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-   -   Court backs firing of waitress without makeup (http://ledge.fleetwoodmac.net/showthread.php?t=17445)

gldstwmn 12-28-2004 09:13 PM

Court backs firing of waitress without makeup
 
http://www.cnn.com/2004/LAW/12/28/co...eut/index.html

SAN FRANCISCO, California (Reuters) -- A female bartender who refused to wear makeup at a Reno, Nevada, casino was not unfairly dismissed from her job, a U.S. federal appeals court ruled Tuesday.

Darlene Jespersen, who had worked for nearly 20 years at a Harrah's Entertainment Inc casino bar in Reno, Nevada, objected to the company's revised policy that required female bartenders, but not men, to wear makeup.

A previously much-praised employee, Jespersen was fired in 2000 after the firm instituted a "Beverage Department Image Transformation" program and she sued, alleging sex discrimination.

In a 2-1 decision, a three-judge panel of the U.S. 9th Circuit Court of Appeals upheld a lower court ruling in favor of Harrah's. All three judges are males appointed by Democratic presidents.

"We have previously held that grooming and appearance standards that apply differently to women and men do not constitute discrimination on the basis of sex," Judge Wallace Tashima wrote for the majority.

He cited the precedent of a 1974 case in which the court ruled that a company can require men to have short hair but allow long hair on women.

The Lambda Legal Defense Fund, a gay rights group that backed Jespersen's suit, had argued that forcing female employees to have different standards than men was unlawful under rules, known as Title VII, against discrimination on race, color, religion, sex or national origin.

The ruling found, however, that the casino's appearance standards were no more burdensome for women than for men.

In a dissenting opinion, Judge Sidney Thomas backed the reasoning of the plaintiff. "Harrah's fired Jespersen because of her failure to conform to sex stereotypes, which is discrimination based on sex and is therefore impermissible under Title VII," he wrote.

"The distinction created by the majority opinion leaves men and women in services industries, who are more likely to be subject to policies like the Harrah's 'Personal Best' policy, without the protection that white-collar professionals receive," he wrote.

amber 12-28-2004 09:15 PM

Christ. :mad:

strandinthewind 12-28-2004 09:17 PM

This was a tough case. I think in the end, the court did the right thing. Thanks for posting.

sara1998 12-28-2004 09:19 PM

What a bunch of bull****. Anyone ever heard of a I-don't-wanna-do-anything-to-myself-today day?? What bastards. :mad:

Nixxxed 12-28-2004 09:50 PM

If I were that waitress, I would've gone completely Tammy Faye with my makeup in protest. Or worse ... Michael Jackson. :laugh:

I think this is pretty crappy.

½ ¡Ñ§ÅñË ® 12-28-2004 09:56 PM

[QUOTE=Nixxxed]If I were that waitress, I would've gone completely Tammy Faye with my makeup in protest. Or worse ... Michael Jackson. :laugh:

QUOTE]Yeah what she said.

SuzeQuze 12-28-2004 10:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gldstwmn
http://www.cnn.com/2004/LAW/12/28/co...eut/index.html
...
The ruling found, however, that the casino's appearance standards were no more burdensome for women than for men...

How can this be true if the men do not have to wear makeup? Of course it is more burdensome for women. Do the men have to wear panty hose or bras? These things take time to put on. Do men typically need curling irons or blow dryers? This part of their finding just can't be true IMO.

Having said that, I almost never leave my house without makeup on, I'm just a girlie girl. But I don't think anyone should be required to wear it. Most bar tenders in that context just would, I wonder why she won't?

ontheEdgeof17 12-28-2004 10:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SuzeQuze
How can this be true if the men do not have to wear makeup? Of course it is more burdensome for women. Do the men have to wear panty hose or bras? These things take time to put on. Do men typically need curling irons or blow dryers? This part of their finding just can't be true IMO.

Taking 5 seconds to put on a bra is far from burdensome. Try shaving....it's a major pain in the ass. And some men do blow dry their hair. My hair is longer now and it is cold out so I blow dry mine.

gldstwmn 12-28-2004 10:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SuzeQuze
How can this be true if the men do not have to wear makeup? Of course it is more burdensome for women. Do the men have to wear panty hose or bras?

I had this one broad complaining one time because I do not wear panty hose. I haven't worn them since I was a waitress in the 80's. :laugh: She was trying to tell the manager that I was violating the dress code because I never wore hose with my skirts.
Corporate America-not for me. :laugh:

SuzeQuze 12-28-2004 10:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ontheEdgeof17
Taking 5 seconds to put on a bra is far from burdensome. Try shaving....it's a major pain in the ass. And some men do blow dry their hair. My hair is longer now and it is cold out so I blow dry mine.

