Stevie Nicks Video Access Hollywood Interview

[michelej1]

Going down memory lane, I want to point out that after she and Lindsey apparently had a big fight following SYW, Stevie's worse fears about performing without Christine had come true, but before that she was (publicly) promoting their quartet.

This isn't the first time she has talked about what a "rock" band they are. She was doing that in 2001. Actually, Stevie was giving those kinds of interviews before Lindsey was, because she was promoting TISL in 2001. She is the one who was FIRST saying what new things they could achieve without Christine. Lindsey said it too, but he was saying that in 2003 and 2004, not in 2001, because he wasn't being interviewed that much in 2001. So, she's not suddenly mimicing what he says about what they've developed into as a four-piece. She was saying that stuff 12 years ago. She is the one who said it originally.

"If you take Christine's synthesizers and organ out of the mix then the whole thing will go back toward the guitar so that's an exciting premise for all of us because we love to rock,'' Nicks says enthusiastically.

According to her, being a power foursome is her and Mick's idea. Not Lindsey's, based on this 2001 comment.

Mick [Fleetwood] and I are going to make this happen; we're the strong ones, and we're going to push this through if it kills us. We really want to do another record. Christine [McVie] doesn't want to do it; if that's what she wants, that's what she's going to get. But under that circumstance, Mick and I think it's very exciting, and Lindsey and John [McVie]. That pushes Fleetwood Mac back to being a power trio, basically; you take that lead keyboard element out and you are left with a more guitar-centered band. That's a very exciting premise to all of us, so I think it'll happen.

What I think is pretty great about the idea of having to move ahead without Christine -- because she really is not going to do it; it's ok, she doesn't want to, that's alright, it's her world, and it's her choice -- but without her, you take her out of the mix, then you're taking the synthesizer/organ out. You're also taking the trio of singers away, so the trio singers are going back to...what? To Lindsey and Stevie, to Buckingham/Nicks basically. The band itself goes back to being much more guitar orientated. It could go back to Blues; it could go back to serious ZZ Top Rock & Roll or whatever. It gives us, I think, a very interesting artistic thing to do with Fleetwood Mac now. I'm very excited about it, I will run "Trouble in Shangri-La" to where it ends, and when it ends I will probably go straight into the studio with Fleetwood Mac.

And I think the fact that Chris won't be there is very interesting, too. It'll be just Lindsey and me singing again, so that really goes back full circle to where we started in San Francisco.

[SpyNote]

Originally Posted by michelej1

Yes, but Stevie and Lindsey were getting along the whole tour, so when she said there could have been more than one song from Christine, but Lindsey's words were "she can't just come and go" she was getting along with him THEN, presumably. I just don't understand the assertion that she was speaking her own mind in London, but now she's speaking Lindsey's mind. Only a couple of months have passed since then.

Only? A lot can happen in a couple of months. It only takes one conversation to change anyone’s opinion about anything.

If Lindsey was talking about Christine rejoining the band when Stevie said that in London (which I don't think he was, he was only talking about her guest appearance) then nothing has changed. Stevie was speaking independently in London and now she's just quoting Lindsey? If that's true, I'd like to know what he did between now and London to turn her around that he didn't do before London? Maybe HE'S the Supreme and his powers have gotten stronger over time, so he can do things to Stevie now that he couldn't do in September.

Or maybe you were using your clairvoyance to read Stevie’s mind. I’d like to know, too. We don’t know.

And the fact is, Stevie has never said Lindsey didn't want Christine back in the band. When she said all of them asked Christine to change her mind, she emphasized every single ONE of them. I don't think she meant 3 of us and not Lindsey. And she said it's Christine's band and she can come back if she wants to. When it came to the London appearances, she indicated that Lindsey had a say in that (and then Christine did too), but she's talking differently now. She's not saying anything about Lindsey right now. I think if the subject was the same as it was then, then she'd invoke Lindsey now, like she did then.

Unless of course she's not saying Lindsey's name to protect him -- which would be curious, since she singled him out as the only one limiting Christine's involvement in the London appearances, just two months ago. Why would she clam up about him now, if what she is doing is voicing his opinion?

I don’t think she was clamming up about him. I think she was adjusting her views. My speculation is that she has started to accept some of Lindsey’s arguments. I also think Lindsey is passive aggressive. I get that impression from reading Carol Ann Harris’ book and watching him behave passive aggressively in the Say You Will documentary. So I don’t think he would ever bluntly say that Christine couldn’t come back to the band. Conversely, I don’t think he would ever completely welcome her back either.

