Ann Coulter: You're stupider than I am

[Jyqm]

Originally Posted by Lux

I was referring to both, you were specifically covered, and I don't care to debate this with you because that would surely be the ironic aspect. One will walk away feeling successful, feeling they made the winning argument, have a laugh at the other's expense and then we can come back tomorrow and start all over again. That is simply tiring but when mocking others into a sense of superiority involves subjects who actively do only good, it is rather pathetic. Now it's not even about that, it's about defining irony which is back to tiring. If you think I want to debate the irony then you ought to read the post again.

You ought to read mine again as well. It's a big assumption to think that a campus group like "Students Against Hate" "actively does only good." They very well might do good, but they very well might also do nothing other than incestual back-patting, as I mentioned. There are groups like this at a lot of universities, with these bland and ultimately meaningless names, and they really don't do much of anything because they really don't have much of an agenda beyond "Hate is bad."

As I said, UConn and other American universities have lots of socially- and politically-minded student groups with actual goals who (hopefully) engage in atcual productive activities. UConn's got an Animal Rights Club, Students for Sensible Drug Policy, Food Not Bombs, Queers United Against Discrimination, Amnesty International, College Democrats, College Republicans, Habitat for Humanity, American Red Cross, V-Day Campaign, NOW... But I'll be damned if I can find a listing for Students Against Hate on the UConn website: http://www.ca.uconn.edu/csiapp/OrganizationInfo/all.cfm

Actually, the only references to the club that I can even find online are in connection with the Coulter speech, including an article which claims that Students Against Hate's mission statement is as follows: "Students Against Hate seeks to be a proactive presence on campus. Because we recognize and cherish our First Amendment right to freedom of speech, we are here to encourage the expression of opposing points of view in positive and respectful discussion without invoking anger and fear or further polarizing the student body. We hope to reach out to the entire UConn community in a peaceful manner to encourage constructive discourse, free of hate and discrimination." So what exactly is it they do again? http://freeuconn.com/articles/showarticle.php?id=11

Again, I'm not agreeing with David, but I also don't think that student groups like this should just be automatically lauded because they're "against hate." Standing outside an auditorium and chanting "You suck!" at Ann Coulter is not my idea of productive campus do-goodery (nor does it really seem in line with that brilliant mission statement).

[SteveMacD]

Originally Posted by Jyqm

Not when you whine like that, you don't. Nobody likes a bunch of whiners.

(Besides, don't you think if there was anything at all worthwhile going on in Canada, we'd have annexed you by now?)

Uhh, Jyqm, I'm not Canadian. I was born, raised, and still live in Dayton, Ohio. Although, I DO love hockey and Molson's.

[Jyqm]

Originally Posted by SteveMacD

Uhh, Jyqm, I'm not Canadian. I was born, raised, and still live in Dayton, Ohio. Although, I DO love hockey and Molson's.

I know, but it just wouldn't have been as amusing outside the second person...

[irishgrl]

Originally Posted by Jyqm

You ought to read mine again as well. It's a big assumption to think that a campus group like "Students Against Hate" "actively does only good." They very well might do good, but they very well might also do nothing other than incestual back-patting, as I mentioned. There are groups like this at a lot of universities, with these bland and ultimately meaningless names, and they really don't do much of anything because they really don't have much of an agenda beyond "Hate is bad."

Actually, the only references to the club that I can even find online are in connection with the Coulter speech, including an article which claims that Students Against Hate's mission statement is as follows: "Students Against Hate seeks to be a proactive presence on campus. Because we recognize and cherish our First Amendment right to freedom of speech, we are here to encourage the expression of opposing points of view in positive and respectful discussion without invoking anger and fear or further polarizing the student body. We hope to reach out to the entire UConn community in a peaceful manner to encourage constructive discourse, free of hate and discrimination." So what exactly is it they do again? http://freeuconn.com/articles/showarticle.php?id=11

Standing outside an auditorium and chanting "You suck!" at Ann Coulter is not my idea of productive campus do-goodery (nor does it really seem in line with that brilliant mission statement).

Maybe I missed this, did the article say that the protestors were from that group? I thought it was just a hodge-podge of people who just plain dont like Ann Coulter? Possibly it was the Students Against Hate that hired her in the first place since that would be in keeping with their mission statement? Then again, with Ann Coulter's track record of negativity, Im surprised such a group would even consider her to be a speaker (if in fact they did hire her to speak)

[Jyqm]

Originally Posted by irishgrl

Maybe I missed this, did the article say that the protestors were from that group? I thought it was just a hodge-podge of people who just plain dont like Ann Coulter? Possibly it was the Students Against Hate that hired her in the first place since that would be in keeping with their mission statement? Then again, with Ann Coulter's track record of negativity, Im surprised such a group would even consider her to be a speaker (if in fact they did hire her to speak)

No, take a look at the original article again:

Coulter's appearance prompted protests from several student groups. About 100 people rallied outside the auditorium where she spoke, saying she spread a message of intolerance.

