Quiet World Of White & Gold? - Page 2

BlackWidow · #16 06-25-2006, 04:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by amber

Hi!
But then how would that interpretation go with the lyrics before it? If she was his masterpiece, his self control, and was going to become his legacy - he wouldn't really need "white" and "gold" as drugs. Quite the opposite, I would say.

Legacy annd masterpeice go hand & hand. doesn't necessarily mean perfection or success...just that big love that mattered! the one that got away. we all have them..we choose people in life sometimes that are our biggest teachers. if you give someone your power or "self control" - that means you are weak and powerless to that person. so..not a healthy situation. the girl is dangerous..the prices paid were enormous..
"Ive been burned by the fire / crawled through the briars" people in control dont crawl. hence my "white & gold theory".....

amber · #17 06-25-2006, 04:32 PM

^^^

Those are good points, about legacy et al, but I think the grammar of white and gold is written in a way that groups it with masterpiece, self control, and legacy - not as something different than those things. "You'll become his legacy, his quiet world of white and gold" - it's basically one sentence, one theme, with two descriptions of said theme.
I appreciate your interp, though - I agree about the big love and the effects.

BlackWidow · #18 06-25-2006, 04:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by amber

^^^

Those are good points, about legacy et al, but I think the grammar of white and gold is written in a way that groups it with masterpiece, self control, and legacy - not as something different than those things. "You'll become his legacy, his quiet world of white and gold" - it's basically one sentence, one theme, with two descriptions of said theme.
I appreciate your interp, though - I agree about the big love and the effects.

Yea..I'm open to hear everyone's interpretations!
Of course mine is dramatic...

The line is gorgeous!!!!!!

EnchantedSLN · #19 06-25-2006, 04:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by amber

I think the first verse connotes that she's dangerous in general for any lover - that she's very desireable but they won't know what they're getting into - she gets everything she wants, and...well, essentially the meaning of the phrase Dark Angel (something beautiful and therefore the danger (dark) is hidden). I also always thought "It don't show when you break up" meant the girl has a certain emotional freedom (heartlessness is not right, but along those lines), she can let go of lovers easily and come out unscathed, whereas her lovers will be very scathed...

That's good, I'd agree with all of that. Nice reading of the "Dark Angel/break up" part.

Quote:

Now then - do you think it is about Stevie? I never got the sense that Tom wanted to date her, but I definitely think the lyrics could be an apt description of her. But I'm sure lots of women are like that. And as far as I can tell, he would definitely be an Insider in her life. It's also hard for me to imagine that anyone wouldn't want to date Stevie - but that is bias, and wasn't he happily married?

I wouldn't rule it out. At the same time I don't think it definitely is. Stevie fans are too quick to assume any song she's associated with that was written by a guy is about her. Case in point Life In The Fast Lane, which I don't think has anything to do with Stevie. I don't know what Tom has said about it, if anything. I've never heard that he wrote it for her as someone else noted, although that could mean he wrote it about her, or just as a song for her to sing. And even if it was about her, it could still just be a story. Like how Rick Vito commented in the lyric index on BuckinghamNicks.net that "Desiree" was sort of based on Stevie, but not really (http://www.buckinghamnicks.net/sn/guest/desiree.html). I don't know, the whole issue of whether Stevie & Tom had a thing has always been a curious one and a magnet for speculation. I'm not sure what my opinion is. I'm waiting for her to spill all in her autobiog (hee, fat chance.) I can see how it could fit though... do you think it's about her?

sparky · #20 06-25-2006, 04:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by michelle2677

I think it's def about stevie, but I also think it is about Liddy too.

If I ever hear this idea coming out of Tom Petty's mouth, I will instantly climb to the top of the nearest building and toss myself off of it. On the way down, I will puke. If the fall doesn't kill me, I will hope to have choked to death on my own vomit before I hit the ground.

AMber, where have you been ?

amber · #21 06-25-2006, 05:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EnchantedSLN

That's good, I'd agree with all of that. Nice reading of the "Dark Angel/break up" part.

I wouldn't rule it out. At the same time I don't think it definitely is. I don't know what Tom has said about it, if anything. I've never heard that he wrote it for her as someone else noted, although that could mean he wrote it about her, or just as a song for her to sing. And even if it was about her, it could still just be a story. Like how Rick Vito commented in the lyric index on BuckinghamNicks.net that "Desiree" was sort of based on Stevie, but not really (http://www.buckinghamnicks.net/sn/guest/desiree.html). I don't know, the whole issue of whether Stevie & Tom had a thing has always been a curious one and a magnet for speculation. I'm not sure what my opinion is, I'm waiting for her to spill all in her autobiog (hee, fat chance.) I can see how it could fit though... do you think it's about her?

