Can't buy the new Neil Diamond album

Jyqm · #1 11-08-2005, 01:32 PM

You can tell I'm pissed when I actually put an emoticon in the tag of my post. But one look at the Amazon customer reviews of Neil Diamond's new album should tell you why:

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg...music&n=507846

Unfortunately, Sony is using Neil Diamond as one of its accomplices in its attempt to hijack and infect consumers' computers and not allow consumers fair use of their own music.

Can anyone confirm if this is true? Will 12 Songs not allow itself to be imported into iTunes?

If that's the case, I simply can't justify buying this album. Even putting righteous indignation aside, it would just be a waste of money for me. Yes, I have a CD player, but I listen to my music on my iPod. Whether I'm sitting at my desk or walking around town, that's where all of my music is, and that's how I want to listen to it.

Sony doesn't agree. This is partly a dinosaur tactic to discourage copying of the CD (although one really has to wonder, of all the artists on Son't roster, is Neil Diamond really one that they think is at high-risk of being copied and downloaded illegally?), and partly a dig at Apple for not agreeing to the demands of Sony and other record labels to alter some of the features of iTunes. But of course this corporate feuding only hurts the consumer (and the artist) and makes Sony look like a bunch of assholes.

So I just can't justify buying this album, as excited as I am to hear it. So I suffer and Neil suffers, because Sony is a despicable company. Anybody else want to start boycotting their products and writing letters until they give up these kinds of games?

Neil might not even know about it; I should write an e-mail to his website or something.

Brwn_eyes0511 · #2 11-08-2005, 01:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jyqm

You can tell I'm pissed when I actually put an emoticon in the tag of my post. But one look at the Amazon customer reviews of Neil Diamond's new album should tell you why:

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg...music&n=507846

Unfortunately, Sony is using Neil Diamond as one of its accomplices in its attempt to hijack and infect consumers' computers and not allow consumers fair use of their own music.

Can anyone confirm if this is true? Will 12 Songs not allow itself to be imported into iTunes?

If that's the case, I simply can't justify buying this album. Even putting righteous indignation aside, it would just be a waste of money for me. Yes, I have a CD player, but I listen to my music on my iPod. Whether I'm sitting at my desk or walking around town, that's where all of my music is, and that's how I want to listen to it.

Sony doesn't agree. This is partly a dinosaur tactic to discourage copying of the CD (although one really has to wonder, of all the artists on Son't roster, is Neil Diamond really one that they think is at high-risk of being copied and downloaded illegally?), and partly a dig at Apple for not agreeing to the demands of Sony and other record labels to alter some of the features of iTunes. But of course this corporate feuding only hurts the consumer (and the artist) and makes Sony look like a bunch of assholes.

So I just can't justify buying this album, as excited as I am to hear it. So I suffer and Neil suffers, because Sony is a despicable company. Anybody else want to start boycotting their products and writing letters until they give up these kinds of games?

Neil might not even know about it; I should write an e-mail to his website or something.

I've read reviews like this before and several albums that I have bought...and I have always been able to get them onto my ipod!

Jyqm · #3 11-08-2005, 01:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brwn_eyes0511

I've read reviews like this before and several albums that I have bought...and I have always been able to get them onto my ipod!

Yeah, I've heard differing reports in the past few months about Sony albums and iTunes. But I don't think I want to be the guinea pig. I can't justify buying it until I know it's going to work in iTunes and on my iPod.

I also don't want Sony's spyware on my computer.

Raeven Skye · #4 11-08-2005, 01:38 PM

wow that totally sucks....it's no wonder the music "industry" is having a hard time. The rules and regs aren't keeping up with technology.

dissention · #5 11-08-2005, 01:39 PM

I ordered it last night, but I'll be sure not to put in my computer now.

Surely there's some way of getting around the DRM ****, though, because I downloaded the album last week.

Jyqm · #6 11-08-2005, 01:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dissention

I ordered it last night, but I'll be sure not to put in my computer now.

