We're always discussing favs... so look at the ugly!

louielouie2000 · #1 11-06-2009, 01:28 PM

I just posted a variation of this on the Stevie board. It seems we're always talking about favorites, the best of the best, what speaks to our hearts, etc. So let's dish some dirt now instead!

What's the worst Mac album to you, and why? I say we should include any album from 1975-present, including Behind the Mask and Time.

To me, the title, tiara, and bouquet go to Mirage. The whole heaping mess just seems like an afterthought, filler, and half hearted. Lindsey's songs are all abominations, sans Eyes Of The World. The whole '50s pop throwback theme he was going for was just gross, and unimaginative. I realize he probably did it as a way to protest the band members wanting to go back to a more pop-commercial sound. Stevie's nod to country western, That's Alright, has no place on a Mac album. The only person who has consistently good material on this album is Christine.

It's not all bad though. Stevie's songs Straight Back and Gypsy were the last really great Mac songs she ever recorded. Christine's material is predictably good, with Hold Me being one of my favorite Mac tunes of all time. It just makes me smile hugely, and ALWAYS puts me in the best mood when I hear it on the radio. As a whole though, the album just comes across as flat and soulless to me though.

LikeAMagnet · #2 11-06-2009, 01:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by louielouie2000

I just posted a variation of this on the Stevie board. It seems we're always talking about favorites, the best of the best, what speaks to our hearts, etc. So let's dish some dirt now instead!

What's the worst Mac album to you, and why? I say we should include any album from 1975-present, including Behind the Mask and Time.

To me, the title, tiara, and bouquet go to Mirage. The whole heaping mess just seems like an afterthought, filler, and half hearted. Lindsey's songs are all abominations, sans Eyes Of The World. The whole '50s pop throwback theme he was going for was just gross, and unimaginative. I realize he probably did it as a way to protest the band members wanting to go back to a more pop-commercial sound. Stevie's nod to country western, That's Alright, has no place on a Mac album. The only person who has consistently good material on this album is Christine.

It's not all bad though. Stevie's songs Straight Back and Gypsy were the last really great Mac songs she ever recorded. Christine's material is predictably good, with Hold Me being one of my favorite Mac tunes of all time. It just makes me smile hugely, and ALWAYS puts me in the best mood when I hear it on the radio. As a whole though, the album just comes across as flat and soulless to me though.

Two words to back up that entire arguement:

Oh Diane..

What in the name of Lucifer was he thinking? It's the worst song ever. Not just the worst Fleetwood Mac song.. but EVER. Everynow and again I contemplate erasing it off itunes so it won't come on when shuffle is on.. only that I'm completely OCD and have to have the entire album it'd be gone in a flash. Mess of a song.

Oh, and the only reason Eyes Of The World is so good is cos of the Pachelbel intro!

TrueFaith77 · #3 11-06-2009, 02:01 PM

I like "Oh Diane."

Though Mirage would not be my choice for worst post-75 Mac album, I think it marked the end of the Mac as a unified force in their albums. Each individual song on Mirage is actually quite lovely (by all three artists), but I don't hear them communicating to each other or even really complimenting each other the way they do on Rumours -- which has a narrative -- and Tusk -- in which the intertwined/alternating voices are united by a shared artistic impulse, amounting to a social vision. The songs on Mirage seem connected only if you follow the abstract theme suggested by the album's title. Still, Lindsey's attempts to understand both his desires and his musical heritage (the language that allows him to articulate his desires) on tracks like "Oh Diane" and "Can't Go Back" are interesting, pretty, touching, and... catchy. His voice sounds great too.

("Talkin' bout Diane...")

TheWILDheart · #4 11-06-2009, 02:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LikeAMagnet

Oh, and the only reason Eyes Of The World is so good is cos of the Pachelbel intro!

I really don't like Eyes Of The World on the album, but I do enjoy it live. Can't stand Oh Diane at all. But for me, worse albums are...

pre-75: The first 2 - Fleetwood Mac & Mr. Wonderful. Don't like them at all. Having said that, I'm not a blues fan.
Rumours lineup - Tango In The Night. Some great songs, but in general I didn't like it. Stevie's absence was obvious, Lindsey's unhappiness and desire to break out was obvious, which left Christine and the boys to carry the album. She did it well as all her songs were fantastic. But Fleetwood Mac has never been about 1 person.
Post-Rumours: Time. Never felt like a Fleetwood Mac album

Villavic · #5 11-06-2009, 02:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by louielouie2000

I say we should include any album from 1975-present, including Behind the Mask and Time.

I think it's hard if we compare different lineups, but since you asked for it, I'd say I never listen the TIME album, so that's my choice.

BellaDonna93 · #6 11-06-2009, 03:40 PM

For me it's Behind The Mask because it isn't Fleetwood Mac, the real Fleetwood Mac, because of that Lindsey left...so yeah, Behind The Mask.

chiliD · #7 11-06-2009, 07:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BellaDonna93

For me it's Behind The Mask because it isn't Fleetwood Mac, the real Fleetwood Mac, because of that Lindsey left...so yeah, Behind The Mask.

