World Cup

[Gailh]

I think Matarazzi must have said something to Zidane possible of a racist nature but still to react like that.

Gail

[DavidMn]

I felt the outcome of yesterdays game was entirely appropriate. First of all, that was a terrible call to allow the French penalty kick! That guy made a better dive than Greg Louganis! If France would've won the game because of that goal it would have been a disgrace in my opinion. I wholeheartedly congratulate the Italians on their win. They have had some misfortune in cup final history( Roberto Baggio in '94) and they have triumphed over recent adversity in Italy because of the big scandal there. To see a team win with those obstacles facing them is always a good thing. It's what makes sports so much fun to watch. Italy, now you are alone in second place all time in cup victories with 4. Maybe My German team can tie you in 2010. We'el see.

[DavidMn]

More on the Penalty kick call. I find it deplorable that someone like whatever that guy's name was can dive and cause a kick that can totally change the face of a match. It's one of the things I really hate about soccer. I think there should be a system where a coach or someone could challenge a call so that the ref's would have to look at a replay. I mean if you're going to have something that momentous in a match at least make sure it's legtimate!

[bretonbanquet]

Originally Posted by DavidMn

More on the Penalty kick call. I find it deplorable that someone like whatever that guy's name was can dive and cause a kick that can totally change the face of a match. It's one of the things I really hate about soccer. I think there should be a system where a coach or someone could challenge a call so that the ref's would have to look at a replay. I mean if you're going to have something that momentous in a match at least make sure it's legtimate!

A hell of a lot of football fans will agree with you there - almost everyone says that video evidence should be brought in to give a clearer view of contentious decisions like fouls in the penalty box, offsides, and arguments over whether or not the ball crossed the goal-line. So many bad decisions have changed so many big games.

But FIFA always say they'll only introduce new legislation that can be brought in at every level of the game, i.e. even at the lowest level. Football at the low levels can't afford to video everything, so that's where the thing breaks down. Until FIFA will accept a slight disparity in the rules between top level football and lower level, we will have this problem.

Likewise possible answers like having two referees, one in each half of the pitch. Lower level football has a problem finding one referee half the time, let alone two. FIFA is dedicated to supporting grass roots football, and wants the game to be exactly the same all over, whether it's a World Cup final or a fourth division game somewhere in the middle of Africa...

As for what Materazzi said to Zidane, I've heard that it could be anything from an insult aimed at Zidane's mother, a racial insult (Zidane has Algerian roots), or even some jibe at Muslims being terrorists... but Zidane has promised to explain soon

[DavidMn]

Originally Posted by bretonbanquet

A hell of a lot of football fans will agree with you there - almost everyone says that video evidence should be brought in to give a clearer view of contentious decisions like fouls in the penalty box, offsides, and arguments over whether or not the ball crossed the goal-line. So many bad decisions have changed so many big games.

But FIFA always say they'll only introduce new legislation that can be brought in at every level of the game, i.e. even at the lowest level. Football at the low levels can't afford to video everything, so that's where the thing breaks down. Until FIFA will accept a slight disparity in the rules between top level football and lower level, we will have this problem.

Likewise possible answers like having two referees, one in each half of the pitch. Lower level football has a problem finding one referee half the time, let alone two. FIFA is dedicated to supporting grass roots football, and wants the game to be exactly the same all over, whether it's a World Cup final or a fourth division game somewhere in the middle of Africa...

As for what Materazzi said to Zidane, I've heard that it could be anything from an insult aimed at Zidane's mother, a racial insult (Zidane has Algerian roots), or even some jibe at Muslims being terrorists... but Zidane has promised to explain soon

I feel for Zidane in a way, but someone with his exerience especially should be able to rise above with what was on the line.

[bretonbanquet]

Originally Posted by DavidMn

I feel for Zidane in a way, but someone with his exerience especially should be able to rise above with what was on the line.

Yup - I thought that too, especially considering he's had to put up with this kind of thing throughout his whole career. Some people say it was becasue he was tired and over-sensitive given the huge occasion - others say that it was exactly because it was his last game and the last chance to answer all those insults in the way he really wanted to. He does have a bit of a history of being a bit violent - he's no stranger to being sent off.

[DavidMn]

Originally Posted by bretonbanquet

Yup - I thought that too, especially considering he's had to put up with this kind of thing throughout his whole career. Some people say it was becasue he was tired and over-sensitive given the huge occasion - others say that it was exactly because it was his last game and the last chance to answer all those insults in the way he really wanted to. He does have a bit of a history of being a bit violent - he's no stranger to being sent off.

Hmm interesting. Werent you happy though for Italy? I mean with Baggio in 1994 and the scandal going on there now, for them to win it was really nice to see I thought.

[Gailh]

Originally Posted by DavidMn

I feel for Zidane in a way, but someone with his exerience especially should be able to rise above with what was on the line.

