Kerry, a.k.a. Bush, supports faith-based initiatives

[Vianna]

Interesting discussion.

I don't want Kerry or Bush but who else is there who has any chance of beating Bush?

Bush must be removed from the White House. We have to think how best to do that. If it has to be Kerry then it has to be Kerry. I am afraid he can't budge Bush either. But I will do my best by voting for him

Re: religion: I don't care what the issue is, if it involves religion of any kind the government should stay away from it. We DO NOT want religion mixed up with government. Period. Bush's far right born again Christian friends are to me one of the the most offensive things about him.

[gldstwmn]

Originally Posted by Johnny Stew

He'd like us to vote for anyone other than the Democrats, so we can really stick it to 'em, and teach 'em a lesson.

'Cause that worked so well for us last time.

[gldstwmn]

Originally Posted by CarneVaca

What's Kerry done for you? You can't answer the question.

John Kerry has a distinguished legislative record. He and John McCain negotiated an agreement with Vietnam to provide a full accounting for POW-MIAs. He wrote the first bill reducing acid rain. He has repeatedly led the charge in protecting the Arctic National Wildlife Refuge from drilling. He has passed legislation that shut down money laundering activities of terrorists and drug traffickers.

President Clinton Praised Kerry for Putting 100,000 COPS on the Street - "When we tried to get past six years of talking tough on crime but nothing happening, rhetoric and rhetoric and rhetoric and no action, to put 100,000 police on the street, to ban deadly assault weapons to pass the Brady bill, the other side, (the Republicans) led the fight against it. But John Kerry helped us pass the toughest, smartest, best crime bill this country has seen in many a day, and the crime rate has gone down for four years in a row. John Kerry was on the right side of history." (Public Papers of the President: Fall River, MA; 8/28/96)

Democratic Leader Tom Daschle Says Kerry Knows How to Get the Legislative Job Done in the Senate - Senate Majority Leader Tom Daschle had kind words for John Kerry's work on Campaign Finance Reform when he asked Kerry to chair the Democratic Steering Committee: "From our teen-smoking bill to HMO reform and Campaign Finance Reform, John Kerry has demonstrated that he clearly knows how to get the job done. He is a valued and trusted member of our leadership team, and I am pleased he has accepted another term as Chairman of the Steering and Coordination Committee." (Daschle Press Release, 11/19/98)

Even Dr. Bill Frist, Senate Majority Leader Says Kerry's Global AIDS Legislation is a "Huge Step Forward": "'The Kerry- Frist bill is a huge step forward," said (current Majority Leader Bill) Frist. "It further validates U.S. leadership in the global effort to end devastation many countries face in the fight against HIV/AIDS'." (Office of Senator Frist, press release 7/12/02)

58 bills and resolutions John Kerry has sponsored over the years have passed the U.S. Senate. Countless others have been improved because of his work, including the Clean Air Act, the Children's Health Insurance Program and the COPS program.

John Kerry has taken on the special interests and won. He fought against Newt Gingrich's anti-labor and anti-environmental regulatory reform. He has fought to raise the minimum wage. He has worked to shut down wasteful corporate subsidies. And John Kerry played an important role in the effort to reach a settlement with the tobacco companies that ended marketing to children and teenagers.

The number of bills that bear your name is a poor measure of legislative accomplishment. For example, Ted Kennedy, who most would acknowledge as the most accomplished Democratic Senator in a generation, has had just 9 bills signed into law in 10 years. Of the more than 400 bills Kennedy sponsored in 108th, 105th and 104th Congresses none were signed into law. And Bill Frist, the Republican Majority Leader, has sponsored 88 bills in the 108th Congress and zero have become law. In the 107th Congress, Frist sponsored 52 bills and 1 became law. It was a bill to authorize and urge the President to promote democracy in Zimbabwe.

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[Johnny Stew]

Originally Posted by CarneVaca

What's Kerry done for you? You can't answer the question.

Here are some things Kerry has done for me. Hope you don't mind that I'm going to cheat and just copy & paste:

Voted YES on adding sexual orientation to definition of hate crimes. (Jun 2002)
Voted YES on expanding hate crimes to include sexual orientation. (Jun 2000)
Voted NO on prohibiting same-sex marriage. (Sep 1996)
Voted YES on prohibiting job discrimination by sexual orientation. (Sep 1996)
Voted NO on banning affirmative action hiring with federal funds. (Jul 1995)
Voted NO on prohibiting same-sex basic training. (Jun 1998)
Voted NO on killing an increase in the minimum wage. (Nov 1999)

I'd ask if you're satisfied now, but I know what the answer would be.