The REAL Fleetwood Mac is: Peter Green, Jeremy Spencer, Danny Kirwan, John McVie, Mick Fleetwood

So don't EVEN THINK about Fleetwood Mac not being "Fleetwood Mac" because there was no Lindsey Buckingham!

The only "bogus" Fleetwood Mac was the one that attempted to finish out the Mystery To Me tour. Everything else is legitimate, Buckingham or no Buckingham.

Quote:

Originally Posted by vivfox

I played the Time album twice and hated all of it. From Tango, Oh Diane and Only Over You make me barf.

Um...you mean "Oh Diane" & "Only Over You" from MIRAGE and not TANGO, right? Helps to know what album you're listening when you're rating the songs; adds credibility to your opinions.

The list of Fleetwood Mac "stinkers" (in chronological order from oldest to newest):

When You Say
(I'm A) Roadrunner
Not That Funny (studio version)
Oh Diane
Welcome To The Room...Sara
The Second Time
Running Through The Garden
Silver Girl

To me, that's about it. In 40+ years and all the songs they've released, that's a pretty good percentage of decent material to only have 8 "stinkers" in the bunch.

LikeAMagnet · #8 11-06-2009, 08:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chiliD

The REAL Fleetwood Mac is: Peter Green, Jeremy Spencer, Danny Kirwan, John McVie, Mick Fleetwood

So don't EVEN THINK about Fleetwood Mac not being "Fleetwood Mac" because there was no Lindsey Buckingham!

The REAL Fleetwood Mac?? The REAL Fleetwood Mac is the Fleetwood Mac lineup that appeals to a person individually..
My own personal REAL Fleetwood Mac is the Rumours lineup..
Some others might consider the SYW lineup to be the REAL Fleetwood Mac.. its a subjective term really isn't it?

Surely your REAL Fleetwood Mac mightn't be others REAL Fleetwood Mac.

I do agree though, saying its not Fleetwood Mac due to the absence of one band member is, you can dress it up as much as you like but basically, ignorance..

samthrax · #9 11-06-2009, 08:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LikeAMagnet

I do agree though, saying its not Fleetwood Mac due to the absence of one band member is, you can dress it up as much as you like but basically, ignorance..

In the same vain as your post, can't the REAL Fleetwood Mac be different for everyone and not just ignorant?

Mirage has grown on me but I still don't think it's a great album at all. "That's Alright" and "Oh Diane" continually battle each other for "worst song on my itunes".

goldustsongbird · #10 11-06-2009, 08:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by samthrax

In the same vain as your post, can't the REAL Fleetwood Mac be different for everyone and not just ignorant?

Mirage has grown on me but I still don't think it's a great album at all. "That's Alright" and "Oh Diane" continually battle each other for "worst song on my itunes".

louielouie2000 · #11 11-07-2009, 02:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chiliD

The REAL Fleetwood Mac is: Peter Green, Jeremy Spencer, Danny Kirwan, John McVie, Mick Fleetwood

If we really want to play the technicality game, John McVie cannot be included in that list, as he wasn't a full time member in Fleetwood Mac when the band was formed.

Using your logic, Stuart Sutcliffe is a REAL member of the Beatles, and Ringo Starr is not. Millions of Beatles fans across the world would raise hell at that suggestion however (though I suspect the really hard core ones would agree).

My point is, we can be technical all we want, but the reality is the most successful lineup of any one band is what the world considers to be the real deal. I almost wish the band had changed names when Lindsey and Stevie joined, because that incarnation of the band was so very disconnected from the band's roots. But in their own way, Fleetwood Mac did just that: by simply titling the 1975 album Fleetwood Mac, they were making a statement that this was definitively a new band.

My take on post 1975 Fleetwood Mac is this. For better or worse, the band entered a new realm of success that year, effectively rendering all previous incarnations of the band null and void. In my personal opinion, so long as greater than 50% of the 1975 members of the band are present, you can call it Fleetwood Mac. With the Time album, 60% of the band was still in tact, so I definitely agree that it is a link in the Fleetwood Mac chain. However, the Time tour only had 40% of the lineup present, so I don't consider it to be the real deal. We can all argue semantics forever and twist technicalities to fit our own definitions, but the definition of real Fleetwood Mac is subjective, and can really only be defined by the individual fans themselves. I think once you reach a certain level of success and fame, your name is no longer your own, but belongs instead to the public domain. But that's just my two cents... and they are worthless to anybody but myself!

OldTimer · #12 11-07-2009, 11:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by louielouie2000

the band entered a new realm of success that year, effectively rendering all previous incarnations of the band null and void.

null and void?

You've just designated all the FM music of Green, Spencer, Kirwan, Welch, etc, to be null and void?!?!?!

There is no justice.

markolas · #13 11-07-2009, 01:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OldTimer

null and void?

You've just designated all the FM music of Green, Spencer, Kirwan, Welch, etc, to be null and void?!?!?!

Yeah, I definitely think that's overstating it. I generally prefer the LB/SN/CM incarnation of FM, but I do enjoy the early Peter Green FM and I like what I've heard of Kiln House an awful lot. The Bob Welch era I might be inclined to agree with louie about - but *all* previous incarnations? I don't think so. The Green/Spencer FM might as well be a different band from the Stevie/Lindsey FM, and I can appreciate both on their own terms.