Safety for teen users of The Ledge
 

Of course, most people by now know the current situation concerning a Ledgie minor. Whether or not everyone agrees with how that is being handled, it does bring up some concerns about whether The Ledge is safe concerning underage users.
I know that teens (or anyone who posts) Should feel safe, but you never know who is at the other keyboard. I feel that the Ledgies here are trustworthy, but it does concern me that any guest could come here and see anything a minor has posted.
The moderators may or may not agree that anything different needs to be done, but it is something to think about. I think it would be a good idea that if a minor comes to The Ledge and posts something like what school they attend, the city they live in, or a phone number, that it should be able to be deleted by a moderator.
This post is something that LikeAWillow and I have been discussing and hope that other members have ideas they would like to share about how The Ledge can stay safe for all users.
Of course, it is also up to the minors using The Ledge to be sensible and use discretion when posting about themselves. Never share any information that leads to your location

I have no idea what happened with a Ledgie minor.... is in appropriate to ask?

EDIT: Miranda... got it. I agree that minors should be protected on here, but was it really an issue of Miranda posting anything inappropriate? Or were her parents just uncomfortable with the entire situation in general?

No, Dani, it's about Miranda's leaving... I think.

However, as a teenager, I do agree with the notion of deleting posts that give away location. I have posted where I live online before then gone back to it and thought "Why the HELL did I do that?" I don't really like the thought of the area for teen ledgies though, that was suggested in another thread. I get on better with people older tham myself and often have trouble communicating with people of my own age. For me an segregated area would make me feel like I was back in school. I like being able to read everyone else's posts and share my view on them in all the parts of The Ledge :wavey:

I personally feel that nobody under the age of 18 should be allowed on the Internet at all. If I were President. . .

:laugh: For real?

:shocked: Bye...

No seriously, what about us who don't like most people in our own area? You'd rather us have hardly any friends? :shrug: I probably have four of five friends I actually care about here, where as I have about ten online, most of which I've known since I was 13/14...

Well, nothing happened, really. Personally I would hate to see this incident (caused by some overzealous parents IMHO) set a precedent for turning this place into even more of a nanny state. Yes, everyone here should adhere to a self-regulated, rational code of conduct, i.e., don't be an ass. But I would hate to see this place become all Disney unicorns and amber waves of grain just to assuage the irrational overreaction by a couple of skittish parents. If you are a minor and you are joining this board, you (or your parents) should have already received an education on the basics of online safety and conduct. If you haven't and you unwittingly or intentionally do something stupid or self-destructive on here, then that is something that needs to be addressed by yourself- don't drag others down with you. There can only be so many safeguards. I think the Ledge as it stands already sufficiently promotes a non-hostile, safe, friendly environment.

I do feel bad for Miranda, and I can only imagine that this will only further strain an already strained relationship with her parents. But as others have mentioned, perhaps there is another side to the story that we haven't heard. :shrug: There are three sides to any story- one side, the other's side and the Truth. The only good news is that she will only have to endure this kind of suppression for a few more years...

I agree... it's no fun to sit at the kiddy table away from the grown ups. But I don't understand why it would be dangerous to give away your location. Yes, it would be stupid to give away your street and house number. But what's wrong with stating the name of your city? :shrug: The only thing that makes me cringe a little is seeing pictures of friends of friends of friends. I wonder whether these people would appreciate having their mugs plastered on some anonymous forum on the interwebs, especially if said friends are intoxicated or otherwise not ready for prime time. But, eh, what do I know...

Most forums don't allow guests to come and go as they please. Perhaps The Ledge should hide all posts unless you are registered.

I'm not sure if michelej1 would be equipped to handle the surge of new registrations in a timely manner!

I don't live in a city. I'm in a little village and I gave it's name away. I'm also the only 16y/o with short hair in this place, that's all (:

I really like this idea, although I'm sure implementing it would be tough. I've gotten a few somewhat creepy PMs over the years, but at least I then had a username in mind to stay away from. Also, though I never received anything blatantly report worthy (just the sort of messages that make the hair on the back of your neck stand up, even if you can't say why), it was always nice to know that if something really made me uncomfortable, I could report that person. If there's any way the board could become members only without crashing the server and causing Michele a lot of undue hassle....I think it would be a fantastic idea.