Originally Posted by CarneVaca

This is getting boring. One point, though, Johnny Stew: The goverment just conducted the first-ever rollover tests on cars and SUVs. You should ask yourself if that would have ever happened if Ralph Nader hadn't pushed for auto safety all those years ago.

I'm getting a kick out of the way you dodge any discussion of the dark-side of the guys you praise, but expect the rest of us to go out of our way in proving our points.
What's the matter... didn't have a response to what I posted about Nader making money off of the very companies he claims to be against? Or was the truth just too boring?

Originally Posted by CarneVaca

Kerry = Bush
Bush = Kerry

Record scratched. Needle skipping.

[gldstwmn]

Originally Posted by Johnny Stew

I'm getting a kick out of the way you dodge any discussion of the dark-side of the guys you praise, but expect the rest of us to go out of our way in proving our points.
What's the matter... didn't have a response to what I posted about Nader making money off of the very companies he claims to be against? Or was the truth just too boring?
Record scratched. Needle skipping.

It's especially defeating to only be able to repeat the one great thing someone did 30-40 years ago. Even OJ won the Heisman trophy.

[Johnny Stew]

Oh, yeah... I almost forgot one of the important things John Kerry did for me: He served in the military to help protect the freedoms we all enjoy.

[Johnny Stew]

Originally Posted by gldstwmn

'Cause that worked so well for us last time.

Yep, that really made them stop and re-think everything, didn't it?

[Johnny Stew]

Originally Posted by gldstwmn

It's especially defeating to only be able to repeat the one great thing someone did 30-40 years ago. Even OJ won the Heisman trophy.

[gldstwmn]

http://www.theunitycampaign.org/

Pollwatch 04

Continuing Proof that Nader Helps Bush
Ralph Nader continues to assert he’ll help beat George
Bush. Nader’s communications director Kevin Zeese specifically cites a CNN poll in which John Kerry’s lead improves by 1% when Nader is included. What Mr. Zeese fails to mention is that the poll he cited is contradicted by 117 other polls – as is documented in the latest Poll Watch 04 study released August 2, 2004.

The Poll Watch 04 study covers every Bush/Kerry—Bush/Kerry/Nader poll conducted, nationally or in battleground states, from Nader’s announcement of his candidacy through July 26. It is based on data from the authoritative, non-partisan PollingReport.com, and sponsored by The Unity Campaign.

Of 121 polls in the study, 117 contradict Nader’s persistent claim that he’ll take more votes from Republicans than from Democrats. Of these, 93 show Nader takes more votes from Kerry, while 24 show no impact. 4 polls show Nader taking more votes from Bush, in each case by a percentage far within each poll’s margin of error.

Across all polls in the study, Nader gets an average of 4.3%, with more than 2.5% coming from Senator Kerry, and 0.9% from President Bush. That 1.6% average impact on the Bush/Kerry margin exceeds the winning margin from the 2000 presidential election in six states. Those six states had 59 electoral votes (Florida, New Mexico, Wisconsin, Iowa, Oregon, and New Hampshire).

The study spreadsheet provides all raw data in the study, including polls results, sponsors, dates and sources.

[gldstwmn]

http://msnbc.msn.com/id/5411492/site/newsweek/

By Holly Bailey
NewsweekJuly 19 issue - In his run for the White House, Ralph Nader is getting help from an unexpected source: Republicans. Of the $1 million that Nader has raised for his campaign so far, about $50,000 is from donors who have also given to President George W. Bush's campaign. One in 10 of Nader's biggest contributors—individuals who've written checks of $1,000 or more—are longtime GOP donors.

Among the notable: Richard Egan, Bush's former ambassador to Ireland. Egan raised more than $100,000 as a Bush Pioneer in 2000 and at least $200,000 this cycle as one of the Rangers, the Bush campaign's most elite fund-raising circle. In 2001 Egan contributed $100,000 of his own money to help pay for Bush's Inauguration, while he and his family rank among the biggest contributors to the Republican Party in general, giving nearly $1 million to the GOP since 1999, according to the Center for Responsive Politics. And according to Nader's campaign-finance reports, Egan, his son John and his daughter-in-law Pamela each contributed the maximum $2,000 donation to Nader's effort. Egan declined to comment to NEWSWEEK.

Another $2,000 contributor to Nader was Houston businessman and longtime Bush-family pal Nijad Fares, the son of Lebanese Deputy Prime Minister Issam Fares. In 2000 Fares gave $200,000 to the Bush Inaugural fund. "Republicans are giving money to Nader because they want to prop up his candidacy," says Democratic National Committee Chairman Terry McAuliffe.