Surely there's some way of getting around the DRM ****, though, because I downloaded the album last week.

Well, apparently you can buy it direct from iTunes, but I want the CD and the liner notes for my money.

And yes, there are always ways to get around everything, it's just the degree of how much of a pain in the ass it is to do it.

And also the principle of the thing. I really don't want to be giving Sony money and encouraging them to keep pulling this kind of ****.

JazmenFlowers · #7 11-08-2005, 01:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jyqm

Well, apparently you can buy it direct from iTunes, but I want the CD and the liner notes for my money.

And yes, there are always ways to get around everything, it's just the degree of how much of a pain in the ass it is to do it.

And also the principle of the thing. I really don't want to be giving Sony money and encouraging them to keep pulling this kind of ****.

I had a similar problem with Barbra Streisand's Guilty Pleasures CD, and she's on Sony/Columbia. I was able to finally get it to load onto iTunes after 3 tries. Another thing I've had to do with some of my Linda Eder CDs is get a friend to load it onto his computer and burn me a copy and then put it on my iTunes - pain in the arse...I know.

estranged4life · #8 11-08-2005, 01:48 PM

saw an article a few days ago that Sony is using technology that can interfere with iTunes, iPods, etc.

Not only that but that technology can also flag your hardrive as being used for illegal downloads, (Dont ask me what that means, but the MSN article I read said Sony approved that technology to see who is doing illegal downloading), and from what some tech.experts have now said is that technology can cause "possible viruses" on your PC.

If I can re-locate the article on MSN I will post it here.

Jyqm · #9 11-08-2005, 02:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by estranged4life

Not only that but that technology can also flag your hardrive as being used for illegal downloads, (Dont ask me what that means, but the MSN article I read said Sony approved that technology to see who is doing illegal downloading), and from what some tech.experts have now said is that technology can cause "possible viruses" on your PC.

Yes indeed.

I hope Sony enjoys the taste of irony. I don't want their Trojan spyware on my computer leaving me open to viruses and telling them if I'm downloading things illegally... so I'm now illegally downloading 12 Songs, an album I would have otherwise purchased legally without a moment's hesitation. (And I still will purchase it legally, if a no-spyware version is released.)

So I guess their strategy is working?

hayley · #10 11-08-2005, 03:06 PM

It won't import into iTunes on my computer, and it pisses me off too. It frustrates me so much. What pisses me off more with our copy protection is that half the CDs it's on I have NO problem importing, and the other half I can't. I don't understand that.

You can get around it- it's a bit of a pain in the ass, but manageable. I've been able to burn a copy of it using Windows Media Player and then import the burned CD.

trackaghost · #11 11-08-2005, 04:21 PM

Copy protection sucks. The last time I got one of those CDs I had to record it onto my computer like you would a vinyl record. It sounds okay but it's such a hassle.
Worst thing for me though is that 12 Songs isn't released in the UK yet and I have no idea where to get the import since Amazon UK doesn't seem to have it. Oh well.

Raeven Skye · #12 11-08-2005, 07:24 PM

i read an article about it online today, too. Although it's a bit too "techie" for me, I still get that Sony's spyware causes your system to "lie" about its files, so it's almost impossible to delete, and it leaves a wide backdoor open for hackers. sucks sucks sucks

estranged4life · #13 11-08-2005, 11:56 PM

Sony Music issues fix to anti-piracy program

Record company criticized over hidden copy-protection code for Windows

SAN JOSE, Calif. - After a chorus of criticism, Sony Corp.'s music division said Wednesday it is distributing a free software patch to reveal hidden files that automatically installed to hard drives when some of its music CDs were played on personal computers.

The offending technology was designed to thwart music piracy.

Sony BMG Music Entertainment and its partner, UK-based First 4 Internet, said they decided to offer the patch as a precaution, not because of any security vulnerability, which some critics had alleged.

"What we decided to do is take extra precautionary steps to allay any fears," said Mathew Gilliat-Smith, First 4 Internet's CEO. "There should be no concern here."