Thanks. I recently saw an interview with Stevie (although it wasn't a recent interview) where she said something like "It was easy for me to break up. I always had to leave on a tour, and I could use that as an excuse." That kind of added weight in my mind to what I thought "don't show when you break up" meant, even if the song isn't about Stevie.

I can't decide. I guess if pinned down, I would have to say...nope, I don't know. Tom is so very circumspect, and no one, including Stevie or anyone else, has never even hinted they had anything other than a musical relationship. (right? You know more stuff). It sure does remind me of Stevie, though. Maybe it is based on her, but he wrote the "I'm the one you couldn't love" and all those parts not from his own perspective? you know, just to make the song more evocative and personal sounding? That doesn't really jibe, though.
But, if it was about her, who would the other guy be?

Were they both working with Iovine right then? That doesn't make sense. I was thinking maybe the other guy wasn't a specific guy, just a general guy - but the language seems more specific to me.
My feelings about Tom and his personality lead me to believe it isn't about her. Only just. I never even started thinking about it in connection to Stevie until recently.
Also, do you think Stevie wouldn't have dated Petty if he wanted her too? Doesn't it seem like she would have? It appears she was attached to his hip for a few years there.

I think he was married at the time?

David · #22 06-25-2006, 05:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sparky

If I ever hear this idea coming out of Tom Petty's mouth, I will instantly climb to the top of the nearest building and toss myself off of it. On the way down, I will puke. If the fall doesn't kill me, I will hope to have choked to death on my own vomit before I hit the ground.

What do we know for certain? We know from that old documentary on the Heartbreakers that Stevie asked Tom to write her a song for her first solo album & so he wrote "Insider." She decided for some reason not to sing the melody but to sing a harmony to Tom's lead vocal. Tom & Jimmy both loved the track with the harmony so much that Tom gave off a very forlorn vibe about giving the song away. Stevie noticed this vibe & told Tom, "You keep it. I can tell you love it. Just write me another song." Tom thought how cool it was for her to give it back to him.

Stevie said that she wanted to meet Tom Petty in 1979. I guess he went backstage at the Forum when the Mac played there in December. Stevie talked to Jimmy at that point about wanting him to produce her solo album if she ever started working on it. Stevie later said she didn't necessarily want Tom to write her a ballad for her album because she had plenty of ballads--she wanted him to write her more of a rocker, so she was glad to get "Stop Dragging My Heart Around." Stevie & Heartbreakers recorded some stuff during tour breaks in 1980 & again in 1981.

If Tom wrote "Insider" in 1980 or so, he & Stevie were still fairly new to each other. I don't think he knew Lindsey at all at that point. In fact, he admits to having had an anti-Fleetwood Mac bias at the time, agreeing with the newer acts & the punks that Fleetwood Mac was corporate & bland. The Heartbreakers were on the fringes in 1979 & 1980, despite having had a big hit with "Damn the Torpedoes," so it makes sense they wouldn't have thought much of Fleetwood Mac. In fact, I can see that anti-Mac bias spilling over into his tentative relationship with Stevie: she wanting a closer friendship & working relationship, & he & his Heartbreakers essentially wanting to distance themselves from this wacky, spacy woman.

I think the Heartbreakers grew to like Stevie a lot, but I bet it took awhile. And I doubt Tom Petty was writing songs about the Buckingham/Nicks relationship. I figure he probably didn't care at all about that.

amber · #23 06-25-2006, 05:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sparky

If I ever hear this idea coming out of Tom Petty's mouth, I will instantly climb to the top of the nearest building and toss myself off of it. On the way down, I will puke. If the fall doesn't kill me, I will hope to have choked to death on my own vomit before I hit the ground.

AMber, where have you been ?

I honestly never connected the lyrics with Stevie until very recently, as well.

Around.

I've been reading. I noticed I would post, and no one would answer me or say anything. Also, someone called me names. So I didn't feel like posting. It's really not as fun to post in a void, with no response. Although it is more fun than if the response is someone calling you a name.

Hey, you should go to Chico next weekend and hang out at the river with me! And the bars.

Bring your bike, 'kay? You know the old movie Robin Hood with Errol Flynn? That was filmed in bidwell park, the biggest park west of the mississippi in Chico. You can ride your bike way, way far. The park is two blocks from my friends house. So, see you there, right?

But seriously, do you have any fabulous fun planned for the holiday weekend? (The holiday being my birthday, of course!

