Mick Fleetwood Blames Nicks For Fleetwood Mac Tour Trouble

[MikeInNV]

Originally Posted by David

I don't know how all four members working on an album "from the ground up" would solve the problems Stevie had with the last album. She apparently didn't like the way some of her songs turned out. Does that mean she wanted those songs to be a lot more like the demos she shipped from the road? Did she make her beefs known during the recording she was there for?

Maybe it was all just an argument over the inclusion of "Come," or a problem she had with the running order.

What does it even mean to work on an album from the ground up? That you write all your songs in the studio? The two writers could try that--maybe even try writing a song together--but I don't see how doing that would prevent the problems they had with Say You Will. If they have a prickly, unpleasant time working in the same room, doing the album from the ground up could even exacerbate that problem.

Musically, is there any advantage to be gained by writing & recording from the ground up? No, not when one of the members is influencing the final sound of the album fifty times as much as the other three members. That guy will still make his songs sound "out there" in comparison with the other songs.

Actually, the one musical advantage to the from the ground up method is that the tracks won't sound as if they were timestamped over the course of six or seven years. That was my main problem with Say You Will: I could literally hear four different major recording sessions spread out over six years. It sounded like a bootlegger had grabbed a bunch of unreleased stuff from the vaults, and thrown it onto a single CD-R regardless of what year it was recorded.

I agree with every word of this.

[SteveMacD]

Originally Posted by elle

huh? what do you call a non-advertised tour with just him and his guitar? no band, no GYOW, just him.

Lou Reed would NEVER, EVER, EVER have let THIS happen...

[elle]

Originally Posted by David

I don't know how all four members working on an album "from the ground up" would solve the problems Stevie had with the last album.
...
Actually, the one musical advantage to the from the ground up method is that the tracks won't sound as if they were timestamped over the course of six or seven years. That was my main problem with Say You Will: I could literally hear four different major recording sessions spread out over six years. It sounded like a bootlegger had grabbed a bunch of unreleased stuff from the vaults, and thrown it onto a single CD-R regardless of what year it was recorded.

hi David - looks like you went through the full circle between the beginning and the end of your post...

you know, since i don't really have much interest or investment into individual members hurt feelings (well, other than if lindsey being happy leads him to churning out bunch of great solo albums in short succession ), i just skimmed through your first few paragraphs.

as a completely lindsey-skewed person, the speculation i heard is that one reason LB cannot make SN songs better lately is that she now doesn't listen to him as she used to.

LB has been saying over and over that FM should get an outside producer for the next FM album, so i don't really understand why so many people keep saying that he will be the producer.

your last paragraph and the part that i bolded is - in my understanding -what people who listen to the music on the album (as opposed to listening to individual members bickering) thought was the problem with SYW - unevenness and non-cohesiveness of that album. that problem should be solved by building the album from the ground up.

of course, lindsey did that with SWS (as opposed to GOS which was more like SYW although not that extreme) - he made a cohesive album. many also say that SWS is an underproduced album. and for some songs, i personally would love if he had just left them as they were in their previously nearly completed demo form (She Smiled Sweetly). however, i enjoy listening to SWS all the way through, unlike GOS or SYW where i keep skipping songs.

[michelej1]

Originally Posted by David

I don't know how all four members working on an album "from the ground up" would solve the problems Stevie had with the last album. She apparently didn't like the way some of her songs turned out. Does that mean she wanted those songs to be a lot more like the demos she shipped from the road? Did she make her beefs known during the recording she was there for?

In a way, once Stevie was there with the guys, she probably had more influence over the way her songs sounded on SYW than she did on any of the albums that preceded it, because Lindsey had a lot more incentive to heed her complaints in 2003 than he would have in the seventies or eighties.

Stevie was never really a ground worker anyway. I mean she complained that they would leave her alone in a room for hours and forget that she was there waiting to sing, while they worked on the music. So, it's not like she would be adding a lot, but she was definitely unhappy with SYW and if they did another album, it would be nice if she didn't start out unhappy (even if she eventually ends up there) about Lindsey butchering her demos while she was on the road listening to Do Ya Think I'm Sexy from her dresssing room every night.

But working from the ground up would mean that Stevie's vocals would not be simply strapped onto Lindsey's finished songs. He'd write songs with her back up in mind and the arrangements would evolve organically with both of them knowing that the other would have a part on his/her song.

Michele

[KenshiMaster16]

Lindsey's said he wouldn't mind having an outside producer for the next Mac project so if Mick REALLY wants the Mac back together, with a new album and tour, then he should really only be looking in one person's direction (and it's not Stevie's direction...)

.... Dave Stewart.

That's probably the only man who can convince Stevie to do a Mac album, and after his work on In Your Dreams, he could probably produce one Hell of a Mac album. We've already seen what he can do with Stevie's material, imagine the possibilities of him working with Lindsey on Lindsey's material.

[Johnny Stew]

Originally Posted by michelej1

In a way, once Stevie was there with the guys, she probably had more influence over the way her songs sounded on SYW than she did on any of the albums that preceded it, because Lindsey had a lot more incentive to heed her complaints in 2003 than he would have in the seventies or eighties.

She's talked about being unhappy with the final result of her songs on 'SYW,' but I've often wondered if it was more so the end battles (their disagreements about making it a double-length album, choosing Mark Needham instead of Chris Lord-Alge, and the huge tiff over the running order) that really left the bad taste in her mouth and colored her opinion of the entire album.