LOL! The bra thing is a stretch yeah. :laugh: We shave too but not our faces which does look like a pain. Legs and 'pits also ain't no picnic.

strandinthewind 12-28-2004 11:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ontheEdgeof17
Taking 5 seconds to put on a bra is far from burdensome. Try shaving....it's a major pain in the ass. And some men do blow dry their hair. My hair is longer now and it is cold out so I blow dry mine.

You know damn good and well this is a losing argument no matter how true it may be. The fillies just take 20 minutes to do what the guys do in five. I cite the ladies roon ritual and the hours on hours of total time I have been kept waiting as an example :laugh: :laugh:

ontheEdgeof17 12-28-2004 11:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by strandinthewind
You know damn good and well this is a losing argument no matter how true it may be. The fillies just take 20 minutes to do what the guys do in five. I cite the ladies roon ritual and the hours on hours of total time I have been kept waiting as an example :laugh: :laugh:


It's their own damn fault. Pee and get the hell out. How hard is that?

SuzeQuze 12-28-2004 11:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gldstwmn
I had this one broad complaining one time because I do not wear panty hose. I haven't worn them since I was a waitress in the 80's. :laugh: She was trying to tell the manager that I was violating the dress code because I never wore hose with my skirts.
Corporate America-not for me. :laugh:

What a jackass tattle tale, what was her problem? Katie Couric doesn't even wear hose anymore, they're just awful.

strandinthewind 12-28-2004 11:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ontheEdgeof17
It's their own damn fault. Pee and get the hell out. How hard is that?

Child - you are preaching to the choir :laugh: Then, when confronted with this FACT - they pout or let you have it. It is a no win argument - thus, I wait without comment!!!! :laugh:

SuzeQuze 12-28-2004 11:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ontheEdgeof17
It's their own damn fault. Pee and get the hell out. How hard is that?

LOL, ya bast*rd! It just takes longer for us due to anatomical constraints.

strandinthewind 12-28-2004 11:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SuzeQuze
LOL, ya bast*rd! It just takes longer for us due to anatomical constraints.

BS - I used to know this hellcat in law school who would, when drunk (which was often :laugh: ) storm into the men's room pift her leg and pee in the urinal :eek: Needless to say, she was a favorite party guest!!!!! :laugh: :wavey:

ontheEdgeof17 12-28-2004 11:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by strandinthewind
BS - I used to know this hellcat in law school who would, when drunk (which was often :laugh: ) storm into the men's room pift her leg and pee in the urinal :eek: Needless to say, she was a favorite party guest!!!!! :laugh: :wavey:

Gotta love my mom! :xoxo:

SuzeQuze 12-28-2004 11:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by strandinthewind
BS - I used to know this hellcat in law school who would, when drunk (which was often :laugh: ) storm into the men's room pift her leg and pee in the urinal :eek: Needless to say, she was a favorite party guest!!!!! :laugh: :wavey:

Hmm, with urine on her legs and all? To each his own I guess. :shrug: ;)

SuzeQuze 12-28-2004 11:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ontheEdgeof17
Gotta love my mom! :xoxo:

LOL! Curtis I wish you could come by on New Year's Eve cuz I'm making appletinis which are delicious but deadly.

strandinthewind 12-28-2004 11:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ontheEdgeof17
Gotta love my mom! :xoxo:

ROTMFFLMAO :laugh: :laugh:

ontheEdgeof17 12-28-2004 11:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SuzeQuze
LOL! Curtis I wish you could come by on New Year's Eve cuz I'm making appletinis which are delicious but deadly.


I just might. I never pass up free alcohol. :woohoo:

strandinthewind 12-28-2004 11:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SuzeQuze
Hmm, with urine on her legs and all? To each his own I guess. :shrug: ;)

I swear to you she never got it on her legs. Then again, this chick could also, when intoxicated, sit on the floor, put a beer or cocktail on her head, and use her feet to drink it :eek: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

Did I also mention she was WILDLY intelligent and graduated at the head of the class and is a helluva lawyer to this day!!!!!!!!!!!!!

ontheEdgeof17 12-28-2004 11:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by strandinthewind
I swear to you she never got it on her legs. Then again, this chick could also, when intoxicated, sit on the floor, put a beer or cocktail on her head, and use her feet to drink it :eek: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

Did I also mention she was WILDLY intelligent and graduated at the head of the class and is a helluva lawyer to this day!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Oh. That's not my mom then. It's Marsha Clark. She's a hoot. :wavey:

amber 12-28-2004 11:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by strandinthewind
Child - you are preaching to the choir :laugh: Then, when confronted with this FACT - they pout or let you have it. It is a no win argument - thus, I wait without comment!!!! :laugh:

you're so foul. we have to pull down our pants, or skirt and hose, then underwear too, then we have to wipe, then we have to put all our stuff back on.
You have to whip it out, pee, tuck it back in.
duh?

