Still think Stevie is going to do the FM album?

[BlueDenimLamp]

Originally Posted by michelej1

And at that point they weren't signed up for all the tour dates they have on schedule now. It could have been a lot shorter. If they were all on board to record an album, then they probably wouldn't have added new tour dates. The extended tour isn't keeping the album from happening. The extended tour is what they're doing because they can't do an album.

Of course, they can do one. Since they've made money off of the tour, why they don't pocket it and record an album without Stevie which won't make money but might fulfill them creatively, I will never know. And no it doesn't have to be their swan song. They can record without her now and record with her in 3 years, if she is willing. But the four of them just sit there.

Michele

All Mick has to do is have a contract drawn up and hand it to Stevie...Either you sign the contract agreeing to record with FM or "You are out of the band"
it's that simple...

[MikeVielhaber]

Originally Posted by BlueDenimLamp

All Mick has to do is have a contract drawn up and hand it to Stevie...Either you sign the contract agreeing to record with FM or "You are out of the band"
it's that simple...

It's not that simple. They are, after all, not just band mates, but friends for 40 years now who seem to get along fairly well at this point. That probably means something to them, especially Mick, and giving her an ultimatum would jeopardize that. They probably really want Stevie on the album and kicking her out would be compromising the whole point of making the album which is to make an album with the whole Rumours lineup rather than just putting out a new album regardless of who is on board. I'd love to hear an album even if Stevie is not on it, but it's definitely not simple.

[BlueDenimLamp]

Originally Posted by MikeVielhaber

It's not that simple. They are, after all, not just band mates, but friends for 40 years now who seem to get along fairly well at this point. That probably means something to them, especially Mick, and giving her an ultimatum would jeopardize that. They probably really want Stevie on the album and kicking her out would be compromising the whole point of making the album which is to make an album with the whole Rumours lineup rather than just putting out a new album regardless of who is on board. I'd love to hear an album even if Stevie is not on it, but it's definitely not simple.

But yet the "You're in or you're out" applies to others but not Stevie?

[jbrownsjr]

Originally Posted by BlueDenimLamp

But yet the "You're in or you're out" applies to others but not Stevie?

You know damn well he doesn't want to give up on the 5 of them at this moment. It took a miracle to make it happen in 2014.

[MikeVielhaber]

Originally Posted by BlueDenimLamp

But yet the "You're in or you're out" applies to others but not Stevie?

It's not about Stevie vs. everyone else. It's about timing. This is 2015 and they're all in their late 60s or early 70s. It's not the same as it was in the past. I'm sure in the past the band was all that mattered and either be on board or get out. It's probably not the case anymore and the idea of getting an album with all 5 is probably a bigger deal now because of everyone's advanced age. I don't know if this is the case, but it seems plausible.

[SteveMacD]

Originally Posted by bombaysaffires

I think she still thinks she can jump back and forth between the solo career and FM one more time, and I'm not sure that's so true. I think at this point in time there are too many variables outside of their control

And, even with the variables within their control, Stevie might not be able to jump back and forth so easily this time. I think she overplayed her power within the band from 2009 until Christine's return. Now they could put out a band album without her.

Originally Posted by BlueDenimLamp

In terms of Stevie "getting her priorities straight" she's made FM her #1 priority for three years in a row...

For which she got paid handsomely.

Maybe they could do something as one of Mick's "Zoo" incarnations.

Why do that when it's Fleetwood Mac?

Perhaps Christine should have "got her priorities straight" a few years sooner instead of waiting until the last minute to pull her head out of the sand...

That's a straw man. Stevie chooses to be a member of Fleetwood Mac. It's her job. Christine didn't want to be in Fleetwood Mac and she retired. She didn't drag the band through a will-she-or-won't-she. She told them what her plans were, and she stuck with it, at least until she read Ken's book. So, she came back. Which Stevie should be thrilled with, considering she offered Christine $5 million to come back.

Originally Posted by BlueDenimLamp

And yes in fact Stevie is being blamed for FM's lack of output when in fact FM is the one responsible for holding themselves back and not Stevie...If Stevie has in fact told them "no new music" and she did in fact tell them this after the 2009 tour then FM has no one to blame but themselves for not parting ways with Stevie and moving on...

What a bunch of crap. Fleetwood Mac is a band that has always had at least two lead vocalists. Doing an album without a second lead vocalist at that point would be a Lindsey Buckingham solo album. Lindsey ended up doing a solo album instead, and many of those songs would have been on a Fleetwood Mac album had Stevie not blown the band off.

Originally Posted by michelej1

Of course, they can do one. Since they've made money off of the tour, why they don't pocket it and record an album without Stevie which won't make money but might fulfill them creatively, I will never know. And no it doesn't have to be their swan song. They can record without her now and record with her in 3 years, if she is willing. But the four of them just sit there.

I still don't get how you constantly underestimate the band. You basically said you couldn't possibly see how there would be any demand for another Fleetwood Mac tour so shortly after their 2013 tour because Christine wasn't the household name Stevie is, yet they're selling out arenas while being one of the highest priced concert tickets, much higher than the 2013 tour. Stevie is the household name, but she's not bigger than the band. They'll do about as well as a quartet as Stevie will as a solo artist. Neither will make a lot of money on any project. Very, very few artists are making a lot of money in music these days, especially older ones.

[michelej1]

Originally Posted by SteveMacD

I still don't get how you constantly underestimate the band. You basically said you couldn't possibly see how there would be any demand for another Fleetwood Mac tour so shortly after their 2013 tour because Christine wasn't the household name Stevie is, yet they're selling out arenas while being one of the highest priced concert tickets, much higher than the 2013 tour. Stevie is the household name, but she's not bigger than the band. They'll do about as well as a quartet as Stevie will as a solo artist. Neither will make a lot of money on any project. Very, very few artists are making a lot of money in music these days, especially older ones.

I never said that there wouldn't be a demand for the band because Christine wasn't the household name that Stevie was. I said that the tour would not be a successful one because I felt that they saturated the market -- not completely. I thought the 2013 tour was a short one and that they could come through and do a lot of smaller venues in 2014, but I didn't think they could sell out arenas again the way they are doing now. But thinking that had nothing to do with Stevie. It had to do with what happened during the second leg of the SYW tour, when no one wanted to see them again, having just seen them in 2003.

I never said Stevie was bigger than the band. In fact, just this week I posted that Stevie alone couldn't outsell FM without her. I think that's true of both tours and albums. FM can be as profitable as Stevie is solo. It just can't be as profitable without her as it can be with her. But even that is only true when it comes to touring. My belief is that albums don't sell any more these days anyway, so there's no reason that FM should think of sales at all when it comes to making this album.

I don't think any album they sell will make money, but that's not because Stevie won't be with them. I don't think the album will make money anyway. That's why they should stop holding out for Stevie on the album. They have nothing to lose with her gone. They won't sell more records with her than they will without her.

They also won't lose publicity because her opting out of this album will generate publicity of its own kind, really. So, they'll still get as much press as a foursome.

And if they feel they don't want to take their last recording bow without Stevie, it doesn't have to be their last bow. They can take their last bow 3 years from now and do an album without her today.

Michele

[SteveMacD]

Originally Posted by BlueDenimLamp

But yet the "You're in or you're out" applies to others but not Stevie?

Originally Posted by MikeVielhaber

It's not about Stevie vs. everyone else. It's about timing.

I agree that now is not the time to have that conversation, but only because they have commitments until July. You're right that it's not Stevie vs. everyone else. It's about Stevie choosing to be in the band or choosing not to be in the band. Maybe Stevie is weighing her options right now, but make no mistake the band is weighing their options, too.

This is 2015 and they're all in their late 60s or early 70s.

All the more reason to have that conversation. There might not be another five years to wait around for Stevie.

It's not the same as it was in the past. I'm sure in the past the band was all that mattered and either be on board or get out. It's probably not the case anymore and the idea of getting an album with all 5 is probably a bigger deal now because of everyone's advanced age.

