great romance" - as Stevie reflecting as a whole on her career & her relationship in a great legendary rock n roll band, not a singular person. Not that line. Sure the essence of the song is thanking someone who "saved" her life, subsequently Stevie salvaged her career & eventually came back stronger, after yet another difficult low point (Klonopin), this time almost more deadly than before.

[HejiraNYC]

Originally Posted by Christopher

FWIW lyrics are not linear or literal. As per usual with Stevie you need to read between her lines, she weaves assorted themes and subjects in many of her songs and FWIW is no different imo. I too, interpret "I got to sing, I got to dance, I got to be part of a great romance" - as Stevie reflecting as a whole on her career & her relationship in a great legendary rock n roll band, not a singular person. Not that line. Sure the essence of the song is thanking someone who "saved" her life, subsequently Stevie salvaged her career & eventually came back stronger, after yet another difficult low point (Klonopin), this time almost more deadly than before.

I tend to agree that Stevie has a theme in mind and writes little vignettes around the theme to tell her story, which is never linear or literal. The theme of this story is how her life has been saved by the angels in her life during the great nadirs- presumably her addiction/recovery to Klonopin and then the Street Angel fiasco/tour- an era that is so unspeakably traumatic that she never even mentions it any more except in song.

Now, putting my shipper hat on for a moment, I am going to hone in one obvious facet of this song that nobody seems to pick up on: the phrase "for what it's worth." Sometimes that is a phrase that is tacked onto a string of facts or things to consider, which leaves the listener to draw up a conclusion about this information. My theory about "for what it's worth" is that this person saved her life by making up all of these promises/enticements for Stevie to come to her own conclusion to go for treatment. I think the first verse and chorus is about Lindsey. Based on what we know about Lindsey and his concerns about Stevie around this time, is it possible that he tossed out these gestures (leaving his girlfriend, packing up his stuff, moving in, etc.) as an enticement for Stevie to get help? She was probably in a very vulnerable emotional state at the time and needed to hear those words by someone who cared so deeply about her that she really had no choice but to go. She must have gone to rehab with dreams of blue-gray eyes, white picket fences and rose gardens. As many people suspect/believe/wish, the "great romance" came to pass during The Dance, and it was definitely forbidden.

The second verse is about the post-recovery phase in which she was "broken" and "scared" and basically thrown to the wolves. This is probably about Dallas Taylor and the way he also saved her livelihood, if not her life, by holding her hand and giving her hope and reassurance. I don't think there is any reason to believe that they were sharing a bunk in the back of the tour bus.

As usual, in her typical lying by omission, Stevie has conveniently neglected to tell the full story about this song in interviews.

[bombaysaffires]

Interesting discussion, and this is what makes Stevie's songs so compelling... everyone can find what they want in them!

That said, personally, I feel this song is pretty literal. I don't think the relationship she's talking about is hypothetical or a vague amalgamation of various relationships... I think it's about one in particular. The lyrics are pretty straightforward, there's not a lot of mysticism and symbology of winds and rains and birds and the like. It's pretty uncluttered language. The lines "a great romance, still forbidden, still outrageous, only a few around us knew but no one said a word it was contagious" I just don't get the vibe that this is about LB. That said, given the sheer number of relationships, hookups, one-offs, full on love affairs-- that she's had in her life, the circumstances of a secret relationship could refer to any number of people, so exactly WHO it's about is not certain. However, she's given a pretty straightforward commentary that the song relates to a particular person (Dallas Taylor) at a particular time in her life when she needed someone to lean on and he was that someone. Does that relationship parallel others she's had in the past? Sure, so in that sense the circumstances she describes in FWIW probably fit previous "Secret Loves" she's had over the years. But I think the core of it is pretty literal to that one relationship. YMMV

[jellyman10]

Originally Posted by HejiraNYC

She must have gone to rehab with dreams of blue-gray eyes, white picket fences and rose gardens. As many people suspect/believe/wish, the "great romance" came to pass during The Dance, and it was definitely forbidden.

Enjoyed your post. Not clear on why a romantic relationship with LB would be forbidden in 1997?

[michelej1]

Originally Posted by HejiraNYC

I am going to hone in one obvious facet of this song that nobody seems to pick up on: the phrase "for what it's worth." Sometimes that is a phrase that is tacked onto a string of facts or things to consider, which leaves the listener to draw up a conclusion about this information.

This phrase has always stuck out to me, because of the way it's appendaged to an unfinished sentence. To me, it's most often used in an anti-climatic fashion. Kind of apologetic. "Well, that turned out to be a complete fiasco and nothing worked like we planned, but for what it's worth, I'm glad you drove 200 miles to my picnic, even though it rained."

Michele

[Christopher]

Originally Posted by HejiraNYC

I tend to agree that Stevie has a theme in mind and writes little vignettes around the theme to tell her story, which is never linear or literal. The theme of this story is how her life has been saved by the angels in her life during the great nadirs- presumably her addiction/recovery to Klonopin and then the Street Angel fiasco/tour- an era that is so unspeakably traumatic that she never even mentions it any more except in song.

Now, putting my shipper hat on for a moment, I am going to hone in one obvious facet of this song that nobody seems to pick up on: the phrase "for what it's worth." Sometimes that is a phrase that is tacked onto a string of facts or things to consider, which leaves the listener to draw up a conclusion about this information. My theory about "for what it's worth" is that this person saved her life by making up all of these promises/enticements for Stevie to come to her own conclusion to go for treatment. I think the first verse and chorus is about Lindsey. Based on what we know about Lindsey and his concerns about Stevie around this time, is it possible that he tossed out these gestures (leaving his girlfriend, packing up his stuff, moving in, etc.) as an enticement for Stevie to get help? She was probably in a very vulnerable emotional state at the time and needed to hear those words by someone who cared so deeply about her that she really had no choice but to go. She must have gone to rehab with dreams of blue-gray eyes, white picket fences and rose gardens. As many people suspect/believe/wish, the "great romance" came to pass during The Dance, and it was definitely forbidden.

The second verse is about the post-recovery phase in which she was "broken" and "scared" and basically thrown to the wolves. This is probably about Dallas Taylor and the way he also saved her livelihood, if not her life, by holding her hand and giving her hope and reassurance. I don't think there is any reason to believe that they were sharing a bunk in the back of the tour bus.

As usual, in her typical lying by omission, Stevie has conveniently neglected to tell the full story about this song in interviews.

Hmmm... Interesting. If you really examine the summation of Stevie's life at this time, just the bits and pieces that we know of, for example FM surely was contacted at least a month before their one off reunion during Clinton's inauguration January 20th, 1993, which squarely one can assume Stevie & Lindsey were in communication late 1992 (the infamous phone call of Stevie cajoling Lindsey that they had to do this gig). So even though she clearly was knee-deep in her own health crisis, which was obvious to anyone watching their performance of "Don't Stop", with her jaw dropping appearance, all pasty & bloated, barely recognizable sans her trademark finery & tamborine - She felt some urgency to do this! Maybe it was more about reconnecting with Lindsey, than the President of the United States call of duty? Also note, during this timeframe, Stevie was practically finished with the Glyn Johns production of Street Angel. She wrote and recorded the bulk of this record in 1992, including Blue Denim, and Glyn & Stevie turned in the final mixed masters in early 1993. So it is totally plausible that Lindsey, after some talks & seeing for himself Stevie's imminent destruction at hand, intervened in some small or big way. Because soon after, the record company delayed SA, and Stevie entered rehab in 93', then came out...and we know the rest. Or do we?

[HejiraNYC]

Originally Posted by jellyman10

Enjoyed your post. Not clear on why a romantic relationship with LB would be forbidden in 1997?

Maybe it wasn't "forbidden" at the time as much as it was supposed to be a deeply held secret. It only became "forbidden" when Lindsey's relationship with Kristen came to light.

[CADreaming]

Originally Posted by Christopher

Hmmm... Interesting. If you really examine the summation of Stevie's life at this time, just the bits and pieces that we know of, for example FM surely was contacted at least a month before their one off reunion during Clinton's inauguration January 20th, 1993, which squarely one can assume Stevie & Lindsey were in communication late 1992 (the infamous phone call of Stevie cajoling Lindsey that they had to do this gig). So even though she clearly was knee-deep in her own health crisis, which was obvious to anyone watching their performance of "Don't Stop", with her jaw dropping appearance, all pasty & bloated, barely recognizable sans her trademark finery & tamborine - She felt some urgency to do this! Maybe it was more about reconnecting with Lindsey, than the President of the United States call of duty? Also note, during this timeframe, Stevie was practically finished with the Glyn Johns production of Street Angel. She wrote and recorded the bulk of this record in 1992, including Blue Denim, and Glyn & Stevie turned in the final mixed masters in early 1993. So it is totally plausible that Lindsey, after some talks & seeing for himself Stevie's imminent destruction at hand, intervened in some small or big way. Because soon after, the record company delayed SA, and Stevie entered rehab in 93', then came out...and we know the rest. Or do we?

That's what I think could very well have happened...

[Johnny Stew]

In some 'Street Angel'-era interview, Stevie said that there was no prospect of a full Fleetwood Mac reunion, because "Lindsey doesn't want to be around me."

Nothing wrong with speculation, of course, but I really don't think those two had anything to do with each other until 1996, outside of the inaugural gala performance, and I don't believe Lindsey had any pull regarding Stevie's rehab stint.

[CADreaming]

^Johnny Stew I totally understand where you are coming from. It makes sense from one point of view.

But, I think there is a possibility Lindsey may have been compelled to get involved in an intervention for a number of reasons, including the story Debbie (catdancer) told a few years ago when she talked to Lindsey (at a radio station, I believe) in 1992. He was very worried about Stevie and her Klonopin use that he had recently witnessed at a show they did in SF and how Stevie didn't know his family. In particular, his sister-in-law at the time Eileen, who was married to Jeff, had been very close friends with Stevie but she didn't even know her and didn't even know Lindsey was there either... Debbie said Lindsey was really sad and concerned and asked her to tell Stevie to call him.

And, for all I know they're on the phone right now. We can't possibly know what all goes on and went on behind the scenes that would change our minds in regards to their communication or personal involvement. For instance, Stevie can say, "we're not talking" with a straight face because they are not talking -- at that moment. Or they are in a disagreement -- that will be over tomorrow. Or Lindsey didn't want to be around her because she was so looped out on Klonopin he couldn't bare it and she wrote, "so I'm going away for a little while to remember how to feel..."

[David]

Originally Posted by bombaysaffires

Interesting discussion, and this is what makes Stevie's songs so compelling... everyone can find what they want in them!

Stevie is the William Blake of pop songwriters! You can hang whatever coat you're wearing on her rack.