Somewhat side-note: I'm not a fan of the teen board either, although to clarify, I think the idea holidayroad had in mind was to have a board that only teens had access to in addition to their access to the rest of the forum. Then it could just be a place where they could feel more comfortable about opening up a little more and sharing details about school/life/etc without worrying that everyone on the internet could see it. I'm sure it would be difficult to manage, though, and even more difficult to patrol (verification, etc.) Having younger kids here and having them be able to mix with the older posters is great. I wouldn't be half as interested in politics as I am if it weren't for how active the political threads were when I first joined the board. 15 year old Marissa gives a belated thank you to disention, irishgirl, strand, etc, though none of you post any more.

It would be really easy, actually. You could make all the forum sections viewable only to registered users. Or just Chit Chat. Of course there are pros and cons to doing this - even without considering user safety. But still, anyone can register and just lurk.

But I think the Ledge is a safe place. Even though Miranda isn't allowed on, it's not like anything horrible happened which caused her "banning." I think the safest way to be safe anywhere on the internet is limit the amount of information you put out there. I know if I was a parent, I wouldn't want my child to post their picture on a forum, or give any information such as their city - or anything more detailed than that. In the end it's up to the parents to decide what they want to allow their kid to do online.

I meant tough in that there would be a ton of new registsrations over a very short period of time :)

But at least you know there's a name attached to everyone viewing somewhere and that said name can be banned (and the ledge's registration rules make it more difficult than usual to have multiple accounts.) Let's say right now, OnlinePredator23434 sends me a message saying "Hey there, you seem like fun. Let's meet up." I say, "Sorry, buddy, I don't meet up with strangers on here." He says "Like that's going to stop me? You go to Wellesley College. [enter malicious threats here.]" I report this to Michele. Michele is kind enough to ban him. Well, OnlinePredator23434 can still view the ledge and all its happenings as a guest even after he's banned. Change the system and you have a better shot at keeping out people who have proven they need to be kept out.

Nope, not at all! Miranda was just the spark that started this discussion, she isn't the topic of it.

Actually, I was the one who mentioned a teen area. My idea wasn't that teens should not be allowed on the rest of the board, but that, if a parent thought a teen should only communicate with other teens, there would be a section here that would promote that.

That is exactly what I had in mind. I should have posted it more clearly when I first said it.

I agree with your points. But I don't think banned users can actually come back as guests? If you ban their IP - I thought that computer cannot access the site at all? I'm not sure how the ledge is set up.

Yes, you can ban an IP, but not everyone has a static IP address. Would be very easy to use another computer, or simply use a proxy of some sort.

I'm all for rendering The Ledge & all of its forums (except maybe the one pertaining to technical questions regarding the operation of the board) visible only to registered users.

Alright, new plan!

Require the following:

-Current Driver's license
-Social security card
-Birth certificate
-Background check
-And finally, make them take a short quiz on Fleetwood Mac

Vigilantes of the youth unite! :thumbsup:

Sit in your room and listen to the Smiths and the Cure and cry like everyone else had to do before the Internet existed.

I grew up on the Ledge. Literally. It wasn't a good thing. I wish my parents had taken more of an interest in what I was doing, I may have been forced to learn how to actually speak to regular people. Everyone can debate back and forth over whether Miranda's parents were right, but she's a minor and it's their right to do what they did. Sucks for all of you who are losing contact with a friend, but it's not the first time this has happened to a younger member of the Ledge and it won't be the last.

Closing the boards so only registered users can read messages is a really good idea. I'm kinda completely confused as to why it hasn't been done before.

:laugh: Can I listen to The Wall instead? Seriously though, I can and do talk to dozens of people, I just don't relate to any of them.

You were, what?, seven? nine? when we first started coming here?? :D

And I was just barely 18. ummmm....x 2.35 :lol:

No, you gotta listen to Wish You Were Here instead! :lol:

Anyways, about the boards being private, that is a very good idea. Most forums (such as IMDb, which I used to post at a lot till a left a few months ago) are private for a reason, and The Ledge should be no exception.

