Thor...

[mylittledemon]

Just saw this at the Embassy theatre... very small crowd. anyway... it was a pretty good flick... for those of you that are digging what Marvel is doing these days (Iron Man, etc)... Chris Hemsworth was pretty good as the title character... arrogant, brash but likeable all the same. He's also massively roided up... huge.

The guy who plays Loki is also a revelation... never seen him before in anything else and his name escapes me. Anthony Hopkins plays Odin as a tired and world-weary type character but also the "all-wise" character we expect.

I didn't see it in 3D so I can't comment on that but overall worth seeing. 7.5/10

[darklinensuit]

I collected Marvel comics until I was 13 & loved them enough to hate all the X-Men movies. I'm studying adaptation in school so I'll probably see this one.

- Jake

[mylittledemon]

I liked X-Men 2 the most of the 3... I don't particularly care for the first or 3rd one. The Wolverine solo film was atrocious.

Iron Man was probably the only thing Marvel has really gotten bang-on.

[Meowi]

Only someone so awesome like Brandon with his Marvel love could create this thread.

[mylittledemon]

hey I love DC, too! I meant to put this in the "movies I've seen thread" but for some reason I didnt

[Dodfather]

Haven't seen Thor yet but will check it out soon. I know it's a looong time away but I'm still more excited for the new Superman film! Zod is back!

I still don't see why they had to reboot it again when there was nothing wrong with Superman Returns but oh wel...

[mylittledemon]

I disliked just about everything about Superman Returns.

[Dodfather]

Originally Posted by mylittledemon

I disliked just about everything about Superman Returns.

Grrrrr! I loved it. It's a total fanboy's film though, full of brilliant little references to the original Donner movie. The score is incredible too - original yet full of the little John Williams motifs.

The film seemed to get a bad rap because there wasn't enough action but it had to set the scene first, which is common in most first Superhero movies. Singer did say that the second film would be more action oriented - he'd go all "Wrath of Khan" on it, I just wish he'd been able to make that film...

By the way Brandon - thoughts on the Donner cut of Superman 2?

[mylittledemon]

Oh man now you got me on a Superman rant... I think part of the reason that Superman Returns didn't work was because of the story. That's first part of making an interesting film, and it was the part that I think that Bryan Singer failed on. The last time we saw Superman on the big screen before that was 1987. So aside from having Christopher Reeve cemented in our minds as Superman (and rightly so, he is Superman)... the new "Superman Returns" incarnation lept from nowhere. The story supposedly takes place after the events of Donner's Superman 2 and I don't think the movie going public at large was aware of this.

Lois Lane was downright unlikeable in the film. Sure she's better looking than Margot Kidder, but she didn't have that spunk, that pizazz that Kidder had. She certainly had zero chemistry with Brandon Routh.

I can go on and on about how Routh was wrong for the part... and how the Superman costume was lame and that it didn't need to changed... about how Kevin Spacey's plot to sell newly created land from the crystals from the Fortress of Solitude (how would have right to sell this "land"?) was thinner than his hair... Not to mention the fact that Superman and Lois had shagged (in Superman 2) and now Lois was toting around their love child...

Overall I think the movie doesn't feel like Superman because it made Superman unlikeable... he wasn't larger than life... and he wasn't fighting for truth, justice, and the American way... All amidst a gloomy backdrop of a film. There was a great deal of magic missing from Routh's performance (Reeve had it in spades)... although he nearly got Clark Kent right. Well... maybe I'm being too harsh on the film. The only thing I really remember about the movie is the airplane rescue scene. Plus, the guy sitting next to me in the theatre was farting repeatedly.

Superman II the Donner cut? Brilliant. 8/10 for me. The only thing that didn't work is a particular scene between Lois and Clark and it's so out of sync because the footage used was test footage... so you have Clark with a different pair of glasses, different hair... and it's a bit jarring. The rest is nigh-perfection.

[Dodfather]

Originally Posted by mylittledemon

Oh man now you got me on a Superman rant... I think part of the reason that Superman Returns didn't work was because of the story. That's first part of making an interesting film, and it was the part that I think that Bryan Singer failed on. The last time we saw Superman on the big screen before that was 1987. So aside from having Christopher Reeve cemented in our minds as Superman (and rightly so, he is Superman)... the new "Superman Returns" incarnation lept from nowhere. The story supposedly takes place after the events of Donner's Superman 2 and I don't think the movie going public at large was aware of this.

Lois Lane was downright unlikeable in the film. Sure she's better looking than Margot Kidder, but she didn't have that spunk, that pizazz that Kidder had. She certainly had zero chemistry with Brandon Routh.

I can go on and on about how Routh was wrong for the part... and how the Superman costume was lame and that it didn't need to changed... about how Kevin Spacey's plot to sell newly created land from the crystals from the Fortress of Solitude (how would have right to sell this "land"?) was thinner than his hair... Not to mention the fact that Superman and Lois had shagged (in Superman 2) and now Lois was toting around their love child...