The controversy started Monday after Windows expert Mark Russinovich posted a Web log report on how he found hidden files on his PC after playing a Van Zant CD. He also said it disabled his CD drive after he tried to manually remove it.

Russinovich made the discovery while running a program he had written for uncovering file-cloaking "RootKits." In this case, the Sony program hid the antipiracy software from view. Similar technology also has been used by virus and worm writers to conceal their code.

A firestorm quickly erupted over what appeared to be an attempt by the music company to retain control over its intellectual property by secretly installing hidden software on the PCs of unsuspecting customers.

Making matters worse, Sony did not disclose exactly what it was doing in its license agreement, Russinovich said. It only mentions that proprietary software to enable copy protection would be installed. The software affects only PCs running the Windows operating system.

"The (license) makes no mention that it's going to install something that's going to be hidden from view, that will constantly consume CPU resources even if I'm not listening to music and it will have no uninstall capability," he said.

Because the technology looks for a specific prefix in the filename, it also could be used by malware authors to mask their programs, Russinovich said. There's also the question of how a PC user is supposed to maintain a system that runs hidden programs.

"If you've got software on your computer that you can't see, there's no way for you to manage it from a security point of view," he said. "You don't know if you need updates for it. You don't know if you should uninstall it because you don't know it's even there."

CONTINUED: Vulnerability to 'malware' claimed

Though there are no known problems with software, that could change and leave millions of unsuspecting PC users at risk of having their machines taken over by malware, said Ero Carrera, a researcher at F-Secure, a computer security firm.

"The code of the application is not exactly well done," he said. "I would tend to believe there are people already working on finding exploits."

The copy protection technology, which limits how many times a CD can be copied, was included on about 20 titles, including discs from The Bad Plus and Vivian Green, among others.

Gilliat-Smith and Sony BMG spokesman John McKay said the technology had been on the market for about eight months and there had been no major complaints prior to Russinovich's blog post. Still, a newer, similar technology was in the process of rolling out before the latest controversy erupted.

The patches that reveal the hidden files are being made available to antivirus companies as well as customers who visit the Sony BMG site. They do not remove the copy protection software, however.

McKay said customers can request a program to safely uninstall everything by visiting the Sony BMG Web site at http://cp.sonybmg.com. That site, however, requires a form to be filled out and submitted.

In a test of the form late Wednesday, an e-mail confirming receipt was quickly returned by Sony BMG customer service, but it included no instructions on how to remove the software. The message promised another reply "shortly."

The process is unlike the vast majority of Windows software, which can be easily uninstalled - by the user, without permission - through the "Add or Remove Programs" tool in the operating system's control panel.

The controversy highlights the need for rules as to what content providers can and can't install on PCs to protect their property, said Russinovich, who is co-founder and chief software architect at Winternals Software, which specializes in advanced systems software for Microsoft Windows. (MSNBC is a Microsoft-NBC joint venture.)

"We need to get some formality about what's legal, what's ethical and what's fair - and what level of disclosure there needs to be," he said. "It's fine for Sony to say we're not going to do that now. What kind of guarantee do we have they're not going to do it at a future date or that other companies are not going to do this?"

Jyqm · #14 11-09-2005, 08:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by estranged4life

Sony Music issues fix to anti-piracy program

Thanks for posting this, Brian.

Of course, it's not really much of a solution. They're not actually discontinuing their use of the software, nor or they actually removing it from people's computers - they're just making it visible to the relatively small number of people who are up in arms about this.

So I think I'll stick with boycotting Sony products for the time being, unfair as it is to Neil.

Fantastic album, though. Hell yeah it is.

hayley · #15 11-09-2005, 10:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by estranged4life

The controversy started Monday after Windows expert Mark Russinovich posted a Web log report on how he found hidden files on his PC after playing a Van Zant CD. He also said it disabled his CD drive after he tried to manually remove it.

That's what he gets for playing that crap ass Van Zant CD.