Yes he should be able to rise above it but it must be difficult at times.

the Italian and Spanish game is rife with racism.

When England played Spain at Real Madrid's ground the black English players were subjected to monkey chants every time they touched the ball. The spanish manager Aragones called Tierry Henry a "black ****"

The fans of some Italian clubs (Lazio) are openly racist.

Paulo di Canio was photographed giving a nazi salute after one game!

Zidane shouldn't have done what he did. He should have left it at the time and then after the game (if the insult was racist) show up Matarazzi for what he said

Gail

[DavidMn]

Originally Posted by Gailh

Yes he should be able to rise above it but it must be difficult at times.

the Italian and Spanish game is rife with racism.

When England played Spain at Real Madrid's ground the black English players were subjected to monkey chants every time they touched the ball. The spanish manager Aragones called Tierry Henry a "black ****"

The fans of some Italian clubs (Lazio) are openly racist.

Paulo di Canio was photographed giving a nazi salute after one game!

Zidane shouldn't have done what he did. He should have left it at the time and then after the game (if the insult was racist) show up Matarazzi for what he said

Gail

I remember a piece on a sports channel here that talked about the racist element and how they hoped it wouldnt rear its head during the World Cup.

[bretonbanquet]

Originally Posted by DavidMn

Hmm interesting. Werent you happy though for Italy? I mean with Baggio in 1994 and the scandal going on there now, for them to win it was really nice to see I thought.

I was definitely happy for Italy. It was the first final in ages that I didn't mind who won. By the end I was rooting for Italy - they were robbed in 2002, and they had bad luck as you say in '94, so their win was just fine by me.

I agree with Gail that it would have been better for Zidane to find Materazzi behind the scenes somewhere and deal with him then - but maybe he wanted everyone to see it all?

[DavidMn]

Originally Posted by bretonbanquet

I was definitely happy for Italy. It was the first final in ages that I didn't mind who won. By the end I was rooting for Italy - they were robbed in 2002, and they had bad luck as you say in '94, so their win was just fine by me.

I agree with Gail that it would have been better for Zidane to find Materazzi behind the scenes somewhere and deal with him then - but maybe he wanted everyone to see it all?

Here's another thing to think about. He did lead France to a victory in 1998, and that was secure no matter what happened. Perhaps he wouldve thought differently if France hadnt won before?

[bretonbanquet]

Originally Posted by DavidMn

Here's another thing to think about. He did lead France to a victory in 1998, and that was secure no matter what happened. Perhaps he wouldve thought differently if France hadnt won before?

That may well be true - you must definitely have a different attitude if you've won it before. That might be why all of us armchair fans are amazed that he did it.

[DavidMn]

Originally Posted by bretonbanquet

That may well be true - you must definitely have a different attitude if you've won it before. That might be why all of us armchair fans are amazed that he did it.

I wont harp on this anymore after this post but back to the Penalty Kick situation one more time. Look at how Australia lost in the round of 16. And I'm sure there's been signifigant matches in World Cup and otherwise that have been decided on a bad call like that.

[bretonbanquet]

Originally Posted by DavidMn

I wont harp on this anymore after this post but back to the Penalty Kick situation one more time. Look at how Australia lost in the round of 16. And I'm sure there's been signifigant matches in World Cup and otherwise that have been decided on a bad call like that.

Yeah, only thing is - that was a good call at least I think it was. The referee had no choice but to give the penalty in that instance.

[Serrart]

Originally Posted by Gailh

Yes he should be able to rise above it but it must be difficult at times.

the Italian and Spanish game is rife with racism.

When England played Spain at Real Madrid's ground the black English players were subjected to monkey chants every time they touched the ball. The spanish manager Aragones called Tierry Henry a "black ****"

The fans of some Italian clubs (Lazio) are openly racist.

Paulo di Canio was photographed giving a nazi salute after one game!

Zidane shouldn't have done what he did. He should have left it at the time and then after the game (if the insult was racist) show up Matarazzi for what he said

Gail

That's not really true. But I think soccer can bring out some of the worst feelings and that a lot of team fans all over the world (including Great Britain) have racist elements between them.

About many Lazio fans (not all), more than nazists, between them there are ignorant idiots nostalgic for fascism, in fact Di Canio is a Mussolini admirer and what he did wasn't a nazi but a fascist salute, that by the way in Italy is a crime to do.

About Zidane, players of every nationality say every sort of violent things on the field, only to have that kind of reactions from the opponents. The professionism of a player should be in doing the right thing. When Totti, at the European Championship spit on a Danish player, in Italy he was unanimously condemned for his gesture, nobody found excuses for him in what the Danish player told before being hit. They're paid millions of Euros also to behave responsibly. I think Zidane just lost his head, it happened to him before in critical moments.

Romy