"I hear the islands calling
I hear angry words
Flying across the ocean
Like some sea birds
Never stopping
I feel my blood racing
I can’t believe what you are saying
I used to love you so much"

[Macfanforever]

To bad Mick could not drum up.{No pun intended} some money selling his wine at Costco's or firing up the Zoo band,Be a guess drummer for Stevie on her upcoming tour and other things that brings the cash flow in.sorry to hear about the divorce which does wipe out the funds quickly. I can understand that he needs to get back to work.An Unleashed Part Two tour does not make since 3 years later.Lisdsey probably has more road work and other related work to complete before getting involved with FM.As mention from the last Off the Record show .Lindsey mentioned about having a new producer to produce the FM album.I wonder if Dave came across Lindsey's and Mick's mind.

[Macfanforever]

Originally Posted by KenshiMaster16

Lindsey's said he wouldn't mind having an outside producer for the next Mac project so if Mick REALLY wants the Mac back together, with a new album and tour, then he should really only be looking in one person's direction (and it's not Stevie's direction...)

.... Dave Stewart.

That's probably the only man who can convince Stevie to do a Mac album, and after his work on In Your Dreams, he could probably produce one Hell of a Mac album. We've already seen what he can do with Stevie's material, imagine the possibilities of him working with Lindsey on Lindsey's material.

I agree.Dave Stewart is the producer Mac needs.

[PenguinHead]

Originally Posted by KenshiMaster16

That's probably the only man who can convince Stevie to do a Mac album, and after his work on In Your Dreams, he could probably produce one Hell of a Mac album. We've already seen what he can do with Stevie's material, imagine the possibilities of him working with Lindsey on Lindsey's material.

Very true. With Dave's involvement, Fleetwood Mac could put out an amazing album. I'm glad that Lindsey has expressed interest in bringing in another producer. He was very impressed with what Dave did with Stevie's album, so it's a real possibility.

I appreciate Say You Will for what it is, but it has a very dark, cold feel to it. Both Stevie and Lindsey are not the most light-hearted people; and Lindsey has gotten very introspective in more recent years, and it shows in his production work. Though a bit heavy, it's all well and good. Yet, with Christine's absence, Say You Will has almost no levity. The tone of her songs provided the perfect balance.

Lindsey has certainly enjoyed working in a very insular fashion on his solo work. I hope that he finds a producer he can collaborate with in making a Fleetwood Mac record. He has expressed that it would be appealing to have someone else share the burden of production duties.

[The Chain]

Originally Posted by Macfanforever

I wonder if Dave came across Lindsey's and Mick's mind.

Does anyone remember the interview where Lindsey specifically named Dave as a producer he or the band had considered for the next Mac project?

[elle]

Originally Posted by The Chain

Does anyone remember the interview where Lindsey specifically named Dave as a producer he or the band had considered for the next Mac project?

i don't remember which exact interview but i think it was probably some time in 2008. he said they are considering someone like Daniel Lanois or Dave Stewart.

[jellyman10]

If Dave Stewart values his mental health, he won't get in a studio with Lindsey Buckingham.
If Stevie Nicks values her friendship with Dave Stewart, she won't encourage it either.

The more I think about this, the more I think that not only might it finally be over, but that it should be over. I'm a proud chiffonhead and I think Mama might enjoy what's left of her life more if she has less contact with Mick and Lindsey. Come in out of the darkness.

[HejiraNYC]

Originally Posted by SteveMacD

Lou Reed would NEVER, EVER, EVER have let THIS happen...

No... but he would let THIS happen...

[HejiraNYC]

Originally Posted by jellyman10

If Dave Stewart values his mental health, he won't get in a studio with Lindsey Buckingham.
If Stevie Nicks values her friendship with Dave Stewart, she won't encourage it either.

The more I think about this, the more I think that not only might it finally be over, but that it should be over. I'm a proud chiffonhead and I think Mama might enjoy what's left of her life more if she has less contact with Mick and Lindsey. Come in out of the darkness.

I think people are under the assumption that Dave Stewart is at home patiently waiting for Stevie to call. The man is incredibly busy and he's got so many irons in the fire:

-Joss Stone
-Weapons of Mass Entertainment
-Another new solo album
-Ghost - The Musical (which may become a legitimate Broadway phenomenon)

At this point, it seems like even if FM was ready to record a new album, they would have to wait for Dave's schedule to open up.

I don't think it's over by any stretch. Surely there are hurt feelings at the moment, but they have certainly been through worse tribulations; they will get over it. Even the Rolling Stones are eyeing a 2013 50th anniversary tour with Bill Wyman on board. And Buddah knows there was some heavy sh** that went down after Keith slammed Mick in his book. Mick just needs to feel wanted for a change, and once Stevie gets off the road later this year, she will reach out to him. For some reason, I suspect it won't take much arm-twisting to get Mick to do a Fleetwood Mac tour.

[jellyman10]

Originally Posted by HejiraNYC

No... but he would let THIS happen...

Touche! So Lou isn't bulletproof. Excellent. Career-for-career, he's still ten times more genuinely radical than Lindsey Buckingham, which is my broad point, and I make it repeatedly as a counterweight to the piffle put forward by people who think that it's difficult or courageous to look edgy whilst standing next to Stevie Nicks.