)

BlackWidow · #24 06-25-2006, 05:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by amber

Thanks. I recently saw an interview with Stevie (although it wasn't a recent interview) where she said something like "It was easy for me to break up. I always had to leave on a tour, and I could use that as an excuse." That kind of added weight in my mind to what I thought "don't show when you break up" meant.

I can't decide. I guess if pinned down, I would have to say...nope, I don't know. Tom is so very circumspect, and no one, including Stevie or anyone else, has never even hinted they had anything other than a musical relationship. (right? You know more stuff). It sure does remind me of Stevie, though. Maybe it is based on her, but he wrote the "I'm the one you couldn't love" and all those parts not from his own perspective? you know, just to make the song more evocative and personal sounding? That doesn't really jibe, though.
But, if it was about her, who would the other guy be?

Were they both working with Iovine right then? That doesn't make sense. I was thinking maybe the other guy wasn't a specific guy, just a general guy - but the language seems more specific to me.
My feelings about Tom and his personality lead me to believe it isn't about her. Only just. I never even started thinking about it in connection to Stevie until recently.
Also, do you think Stevie wouldn't have dated Petty if he wanted her too? Doesn't it seem like she would have? It appears she was attached to his hip for a few years there.

I think he was married at the time?

Yes..he was/is married.
I think she just took the high road and kept it a professional friendship!
Plus Jimmy Iovine was so there too....she was with Jimmy and he was producing both of them..too complicated. If they had both been single...MOST DEFINITELY!!!

BlackWidow · #25 06-25-2006, 05:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David

What do we know for certain? We know from that old documentary on the Heartbreakers that Stevie asked Tom to write her a song for her first solo album & so he wrote "Insider." She decided for some reason not to sing the melody but to sing a harmony to Tom's lead vocal. Tom & Jimmy both loved the track with the harmony so much that Tom gave off a very forlorn vibe about giving the song away. Stevie noticed this vibe & told Tom, "You keep it. I can tell you love it. Just write me another song." Tom thought how cool it was for her to give it back to him.

Stevie said that she wanted to meet Tom Petty in 1979. I guess he went backstage at the Forum when the Mac played there in December. Stevie talked to Jimmy at that point about wanting him to produce her solo album if she ever started working on it. Stevie later said she didn't necessarily want Tom to write her a ballad for her album because she had plenty of ballads--she wanted him to write her more of a rocker, so she was glad to get "Stop Dragging My Heart Around." Stevie & Heartbreakers recorded some stuff during tour breaks in 1980 & again in 1981.

If Tom wrote "Insider" in 1980 or so, he & Stevie were still fairly new to each other. I don't think he knew Lindsey at all at that point. In fact, he admits to having had an anti-Fleetwood Mac bias at the time, agreeing with the newer acts & the punks that Fleetwood Mac was corporate & bland. The Heartbreakers were on the fringes in 1979 & 1980, despite having had a big hit with "Damn the Torpedoes," so it makes sense they wouldn't have thought much of Fleetwood Mac. In fact, I can see that anti-Mac bias spilling over into his tentative relationship with Stevie: she wanting a closer friendship & working relationship, & he & his Heartbreakers essentially wanting to distance themselves from this wacky, spacy woman.

I think the Heartbreakers grew to like Stevie a lot, but I bet it took awhile. And I doubt Tom Petty was writing songs about the Buckingham/Nicks relationship. I figure he probably didn't care at all about that.

DAVID:
You are spot on! 100%

amber · #26 06-25-2006, 05:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlackWidow

Yes..he was/is married.
I think she just took the high road and kept it a professional friendship!
Plus Jimmy Iovine was so there too....she was with Jimmy and he was producing both of them..too complicated. If they had both been single...MOST DEFINITELY!!!

Especially now that David clarified the time line. Whew, I'm back to my original opinion, with no conflicting doubts!

Thanks David!

BlackWidow · #27 06-25-2006, 05:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by amber

Especially now that David clarified the time line. Whew, I'm back to my original opinion, with no conflicting doubts!

Thanks David!

Amber,
Ignore the jerks!
Who gave you a hard time???

amber · #28 06-25-2006, 05:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlackWidow

Amber,
Ignore the jerks!
Who gave you a hard time???

Doesn't matter, he knows what he did. And, like someone said on another thread, or millions of times here, everyone is allowed their own opinion. After, I gave him my opinion on why he was wrong...

BlackWidow · #29 06-25-2006, 05:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by amber

Doesn't matter, he knows what he did. And, like someone said on another thread, or millions of times here, everyone is allowed their own opinion. After, I gave him my opinion on why he was wrong...

I got your back......