Suicide And Morality - Page 2

estranged4life · #16 02-12-2011, 06:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Silver Springs

wish i could delete this thread....sorry..im a stupid little girl

you're not. If this is a possible cry for help, instead as stated below that this is a "purely intellectual question", your Ledgie family showed how much they care about you and your well being and don't want to see you do something that once completed can never be undone.

Take it from someone who just several months ago ended up calling a suicide prevention hotline locally because I felt the need to do something to get the thought of ending my existence out of my head...

Please, find a local suicide prevention phone number if you truly are having those type of thoughts...Noone will think you're a stupid girl but a brave soul to find the courage to fight the urge to 'end it' and to fight forward and onward.

HomerMcvie · #17 02-12-2011, 06:09 PM

Several years ago, the "love of my life" left me. I was completely devastated. I could barely do anything, beyond manage to go to work, for months. And I did try to hang myself, twice....but I just couldn't go through with it. And honestly, I was in a funk, for YEARS. But I stuck it out, and made the best of what I had(I gave up on love, and just focused on my friends). And I got through it. And 19 months ago, had a rebirth, of sorts. And life has never been better, than it is now!

I'm so thankful that I did stick it out. Because better times are ahead, for me and you. I promise.

jannieC · #18 02-12-2011, 06:42 PM

My 15 year old niece hung herself two years ago this month. I work with suicidal people all day long. It's quite different when it's someone you love. Thank you to Lindsfan for posting the UK link.

APerfectLie · #19 02-12-2011, 06:58 PM

Honestly, I don't think suicide is "wrong" and I would never judge someone who did it. I don't think people should ever choose suicide, but not because it is wrong, but because there are people out there who care about them, or who will care about them, because sometimes you don't even know that person yet. I feel as a society, we try to label suicide as being wrong, selfish, an unforgivable sin, and what not only to make people who feel suicidal fear committing the act, rather than actually reaching out to people and loving them and making it to where they don't have to contemplate that path in the first place. We try to put the blame on the person who commits the act and label ourselves as the victim, rather than looking at the fact that we may have failed that person. I'm a senior at UT and I am an math major in the actuarial science program. There are 50,000 students there and only 200 of us in actuarial science, so it is a relatively small program, but amongst all 50000 students, it is very easy to feel secluded and alone. Last semester a sophomore shot himself on campus. He also was in actuarial science. I never knew the kid, nor did I have any classes with him, but I still wonder to this day, what if I did? What if I would have befriended this kid? Perhaps he would still be here today. I don't blame him for what he did, I just wish I could have helped. Rescue is possible.

jannieC · #20 02-12-2011, 07:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by APerfectLie

Honestly, I don't think suicide is "wrong" and I would never judge someone who did it. I don't think people should ever choose suicide, but not because it is wrong, but because there are people out there who care about them, or who will care about them, because sometimes you don't even know that person yet. I feel as a society, we try to label suicide as being wrong, selfish, an unforgivable sin, and what not only to make people who feel suicidal fear committing the act, rather than actually reaching out to people and loving them and making it to where they don't have to contemplate that path in the first place. We try to put the blame on the person who commits the act and label ourselves as the victim, rather than looking at the fact that we may have failed that person. I'm a senior at UT and I am an math major in the actuarial science program. There are 50,000 students there and only 200 of us in actuarial science, so it is a relatively small program, but amongst all 50000 students, it is very easy to feel secluded and alone. Last semester a sophomore shot himself on campus. He also was in actuarial science. I never knew the kid, nor did I have any classes with him, but I still wonder to this day, what if I did? What if I would have befriended this kid? Perhaps he would still be here today. I don't blame him for what he did, I just wish I could have helped. Rescue is possible.

No one is responsible for another person's life. I am a therapist who lost a niece to suicide. Certainly I should have been able to see the signs, right? Truth is, the people who want to die, die. I believe there are two types of suiciders. Chronically depressed people who just can't take the pain any longer and impulsive reactive people who do it in a fit of pain. Beyond that, you have folks who have personality disorders and make numerous attempts. Unfortunately, a "cry for help" can end up in a tragic end.