Christine came out of retirement for a reason, and it wasn't to do another Greatest Hits tour. She specifically wanted to make music with Fleetwood Mac, and the very first thing she did when they agreed to let her back in the band was go into the studio to work with Lindsey, Mick, and John. Yes, the top priority is to get an album with all five, but again, there may not be five years to wait for Stevie.

[Jondalar]

Originally Posted by SteveMacD

I agree that now is not the time to have that conversation, but only because they have commitments until July. You're right that it's not Stevie vs. everyone else. It's about Stevie choosing to be in the band or choosing not to be in the band. Maybe Stevie is weighing her options right now, but make no mistake the band is weighing their options, too.


All the more reason to have that conversation. There might not be another five years to wait around for Stevie.


Christine came out of retirement for a reason, and it wasn't to do another Greatest Hits tour. She specifically wanted to make music with Fleetwood Mac, and the very first thing she did when they agreed to let her back in the band was go into the studio to work with Lindsey, Mick, and John. Yes, the top priority is to get an album with all five, but again, there may not be five years to wait for Stevie.

It's about timing. And maybe Stevie should leave Fleetwood Mac. Her solo albums keep getting better and better. Fleetwood Mac is not going to sale many albums with or without her. Hardly anyone is these days. Plus, Stevie does not enjoy the process.

[Nick]

As much as I love Stevie, a FM reunion studio album will sell much more than anything she puts out solo. Even the 2003 FM album (SYW) without Christine sold more than her solo albums from 1994 (SA) going forward. With Christine on board this next album could be a monster.

[SteveMacD]

Originally Posted by michelej1

I never said that there wouldn't be a demand for the band because Christine wasn't the household name that Stevie was. I said that the tour would not be a successful one because I felt that they saturated the market -- not completely...But thinking that had nothing to do with Stevie. It had to do with what happened during the second leg of the SYW tour, when no one wanted to see them again, having just seen them in 2003.

They wouldn't have just seen them in 2013. They saw a very similar band, but not same one. It suggested that the crowds wouldn't be sophisticated enough to know the difference or care if Christine was in the band or if she wasn't. Clearly, that wasn't the case.

I never said Stevie was bigger than the band. In fact, just this week I posted that Stevie alone couldn't outsell FM without her. I think that's true of both tours and albums. FM can be as profitable as Stevie is solo. It just can't be as profitable without her as it can be with her. But even that is only true when it comes to touring.

You also said that they could go back to being an opening act or play state fairs as part of a package tour without Stevie, because that's what happened in 1994-95 (when there were NO "Rumours" era vocalists touring with the band).

My belief is that albums don't sell any more these days anyway, so there's no reason that FM should think of sales at all when it comes to making this album.

But, you didn't make that distinction when you said "record an album without Stevie which won't make money but might fulfill them creatively," which sounds like you're saying that an album without Stevie won't make money because she's not on it.

[Jondalar]

Originally Posted by BlueDenimLamp

But yet the "You're in or you're out" applies to others but not Stevie?

How in the hell can Lindsey or Christine tell Stevie you are either in or out? Please.... This isn't Project Runway.

[BlueDenimLamp]

Originally Posted by Jondalar

How in the hell can Lindsey or Christine tell Stevie you are either in or out? Please.... This isn't Project Runway.

Mick as co-owner of the band could say that.

[jbrownsjr]

Any album with Christine is going to be better. She and Lindsey have had amazing chemistry since they've met. I want to hear the growth of what they've talked about in the interviews, last year. I haven't seen Buck that happy about making music with FMac in a long time.

[michelej1]

Originally Posted by SteveMacD

But, you didn't make that distinction when you said "record an album without Stevie which won't make money but might fulfill them creatively," which sounds like you're saying that an album without Stevie won't make money because she's not on it.

No, it doesn't sound like I'm saying that. That's how you're interpreting it, but you're doing so without foundation. I must have posted 100 posts since January 2014 about Stevie not being on the next FM album and I've never suggested the album would sell less because Stevie is not involved. I've always said the album is not going to sell anyway, so why do they care if Stevie is involved or not, if she doesn't want to be on it?

Michele