But anyway, Stevie's comments about Christine are similar to what they were in 2003/2004 when she finally accepted that Christine wasn't coming back. So, I don't see anything new or newly "influenced" about them at all.

Whether she was influenced is my speculation based on her tone and body language when the interviewer asked about Christine. She could have been tired of answering the same question over and over again for all we know. Not everything can be explained by citing quotes from past articles.

You think? See, I would say that's untrue. Christine said in 1997 (Best Buy) that they all form a bed on which Lindsey rolls around and does whatever he wants, so I think he always ran the band's stage show. The only difference is he got to do more of his own songs with her 1/3 gone and, of course, the piano was less a focal point. But in terms of the band's sound and arrangements live, I think he always had control of that. He loses space and time (and songs) upon her return, but I don't think he loses control. And I don't think he was happy about her leaving in the first place. I mean, I think he liked it in time and grew into the 1/3 room she opened up, but I think he was upset when she initially decided not to tour with them.

I never disputed that he ran the band’s stage show. I said that he basically runs Fleetwood Mac because he has full control over the stage and the studio. Maybe that’s always been his role. But without Christine's influence, the Fleetwood Mac albums have been sounding like his solo projects, which is probably why they aren't selling well. If Christine came back, I would expect the sound of the Fleetwood Mac albums to be more melodic and less edgy. Many Ledgies would disapprove of this, but they would definitely sell more albums.

Sure, I believe Lindsey was initially upset at Christine leaving (which of course he had no reason to be considering that he did the same thing 10 years earlier), but probably more so because she abruptly cut ties with everyone.

[michelej1]

Originally Posted by SpyNote

Or maybe you were using your clairvoyance to read Stevie’s mind. I’d like to know, too. We don’t know.

I wasn't reading her mind. I was reading what she SAID. You are the one who said she was saying it because Lindsey influenced her. I wasn't trying to get into her head. I was just listening to her words. You're the one who said they were someone else's words and I am just saying -- not really, because Stevie also said similar words in 2001. It's not just Lindsey who has said that.

Originally Posted by SpyNote

Not everything can be explained by citing quotes from past articles.

No, but quotes from old articles on the very same subject can certainly indicate whether that is something that Stevie has said for a long time or whether it's a sudden change of viewpoint caused by Lindsey's magic influence over her from September to now.

As far as Lindsey's position in the band, Stevie has said that Lindsey had absolute control in the studio too. He was the "Ayatollah." From her point of view, he actually has less control over her output now than he did when Christine was in the band, because now they're more 50/50. She said in the old days that she was kept in the "back of the bus" by him. I think he's had control since Rumours hit.

I don't know whether he wants Christine back in the band or he doesn't want her back. I wasn't trying to divine what he thinks based on what Stevie has been saying about the Guardian interview. I think Stevie can have an independent position on the subject without having been influenced by Lindsey.

As for your point that SYW sounded more like Lindsey's solo projects, I would agree with that. I don't know if that's the reason for its low sales though. I think their age and the era contributed a lot to those poor sales.

Michele

[louielouie2000]

Anybody else think they probably BOTH want Christine back, but are just really wary of the carrot that's being dangled in front of their noses being yanked away? Or perhaps, they just want to temper the fanbase (us) to not be terribly devastated if Chris doesn't actually return.

[elle]

Originally Posted by louielouie2000

Anybody else think they probably BOTH want Christine back, but are just really wary of the carrot that's being dangled in front of their noses being yanked away? Or perhaps, they just want to temper the fanbase (us) to not be terribly devastated if Chris doesn't actually return.

Yes and yes. But I think that's just a part of it. Bigger part being they all want some kind of big official announcement at some point.

[louielouie2000]

Originally Posted by elle

Yes and yes. But I think that's just a part of it. Bigger part being they all want some kind of big official announcement at some point.

Exactly! They don't want to steal the thunder of any official announcements. Plus, I doubt they have any contractual agreements hammered out to make any proclamations just yet, either.

[michelej1]

Originally Posted by louielouie2000

Anybody else think they probably BOTH want Christine back, but are just really wary of the carrot that's being dangled in front of their noses being yanked away? Or perhaps, they just want to temper the fanbase (us) to not be terribly devastated if Chris doesn't actually return.

I don't think Christine would have told the Guardian she wanted to come back, if there hadn't been some kind of tacit agreement about it by the band.