Republicans and conservative groups in battleground states including Oregon, Florida, Wisconsin and Michigan are also working to get Nader on the ballot this November. Democrats have sued to keep him off the ticket in Arizona, where, according to the state's Democratic Party, half of the 10,000 registered voters who signed petitions last month to get Nader on the ballot were Republicans. The state GOP committees in Michigan and Florida have announced efforts to collect signatures to get Nader on the ballot in those states. Meanwhile, in Oregon, two conservative groups—the Oregon Family Council and Citizens for a Sound Economy—financed phone calls to GOP voters encouraging them to attend a recent Nader nominating convention. CSE, which is headed by former Republican House majority leader Dick Armey, plans to take its campaign to other states. Nader last week rejected calls to disavow Republican efforts on his part, telling reporters that GOPers aren't doing much to help his insurgent campaign. Yet he seems to find some inspiration in his new supporters, telling the crowd at a recent rally, "I think I'll end up taking more votes away from Republicans than Democrats."

[dissention]

Originally Posted by CarneVaca

And I'm sure he didn't have at least a half-dozen indigenous folk "working" for him.

That's pure assumption. Maybe he did, maybe he didn't. But surely you wouldn't look down on Teresa for her fathers behavior and who he chose to employ.

[dissention]

Originally Posted by gldstwmn

Teresa's accent is lovely. She speaks softly and eloquently, with a cultured diction.
Laura sounds as though she may have some kind of sinus problems. Uh oh.

"Pass the straw, George."

[dissention]

Originally Posted by gldstwmn

Nader's poll numbers don't mean a thang if he ain't on the ballot.

Good point.

[dissention]

Originally Posted by gldstwmn

John Kerry has a distinguished legislative record. He and John McCain negotiated an agreement with Vietnam to provide a full accounting for POW-MIAs. He wrote the first bill reducing acid rain. He has repeatedly led the charge in protecting the Arctic National Wildlife Refuge from drilling. He has passed legislation that shut down money laundering activities of terrorists and drug traffickers.

President Clinton Praised Kerry for Putting 100,000 COPS on the Street - "When we tried to get past six years of talking tough on crime but nothing happening, rhetoric and rhetoric and rhetoric and no action, to put 100,000 police on the street, to ban deadly assault weapons to pass the Brady bill, the other side, (the Republicans) led the fight against it. But John Kerry helped us pass the toughest, smartest, best crime bill this country has seen in many a day, and the crime rate has gone down for four years in a row. John Kerry was on the right side of history." (Public Papers of the President: Fall River, MA; 8/28/96)

Democratic Leader Tom Daschle Says Kerry Knows How to Get the Legislative Job Done in the Senate - Senate Majority Leader Tom Daschle had kind words for John Kerry's work on Campaign Finance Reform when he asked Kerry to chair the Democratic Steering Committee: "From our teen-smoking bill to HMO reform and Campaign Finance Reform, John Kerry has demonstrated that he clearly knows how to get the job done. He is a valued and trusted member of our leadership team, and I am pleased he has accepted another term as Chairman of the Steering and Coordination Committee." (Daschle Press Release, 11/19/98)

Even Dr. Bill Frist, Senate Majority Leader Says Kerry's Global AIDS Legislation is a "Huge Step Forward": "'The Kerry- Frist bill is a huge step forward," said (current Majority Leader Bill) Frist. "It further validates U.S. leadership in the global effort to end devastation many countries face in the fight against HIV/AIDS'." (Office of Senator Frist, press release 7/12/02)

58 bills and resolutions John Kerry has sponsored over the years have passed the U.S. Senate. Countless others have been improved because of his work, including the Clean Air Act, the Children's Health Insurance Program and the COPS program.

John Kerry has taken on the special interests and won. He fought against Newt Gingrich's anti-labor and anti-environmental regulatory reform. He has fought to raise the minimum wage. He has worked to shut down wasteful corporate subsidies. And John Kerry played an important role in the effort to reach a settlement with the tobacco companies that ended marketing to children and teenagers.

The number of bills that bear your name is a poor measure of legislative accomplishment. For example, Ted Kennedy, who most would acknowledge as the most accomplished Democratic Senator in a generation, has had just 9 bills signed into law in 10 years. Of the more than 400 bills Kennedy sponsored in 108th, 105th and 104th Congresses none were signed into law. And Bill Frist, the Republican Majority Leader, has sponsored 88 bills in the 108th Congress and zero have become law. In the 107th Congress, Frist sponsored 52 bills and 1 became law. It was a bill to authorize and urge the President to promote democracy in Zimbabwe.

---

He also led the pack on the Iran-Contra issue.

[strandinthewind]

Originally Posted by dissention

He also led the pack on the Iran-Contra issue.

That Democratic with hunt

JOKING