I really could go on and on here, but the bottom line is that this thread is making some people scared and nervous for someone who is in pain and feeling suicidal. If anyone has Bee's number, reach out to her.

APerfectLie · #21 02-12-2011, 08:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jannieC

No one is responsible for another person's life. I am a therapist who lost a niece to suicide. Certainly I should have been able to see the signs, right? Truth is, the people who want to die, die. I believe there are two types of suiciders. Chronically depressed people who just can't take the pain any longer and impulsive reactive people who do it in a fit of pain. Beyond that, you have folks who have personality disorders and make numerous attempts. Unfortunately, a "cry for help" can end up in a tragic end.

I really could go on and on here, but the bottom line is that this thread is making some people scared and nervous for someone who is in pain and feeling suicidal. If anyone has Bee's number, reach out to her.

We are definitely not responsible for someone else's life, and I'm not saying that everyone who commits suicide could have been saved. What I am saying is that whoever commits suicide is obviously in terrible pain, yet we easily put blame on them because we are immensely afraid that we could have done more. Yes, there are people who want to die and there is no stopping them. But it is incredibly selfish of us to act as if they must live their life in pain to keep us happy. I don't think suicide is wrong, it think it is terribly sad. I think it is terribly wrong to ever blame a person who commits suicide and say that they are selfish and they should have sought help or said something, because many times they do and we just don't notice it. I want people to know that I'm here for them, not that I'm afraid that they won't be here for me. That is one thing I love about this forum and this thread. We reach out to complete strangers that we don't even know in our personal lives and try to save them for themselves, not for ourselves.

fringed n fab · #22 02-12-2011, 08:56 PM

Obviously this thread is more about a person in question, rather than our personal views on the subject. I hope they find the help they need and not just look to a message board for comfort. That said, and this is just my gathering (spiritually) of it, is that suicide is never right and is a broken contract with God. And I believe we have a forgiving, merciful God. Sometimes people may be mentally ill and not in their right minds when they leave this earth and I would think God may be forgiving of people. But to take your own life out of selfishness or something, I believe that's different. If you've ever listened to any noted psychic on tv, they'll all tell you it is much harder for them to reach or come in contact with someone who took their lives from suicide, that they go on to (some other place) apart from where most of us will go when we die. I don't think it's hell they go to, rather some type of Purgatory or some other level or something until whatever is right with God. I believe some people leave this world not in their right minds or maybe mentally ill and lost even, and this very serious issue is left between them and God. And these are just my personal views on it and I hope I don't offend others. It's just a serious subject really and I would hope people get the professional help they need because we can only do so much as members of a message board. Sorry to seem so serious, but this topic is.

jannieC · #23 02-12-2011, 09:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by APerfectLie

We are definitely not responsible for someone else's life, and I'm not saying that everyone who commits suicide could have been saved. What I am saying is that whoever commits suicide is obviously in terrible pain, yet we easily put blame on them because we are immensely afraid that we could have done more. Yes, there are people who want to die and there is no stopping them. But it is incredibly selfish of us to act as if they must live their life in pain to keep us happy. I don't think suicide is wrong, it think it is terribly sad. I think it is terribly wrong to ever blame a person who commits suicide and say that they are selfish and they should have sought help or said something, because many times they do and we just don't notice it. I want people to know that I'm here for them, not that I'm afraid that they won't be here for me. That is one thing I love about this forum and this thread. We reach out to complete strangers that we don't even know in our personal lives and try to save them for themselves, not for ourselves.

This is very true, John. And in fact, people do reach out for help and work through issues in counseling yet still end up taking their own lives. But SO many people who seek professional help get better and find ways to improve their coping skills. Thoughts and feelings are temporary. Things can change so quickly.

I think everyone is being very supportive here; it is a very scary situation to read someone's words and feel helpless to do anything.

