Off-Topic: Elton John today

[LikeAWillow]

Originally Posted by HejiraNYC

Fine, but human sexuality is intrinsic whereas all of those other "sins" are the result of voluntary actions.

But that's beside the point.
.

There's evidence that sadistic personality disorder has biological routes. Should a sadist be accepted for acting on their impulses?

I know your finger is hovering over the reply button right now.Take a deep breath before you jump right back up on that soapbox.

I'm not equating homosexuality with sadism. I think what I just said was complete bull****. If it's not, I'm Tom Bundy for the relations I've had with other women. It is a hole in your argument, though, and when you have the balls to ask a poster with a thought out, structured, and well-intentioned post to

think before you express [your opinions]

,especially when your own are little more than rhetoric, you hurt our cause more than you help it. Fiver is trying to have a discussion with you. Being militant in response degrades that discussion.

[HejiraNYC]

Originally Posted by LikeAWillow

There's evidence that sadistic personality disorder has biological routes. Should a sadist be accepted for acting on their impulses?

I know your finger is hovering over the reply button right now.Take a deep breath before you jump right back up on that soapbox.

I'm not equating homosexuality with sadism. I think what I just said was complete bull****. If it's not, I'm Tom Bundy for the relations I've had with other women. It is a hole in your argument, though, and when you have the balls to ask a poster with a thought out, structured, and well-intentioned post to



,especially when your own are little more than rhetoric, you hurt our cause more than you help it. Fiver is trying to have a discussion with you. Being militant in response degrades that discussion.

Are you drunk? What the hell was that? Before you call someone out on their so-called "rhetoric," why don't you learn to write in something other than some incoherent non-sequiturs? Is this the by-product of growing up in the Facebook and Twitter generation? What is a hole in my argument?

Oh, and if you are trying to sound smart and insist on namedropping, why don't you at least get the name correct? It's Ted Bundy.

[iamnotafraid]

HejiraNYC,
Why all the name calling? Do you think she deserved that?
We all have different opinions, but name calling and putting
people down isn't that a little silly and mean?

[HejiraNYC]

Originally Posted by iamnotafraid

HejiraNYC,
Why all the name calling? Do you think she deserved that?
We all have different opinions, but name calling and putting
people down isn't that a little silly and mean?

Please re-read. I didn't call her any names.

Secondly, if someone is going to call me out, then he/she had better have something rational to say. I love to engage in a friendly debate, but if you come on with the sole intention of stirring up **** without adding anything meaningful to the discussion, then you'd better be prepared to get as good as you can give. What can I say? I don't turn the other cheek. Jesus would not be proud!

[LiamMcConville]

Originally Posted by HejiraNYC

Please re-read. I didn't call her any names.

Secondly, if someone is going to call me out, then he/she had better have something rational to say. I love to engage in a friendly debate, but if you come on with the sole intention of stirring up **** without adding anything meaningful to the discussion, then you'd better be prepared to get as good as you can give. What can I say? I don't turn the other cheek. Jesus would not be proud!

Why should any one grace you with a rational response when you've been posting nothing but irrational/extremist blabber?

Every post you've made in this thread has been equally judgmental & intolerant as the Christians you've accused throughout.

My original point was that you show insensitivity and inflict pain to people every time you express your "opinion" about homosexuality which, as you've acknowledged, is not a choice. If you can call something "wrong" but cannot really articulate what "right" would be, how does that really help anyone? Again, you're entitled to your opinions (which I hope, for your sake, will evolve), but please think before you express them.

What a joke. "I'm being a crybaby bitch because Christian's don't accept my sexual orientation, but I'm going to be equally intolerant and insensitive to their lifestyles. That will teach them! Ha!"

[skcin]

I must say, I'm actually pretty impressed that this thread is still open.

I don't have much to add to the discussion itself, except that you can believe something will happen (ie - all gays will go to hell) but that doesn't mean it WILL happen. it's NOT fact. it's belief. it's opinion. You can believe what you want, but others will probably disagree & that doesn't mean they are wrong.

I have noticed, Ed, that you've ended most of your posts with something like (this is NOT a direct quote) 'you have a right to your opinion, no matter how ignorant it is...' or something similar. Way to throw in YOUR judgement of others when bitching about them judging you. Haven't seen any of the "jesusy" people here say "you can do whatever you want, not matter how ignorant and disgusting and sick and horrific it is..." Implying someone is less intelligent than you are soley becuase you disagree with what they believe is kind of f*cked up.

Originally Posted by carrie721

-both are delicious dipped in peanut butter
-apples can fly for a little bit if you throw them real hard.

point, set, match.

Always the voice of reason.

[carrie721]

Originally Posted by trackaghost

It doesn't make sense to me either. Imagine someone who devotes their life to good, does great things, affects positive change in the world, shows people incredible kindness and through it all shows great humility, yet because they have "laid with men" and not repented for that one thing, they would be turned away from heaven? Crazy. If people are to be judged surely it should be on how they have treated others and not who they have loved? (Not that I think it's a sin anyway).

yeah, i don't understand why god would care. if there were a god, i would think he'd just want us to be good to each other.

Originally Posted by LiamMcConville

Why should any one grace you with a rational response when you've been posting nothing but irrational/extremist blabber?