Overall I think the movie doesn't feel like Superman because it made Superman unlikeable... he wasn't larger than life... and he wasn't fighting for truth, justice, and the American way... All amidst a gloomy backdrop of a film. There was a great deal of magic missing from Routh's performance (Reeve had it in spades)... although he nearly got Clark Kent right. Well... maybe I'm being too harsh on the film. The only thing I really remember about the movie is the airplane rescue scene. Plus, the guy sitting next to me in the theatre was farting repeatedly.

Superman II the Donner cut? Brilliant. 8/10 for me. The only thing that didn't work is a particular scene between Lois and Clark and it's so out of sync because the footage used was test footage... so you have Clark with a different pair of glasses, different hair... and it's a bit jarring. The rest is nigh-perfection.

Ok - here we go...

I do think that Bryan Singer perhaps trusted the movie going public a bit much with then the story took place. He did say over and over and over again that the story would take place after S2 but if people weren't listening what could he do? I actually liked the story - it was a nice return to Lex Luthor's obsession with land ("it's the only thing people aren't making any more") and yet here he was, making more!

Ok - the love child was a bit jarring but I think Singer really planned to develop this in what he was certain would be a follow-up film. It was have humanized Superman even more to have an achilees heel other than Kryptonite. Of course it's this humanization of Superman that people have an issue with - he should be spectacular - but it could work with just this one issue. I have to say I kept thinking of Mallrats whenever the child would appear though...

I take your point about the film being bleak. It is, but there are some very nice lighter moments, especially between Clark, Lois and Jimmy. I think a big part of the gloom had to do with Singer's choice to have had Superman leave for 5 years. He had to return to a world where, as Lois wrote, he wasn't needed any more. I thought that was interesting way to go.

I know what you mean about the gloomy appearance/backdrop of the film though - although I think it works with this particular plot. One of my favourite things about Donner's S1 is that you move from pastoral landscapes in Smallville to Metropolis and - boom!- you're unmistakably in a comic book. I think this is what Singer would/could have done in his next installment. All the gloomy exposition had been set up, Superman had shown he was needed again, and so we could have had a bright, action filled comic book movie.

Routh's Clark Kent was better than his Superman, you're right there.

Kate Bosworth did the best she could with Lois, who I think is generally an unlikeable, quite shrill character. Margot Kidder was spot on and made her more human in her relationship to Clark whereas Kate Bosworth, as with most other "Lois's", was too harsh and dismissive towards him and just a bit irritating. I'm ok with it though because it's a very difficult role to get right due to what I see as a fundamental character flaw.

Spacey's performance was brilliant - by far the best in the film. I think he got the cartoonish over the top villainy right (Krrryptonite!") yet was really menacing at times too.

I'll say again - John Ottman did an incredible job with the score.

Thone reallllly jarring image for me was just after Superman lifted the Kryptonite land mass into the sky and fell backwards, making the shape of the cross with his body as he "sacrificed" himself to save Earth. Superman has always been set up as a cross between the American Dream/Ultimate immigrant and almost Christ-like figure - a being who descends from above to protect us yet be hunted only to rise again (especially at the end of Returns) - but it didn't need to be so obvious in this film.

One of the reasons I'm excited for the new movie is that they're bringing back Zod. Yes!! Him and Lex Luthor are the only Superman villains I really like. Not keen on Brainiac or Bizarro. They work in Smallville because they can be involved in long, complex story arcs but I don't know how they could translate to the big-screen. They'd be better than Nuclear Man though! More on that in a bt...

Phew.

I fricking love the Donner cut of S2, esopecially at the start when Lois has her hunch as to who Clark is in the Daily Planet office and is doodling on the paper. It is much closer in tone to the first film (obviously I suppose) and just starts things off at a cracking pace. Yeah, the scene in the hotel does jar because it's early footage but I suppose that can't be helped.

You mentioned the last time you had seen uperman on the big-screen was in 1987. God, I hate Superman IV: The Death of the Franchise. It is truly, truly appalling. F*^"*g awful!! They filmed parts of it in Milton Keynes for God's skae - how could an industrial town in England look at all like Manhattan?! Have you seen the extra footage on the Superman 13-disc box set? Oh man. Lex Luthor cuddling a hand held hoover that holds the remains of the first Nuclear Man saying "My baby..." Oh my God. Trivia: Mark Pillow (Nuclear Man) was last heard of working as a bouncer in Leeds.

That was actually one of the first movies I saw at the cinema, along with Masters Of The Universe (whichever came out first). I have a strange fondness for that film! Yeah it sucks but what the Hell, I like it. Both films made by Golan Globus and are very much linked. The reason S4 got such low production values was that money was siphoned off to make Masters!

Ok - next - what about Supergirl (1984)? Haha! Again, I know it sucks but I have a lot of love for it!

[mylittledemon]

haha, I was hoping you'd come back with a big, lengthy response.