Oh but Ledgies are far more interesting than regular people! :nod:

There's not a whole lot you can do. Anyone can lie about their age.

Honestly...
 

it just depends on which website a 'minor' is visiting.

My 17 year old niece "Nimrod" (My pet name for Kendra) has/had a myspace account once but some '30-something' year old perv decided to potray himself as a teenager...so once her dad (My older brother Geary) took care of said 'perv' I offered my parental eagle-eye (somewhat odd that I'm NOT yet a parent) to watch her account and to make sure she isnt trying to act older than what she actually is.

Havent had an incident since...


Damn, I hate being old...

So, just for my understanding, wouldn't cutting off the board to unregistered members end what led to many of the Ledgies signing up? I mean...I lurked for about a year or something before I actually got to sign up (thanks Arlene :xoxo:).

As a minor I am guilty of a few things: Posting pictures of my friends online (I did this to Jeordy but he doesn't mind...but still), posting my phone number (but it's on a private page that only friends can read...but we all know that fb isn't the safest place ever), telling the name of the school I go to and my daily routine (not smart once I think about it), and a few other things...

I agree that the Ledge should be a safe haven for us minors who are as equal as everyone else here. How to implement that safety is gonna be cause for a good debate. Locking us up in a corner is not a good idea (I know it's not yours...I'm just saying) but we all should be urged to self regulate what we post so that we are safe (there's creepers out there :lol:)...

I started posting on The Ledge when I was 15. I remember trading even, meaning I gave my actual address to people who would then mail me tapes. I'm scratching my brain to whether or not my parents knew about this, they had to have because how else would I get to the post office to mail my trades?

I don't know, I think in a case like this, it's up to the user, not the community. 15 is old enough to know what information should be shared and what shouldn't and honestly, it's also old enough to decide whether or not you want to be posting on a message board. I don't really know much about the 15yo in question, but if she's spending an amount of her limited internet time on The Ledge, she's probably pretty intelligent! ;)

I just think this it ridiculous. And I've never even talked to Miranda.

The likelihood of there being people out there who troll Stevie Nicks fan forums for underage pussy, is low.

The person above me who said self regulation, is dead on.

And to quote someone else from the other thread -- 'Are we being serious right now'?

Whoa......Stop the world and let me off, we actually agree on something!!!

I think there are enough filters already in place:

1. Parents (If they are doing there job)
2. Common sense
3. Moderators

And I agree with the other Ledgies that it would be a bad idea to make the
forums only available to registered users. I'm a member of another fansite
that makes you sign in to see some of the post. It just makes it a pain in the
a$$. And I think the Ledge would have less members, at least new ones if
it goes that way. I doubt I would have become a member here if you had to
be registered/sign in to read the posts. Hey....wait a minute, that might be
the reason to change things here.

I kind of like the idea of the forums being private. As members, we are the ones that keep the forum going by contributing to it with our posts, pictures, info, demos, art, etc. Meanwhile, anyone coming through can take advantage of all this without putting any effort into keeping the forum going themselves which takes away from the community effort. Anyway, that's just a thought :)

Yes, for real. I believe the Internet is, and should remain, a forum with few restrictions (within current legal limits of course). In other words: It's like a night club.

At most, kids should be introduced to using the web at school--and only in educational forums, class-related websites. I don't even think the web should be used as a resource for research materials until college.

You need a license to drive, you need ID to get into bars, you have to 18 to have sex. You should be 18 to get on the Internet.

Besides, I think the Internet is destroying a generation's sensibilities. (And the previous generations had gotten bad enough.)

Really don't get me started. . .

but yes, I never say anything I don't mean.

Oh... okay then. Clears that one up. I'll just go hang around on the corner smoking pot :thumbsup:

You'd have to become the Queen too to get us in the UK...

Or 16 to have sex in the UK, Australia, The Netherlands, Russia, Finland, New Zealand... America isn't the only country in the world you know.

Is too. :p

We'll keep Christine then ;)

And Ringo ;) ... actually on second thought you can have him if you give us back our Beatles memorabilia

Are we talking about the same teens that are sending nude pictures of themselves to each other (sextexting) ????? Geez :shrug:

Good call. :nod: