National Evangelical Leader Resigns Amid Gay Hooker Allegations

[SuzeQuze]

Originally Posted by macfanken

I wonder if Haggard has met James Guckert/Jeff Gannon, the White House hooker?

Jeff is with BlackWidow who is working on getting him to talk.

[Rickypt]

I never thought I'd find myself agreeing with Bay Buchanan on anything, but nodded my head when she said the last thing supporters of the gay marriage issue in Colorado needed a few days before the election was a meth-selling escort as their poster child.

[Nixxxed]

Originally Posted by Rickypt

I never thought I'd find myself agreeing with Bay Buchanan on anything, but nodded my head when she said the last thing supporters of the gay marriage issue in Colorado needed a few days before the election was a meth-selling escort as their poster child.

Weird. I actually agreed with her when she had her mini-breakdown on CNN over the Foley scandal a month back. Of course, she said the same thing about Republican supporters then (with Foley being the poster child)...

Another little tidbit - the TV station Jones went to decided on the timing. He went to them almost 3 months ago - they decided to wait until yesterday (late Wednesday?) to air the report.

[irishgrl]

I wonder what the advantages/disadvantages would be for this timing....

[Rickypt]

Originally Posted by irishgrl

I wonder what the advantages/disadvantages would be for this timing....

Biggest advantage: Releasing a story a few days before an election will ensure massive coverage and good ratings for the TV station

Biggest political advantage: Those who oppose gay marriage make sure that the last thing people from Colorado have on their mind when going into the voting booth is gay people are drug-using, sex fiends.

Possible political advantage, but doubtful: People will consider this to be one more strike against a corrupt and morally bankrupt right-wing and will vote Democrat. Very doubtful, though.

[foxyluva]

Only in America...

[The Tower]

Originally Posted by Rickypt

I never thought I'd find myself agreeing with Bay Buchanan on anything, but nodded my head when she said the last thing supporters of the gay marriage issue in Colorado needed a few days before the election was a meth-selling escort as their poster child.

See, I have a problem with that. I don't put a divide between "marriage = good" "prostitution = bad" "drug use = bad". That kind of judgement that Bay Buchanan is peddling is the whole root of the problem. Gay marriage is somehow more acceptable with two doctors who have adopted kids? Wheras if it were a Bear and a Cub who are leather oficiandos who fist each other shouldn't be allowed to marry? I don't see the difference.

The whole issue here is that Haggarty is an unbelievable hypocrite. Everything else is moral semantics.

[Rickypt]

Originally Posted by The Tower

See, I have a problem with that. I don't put a divide between "marriage = good" "prostitution = bad" "drug use = bad". That kind of judgement that Bay Buchanan is peddling is the whole root of the problem. Gay marriage is somehow more acceptable with two doctors who have adopted kids? Wheras if it were a Bear and a Cub who are leather oficiandos who fist each other shouldn't be allowed to marry? I don't see the difference.

The whole issue here is that Haggarty is an unbelievable hypocrite. Everything else is moral semantics.

I'm only talking from the narrow lens of political strategy around the gay marriage ballot issue. It is reality that none of this helps the pro-gay marriage movement in the next few days before the election. I actually share your opinion on the whole marriage/morality issue though.l

I completely agree with you about what the "whole issue" is...unfortunately, almost no one in the media seems to want to talk about the whole issue (which is why I've made a zillion posts on this thread expressing my frustration).

[Nixxxed]

So Haggard was forced out today.

But I found an interesting tidbit on the Huffington Post, a comment from another evangelical pastor on how other pastors (and their wives) can avoid the same situation Haggard fell into:

Most pastors I know do not have satisfying, free, sexual conversations and liberties with their wives. At the risk of being even more widely despised than I currently am, I will lean over the plate and take one for the team on this. It is not uncommon to meet pastors’ wives who really let themselves go; they sometimes feel that because their husband is a pastor, he is therefore trapped into fidelity, which gives them cause for laziness. A wife who lets herself go and is not sexually available to her husband in the ways that the Song of Songs is so frank about is not responsible for her husband’s sin, but she may not be helping him either.

His other recommendations are equally insane: http://theresurgence.com/md_blog_200...l_leader_quits

[irishgrl]

Originally Posted by Nixxxed

So Haggard was forced out today.

But I found an interesting tidbit on the Huffington Post, a comment from another evangelical pastor on how other pastors (and their wives) can avoid the same situation Haggard fell into:



His other recommendations are equally insane: http://theresurgence.com/md_blog_200...l_leader_quits

aside from the fact that he's managed to blame the woman, I really have a problem with that whole "wives must be submissive" part.

your link takes us to an interview with Haggard. and that bit you quoted is Haggard as well........

[PsychCat]

Personally, I have no patience for guys like this.
I also never looked at it as a "political thing".... sounds more like a morals issue, ie. these types are what give "religion" a bad name.
(beware of flying stones....)

I repeat... it's no wonder there is so much hate in the world.... we can't even get along in our own space.

[estranged4life]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/15536263/

Evangelical leader contrite after dismissal from Colorado megachurch

COLORADO SPRINGS, Colo. - Less than 24 hours after he was fired from the pulpit of the evangelical megachurch he founded, the Rev Ted Haggard confessed to his followers Sunday that he was guilty of sexual immorality.

In a letter that was read to the congregation of the New Life Church by another clergyman, Haggard apologized for his acts and requested forgiveness.

"I am so sorry for the circumstances that have caused shame and embarrassment for all of you," he said, adding that he had confused the situation by giving inconsistent remarks to reporters denying the scandal.

"The fact is I am guilty of sexual immorality. And I take responsibility for the entire problem. I am a deceiver and a liar. There's a part of my life that is so repulsive and dark that I have been warring against it for all of my adult life," he said.

Haggard resigned last week as president of the National Association of Evangelicals, where he held sway in Washington and condemned homosexuality, after a man claimed to have had drug-fueled homosexual trysts with him. Haggard also placed himself on administrative leave from the New Life Church, which has 14,000 members, but its independent Overseer Board fired him on Saturday.

In his letter, Haggard said "the accusations made against me are not all true but enough of them are that I was appropriately removed from his church leadership position."

He did not give detail details on which accusations were true.

Board finds fault
Haggard was dismissed Saturday as New Life's leader after a board determined the influential evangelist had committed "sexually immoral conduct," the church said.

Haggard had resigned two days earlier as president of the National Association of Evangelicals, where he held sway in Washington and condemned homosexuality, after a Denver man named Mike Jones claimed to have had drug-fueled trysts with him.

He also had placed himself on administrative leave from the New Life Church, but its Overseer Board took the stronger action Saturday.

"Our investigation and Pastor Haggard's public statements have proven without a doubt that he has committed sexually immoral conduct," the independent board said in a Saturday statement.

Haggard was "informed of this decision," the statement said, and he "agreed as well that he should be dismissed."

Haggard, 50, on Friday acknowledged paying Jones for a massage and for methamphetamine, but said he did not have sex with him and did not take the drug.

The statement from the 14,000-member church said the investigation would continue to determine the extent of the misconduct. The Rev. Mike Ware of Victory Church in Westminster, a member of the board, declined to characterize what investigators found but said the board did not talk to Jones.

'We stand by him'
Haggard did not answer his home or mobile phones Saturday, and neither was accepting messages. The Rev. Rob Brendle, an associate pastor at New Life, said Haggard was out of town.

"We are fully confident in the board's judgment and decision," Brendle said. "Everyone supports Ted and his family. We stand by him."

Jones said in a telephone interview Sunday: "I am sad for him and his family. I know this is a tough day for him also. I wish him well. I wish his family well. My intent was never to destroy his family. My intent was to expose a hypocrite.

"I hope the healing process can start. I welcome his request for forgiveness for me."

Interim pastor named
The Rev. Ross Parsley will lead the church until a permanent replacement for Haggard is chosen by the end of the year, the statement said.

Haggard's situation is a disappointment to Christian conservatives, whom President Bush and other Republicans are courting heavily in the run-up to Tuesday's election.

Many were already disheartened with the president and the Republican-controlled Congress over their failure to deliver big gains on social issues even before the congressional page scandal involving former Rep. Mark Foley.

A political force
Haggard, who had been president of the evangelical association since 2003, has participated in conference calls with White House staffers and lobbied Congress last year on Supreme Court nominees.

Haggard visited the White House once or twice, Deputy Press Secretary Tony Fratto said Friday.

Richard Cizik, the evangelical association's vice president for governmental affairs, called Haggard's ouster "heartbreaking and unfortunate."

"He is a man who has done a lot of good and who hopefully after a period of repentance and counsel and spiritual restoration will have a future ministry at some point," Cizik said.

The assocation has named President Leith Anderson, senior pastor of Wooddale Church in Eden Prairie, Minn., as its interim president.

Accuser feels vindicated
The board's decision cuts Haggard off from the massive church he founded in the mid-1980s. He held New Life's first services in the unfinished basement of his Colorado Springs home.

Jones, who said he is gay, said he was upset when he discovered who Haggard was and found out that the New Life Church had publicly opposed same-sex marriage - a key issue in Colorado, with a pair of issues on Tuesday's ballot.

"It made me angry that here's someone preaching about gay marriage and going behind the scenes having gay sex," Jones said.

Jones also said Haggard snorted methamphetamine before their sexual encounters to heighten his experience but has denied selling drugs. He agreed to take a lie-detector test Friday; the administrator of the test said the answers about his sex allegations "indicated deception."

But Jones said Saturday: "Obviously they determined there was sexual indiscretions, so I think that vindicates my claim."

Haggard denies sexual claims
Haggard told reporters he bought meth but never used it; he said he received a massage from Jones after being referred to him by a Denver hotel. Jones said that no hotel referred Haggard and that he advertises only in gay publications.

In a TV interview this week, Haggard said: "Never had a gay relationship with anybody, and I'm steady with my wife, I'm faithful to my wife."

Church member Christine Rayes, 47, said the congregation had hoped the allegations "were all lies."

"We all have to move forward now," she said. "This doesn't make what Ted accomplished here any less. The farther up you are, the more you are a target for Satan."

[foxyluva]

^^^ Obviously even the most devout man cannot repress his natural desires - how much more evidence do these people need

[sparky]

Originally Posted by estranged4life

spiritual restoration

What exactly would that be ?

Does it involve power tools, dry wall, and fresh paint?

At the very least, for this guy, it's gonna involve a man in a tool belt.

[estranged4life]

Originally Posted by foxyluva

^^^ Obviously even the most devout man cannot repress his natural desires - how much more evidence do these people need

statement from that article I posted, Sounds like someone needs to get a clue...I can sell her one for $.01

"This doesn't make what Ted accomplished here any less. The farther up you are, the more you are a target for Satan."

Let's see, Can we all say good ol' Satan will get the blame for this? It'll be easy for Rev.F-tard to pass the blame onto something/someone that can easily take the blame off of himself when he needs to look in the mirror to see who is really to blame.