Stevie talked about the Vegas gigs and Christine being on safari in January. Maybe they plan to do something contractually and officially in February, once all that is over and the extra time will give Christine one last chance to change her mind. But they seem to be on the same page, because Christine wasn't talking about returning to record (which seems to be in the works as well), but she said she wanted to live out of a suitcase again.

I definitely think they want to make a big announcement and have a grand Rolling Stone spread, or something, to herald the news. Michele

[michelej1]

Originally Posted by elle

Yes and yes.

Yep. Stevie hasn't said anything about not wanting Christine back. All she said was that she asked Christine to make sure it's what Chris wants.

Michele

[SpyNote]

Originally Posted by michelej1

I wasn't reading her mind. I was reading what she SAID. You are the one who said she was saying it because Lindsey influenced her. I wasn't trying to get into her head. I was just listening to her words. You're the one who said they were someone else's words and I am just saying -- not really, because Stevie also said similar words in 2001. It's not just Lindsey who has said that.

It was a joke. You sarcastically mentioned The Supreme so I threw it back at you. I wasn't accusing you of mind reading.

No, but quotes from old articles on the very same subject can certainly indicate whether that is something that Stevie has said for a long time or whether it's a sudden change of viewpoint caused by Lindsey's magic influence over her from September to now.

Like I already said, people can change their mind. And with Stevie, she does change her mind. She once said that she wasn't interested in recording a new solo album, but she changed her mind. Words are not set in stone. Opinions change in light of new information. We don't know what has been said since London because it hasn't been reported. There's obviously more to this that we don't know about yet. You're speculating and I'm speculating about things. Just because we don't agree doesn't mean what I present is inaccurate. It's just my opinion and interpretation.

As far as Lindsey's position in the band, Stevie has said that Lindsey had absolute control in the studio too. He was the "Ayatollah." From her point of view, he actually has less control over her output now than he did when Christine was in the band, because now they're more 50/50. She said in the old days that she was kept in the "back of the bus" by him. I think he's had control since Rumours hit.

The point I was trying to make is that he would have less control if Christine came back. In the December Mojo article, Stevie says, "[Christine's] the only one in Fleetwood Mac [Lindsey] was ever willing to listen to." So to me, that says that she had strong creative influence.

I don't know whether he wants Christine back in the band or he doesn't want her back.

Then why tell Mojo magazine not to use a line-up shot including Christine on the cover of their issue about the making of Rumours, which is what the writer says? I think the bigger reason is that Lindsey is extremely insecure and has a fragile ego. He doesn't want to be upstaged by Christine now that he has more control and influence over the band. This is my interpretation, not pulling something out of the divine.

As for your point that SYW sounded more like Lindsey's solo projects, I would agree with that. I don't know if that's the reason for its low sales though. I think their age and the era contributed a lot to those poor sales.

I think age and era were minor considerations. There are plenty of other artists who are just as old and older, The Eagles and Rolling Stones, for example, who still hit the platinum mark with new album releases. But when you try to churn your audience stylistically, some of them are going to drop off, which I think happened with Say You Will. Christine, along with Stevie's songs, helped bring their sound more to the center.

Say You Will just didn't sound like a Fleetwood Mac album. It sounded like a Lindsey Buckingham solo project, experimental and a little scattered. It also sounded dated in parts. Scaling down the number of songs would have helped. Overall, it was a mixed, incohesive work.

[elle]

Originally Posted by SpyNote

Say You Will just didn't sound like a Fleetwood Mac album. It sounded like a Lindsey Buckingham solo project, experimental and a little scattered. It also sounded dated in parts. Scaling down the number of songs would have helped. Overall, it was a mixed, incohesive work.

it did not. Lindsey's solo project, original Gift of Screws, had mixed styles but it was cohesive and far superior to SYW. if you are looking at it as a whole album (as opposed to a grouping of individual songs), SYW sounds nothing like GOS1.

for whatever reasons, the label would not let that album out in 2001, and instead *convinced* Lindsey he should roll it into the FM project. come to think of it, why did they let Stevie put her album out in 2001, instead of making her roll some of those songs into FM project too, and have FM album out in 2001 instead of 2003? which would make sense and be much sooner after the big bang of the Dance. i don't think i've ever heard any LB fan say GOS1 is not some of LB's best work, while SN fans seem to be very divided on TISL.

[SpyNote]

Originally Posted by elle

it did not. Lindsey's solo project, original Gift of Screws, had mixed styles but it was cohesive and far superior to SYW. if you are looking at it as a whole album (as opposed to a grouping of individual songs), SYW sounds nothing like GOS1.