SuzeQuze 12-28-2004 11:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by strandinthewind
I swear to you she never got it on her legs. Then again, this chick could also, when intoxicated, sit on the floor, put a beer or cocktail on her head, and use her feet to drink it :eek: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

Did I also mention she was WILDLY intelligent and graduated at the head of the class and is a helluva lawyer to this day!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Holy sh*t, she sounds awesome. Isn't it a law that lawyers drink alcohol? Don't they even have to keep some liquor in their desks or face disbarment?

SuzeQuze 12-28-2004 11:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by amber
you're so foul. we have to pull down our pants, or skirt and hose, then underwear too, then we have to wipe, then we have to put all our stuff back on.
You have to whip it out, pee, tuck it back in.
duh?

This is why I love you, I say "anatomical constraints" and you say everything else, :lol: :lol: :xoxo:

amber 12-28-2004 11:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SuzeQuze
Holy sh*t, she sounds awesome. Isn't it a law that lawyers drink alcohol? Don't they even have to keep some liquor in their desks or face disbarment?

Yeah. It's how they dull their conscience for charging what they do. :D

strandinthewind 12-28-2004 11:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by amber
you're so foul. we have to pull down our pants, or skirt and hose, then underwear too, then we have to wipe, then we have to put all our stuff back on.
You have to whip it out, pee, tuck it back in.
duh?

My word - how do you all do ALL of that in less than 30 minutes :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

ontheEdgeof17 12-28-2004 11:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by amber
you're so foul. we have to pull down our pants, or skirt and hose, then underwear too, then we have to wipe, then we have to put all our stuff back on.
You have to whip it out, pee, tuck it back in.
duh?


Grow a penis already.

strandinthewind 12-28-2004 11:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SuzeQuze
Holy sh*t, she sounds awesome. Isn't it a law that lawyers drink alcohol? Don't they even have to keep some liquor in their desks or face disbarment?

Yes - let me just say Bar Assoc. conventions are booze fests - BUT let me also say conv. of accountants are the wildest - they are these little balding dynamos :laugh:

strandinthewind 12-28-2004 11:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ontheEdgeof17
Grow a penis already.

Well, she seemingly has the balls :cool:

:wavey: :wavey: Amber :wavey: :wavey:

(that was BTW a compliment!!!! )

SuzeQuze 12-28-2004 11:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by strandinthewind
Yes - let me just say Bar Assoc. conventions are booze fests - BUT let me also say conv. of accountants are the wildest - they are these little balding dynamos :laugh:

Really? Interesting, I thought they were squares. I do know this hot chick accountant who dates a guy in this local band I like, but I digress... Going to bed now, night! :wavey:

PS, I don't have a feather bed but I do have a down comforter which I LOVE. But I now NEED a featherbed. :rolleyes:

bikerchic 12-28-2004 11:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by amber
You have to whip it out, pee, tuck it back in.
duh?

You forgot shake, then tuck it back in :laugh:

amber 12-28-2004 11:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bikerchic
You forgot shake, then tuck it back in :laugh:

It's basically all one motion..... :laugh:

strandinthewind 12-28-2004 11:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by amber
It's basically all one motion..... :laugh:

have you seen this personally - personally, I have used several different techiniques :laugh: :laugh:

GateandGarden 12-28-2004 11:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by strandinthewind
have you seen this personally - personally, I have used several different techiniques :laugh: :laugh:

Good God--this thread got weird fast. :shocked:

amber 12-28-2004 11:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by strandinthewind
have you seen this personally - personally, I have used several different techiniques :laugh: :laugh:

yes, i've studied the techniques....
ah, you're a multishaker.... :laugh:

strandinthewind 12-28-2004 11:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GateandGarden
Good God--this thread got weird fast. :shocked:

well - I am just trying to assert that the out - void - shake - in theory is a blatant rumor started by malicious time consuming women trying to diminish the agony they impose on the male population by making them wait for HOURS while they go to the can :laugh: :rolleyes: :laugh:

bikerchic 12-28-2004 11:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GateandGarden
Good God--this thread got weird fast. :shocked:

:lol: :lol: :lol:

strandinthewind 12-28-2004 11:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by amber
yes, i've studied the techniques....
ah, you're a multishaker.... :laugh:

:laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

Lord Child - the roads we go down in the search for knowledge :cool:


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