Tusk at 40: FM's defining record

[ViscountViktor]

Originally Posted by elle

Tusk and Sara were hits from Tusk.

Hold Me and Gypsy were hits from Mirage. (was Gypsy last Nicks FM hit?)

last FM huge hits from all 5 were Christine's Everywhere and Little Lies, besides Big Love.

Peacekeeper was all over the radio when i didn't even pay attention to FM or LB, so guessing that was a hit too.

I think they mean out of Lindsey's post 1979 songs.

Which is an interesting theory, that Lindsey put all the work into the girl's songs so that he could enjoy his own stuff all on his own, not letting anyone else in.

[elle]

Originally Posted by ViscountViktor

I think they mean out of Lindsey's post 1979 songs.

Which is an interesting theory, that Lindsey put all the work into the girl's songs so that he could enjoy his own stuff all on his own, not letting anyone else in.

no, the person stated post-Rumours. not post-Tusk.

and yes, Tusk was a hit, still is, and very much a band song. but then many other Tusk songs are not. it runs the gamut.

and then on Mirage, Lindsey worked hard on girls songs, making little masterpieces from Hold Me and Gypsy. and then on Tango Lindsey and Chris worked together, producing a relatively cohesive album.

in the last 15 or so years, Lindsey tried extremely hard to go for that band thing that you and others mention and crave. Stevie wouldn't have it. however he (and Mick) tried to entice her, she kept refusing. then Chris came back and jumped right in! that's why BuckVie sounds so much Fleetwood Mac-y. because those songs were meant to entice Stevie to work all together as a band again. recreate from the ground up, building songs together, that magic that so many here crave and that was broken after Rumours.

[HomerMcvie]

Originally Posted by elle

that's why BuckVie sounds so much Fleetwood Mac-y. because those songs were meant to entice Stevie to work all together as a band again. recreate from the ground up, building songs together, that magic that so many here crave and that was broken after Rumours.

Because it's ALL the musicians that are in Fleetwood Mac on it?(yeah, Goat ain't a musician - PLONK PLONK PLONK!)


We know what's broken about FM.


Mick's meal ticket.


Her High Goatness.

[SteveMacD]

Originally Posted by HomerMcvie

We know what's broken about FM.

Still is, too. Just ask Mick, Christine, Campbell, and Finn. I almost hope they do an album without her, again.

[ViscountViktor]

Originally Posted by elle

no, the person stated post-Rumours. not post-Tusk.

and yes, Tusk was a hit, still is, and very much a band song. but then many other Tusk songs are not. it runs the gamut.

and then on Mirage, Lindsey worked hard on girls songs, making little masterpieces from Hold Me and Gypsy. and then on Tango Lindsey and Chris worked together, producing a relatively cohesive album.

in the last 15 or so years, Lindsey tried extremely hard to go for that band thing that you and others mention and crave. Stevie wouldn't have it. however he (and Mick) tried to entice her, she kept refusing. then Chris came back and jumped right in! that's why BuckVie sounds so much Fleetwood Mac-y. because those songs were meant to entice Stevie to work all together as a band again. recreate from the ground up, building songs together, that magic that so many here crave and that was broken after Rumours.

I meant including Tusk.

Why are none of the girls on any of Lindsey's Mirage or Tusk songs? Tango obviously Stevie was barely around so it's understandable, but she was literally sitting in the studio for the entirety of Tusk and Mirage and was completely wasted.

I'm not even sure Chris is on Lindsey's songs on BuckVie, if she is it's not obvious and she's certainly not on all of them, like he is on hers.

[elle]

Originally Posted by ViscountViktor

I'm not even sure Chris is on Lindsey's songs on BuckVie, if she is it's not obvious and she's certainly not on all of them, like he is on hers.

Chris actually took and re-wrote some of originally Lindsey songs on Buckingham McVie, not just that she's on them. she is even lead singer on some of them. Think Red Sun. that was originally Lindsey's song.

Chris and Lindsey collaborate, add on to each other, work around each other, and enjoy that. look at how many co-writes are on Buckingham McVie. some of them started as Lindsey FM songs before Chris came back, while others started as Chris songs that she sent to him to collaborate.

and yes, toxic relationship and constant one-upmanship between Stevie and Lindsey has been a problem that started manifesting itself after Rumours and was definitely not helpful for band working as a unity. they both were probably picking their battles and that resulted in uneven although sometimes interesting products.

[ViscountViktor]

Originally Posted by elle

Chris actually took and re-wrote some of originally Lindsey songs on Buckingham McVie, not just that she's on them. she is even lead singer on some of them. Think Red Sun. that was originally Lindsey's song.

Chris and Lindsey collaborate, add on to each other, work around each other, and enjoy that. look at how many co-writes are on Buckingham McVie. some of them started as Lindsey FM songs before Chris came back, while others started as Chris songs that she sent to him to collaborate.

and yes, toxic relationship and constant one-upmanship between Stevie and Lindsey has been a problem that started manifesting itself after Rumours and was definitely not helpful for band working as a unity. they both were probably picking their battles and that resulted in uneven although sometimes interesting products.

Interesting, I didn't know Red Sun was originally Lindsey's. But still, Lindsey is singing on all 5 songs on BuckVie that Chris sings lead on, Chris definitely doesn't sing on all 5 of Lindsey's leads. Point is that after Rumours, Lindsey doesn't like sharing his tracks, which made a mockery of Fleetwood Mac being a 'band'.