I agree. Gift of Screws isn't your typical Lindsey solo album, like Law & Order, Go Insane, or Under the Skin. His typical sound is not for everyone.

for whatever reasons, the label would not let that album out in 2001, and instead *convinced* Lindsey he should roll it into the FM project. come to think of it, why did they let Stevie put her album out in 2001, instead of making her roll some of those songs into FM project too, and have FM album out in 2001 instead of 2003? which would make sense and be much sooner after the big bang of the Dance. i don't think i've ever heard any LB fan say GOS1 is not some of LB's best work, while SN fans seem to be very divided on TISL.

It comes down to what will sell. The label pushes Lindsey to use his most melodic solo work for Fleetwood Mac releases because they think it will sell better under the Fleetwood Mac moniker than if he released it on his own. I think Lindsey has capitulated on this a number of times because he knows there is some truth to it, and plus he will be guaranteed that his songs will get the exposure.

The label doesn't usually suggest that to Stevie because she can usually be guaranteed to sell at least 500,000 copies of her albums and several thousand copies of her retrospective. Her music is generally more commercial and mainstream.

Were we debating TISL? There's no doubt that some fans were split on TISL. Some said it was overproduced, some said Stevie's voice was noticeably more nasal, and some songs were quite bland and forgettable. I generally like the album because I grew up with a lot of the demos, so there were at least five songs that I was going to like no matter what. But sure, it's not for everyone.

[michelej1]

Originally Posted by SpyNote

Like I already said, people can change their mind. And with Stevie, she does change her mind.

That was my point. Actually, I don't find what she is saying now as a change from what she said before, but even if it's interpreted that way I don't think it would be unusual for Stevie to change her mind. She does it all the time. I don't think it's weird or bizarre or assume she was definitely influenced by Lindsey, if her mind changed.

Originally Posted by SpyNote

Then why tell Mojo magazine not to use a line-up shot including Christine on the cover of their issue about the making of Rumours, which is what the writer says?

The question is, did they show him a line up shot that included Christine and did he say, "don't use that one?" Or did they talk to him about possible shots that might be used and did he say, "don't use one that includes Christine?" If it was the latter, I think the original FM Mojo article would have mentioned that tidbit.

Either way, Christine wasn't back in the band at the time. I don't connect that writer's Mojo cover comment to him not wanting her in the band. He may want her or he may not, I have no idea.

For this thread, I was reflecting on Stevie's Access interview, which isn't about what Lindsey thinks. It's about what she said about Christine needing to be sure it's what she wants, how touring is hard work and they've built themselves into a four piece without Christine. Stevie so frequently says "Lindsey thinks" or "we" or "Lindsey and I think" so when she comes out and speaks for HERSELF and doesn't mention Lindsey, I don't assume she's revealing his thoughts and not her own.

Michele

[michelej1]

Originally Posted by elle

it did not. Lindsey's solo project, original Gift of Screws, had mixed styles but it was cohesive and far superior to SYW. if you are looking at it as a whole album (as opposed to a grouping of individual songs), SYW sounds nothing like GOS1.

No, it didn't sound like Fleetwood Mac in many places, but it really couldn't sound like an LB solo album either, what with the 9 Stevie songs in it.

Also, I don't think he would have put both SYHA and BTLH on on LB album. Maybe one or the other. They were definitely using those songs, plus the single, Say You Will to fill in the gap left by Christine.

I actually never thought that the album sounded like 2 solo albums slapped together. I thought it sounded like a hybrid of Stevie and Lindsey, but that it missed key Fleetwood Mac elements. But even if Christine had been on board for the album, I don't think it would have sold that many more units in the world we lived in in 2003.

If FM had rushed out and recorded an album in 1998 to trade on The Dance's success, then I think that's when the five of them could have had a lot more in record sales.

Michele

[elle]

Originally Posted by michelej1

If FM had rushed out and recorded an album in 1998 to trade on The Dance's success, then I think that's when the five of them could have had a lot more in record sales.

maybe even in 2001 when Stevie and Lindsey both had those solo albums.

[elle]

Originally Posted by SpyNote

I agree. Gift of Screws isn't your typical Lindsey solo album, like Law & Order, Go Insane, or Under the Skin. His typical sound is not for everyone.

that's a strange statement. Law&Order, Go Insane and UTS are 3 albums that are very far from each other in style and sound. so who decides what's typical Lindsey sound? how can those 3 very different albums be typical Lindsey sound, but not OOTC, GOS1, GOS, or SWS?