Just Skimmed Through STORMS

[strandinthewind]

^^^

Well, she says, and has repeatedly said, LB is really scary when he is angry, etc. So, she does comment on that. Also, I do not see her coming to his defense by saying she attacked him. In fact, she never to my knowledge has ever said what LB did after she attacked him in the TITN argument other than it got ugly or something like that.

I think his violence toward her is something she would neverf discuss in public. After all, she is the peacekeeper and if she outed him in that regard, he'd likely leave FM for good.

[Regina]

Except for the fact that she was doing this AFTER he left the band "for good."

There was no hope, at that time, for Lindsey to ever come back and very little good will toward anyone at that time. Even a couple of years later, I think she was quoted somewhere as saying Lindsey would never come back and there would never be a Rumours-era FM reunion (too lazy to look things up, sorry).

If she wanted to, she could have (and others WOULD have) hung him out to dry at that moment. There was a lot of bitterness there. At the least, she could have refused to comment completely but she didn't. She said she attacked him first. She didn't have to set the record straight, but she did and I think that's the reason I never truly believed the abuse rumors to begin with...because of Stevie.

I don't see Stevie in the same light as Carol Ann. I just think she has too strong a personality to stay in a situation like that. And I also think she's very open to discussing all kinds of things as a "lesson" to others. That's why she's so open about her drug use, etc. I think, if she had been abused, even if she chose not to "out" Lindsey...she would have used the "one of my boyfriends" did this to me and I'm telling you to get out while you can, type of speeches.

Lots of people can be scary when angry. They can be snide, rude, crude, intimidating, yell, scream, throw things, etc. That doesn't necessarily mean that they lift one little finger in anger, though.

That's not to say Lindsey didn't with CAH. But, as I stated before, I (chose to) think there was something very wrong with him physically or mentally at the time. And I'm basing that on Carol Ann's own words, by the way. The way she described it leaves that interpretation open.

It's all subject to interpretation, I guess, and what you want to believe.

I've gone on record many, many times on this board as saying I love both Lindsey and Stevie. I've traveled far and wide (for me) to see them both, and I've put blinders on--for them both. So...I'm biased and will be the first to admit it. But I'm not hanging out to dry the people I think either of them are now, based on something they may have done 30 years ago.

[Tango]

Originally Posted by Regina

Except for the fact that she was doing this AFTER he left the band "for good."

There was no hope, at that time, for Lindsey to ever come back and very little good will toward anyone at that time. Even a couple of years later, I think she was quoted somewhere as saying Lindsey would never come back and there would never be a Rumours-era FM reunion (too lazy to look things up, sorry).

If she wanted to, she could have (and others WOULD have) hung him out to dry at that moment. There was a lot of bitterness there. At the least, she could have refused to comment completely but she didn't. She said she attacked him first. She didn't have to set the record straight, but she did and I think that's the reason I never truly believed the abuse rumors to begin with...because of Stevie.

I don't see Stevie in the same light as Carol Ann. I just think she has too strong a personality to stay in a situation like that. And I also think she's very open to discussing all kinds of things as a "lesson" to others. That's why she's so open about her drug use, etc. I think, if she had been abused, even if she chose not to "out" Lindsey...she would have used the "one of my boyfriends" did this to me and I'm telling you to get out while you can, type of speeches.

Lots of people can be scary when angry. They can be snide, rude, crude, intimidating, yell, scream, throw things, etc. That doesn't necessarily mean that they lift one little finger in anger, though.

That's not to say Lindsey didn't with CAH. But, as I stated before, I (chose to) think there was something very wrong with him physically or mentally at the time. And I'm basing that on Carol Ann's own words, by the way. The way she described it leaves that interpretation open.

It's all subject to interpretation, I guess, and what you want to believe.

I've gone on record many, many times on this board as saying I love both Lindsey and Stevie. I've traveled far and wide (for me) to see them both, and I've put blinders on--for them both. So...I'm biased and will be the first to admit it. But I'm not hanging out to dry the people I think either of them are now, based on something they may have done 30 years ago.