"We encourage diverse opinion at UConn, but this is blatant hate speech," said Eric Knudsen, a 19-year-old sophomore journalism and social welfare major who heads campus group Students Against Hate.

They certainly were not the ones who booked her. Actually, here's an article from the UConn student paper that confirms something I suspected: this Students Against Hate group was invented specifically in response to Coulter's speech. (Although comparing the two articles, it's a little unclear whether the Students Against Hate kids were protesting, holding an alternative event somewhere else, or both.)

http://www.dailycampus.com/media/pap...ailycampus.com

'Stop The Hate' Provides Alternative to Coulter's Speech
By: Connie Yan
Issue date: 12/8/05

As students lined up around Jorgensen Center for the Performing Arts to see Ann Coulter's latest speech, many were sitting inside the Student Union Theater at Stop The Hate 2005.

Queers United Against Discrimination (QUAD), the Puerto Rican/Latin American Cultural Center, the Rainbow Center and Students Against Hate sponsored the event as an alternative event to the Coulter speech.

Students Against Hate is an organization that formed as a result of Coulter's first appearance at UConn.

"Mainly our goal was to throw this counter Coulter event," said Samantha Harrigan, a 3rd-semester pre-communications major and a member of the organization.

"We're really trying to deter people from going," Harrigan said as students handed out fliers instructing people to walk out of the Coulter speech at 7:45 p.m.

Media buzz is stronger than ever, as the controversy surrounding the Coulter speech brought in the Associated Press, ABC, Fox and more.

The event included speakers from the UConn community sharing their experiences with discrimination and hate, even in today's society.

The message of alumni and current UConn students was not to be anti-Republican or anti-religion. Chris Albert, a graduate student, is a Christian and a marine. He feels that people like Coulter threaten the three most important things to him - God, his country and his family. He feels Coulter's opinions are an example of "false patriotism."

Albert said he will not be attending Coulter's speech because "she has nothing to offer me," and encourages everyone else to do the same. Albert also encourages not to relay hate messages towards her.

"She wants you to heckle her," he said.

The event attracted not only the attention of the media, but also that of local politicians. Although they were unable to attend, State Rep. Denise W. Merrill and Congresswoman Rosa L. DeLaura sent letters and wishes.

This event is a "demonstration of democracy," DeLaura said in her letter.

Jerome Smith, UConn alumni and the chief of staff for the Boston city counselor, shared his experiences of being a minority, both ethnic and sexual orientation wise, at the event.

"I constantly had to struggle," Smith said. This struggle caused Smith to be depressed and on the verge of suicide. After coming out to his family, he felt "finally for once I had put my two worlds together."

Smith's story encourages acceptance of others and for one's own self. In addition to sharing his story, Smith had planned to quote Coulter for the audience, but decided to spare the audience because "Ann Coulter's quotes aren't original," Smith said.

Member of the Muslim Student Association Ali Langston determined that "ignorance is something that divides us as a people." In encouraging diversity and unity, he shared with the audience some background on the Islam religion, and how different it is from the terrorist group al-Qaida. Since the 9/11 attack, the media has given Islam a negative connotation, according to Langston, which could not be further from the truth.

"Islam is a word that means peace," Langston said
Speaker Hana Kim, a 5th-semester sociology and psychology major, brought attention to racism and bigotry present on the UConn campus. She was brought to tears when recalling an event that took place outside of McMahon residence halls. Although the act was not violent, she was "being objectified using language," Kim said.

As an Asian American, she feels that "when people look at me they see these features and they assume certain things."
The words of Kim, Smith, Langston and Albert were not the only ones heard. An Open Mic session allowed audience members to voice their opinions and reactions to the event.

Stop The Hate 2005's main message was to discourage students from supporting hate speeches from Coulter, who Smith referred to as "one of the leading bigots in the United States."

[SuzeQuze]

Maybe its just me but I think that talking against hate and raising awareness of how much bigotry is still out there is being "productive" in and of itself.

[Jyqm]

Originally Posted by SuzeQuze

Maybe its just me but I think that talking against hate and raising awareness of how much bigotry is still out there is being "productive" in and of itself.

Whose awareness are they raising? If they were giving lectures at high schools or sponsoring community events, I might agree with you. But holding an open mic night at the student union so that the choir of self-righteous UConn students can preach tolerance to themselves and offer each other hugs and hot chocolate while congratulating each other for not attending Coulter's speech isn't really what I'd call getting the word out.

[cliffdweller]

Originally Posted by Jyqm

You ought to read mine again as well. It's a big assumption to think that a campus group like "Students Against Hate" "actively does only good." They very well might do good, but they very well might also do nothing other than incestual back-patting, as I mentioned. There are groups like this at a lot of universities, with these bland and ultimately meaningless names, and they really don't do much of anything because they really don't have much of an agenda beyond "Hate is bad."