I just think it's sad, what we missed out on had he allowed others in. But then strangely on Say You Will Stevie is all over his songs. Probably because he was forced to as part of her agreeing to do it.

[elle]

Originally Posted by ViscountViktor

Interesting, I didn't know Red Sun was originally Lindsey's. But still, Lindsey is singing on all 5 songs on BuckVie that Chris sings lead on, Chris definitely doesn't sing on all 5 of Lindsey's leads. Point is that after Rumours, Lindsey doesn't like sharing his tracks, which made a mockery of Fleetwood Mac being a 'band'.

I just think it's sad, what we missed out on had he allowed others in. But then strangely on Say You Will Stevie is all over his songs. Probably because he was forced to as part of her agreeing to do it.

guess you didn't have much interest in Buckingham McVie. it was all over their interviews at the time.

right, that's my point - your premise is flawed. there are tons of Lindsey tracks that are not "solo" after Rumours era, as you yourself point out. there are a good number that are solo too, sure. but it's not all or nothing, the way your theory is trying to present it.

so blaming it all on Lindsey doesn't work. he was trying really really hard to make a band album the last 15 years. there is someone else in that band who was putting a brake on it, repeatedly. we could have had several FM band albums since 2004. it's disingenuous to use the fact that Stevie repeatedly put a stop on those possible albums as an argument that it's all Lindsey's fault.

btw, I don't think Lindsey sings on Carnival Begins. and live, he definitely didn't sing on Too Far Gone (except maybe "too. far. gone" part, that the whole band sang on.

[UnwindedDreams]

Originally Posted by elle

I don't think Lindsey sings on Carnival Begins. and live, he definitely didn't sing on Too Far Gone (except maybe "too. far. gone" part, that the whole band sang on.

I swear I could hear Lindsey sining on the chorus of Carnival Begin. I hear that voice with the effect he uses. It's a very soft voice.

Where I try hardest to listen for him is one spot in "Caution" I don't think it's called the bridge section. It's the CAU-UUA-TION. I can't tell if it's Lindsey and Brandon or just Brandon!

[ViscountViktor]

Originally Posted by elle

guess you didn't have much interest in Buckingham McVie. it was all over their interviews at the time.

right, that's my point - your premise is flawed. there are tons of Lindsey tracks that are not "solo" after Rumours era, as you yourself point out. there are a good number that are solo too, sure. but it's not all or nothing, the way your theory is trying to present it.

so blaming it all on Lindsey doesn't work. he was trying really really hard to make a band album the last 15 years. there is someone else in that band who was putting a brake on it, repeatedly. we could have had several FM band albums since 2004. it's disingenuous to use the fact that Stevie repeatedly put a stop on those possible albums as an argument that it's all Lindsey's fault.

btw, I don't think Lindsey sings on Carnival Begins. and live, he definitely didn't sing on Too Far Gone (except maybe "too. far. gone" part, that the whole band sang on.

God you're unpleasant to converse with on here. Let's end this conversation.

[tabruns]

Originally Posted by ViscountViktor

Point is that after Rumours, Lindsey doesn't like sharing his tracks, which made a mockery of Fleetwood Mac being a 'band'.

I just think it's sad, what we missed out on had he allowed others in. But then strangely on Say You Will Stevie is all over his songs. Probably because he was forced to as part of her agreeing to do it.

I think FM would have benefited from Lindsey taking a more band-approach too. But regarding SAY YOU WILL, I think Buckingham and Nicks sharing vocals on most of the songs was because they were trying to avoid a "two solo albums put together" feel; and still some critics view SAY YOU WILL that way anyway.

[tabruns]

Just read GET TUSKED.

Interesting to get an inside view of how that album went down. Buckingham going back and forth between wanting to do his own thing and then back to a more band approach and back again was interesting.

Also Caillat saying at one point they had at least four tracked songs from each of the songwriters and they could have stopped there with a single album and more balanced input from each. I've always wondered what songs Mac would have gone with, had they decided TUSK was going to be a single album.

Apparently part of the reason Nicks has fewer songs on the album is because Buckingham wasn't interested in working on some of them ("The Dealer" presented as an example).

Other bits:

McVie thinking "Honey Hi" could be a hit. Also thinking "Storms" sounded "dodgy" when she first heard it.

"What Makes You Think You're The One" was a lyrical and musical slam on Nicks, down to Buckingham deliberately playing simplistic piano and doing a vibrato with his voice.

Caillat apparently thinking that several of Buckingham's songs would have sounded amazing if Buckingham hadn't insisted on "do everything 180 from where it should be".

J. McVie saying "Never Forget" "sounded awful" when they first worked on it.

Caillat's implied criticism that as the album grew into a double it skewed towards Buckingham, noting that none of Buckingham's songs were rejected, 1 of McVie's was (wonder what song that is?), and multiple Nicks songs were.

Combination of "TUSK actually sold well" and "here's why TUSK didn't sell well" presented: TUSK has sold 6.6 million and if you add in singles and "other formats" (?) sales are 9.2 million. Reasons/excuses why it didn't - Pushed out by Warners as a way too expensive double album; album played over the radio in its entirety before release; left-turn musically too much for some fans.

Overall I was surprised that the band comes off as more productive than has generally been understood, at least when they'd get down to tracking a particular song. I also thought there'd have been more in-studio viciousness presented than there was - but maybe Caillat just didn't dwell on that.