I tend to agree with your comments, Regina. Both pretty blonde haired chicks, but totally different personalities. In Stevie's mind she was stronger than Lindsey, or so she expressed in her songs. Yet there's no one stronger than someone enraged, fueled by alcohol and cocaine. Carol Ann was weaker than Lindsey. She was the dependent personality. And, as Stevie said in her comments while in the strangle hold, if the band didn't kill him for harming her, her father and brother would 'kill him.' Kill him? Was this the Nicks family or the Corleone family she was referring to? I hardly see Jess Nicks taking a contract out on Lindsey. But clearly Stevie thought, based on her utterances at the scene, that she had some sense of "back up" and support system.

Carol Ann, at that time, didn't seem to have that back up. She seemed a bit estranged from her family, or at least isolating some of the facts of her life from them. I doubt she was telling her (was it 5) sisters that the beautiful rock star boyfriend that she had was periodly abusing her (see page 357) until she actually left. Even then, she didn't tell her family what the doctor said. There's a definite "shame" sense in people that have been abused, and some people never reveal it. She didn't even tell Stevie about it, when she had the chance. (see pages 329-330) Instead, she changed the subject.

I also agree with you on the neurological effects of the combination of cocaine, alcohol, self medication with seizure medications and his own faulty wired brain synapes that fostered his episodic behaviors. He wasn't like that all the time. There is also NOTHING to suggest ANY of this behavior occured prior to Stevie & Lindsey joining Fleetwood Mac and getting involved with the drugs.

But at the same time, while you suggest that Stevie wasn't abused, you forget he did publicly abuse her. I'm not talking about the Tango episode, but rather the New Zealand show. Two strikes your out? Does there have to be a third acknowledged episode of abuse on Stevie to suggest he clearly had (and I do say HAD) an abuse problem on women during those drug fueled days? Even the men were afraid of him, as outlined in the book. Again, I firmly believe the combination of drugs and alcohol played a part in this. While Lindsey has stated he wasn't under the power of drugs the way the others were, I'd have to disagree. The effects they had on him were every bit as savage, maybe more so, than on the others. He didn't even remember it.

Yesterday's gone. I DO believe that, otherwise I could not be a fan of this band. I believe they were all given a new lease on life. You can't watch The Dance or any of their solo work and not believe that.

[Dreamz19]

Originally Posted by Tango

But at the same time, while you suggest that Stevie wasn't abused, you forget he did publicly abuse her. I'm not talking about the Tango episode, but rather the New Zealand show. Two strikes your out? Does there have to be a third acknowledged episode of abuse on Stevie to suggest he clearly had (and I do say HAD) an abuse problem on women during those drug fueled days? Even the men were afraid of him, as outlined in the book. Again, I firmly believe the combination of drugs and alcohol played a part in this. While Lindsey has stated he wasn't under the power of drugs the way the others were, I'd have to disagree. The effects they had on him were every bit as savage, maybe more so, than on the others. He didn't even remember it.

I agree with you. I can also vaguely remember reading where Stevie mentioned that the words they said to each other during their split was more painful than the physical fights they had. She said something along those lines. While I don't think their physical incidents were as sereve as CAH reports, there definitely seemed to be some form of physical abuse in their relationship as well. Whether it was Stevie hitting him first or Lindsey pushing her etc.

[strandinthewind]

Originally Posted by Regina

. . . She didn't have to set the record straight, but she did and I think that's the reason I never truly believed the abuse rumors to begin with...because of Stevie . . . .

Well, she never said LB did not beat her, hit her, or whatever. She said she attacked him first To me, that is not denying her ever hit her.

[Kelly]

Originally Posted by strandinthewind

Well, she never said LB did not beat her, hit her, or whatever. She said she attacked him first To me, that is not denying her ever hit her.

She also never said he hit her.