Silver Springs · #24 02-12-2011, 11:13 PM

please.. I shouldnt have made this thread......****.... im sorryim sorryim sorryim sorryim sorryim sorryim sorry

sara1998 · #25 02-13-2011, 02:00 AM

Please don't apologize for making this thread. Not enough people are willing to talk about it. As far as the moral piece, I personally believe you didn't learn what you were supposed to while you were here if you commit suicide. I think you come back with the same problems over and over again until your soul has learned how to deal with the problems plaguing your life.

Think of the two people you love the most and who love you most in your life. Try to understand how you would feel if either one of them took their life. Understand that the feelings you might have will haunt you the rest of your life. Multiply it by 100. They say the person who commits suicide dies one death, but the survivors die 1000 deaths. We die over and over again trying to figure what went wrong and if we could have changed anything.

My husband committed suicide almost 8 years ago. I still struggle with why. We had so many high points to experience that would eventually overshadow the hell my husband was going through. A temporary problem for my husband caused my daughter to permanently live without her father. No one wins.

louielouie2000 · #26 02-13-2011, 04:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sara1998

Please don't apologize for making this thread. Not enough people are willing to talk about it.

Agreed. I'm a huge proponent of discussing the very things that people are least comfortable discussing. The very virtue that people are unwilling to talk about this taboo topic is proof that it does indeed need to be discussed in an open fashion. Which is one of the reasons why this thread will not be deleted. Accountability is the second reason.

Regarding morality... I hate that so many people struggle with that subject. I strictly do not believe in a one size fits all morality. Morality and beliefs are individual... look at it as the most personal, intimate, and lasting relationship of your entire life. Only the individual knows what's right when it comes to their relationship with their beliefs. If one questions whether or not a certain action is harmonious with their beliefs, that tells me they probably think it's not. If you question what you say or do after you've done it, that says you probably know what you've said or done is wrong. Trust your first instincts before acting... they're usually what's right for YOU.

Meowi · #27 02-13-2011, 04:40 AM

Would this thread be appropriate though?

Dodfather · #28 02-13-2011, 06:23 AM

Bee - please, please seek some help if you are having problems. Having just very recently lost a good friend to suicide I cannot tell you how heartbreaking it is for people to realise that more could/should have been done to help him. Yes, there is anger towards him but mostly it's an overwhelming sadness that although we knew he was having problems, we didn't realise just how severe they were.

Had we known, we may not have been equipped to deal with it but we could have tried our best to get him help from those who experienced with this. Please give people the chance to help you.

Also, take comfort from the fact that you reached out to us on this board in the first place. This is a positive step which must have taken a lot of courage. Build on that and, if you can, take the next step towards helping yourself.

Sorry if this post doesn;t make much sense, this is just a very raw subject for me at the moment.

McTrouble · #29 02-13-2011, 07:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sara1998

Please don't apologize for making this thread. Not enough people are willing to talk about it. As far as the moral piece, I personally believe you didn't learn what you were supposed to while you were here if you commit suicide. I think you come back with the same problems over and over again until your soul has learned how to deal with the problems plaguing your life.

Think of the two people you love the most and who love you most in your life. Try to understand how you would feel if either one of them took their life. Understand that the feelings you might have will haunt you the rest of your life. Multiply it by 100. They say the person who commits suicide dies one death, but the survivors die 1000 deaths. We die over and over again trying to figure what went wrong and if we could have changed anything.

My husband committed suicide almost 8 years ago. I still struggle with why. We had so many high points to experience that would eventually overshadow the hell my husband was going through. A temporary problem for my husband caused my daughter to permanently live without her father. No one wins.

You are very brave to speak out on this subject.

There are some dark subjects coming out on here at the moment and I think a lot of people are feeling jittery - I personally think it is a downside of these sites.

HomerMcvie · #30 02-13-2011, 11:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by McTrouble

You are very brave to speak out on this subject.

There are some dark subjects coming out on here at the moment and I think a lot of people are feeling jittery - I personally think it is a downside of these sites.

Downside? I disagree, strongly. Quite the contrary. I think it allows us to find strength, in our little community here. For us to understand, that most of us have lost someone to suicide, but also, for us to understand, that we ALL have our down moments in life, and that they WILL pass. To find the inner strength, patience, and love, that allows us to find the greater things that await us.