Every post you've made in this thread has been equally judgmental & intolerant as the Christians you've accused throughout.

this is exactly why i've pretty much left the "gay community."

"i hate them because they hate us" is silly. i see the same kind of irrational groupthink in the gay community that they accuse the right wing/christians of exhibiting, except in the gay community it's laced with the acerbity of the so-called downtrodden. i left the church to get away from that sort of thing, not so i could running into the arms of another group that behaved the same way. it's not different or better if you're "right," it's the same old bullsh*t and it's plain ol' hypocrisy.

re my "so-called downtrodden" comment: of course i think gays get the short end of the stick in society. i'm not saying we should settle for that. but when you take on the mantle of victim and relish in it as so many have, that's when i have to step out of the ring.

Originally Posted by skcin

Always the voice of reason.

well, i'm pretty smart n junk.

[Fiver]

Hey Zombie, I've been thinking about this for the past few days as well. I've realized finally what HejiraNYC was trying to get across.

My statements weren't helpful to the conversation. I don't think the original poster was looking for an outside opinion on what he stated. If he was he would've asked, or gone to a church with similiar beliefs to my own and asked someone there. It really wasn't my place to bring up my view on the matter, and for that I wanna apologize again.

Like I said before, I initially just wanted to post to clear up things said about the Bible that I thought were inaccurate, but I went too far.

If this was a topic called say, "The Bible and Homosexuality" it would've been okay, but I do regret what I said, cause I feel it was out of turn. I know in most threads we meander and end up on totally different subjects, but seeing as how Nikolaj was looking for support, and that this is such a serious matter, I think this is different. As the saying goes, "If you don't have anything nice to say, don't say anything at all." I really do feel regret for any hurt feelings I caused, and think I made a mistake.

If you want to continue just for discussion's sake, and I don't mean this as a challenge or anything, then I'd rather do it through PMs.

The only thing I will respond to here is this

Originally Posted by Zombie

Gay people, however, don't have that choice, according to this logic - they don't have the option of being able to have sex with someone they are actually attracted to without not passing go and heading straight to the Bad Place.

I don't believe a person goes to Hell because they've had homosexual intercourse. It's like... if I lie once, I'm a liar. But if I ask God to forgive that sin, I'm not guilty of it anymore. That's what I believe the verse in 1 Corinthians 6:9-10 is saying

"Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God?
Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor
effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind, nor thieves, nor
covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners shall inherit the
kingdom of God."

because the very next verse says:

"And such were some of you; but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God."

I know this is bringing up the issue again, but that's a very important statement to me, as I don't believe people who are gay go to Hell for being gay. As I said before, I only believe that those who don't accept Jesus' sacrifice will go to Hell. And once again, it's just a belief of mine, and I don't want to push it on anyone here, it's a personal choice to believe it or not.

[T8rBoi]

Originally Posted by Fiver

I don't believe a person goes to Hell because they've had homosexual intercourse. It's like... if I lie once, I'm a liar. But if I ask God to forgive that sin, I'm not guilty of it anymore. That's what I believe the verse in 1 Corinthians 6:9-10 is saying

And now gays are like liars.

I know you are gonna come back and say that isn't what you meant, but why does everyone keep making their points by comparing gays to adulterers or liars or sadists.

But the real point here is that you interpret the bible to say homosexual acts are sins. (just like the adulterers, people who wear mixed fabric clothes or men who shave - let's not just cherry pick our biblical sins, lets get them all out there)

Gays who act on their sexual impulses and desires are Sinners in your eyes. Unless they accept and get the forgiveness of YOUR god, they will be going to a place of unspeakable horrors for eternity.

I got that right, correct?

and I reiterate the point someone made above, how can you not let gays get married and then call their "out-of-wedlock" sex a sin?

[jaycee]

Originally Posted by Fiver

I don't believe a person goes to Hell because they've had homosexual intercourse. It's like... if I lie once, I'm a liar. But if I ask God to forgive that sin, I'm not guilty of it anymore.

Excellent! That's means that we can do pretty much anything we like (except mortal sins), ask your god for forgiveness, and be forgiven! No harm done! That's the best morality I've ever heard of! Accountability to an imaginary friend is much better than the secular Golden Rule, or any form of accountability in which we're not accountable to each other!
Joking aside, the thought that homosexuality is a sin in need of forgiveness is absolutely appalling. The thought that a person needs to ask your god for forgiveness for such an intrinsic quality as sexuality is disgusting. Actually, I think a quote from Richard Dawkins is suitable here:
"ANDREW DENTON: What's your moral code?
RICHARD DAWKINS: I suppose it's a version of the Golden Rule, don't do unto others what you wouldn't wish them to do to you. I do feel intense vicarious sadness when I encounter sadness in others. It doesn't have to be in my own species, I mean it could be of another species as well. My moral code is definitely nothing to do with the sort of busy-bodyish religious moral code that cares about what people do in private. What they do with their sex organs and things like that, seems to me to be an utterly private matter, nothing to do with morals. I despise that kind of alleged morality, deeply despise it."
(From http://www.abc.net.au/tv/elders/tran...s/s2757522.htm)
As usual, I couldn't have said it better myself!
But who am I to talk? I'm only an unbeliever that's going to go to hell when I die anyway...