Don't quote me Mick either...what he wrote doesn't matter to me, esp when he said he wants to rewrite. The NZ incident was the one where he sang offkey? And mocked her during Rhiannon? And kicked his foot out? That seems like drunken, bitter behavior to me, not necessarily physical abuse. Show me where a fan saw him kick the **** out of her onstage and I may agree. Out of all the fans in that arena not ONE has ever come forward to say they witnessed this abuse? Chris was mad about him singing offkey and embarrassing the band...is this the incident you are talking about?

Curious, do you think Stevie has done things that LB wouldn't talk about publically either? She could be just as abusive as you seem to think LB is, behind closed doors.

[strandinthewind]

Originally Posted by Kelly

She also never said he hit her.

Don't quote me Mick either...what he wrote doesn't matter to me, esp when he said he wants to rewrite. The NZ incident was the one where he sang offkey? And mocked her during Rhiannon? And kicked his foot out? That seems like drunken, bitter behavior to me, not necessarily physical abuse. Show me where a fan saw him kick the **** out of her onstage and I may agree. Out of all the fans in that arena not ONE has ever come forward to say they witnessed this abuse? Chris was mad about him singing offkey and embarrassing the band...is this the incident you are talking about?

Curious, do you think Stevie has done things that LB wouldn't talk about publically either? She could be just as abusive as you seem to think LB is, behind closed doors.

1. I never said La Nicks was not abusive -- I would have no way of knowing that. I will say though that she does not strike me as such.

2. I do not think LB is abusive without support. And, you can color it anyway you like, but many have said he is such.

Ostrich head in the sand anyone

[Michelle Daya]

Originally Posted by Kelly

She also never said he hit her.

Don't quote me Mick either...what he wrote doesn't matter to me, esp when he said he wants to rewrite. The NZ incident was the one where he sang offkey? And mocked her during Rhiannon? And kicked his foot out? That seems like drunken, bitter behavior to me, not necessarily physical abuse. Show me where a fan saw him kick the **** out of her onstage and I may agree. Out of all the fans in that arena not ONE has ever come forward to say they witnessed this abuse? Chris was mad about him singing offkey and embarrassing the band...is this the incident you are talking about?

Curious, do you think Stevie has done things that LB wouldn't talk about publically either? She could be just as abusive as you seem to think LB is, behind closed doors.

your ex who you have stayed friends with (after not being friends) & might possibly even still love is being verbally attacked in a book written by a mutual friend for hitting you or shoving you up against a car. when someone you care about is falsely accused, most people would be shocked & say "he did not hit me.' her saying she jumped on him first was true, i'm sure but she never went to his defense to say he didn't jump on her. she went so far as to say she thought he was going to kill her & that if he did, her family & friends would go after him. you say don't quote you mick, but that's stevie talking. as for mick saying it wasn't the first time, she didn't disagree with that either.

i love lb but even as bob welch pointed out by coming to the defense of cah, he wasn't perfect. doesn't make me love his music any less but honestly, i don't think i would have wanted to date him or get on his bad side back then. i'm guessing he's worked on his little demons since & that's why he's so happy? so i respect him for that.

[strandinthewind]

Originally Posted by Kelly

She also never said he hit her.

Don't quote me Mick either...what he wrote doesn't matter to me, esp when he said he wants to rewrite. The NZ incident was the one where he sang offkey? And mocked her during Rhiannon? And kicked his foot out? That seems like drunken, bitter behavior to me, not necessarily physical abuse. Show me where a fan saw him kick the **** out of her onstage and I may agree. Out of all the fans in that arena not ONE has ever come forward to say they witnessed this abuse? Chris was mad about him singing offkey and embarrassing the band...is this the incident you are talking about? . . . .

At 6:42 (3:49 counting backward) or so - she says "he didn't just get violent with me," I attacked him, etc. So, she did say he got violent with her Otherwise, what is your definition of getting violent with someone?

[michaelD]

Just got done reading this... It was a good read, and a very interesting tale. It's a classic story, and most of it I have heard before.

Whatever her reasons for writing it etc... I found it entertaining.