You know, I see all your points and can see it from that point of view... but then there's that side of me that will always go... but, but... see here! This wasn't done right, or that... etc

I did like the idea of trying to make it "Superman 3"... where the story was going but it was just, sadly, the follow through that didn't work. There is something magical (I hate to use that word) about Superman and Superman II. I don't know if it's just Reeve , or Reeve + Donner... but they really just nailed it. There was something epic about it as well... starting off on Krypton. Anyway... there's no real sense in comparing to two... I'm glad to hear it's rebooting and hope they don't screw it up this time.

Also... DON'T change the costume! There was no need for the Superman Returns version of the suit... It's not like Batman where the suit needs to change. Keep it simple, there's a reason why Superman already works... it ain't broken... so don't fix him.

PS... I loved Peter O'Toole in Supergirl... that's about it

PPS... I do have a fondess for Masters of the Universe. Frank Langella was amazing as Skeletor.

[Dodfather]

Originally Posted by mylittledemon

haha, I was hoping you'd come back with a big, lengthy response.

You know, I see all your points and can see it from that point of view... but then there's that side of me that will always go... but, but... see here! This wasn't done right, or that... etc

I did like the idea of trying to make it "Superman 3"... where the story was going but it was just, sadly, the follow through that didn't work. There is something magical (I hate to use that word) about Superman and Superman II. I don't know if it's just Reeve , or Reeve + Donner... but they really just nailed it. There was something epic about it as well... starting off on Krypton. Anyway... there's no real sense in comparing to two... I'm glad to hear it's rebooting and hope they don't screw it up this time.

Also... DON'T change the costume! There was no need for the Superman Returns version of the suit... It's not like Batman where the suit needs to change. Keep it simple, there's a reason why Superman already works... it ain't broken... so don't fix him.

PS... I loved Peter O'Toole in Supergirl... that's about it

PPS... I do have a fondess for Masters of the Universe. Frank Langella was amazing as Skeletor.

Yes!! Someone else who likes Masters Of The Universe!! Yeah - it really is Frank Langella's film.

As for Supergirl, I like that it is completely and utterly ridiculous. Faye Dunaway's performance is also one of the campest things I've ever seen. Very, very funny. I still crack up at the "You were hit on the head by a coconut" line... The film actually has a genuinely great opening theme. Seriously. Go and listen to it again and you may agree that Jerry Goldsmith did a brilliant job. The melody is very traditionally Superhero-like and works very well. I think I might have to put the dvd on now actually....

Oh man, I knew you'd have an issue with Superman's costume in Returns! His costume has always changed and developed - sometimes it's a whole different colur. Look at him in the comics. Loads of people thought the costume was too dark, the S was too small etc. I actually wasn't too bothered about it.

[mylittledemon]

Well I know his costume has changed, and when it has it hasn't been too drastic but it always goes back to the classic look. I know when Superman died in '92 they came out with all these Supermen and they each had different suits. Then he went electro in like '97 and that was ridiculous. But you know what i mean... Chris Reeve's suit was just classic and thats how people visually identify with Superman. My point is, don't change it just for sake of "updating" or for the sake of changing it. Anyway... enough of my Superman ranting.

I do remember liking Supergirl as a boy... I dont think I've seen it in 15 or some odd years so I don't know what I'd think about it now.

Yes, Frank Langella was something special in He-Man. I still remember seeing that film at the theatre with my mom and brother... well over 20 years ago :O

[Dodfather]

Originally Posted by mylittledemon

Well I know his costume has changed, and when it has it hasn't been too drastic but it always goes back to the classic look. I know when Superman died in '92 they came out with all these Supermen and they each had different suits. Then he went electro in like '97 and that was ridiculous. But you know what i mean... Chris Reeve's suit was just classic and thats how people visually identify with Superman. My point is, don't change it just for sake of "updating" or for the sake of changing it. Anyway... enough of my Superman ranting.

I do remember liking Supergirl as a boy... I dont think I've seen it in 15 or some odd years so I don't know what I'd think about it now.

Yes, Frank Langella was something special in He-Man. I still remember seeing that film at the theatre with my mom and brother... well over 20 years ago :O

I know what you mean about visually identifying Superman in the classic costume and I think if the change had been much more drastic I'd have been really mad but as it was I was ok with it. Yes, the electro Superman was utterly crap.

Oh Supergirl is terrible. There's no denying it but I still have a fondness for it and seriously, the theme tune is very good. Check it out. Unlike S4 though, it's a charming film - I think so anyway!

My mate says that Masters Of The Universe is inappropriate for children, that it's more of an S&M flick with a chain clad Dolph Lundgren getting whipped!

[mylittledemon]

Inappropriate for children? I think not... (to quote Langella in the film)

The only thing I can find inappropriate about it is that it might possibly scare children what with the creatures and what not (Beast Man, etc)... I do remember being disturbed by some of that (I think I was 8 or 9 when I saw it)... but hey, nothing wrong with Dolph's glistening man pecs