Yeah, but as long as you're not part of the problem right? I don't see the inherent evil in these P.C. groups. I understand there is a problem with over-theorizing and not stepping beyond that into action, but that's not what these student groups are doing. Most of them do act, maybe not as radically as one would like, but hey, at least they are voicing concern, attracting attention to social/poltical issues, and perhaps engaging other students who would not have gotten involved otherwise. It's better than doing nothing imo.

[Jyqm]

Originally Posted by cliffdweller

Yeah, but as long as you're not part of the problem right? I don't see the inherent evil in these P.C. groups.

Oh no, they're not evil, they're just pointless, particularly with the glut of other socially-minded student groups that already exist on American campuses everywhere.

I understand there is a problem with over-theorizing and not stepping beyond that into action, but that's not what these student groups are doing.

If UConn's Students Against Hate group ever does anything beyond their little anti-Coulter love-in, I'll take back my comments about them being silly and pointless and masturbatory. Until then, though, open mic nights at the student union don't count as "action" in my book. The only people who go to these things are the students who are already in the club or who already know that "hate" = bad. They're not opening up anybody's eyes, and they're not effecting any change.

Is it better than nothing? Ehhh, I don't know. It's not worse than nothing, I'll at least give you that.

[irishgrl]

No, take a look at the original article again:
Coulter's appearance prompted protests from several student groups. About 100 people rallied outside the auditorium where she spoke, saying she spread a message of intolerance.

"We encourage diverse opinion at UConn, but this is blatant hate speech," said Eric Knudsen, a 19-year-old sophomore journalism and social welfare major who heads campus group Students Against Hate.

Well, I can certainly believe that the Students against Hate were part of the protestors, but not the ONLY protestors

They certainly were not the ones who booked her.

ok, I was just throwing that out there, but I didnt have any convictions about that idea one way or another.

Actually, here's an article from the UConn student paper that confirms something I suspected: this Students Against Hate group was invented specifically in response to Coulter's speech. (Although comparing the two articles, it's a little unclear whether the Students Against Hate kids were protesting, holding an alternative event somewhere else, or both.)

What tipped you off that the group was formed in response to her speaking?
I didnt see anything that raised any flags, so Im curious as to what made you suspicious.....

[cliffdweller]

Originally Posted by Jyqm

Oh no, they're not evil, they're just pointless, particularly with the glut of other socially-minded student groups that already exist on American campuses everywhere.



If UConn's Students Against Hate group ever does anything beyond their little anti-Coulter love-in, I'll take back my comments about them being silly and pointless and masturbatory. Until then, though, open mic nights at the student union don't count as "action" in my book. The only people who go to these things are the students who are already in the club or who already know that "hate" = bad. They're not opening up anybody's eyes, and they're not effecting any change.

Is it better than nothing? Ehhh, I don't know. It's not worse than nothing, I'll at least give you that.

Sour grapes much? Okay, which student group did you get kicked out of? .

[Jyqm]

Originally Posted by irishgrl

Well, I can certainly believe that the Students against Hate were part of the protestors, but not the ONLY protestors

Oh no, definitely not, I think that article mentioned a number of other student groups that were involved in protesting, and I"m sure there were some non-affiliated kids who showed up too.

What tipped you off that the group was formed in response to her speaking?
I didnt see anything that raised any flags, so Im curious as to what made you suspicious.....

It was just the name: "Students Against Hate." That's not the name of a student group that somebody just came with one day. As opposed to: "You know, protecting the environment is important, but there aren't any environmental groups on campus. I think I'll create one." Or: "You know, we have such a large queer community at this school, but there's no student group representing our interests or promoting tolerance of our lifestyles. I think I'll create one." There's no specific issue or constituency that this group is serving. "Students Against Hate" just sounds like the name of a "task force" created in response to a specific event, like a string of hate crimes... or a speech by someone controversial and hateful. You don't create a student group "against" something, unless there's something specific that you're against. I doubt there were many active "Students Against War" groups on American campuses in 2000.

[Jyqm]

Originally Posted by cliffdweller

Sour grapes much? Okay, which student group did you get kicked out of? .

No stealing my lines!

I can count the number of student groups I was in in college on one hand. Oh wait... don't even need that one! (Does this surprise anyone? Do I seem like a person who lines up to join groups, no matter what kinds of cool things they're doing?)

[cliffdweller]

Originally Posted by Jyqm

No stealing my lines!

I can count the number of student groups I was in in college on one hand. Oh wait... don't even need that one! (Does this surprise anyone? Do I seem like a person who lines up to join groups, no matter what kinds of cool things they're doing?)

Actually...no.

And which line did I steal?

[Jyqm]

Originally Posted by cliffdweller

Actually...no.

And which line did I steal?

I think I said "Sour grapes much?" in my first post in this very thread.