[shackin'up]

Originally Posted by strandinthewind

^^^

Well, she says, and has repeatedly said, LB is really scary when he is angry, etc. So, she does comment on that. Also, I do not see her coming to his defense by saying she attacked him. In fact, she never to my knowledge has ever said what LB did after she attacked him in the TITN argument other than it got ugly or something like that.

I think his violence toward her is something she would neverf discuss in public. After all, she is the peacekeeper and if she outed him in that regard, he'd likely leave FM for good.

Isn't that why domestic violence seems to be indestructable? I say: Come out of the closet and face it. People can be cruel. Including my musical hero. I think that a passionate controlfreak has some very dangerous dark sides. Esp when you combine it with drugs, booze, a passionate and dominant ex-partner and a very deep dense kind of love.
And the complex dependent bandsituation we all know about.

[strandinthewind]

Originally Posted by shackin'up

Isn't that why domestic violence seems to be indestructable? I say: Come out of the closet and face it. People can be cruel. Including my musical hero. I think that a passionate controlfreak has some very dangerous dark sides. Esp when you combine it with drugs, booze, a passionate and dominant ex-partner and a very deep dense kind of love.
And the complex dependent bandsituation we all know about.

Well, as long as she confronted him with it and got out of that situation, I do not see why she needs to tell the world about the private matter. CAH chose to do so, but that was her choice and IMO she did it for money, which I do not hold against her as and again, it was her story to sell, just as it was LB's story to write, sing, and talk about for money.

[shackin'up]

Originally Posted by strandinthewind

Well, as long as she confronted him with it and got out of that situation, I do not see why she needs to tell the world about the private matter. CAH chose to do so, but that was her choice and IMO she did it for money, which I do not hold against her as and again, it was her story to sell, just as it was LB's story to write, sing, and talk about for money.

americans think so different.

[strandinthewind]

Originally Posted by shackin'up

americans think so different.

You really think that Stevie Nicks publicly publishing that LB beat her would somehow be therapy for her? I think it is salacious and it sells, see CAH's and MF's book. But, that is just not La Nicks. She has always said that the story of her life a great and fascinating one; but she has also said she would rather couch it in terms of her poetry and leave the world wondering. So, apparently, that is how she chooses and chose to tell the world about her life and all that went on. She does haoever, discuss some things very frankly, like her addictions, weight, etc. But, those involve only her. In other words, discussing them does not effect anyone but her.

[danax6]

Originally Posted by Tango

I tend to agree with your comments, Regina. Both pretty blonde haired chicks, but totally different personalities. In Stevie's mind she was stronger than Lindsey, or so she expressed in her songs. Yet there's no one stronger than someone enraged, fueled by alcohol and cocaine. Carol Ann was weaker than Lindsey. She was the dependent personality.

Yes. But there is a needy, dependent side to Stevie also, it's just that her tough personality is present enough that it overrules the neediness when need be. Carol Ann clearly had no backbone. That is also why I think Stevie was the one that was obviously hardest to 'get away from' (and not just because they happened to be in the same band )and 'get over', because of her strong personality. We all know Lindsey admitted that part of the reason he left in 1987 was because of the issues with Stevie and the closure he needed. I think that Stevie was, in many ways, a worthy adversary and that brought out both the best but also the worst in him. It kept him on his toes, whereas girls like Carol Ann were, in retrospect, pretty forgettable.

Originally Posted by Dreamz19

I agree with you. I can also vaguely remember reading where Stevie mentioned that the words they said to each other during their split was more painful than the physical fights they had. She said something along those lines. While I don't think their physical incidents were as sereve as CAH reports, there definitely seemed to be some form of physical abuse in their relationship as well. Whether it was Stevie hitting him first or Lindsey pushing her etc.

She said that they shouted horrible obscenities at each other and spewed words that they had been cropping up for years. Words that were so bad they were never able to come back from it. She said that was definitely the end of Stevie and Lindsey.

Originally Posted by shackin'up

americans think so different.

Thank you. Sometimes it's like talking to a brick wall.